SRAM's new 2023 Drivetrain allows full power shifts

G-Sport

Active member
Oct 7, 2022
270
209
Yorkshire
So did they MOVE the cassette out 2.5mm or is the big gear in the same place and it is 2.5mm wider? If so pitch is going to be bigger and cable derailleurs are going to need a pull modifier to work.
 

Zimmerframe

MUPPET
Subscriber
Jun 12, 2019
13,883
20,573
Brittany, France
So did they MOVE the cassette out 2.5mm or is the big gear in the same place and it is 2.5mm wider? If so pitch is going to be bigger and cable derailleurs are going to need a pull modifier to work.
Pitch is the same. It's all just 2.5mm further out. You can use an existing derailleur with the cassette if you space out 2/3mm.
 

G-Sport

Active member
Oct 7, 2022
270
209
Yorkshire
Pitch is the same. It's all just 2.5mm further out. You can use an existing derailleur with the cassette if you space out 2/3mm.
Thanks. So presumably there is more spoke clearance, so if/when the chain finds it's way between the cassette and the spokes it is going to get even more jammed?
Does anyone know WHY they have done this? If they had left it where it was then the UDH "standard" might not be on revision H and compatibility of everything would be better?!?!
 

pontoon

Member
Apr 24, 2023
63
21
USA
For anyone who has a gen3 levo and the 36t chain ring:
- Did you keep the chain guide?
- If you got rid of the chain guide, are you getting dropped chains?
- if anyone by chance is using the cascade long link with the bottom bracket in the low position, how many links did you use? The online calculator is telling me to use 120 links
 

AlumiPro

Active member
May 1, 2023
168
107
California
For anyone who has a gen3 levo and the 36t chain ring:
- Did you keep the chain guide?
- If you got rid of the chain guide, are you getting dropped chains?
- if anyone by chance is using the cascade long link with the bottom bracket in the low position, how many links did you use? The online calculator is telling me to use 120 links
I ran a 36t SRAM X-Sync 2 aluminum chainring on my gen3 with AXS XX1 and the factory chain guide with no issues. The chain guide is slotted so it can be slid up to clear the 36t and chain just fine. I had to remove some of the stacked washers/spacers behind the chain guide because the Sram aluminum 36t is a little bit different offset than the SRAM 34t steel chainring. Removing some of those washers/spacers allowed the chain guide to move inward toward the frame so the inside of the chain wasn’t rubbing it.
I am now running the new SRAM XX T-type on my gen3 with the t-type 36t chainring with now issues. The t-type 36t chainring is steel which has a different offset than the aluminum 36t SRAM chainring I was running before, so I found that I had to add the washer/spacers back again (same as it was with the factory SRAM 34t). It’s running great!
I’m in the HI setting with the Cascade Long Link and have always run 118 links.
 

AlumiPro

Active member
May 1, 2023
168
107
California
For anyone who has a gen3 levo and the 36t chain ring:
- Did you keep the chain guide?
- If you got rid of the chain guide, are you getting dropped chains?
- if anyone by chance is using the cascade long link with the bottom bracket in the low position, how many links did you use? The online calculator is telling me to use 120 links

46670D80-5858-440F-9E0E-9CFF76910B79.jpeg F71DF022-E621-4708-ADA2-5F739FD091E4.jpeg
 
Last edited:

Rich-H

Active member
Apr 3, 2023
150
109
Hampshire
What?
There is no "end cap" on an XD driver? And if there was it would rotate with the cassette so how could it be "against the derailleur body"?
Do you mean that the hub axle collar is against the part of the derailleur that acts as the dropout (and replaces the UDH)?
That makes sense but the effective OLD would still need to be the same, and there would (presumably) still be a 3mm deep channel in this part to act as the location for the axle end-cap when installing the wheel.
So either the chain has to overhang the locating channel or the channel depth is reduced significantly. Either of which would need to be in the original UDH frame mating specifications to make sure the chain won't rub the stays but isn't.
 

G-Sport

Active member
Oct 7, 2022
270
209
Yorkshire
Thanks for posting that.
Still don't understand why they moved the cassette out 2.5mm, the 13 speed theory is the only logical explanation I've heard but surely no-one really wants that? Maybe for XC I suppose to have closer gaps, but if they are doing the 2, 4, 6 and 8 tooth jumps so they can do narrow-wide then they aren't going to be able to tighten the ratios up so they would just be looking at doing a 60 tooth (or 62 even) big ring which I can't see anyone wanting.
 

jej737

Member
Apr 11, 2021
13
7
USA
May have been covered already but this is from sram concerning the DM chainring on a Get 3 Levo..

SRAM_logo_Zendesk_agent.png
Andy (SRAM (Tickets))
Jul 7, 2023, 16:27 CDT
Hello Eric, thank you for reaching out to SRAM Rider Support.

I apologize for the confusion, the issue is that drive unit from the Levo Gen 3 has an offset in the frame, which means that the drive unit is not centered in the frame. This results in a very poor chainline which can cause premature wear or even failure. Because of this, we recommend using the 104 BCD chainring with a compatible spider on the Gen 3 Levo.

I hope this is helpful, but please let me know if you have any other questions.

Warm Regards,
Andy R.
SRAM Rider Support
Service and Technical Documents
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Jejones737
Jul 5, 2023, 10:50 CDT
Gen 3 turbo levo. bought the direct mount brose chainring, but bike shop says not compatible. Why? I see many others with new transmission running it on their Levo's. Can you explain and point me to website where it says not to use on specialized turbo levo. thanks
This email is a service from SRAM (Tickets). Delivered by Zendesk
 

Tadmcmichael

Member
Feb 27, 2023
6
3
Georgia
Great thread here, I have GX T type on the way. It looks like the 2024 Levos with Transmission have the 104 bcd spider. Is it the same spider as my 2022 (52 mm) or is the spider different for T-type bikes (55 mm)? I can’t see 3 mm making much difference over that long a chainstay length.
 

RickBullotta

E*POWAH Elite World Champion
Jun 5, 2019
1,798
1,535
USA
Great thread here, I have GX T type on the way. It looks like the 2024 Levos with Transmission have the 104 bcd spider. Is it the same spider as my 2022 (52 mm) or is the spider different for T-type bikes (55 mm)? I can’t see 3 mm making much difference over that long a chainstay length.

It makes a difference when you have a cassette with massive range and tight spacing. These systems are designed around very tight tolerances and are far less forgiving than 9, 10 and even 11 speed.
 

Tadmcmichael

Member
Feb 27, 2023
6
3
Georgia
Still not sure if Specialized changed anything on the 2024s, but here is what SRAM said about the chainline:

Hello Tad,

Thanks for contacting SRAM Rider Support. Congrats on the new Eagle Transmission groupset on the way! Transmission is an amazing system for eBikes. We hope you get many wonderful miles dirtside with it.

I appreciate you taking the time to dive into your bike's specs and ensure your Transmission is optimized. I have good news on all fronts for you. The 104BCD is the only compatible kit with the Turbo Levo Gen3 bikes. Chainline can have the biggest impact if you change only the crankset to a different chainline option. In your case, since you're switching to the Transmission cassette as well, your system will line up with each other beautifully.

Let me know if you have any follow-up questions or concerns.

Cheers and happy riding,

Eli

SRAM Rider Support

Service and Technical Documents
 

Rich-H

Active member
Apr 3, 2023
150
109
Hampshire
Still not sure if Specialized changed anything on the 2024s, but here is what SRAM said about the chainline:

Hello Tad,

Thanks for contacting SRAM Rider Support. Congrats on the new Eagle Transmission groupset on the way! Transmission is an amazing system for eBikes. We hope you get many wonderful miles dirtside with it.

I appreciate you taking the time to dive into your bike's specs and ensure your Transmission is optimized. I have good news on all fronts for you. The 104BCD is the only compatible kit with the Turbo Levo Gen3 bikes. Chainline can have the biggest impact if you change only the crankset to a different chainline option. In your case, since you're switching to the Transmission cassette as well, your system will line up with each other beautifully.

Let me know if you have any follow-up questions or concerns.

Cheers and happy riding,

Eli

SRAM Rider Support

Service and Technical Documents
I believe the spider is unchanged on the MY24 bikes so the chainline will still be 52mm. SRAM have said that Transmission is fully compatible with a 52mm chainline.
 

CliffP

New Member
Jan 24, 2023
59
60
San Antonio Texas

🔥 2023 SRAM Eagle Key Features:

1️⃣ Robustness & Reliability - The toughest drivetrain ever
2️⃣ Shifting Under Load - The harder you pedal, the better it shifts
3️⃣ Ease of Use - Simplified maintenance, fitting, and operation
Now after owning the new transmission; I am underwhelmed. I own EMTBs with both SRAM electronic systems and one with XTR. I would take the XXO electric system first with the new shifter module the the XTR system ( the simplicity is worth something) then last the new transmission. I never thought I would say this but here it it…
 

Singletrackmind

Active member
Sep 17, 2020
468
424
San Diego, CA
Now after owning the new transmission; I am underwhelmed. I own EMTBs with both SRAM electronic systems and one with XTR. I would take the XXO electric system first with the new shifter module the the XTR system ( the simplicity is worth something) then last the new transmission. I never thought I would say this but here it it…
Going on my 1st ride today with new SRAM XX Transmission Drivetrain (XO cranks) on my new Orbea Wild. Have only rode it a couple miles on fireroad to set up my suspension. Have high hopes but wondering if it's worth the hype. Have a combination XTR/XT Drivetrain on my YT Decoy and have never had one issue. Super smooth shifting and incredibly reliable.
 

