Even many at Bosch said 85nm/ 600w was the sweet spot for performance and less wear on motor and drivetrain......but they did the update regardless.......presumably to satisfy those convinced of the virtue of more power.Yes ,arms race against DJI , they gotta be seen to be doing something , next stop lobbying the EU for further controls , to cap that DJI juggernaut ......
to be honest , with all my bikes , I am still happiest with my 625 wh Giant , 85nm , never needed more really but still bought 2 more bikes
A stronger Bosch SX and improvements for the CX coming on July 14th
- Thread starter knut7
- Start date
Prisondude
New Member
Been several days multiple attempts to update and can’t get response from manufacturer Haibike customer service is a ghost.
Dennyf
Member
I had to update my flow app to 1.28.9 in order to get the Bosch update. I got the 750W, but not the 100 Nm of torque.
I uninstalled the flow app, reinstalled it, then it showed the performance update for torque, installed that and bingo! Got the 100M Torque. My Bosch motor software version number remained the same: 16.19.0
I uninstalled the flow app, reinstalled it, then it showed the performance update for torque, installed that and bingo! Got the 100M Torque. My Bosch motor software version number remained the same: 16.19.0
Plummet
Flash Git
My gen 4 pole voima mode change wasn't available on the app. You had to take it to the bike shop and hook up diagnostics.
Plummet
Flash Git
Emtb + does not punch as hard immediately from a standstill. Its a smoother release of power with less chance of wheel spin. But, there's more power low down with less pedal input and there's more overrun. More overrun gets you up and over something than you can't pedal up because of pedal tagging.
Ultimately its s better power setting for technical climbing.
The overrun is hilarious when you make a mistake. You keep making the mistake until the overrun stops.
bullit398
Member
Having had a gen4 race, the overrun on this one is a million times more controlable. That one was fun but it could get away from you. