Article Video: Teewing Flux 180mm, high-pivot, Avinox EMTB first look and ride

[sethimus]

so around 74-76cm (when you add the shorter cranks)

ballpark around 22-23cm insertion length needed for a 210mm oneup in a size m for the teewing, where exactly is your problem?

i‘d rather be concerned about the low stack, when you sit so much higher AND have t-rex arms you‘d need a higher front -> get the forbidden

 

[B Rabbit]

Not English, but a nice looking build

 

[Rideit]

so around 74-76cm (when you add the shorter cranks)

ballpark around 22-23cm insertion length needed for a 210mm oneup in a size m for the teewing, where exactly is your problem?

i‘d rather be concerned about the low stack, when you sit so much higher AND have t-rex arms you‘d need a higher front -> get the forbidden

Well, the insertion depth of the Amflow Medium is 250mm, and absolutely will not accept anything longer that the One up 180 for me.
I’ll update with pics.
Perhaps the standover or top of the seatube is much higher on the Teewing, I haven’t looked.

 

[sethimus]

an amflow has a seat tube length of 430mm in size m. you need a 210mm seatpost, the shortest one is a oneup with 545mm length. completely slammed that's 725mm to the rails (430-250 insertion + 545mm) + whatever your saddle is to the top from the rails.so if you have the long legs you claim you have, and that would be a saddle height of around 74-76cm, that would be right on the money. why do you think you need to slam the seatpost completely? that's not needed with your leg length?

 

[Rideit]

Just hang tight, bro, bike is in the shed. I have been sizing bikes up for people for over 40 years, I know a thing or two about a thing or two, lol. I wouldn’t need a 210 slammed, at all. But the 180 is definitely sticking up way high, obviously preventing the post from being low enough on hairball descents. Like, REALLY hairball descents, where I am literally hugging the 27.5 tire with my butt-cheeks.
(hence the Quick Release, it’s ONLY for those occasions, and it still doesn’t go anywhere CLOSE to slammed)
Capiche?
I’ll take pics in a sec, it’s freakin’ -3 degrees F outside…
Just for clarity, I’m not interested in spatting over this in a ‘I’m right, your wrong’ way, I’m looking for a solution that works!

 

[sethimus]

i still don't get why you can't put a 210 in then? i have long legs too, like REALLY long (i can ride a 210 in s4 KSL, that has way less insertion due to the shock tunnel)

 

[Rideit]

Ok, took pics. My saddle height (to top of saddle, as there are different saddle stack heights) is ~75cm, and 180cm from ground to top of saddle.

with this ideal height, the post is 90mm out of the frame. with the post slammed, it is 120cm. I would need to have the 210 almost slammed in order to achieve the desired saddle height.
however, the 210 doesn’t go anywhere near there, it sticks out almost to the height of the 180 where I have it now.
I would be willing to compromise with it dropped to 200mm, but that doesn’t work with either option, the lower part of the 180mm is too short, and the 210 too long.

 

[Rideit]

To answer based on your pic, there are two issues. One, that much post sticking out of a medium frame would be way too much leverage, IMO.
But what I am looking to accomplish is to have a 210 that will allow me to run it with about 10-30cm of post showing max. (This is how it worked with all of my Rocky Mountains).
I hope that makes more sense?
For reference, I have these posts in my personal inventory, I have tried every option, lol.
(not to mention lots of others from other manufacturers at the shop I work in)

 

[sethimus]

then you must have a really high saddle or the insertion depth is less than 250mm. math doesn't lie. i ran in a similar problem when i installed a switchgrade and changed my pedals to outlier pendulums. needed to reduce the travel of the seatpost to 200mm in the end. thankfully the next bike is the velduro where i can run the 240mm easily

 

[Rideit]

I guarantee the insertion depth is less that that, lol.
That’s just what the internet says.

Believe me, I have tried every option that I can think of to get the drop I am looking for from saddle to ground in both positions…

My next step is going be removing the post, and measuring the actual insertion depth, which will be great to know, but still won’t solve my issue. I was thinking about this while driving, it might not be so much that I have a long inseam for my height, but more that I am most comfortable with a saddle height that is quite a bit taller than most. Not sure why.
it has been that way since my first knee surgery, I think I was able to avoid a lot of pain while recovering by not allowing my knee to bend as much. I probably just got used to that tall position, even though now I have full range of motion.

 

[Rideit]

I can’t wait to see your next Velduro build!

 

[Hoverp]

I guarantee the insertion depth is less that that, lol.
That’s just what the internet says.

Believe me, I have tried every option that I can think of to get the drop I am looking for from saddle to ground in both positions…

My next step is going be removing the post, and measuring the actual insertion depth, which will be great to know, but still won’t solve my issue. I was thinking about this while driving, it might not be so much that I have a long inseam for my height, but more that I am most comfortable with a saddle height that is quite a bit taller than most. Not sure why.
it has been that way since my first knee surgery, I think I was able to avoid a lot of pain while recovering by not allowing my knee to bend as much. I probably just got used to that tall position, even though now I have full range of motion.

Not to sound like a jerk, but how do you know the insertion depth of the TeeWing Flux?

 

[bmwpowere36m3]

I’ll measure tomorrow, but it’s astronomical for my height.
(5’8”, but I have an almost 33” inseam).
Short torso, short arms.
Im shaped like a T-Rex.
Im also running 142mm crankarms, lol, but it was just as bad with 165’s.

I feel weird then... cause I'm a half-inch short of 5'9" or 174 cm, same wing span. Inseam (floor to crotch, no shoes) is 32". I've only ever been able to run 170-180 mm droppers as the tire hitting the saddle when lowered is usually my limiter for a preferred height (702mm from BB center to saddle top with 160 mm cranks). I was fitted a while ago for a gravel bike and found over the years that same saddle height works. Any higher and I get knee pains after a lot of riding. I know I have tighter hamstrings and can't touch my toes... but a 210 dropper at 5'8" seems alien to me.

I had to resort to a 160 mm dropper on my VPP eMTB and it's been fine... I can tickle my taint on the 29'er without the saddle being in the way.

 

[Astro66]

Not English, but a nice looking build

I watched it with English Subtitles. Interesting they gave the test bike out with the incorrect bushing in the shock, so there was play and the reviewer had to get a new bushing manufactured. Anyway. They should sort that stuff out in the production bike, but it will be the first thing I check when I pick the bike up.

I actually was inspired by the reviewer saying this is almost like a downhill EMTB, and designed for very, very aggressive riding. Because I have the Amflow PL Carbon Pro. That's exactly what I'm looking for in a second bike.

I love the look, when they had the Flux and Turbo Force in the same shot. The Flux was clearly longer and slacker. Really gave it that aggressive stance.

It's all pointing to this being a fantastic Enduro/Downhill bike. Hopefully the pricing doesn't let it down.

 

[Blownoutrides]

Ok, took pics. My saddle height (to top of saddle, as there are different saddle stack heights) is ~75cm, and 180cm from ground to top of saddle.
View attachment 173231
View attachment 173232
with this ideal height, the post is 90mm out of the frame. with the post slammed, it is 120cm. I would need to have the 210 almost slammed in order to achieve the desired saddle height.
however, the 210 doesn’t go anywhere near there, it sticks out almost to the height of the 180 where I have it now.
I would be willing to compromise with it dropped to 200mm, but that doesn’t work with either option, the lower part of the 180mm is too short, and the 210 too long.

Brands need to start publishing the distance between BB and lower seat post insertion limit. Way more useful than insertion depth.

I guess you could just subtract insertion depth (if known) from seatpost length, but still.

 

[B Rabbit]

I watched it with English Subtitles. Interesting they gave the test bike out with the incorrect bushing in the shock, so there was play and the reviewer had to get a new bushing manufactured. Anyway. They should sort that stuff out in the production bike, but it will be the first thing I check when I pick the bike up.

I actually was inspired by the reviewer saying this is almost like a downhill EMTB, and designed for very, very aggressive riding. Because I have the Amflow PL Carbon Pro. That's exactly what I'm looking for in a second bike.

I love the look, when they had the Flux and Turbo Force in the same shot. The Flux was clearly longer and slacker. Really gave it that aggressive stance.

It's all pointing to this being a fantastic Enduro/Downhill bike. Hopefully the pricing doesn't let it down.

View attachment 173267

It’s an awesome looking bike hey, super impressed, I reckon it’s way nicer than the Velduro.
This will be my next rig

 

[Rideit]

I feel weird then... cause I'm a half-inch short of 5'9" or 174 cm, same wing span. Inseam (floor to crotch, no shoes) is 32". I've only ever been able to run 170-180 mm droppers as the tire hitting the saddle when lowered is usually my limiter for a preferred height (702mm from BB center to saddle top with 160 mm cranks). I was fitted a while ago for a gravel bike and found over the years that same saddle height works. Any higher and I get knee pains after a lot of riding. I know I have tighter hamstrings and can't touch my toes... but a 210 dropper at 5'8" seems alien to me.

I had to resort to a 160 mm dropper on my VPP eMTB and it's been fine... I can tickle my taint on the 29'er without the saddle being in the way.

You are the normal one, I’m the total outlier. Has made sizing bikes difficult for most of my life.

 

[sethimus]

Not to sound like a jerk, but how do you know the insertion depth of the TeeWing Flux?

the shock length is a known measurement, 205mm. the red rectangle's side is about 1.25x the length of the shock, therefore the max insertion depth must be around 250-260mm in the size that is shown in the picture (which we don't know, but i guess it is a medium)

 

[bmwpowere36m3]

View attachment 173276
the shock length is a known measurement, 205mm. the red rectangle's side is about 1.25x the length of the shock, therefore the max insertion depth must be around 250-260mm in the size that is shown in the picture (which we don't know, but i guess it is a medium)

TBF, the insertion depth is from the seat post collar and not dropper collar... at least the way you have it drawn isn't accurate.

 

[sethimus]

TBF, the insertion depth is from the seat post collar and not dropper collar... at least the way you have it drawn isn't accurate.

you are right but i measured it before drawing

 

[Hoverp]

Does going Reverb wireless save you any room?

 

[Plummet]

Great, ANOTHER DJI bike with a ridiculously short seatpost insertion depth. I really need a medium frame that accepts a 210 One Up, but It doesn’t really look feasible. My Amflow can only run a 180, and even that I ALSO have to run a (GASP) QR. Seatpost collar, or that saddle is absolutely in the way.
I have stupid long legs and a short torso, it’s always been hell finding bikes that fit. Then droppers came along, and frames that you could use the entire seatube length.
And there was peace in the Valley.
Now I will only run DJI/Avinox motors, I can’t find a bike that will fit my needs.
I looked into Crestline, and Forbidden…

What bike does suit your needs? shorter droppers compared to mtb's are because the motor is in the way....

Ps 210 dropper is not a requirement. It's a nice to have. I have a 210 pm my mtb and a 180 on my e and there is not one thing i can do on the mtb that i cant do on the e with the 180 dropper.

PS I ride the stupedist of stupid steeps. So my requirement for dropper posts is no less important than anyone else.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

I have a theory, that all these Chinese designed DJI frames have all used this kinked seat tube design because they were heavily influenced by the original Levo SL. These kinked seat tubes limit dropper insertion.

There's no real reason for these kinked seat tubes.... Other than aesthetically looking like the Levo SL

 

[Astro66]

there is not one thing i can do on the mtb that i cant do on the e with the 180 dropper.

I'm in agreement. I do some really technical downhills and climbs, and I don't need a slammed dropper. I just need to be able to move forward and back, without getting my nuts caught up in the seat. And a slightly lower centre of gravity when descending and trying to remain seated, because my legs are exhausted.

When I need to get my weight really low. I tend to lean back behind the seat.

That said. I do run short cranks, which has me slightly higher.

 

[Rideit]

Sure, I can do the rolls, slabs, etc, on the 180, just as I can do lots of things with no dropper, no suspension, and v-brakes.
Would I prefer to?
nope, never.
the other place it sucks is bike-park, it is much harder to bring the bike up to you in the air with a bunch of post and saddle sticking out . That‘s why I run the QR.

My Rocky Powerplay had no issues with the 210, they certainly can be designed around this.

 

[B Rabbit]

i-Track

 

[TheKaiser]

i-Track
View attachment 173344

Is it really i-Track, though? From memory, the i-Track patent has to do with an idler mounted ON the swingarm (or attached appendage), in such a manner that the idler is dynamic as the bike moves through its travel, in order to vary the amount of anti-squat/pedal kick both initially and as the bike gets deeper into the compression.

This design, on the other hand, seems to have the idler located concentric to the main pivot, which is not, strictly speaking, mounting it on the swingarm, and it's certainly not dynamic in relation to the bottom bracket. The idler is captured between the 2 sides of the slot they have molded in that side of the swingarm, which seems like a great design from a durability perspective when compared to other bikes that have the idler axle cantilevered with no support on the outside edge, but is simply capturing the idler within a slot in swingarm enough to make it i-Track, even if it is static relative to the BB?

 

[B Rabbit]

Seems they put the logo on so i assume so

 

[slickrock]

Is it really i-Track, though? From memory, the i-Track patent has to do with an idler mounted ON the swingarm (or attached appendage), in such a manner that the idler is dynamic as the bike moves through its travel, in order to vary the amount of anti-squat/pedal kick both initially and as the bike gets deeper into the compression.

This design, on the other hand, seems to have the idler located concentric to the main pivot, which is not, strictly speaking, mounting it on the swingarm, and it's certainly not dynamic in relation to the bottom bracket. The idler is captured between the 2 sides of the slot they have molded in that side of the swingarm, which seems like a great design from a durability perspective when compared to other bikes that have the idler axle cantilevered with no support on the outside edge, but is simply capturing the idler within a slot in swingarm enough to make it i-Track, even if it is static relative to the BB?

This was discussed earlier in the thread. It looks like the Teewing ripped off the Norco version of the iTrack, where the pulley is imbedded in the swingarm, so it's harder to see that it the idler has its own axle offset from the pivot axle, albeit pretty close to each other. Here is the a diagram of the Norco swingarm that illustrates what I'm talking about.

Technically I haven't really seen the idler close up and on-end, so I wasn't exactly sure if this was the case, but now that the bike sports and iTrack moniker, I guess this confirms it (whether or not Teewing actually licensed it remains to be seen). We need a Rob build out treatment vid to see exactly how the idler is assembled. Until such time, I still think its a complete Norco rip off.

With the Rogue, the distance between idler and pivot locations locations is both greater (since the pivot is fore of the seat tube) and more obvious (mounted external to the swingarm). That's it's an official iTrack design is far more apparent.

 

[Hoverp]

Looks to be centered on the swing arm main pivot from this angle.