Tadmcmichael

Member
Feb 27, 2023
6
3
Georgia
I got the GX installed and I’m loving it. Installs easily and shifts are lightning quick. Whisper quiet as well. No more chain slap. The stock XO1 I had was way too finicky.

For me, was definitively worth the upgrade. 52mm chain line with a 36 Praxxis chainring works great. The kit came with a SRAM 34, but that puts a lot of wear on the higher gears.
 

Gyre

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2021
629
420
Pasadena, CA
This raises a question - if the T-type drivetrain is so good under load, is AXS Multishift back on the table for eMTBs with T-type drivetrains?
 

boytie

Active member
Jul 7, 2019
18
9
New Zealand

🔥 2023 SRAM Eagle Key Features:

1️⃣ Robustness & Reliability - The toughest drivetrain ever
2️⃣ Shifting Under Load - The harder you pedal, the better it shifts
3️⃣ Ease of Use - Simplified maintenance, fitting, and operation
Hi Rob. I watch your Youtube channel all the time. Like your stuff you post. Keep up the good work.

I wanted to add the SRAM GX Eagle AXS Transmission Drivetrain package to my Kenevo Expert 2021 but was told by the store where I brought my bike that this not compatible for most full power e-bikes. Solution they told me was to buy the Kenevo SL???? Seems also that the bikes need a new SRAM specific compatible frame and that you just can't fit this to any MTB. Would love to see you do a follow up video on if there will be some backwards compatibility version and what the challenges are in the double hanger on non compatible bikes.
 

G-Sport

Active member
Oct 7, 2022
270
209
Yorkshire
Won't work on the Kenevo SL (unless there is a new one coming out with the UDH). Should work (as I understand it) on most bikes that have the UDH so that is the thing to check. The biggest problem is the cassette being moved out 2.5mm, the UDH arrangement has space available to allow this shift whereas most other hangers don't.
It might be possible for hub makers to make hubs that space everything in the necessary 2.5mm and you could then run the T-type cassette and chain at least.
 
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Rob Rides EMTB

Administrator
Staff member
Subscriber
Jan 14, 2018
6,178
13,365
Surrey, UK
Hi Rob. I watch your Youtube channel all the time. Like your stuff you post. Keep up the good work.

I wanted to add the SRAM GX Eagle AXS Transmission Drivetrain package to my Kenevo Expert 2021 but was told by the store where I brought my bike that this not compatible for most full power e-bikes. Solution they told me was to buy the Kenevo SL???? Seems also that the bikes need a new SRAM specific compatible frame and that you just can't fit this to any MTB. Would love to see you do a follow up video on if there will be some backwards compatibility version and what the challenges are in the double hanger on non compatible bikes.
Thanks for watching!

The new T-Type transmisison is compatible with bikes that use the UDH (Universal Derailleur Hanger) standard. Most bikes over the past 1-2 years have UHD standard. However, the full power Kenevo doesnt (its an old frame design).

Here's a list of bikes, FYI SRAM Universal Derailleur Hanger Bikes

Full Power ebikes are most definitely compatible with Transmission (SRAM even introduced a motor powered by Brose that only work with Transmission for auto shifting!)

For non compatible bikes there might be a hack, but personally I wouldnt bother. Just the regular, non t-type AXS is still a worthy option for your full power Kenevo.
 

Rich-H

Active member
Apr 3, 2023
150
109
Hampshire
Hi Rob. I watch your Youtube channel all the time. Like your stuff you post. Keep up the good work.

I wanted to add the SRAM GX Eagle AXS Transmission Drivetrain package to my Kenevo Expert 2021 but was told by the store where I brought my bike that this not compatible for most full power e-bikes. Solution they told me was to buy the Kenevo SL???? Seems also that the bikes need a new SRAM specific compatible frame and that you just can't fit this to any MTB. Would love to see you do a follow up video on if there will be some backwards compatibility version and what the challenges are in the double hanger on non compatible bikes.
 

boytie

Active member
Jul 7, 2019
18
9
New Zealand
Thanks for watching!

The new T-Type transmisison is compatible with bikes that use the UDH (Universal Derailleur Hanger) standard. Most bikes over the past 1-2 years have UHD standard. However, the full power Kenevo doesnt (its an old frame design).

Here's a list of bikes, FYI SRAM Universal Derailleur Hanger Bikes

Full Power ebikes are most definitely compatible with Transmission (SRAM even introduced a motor powered by Brose that only work with Transmission for auto shifting!)

For non compatible bikes there might be a hack, but personally I wouldnt bother. Just the regular, non t-type AXS is still a worthy option for your full power Kenevo.
Thanks for the quick reply Rob. The upgrade version single hanger is good gear but my take for Return on Investment is it giving you no actual ride advantage but is pricy and only reason I wanted the double hanger was the added ride protection this gives you that the single hanger is its weakness. For now I am going to replace like for like and when I buy a new bike this will be one of my core requirements. All a learning curve.
 

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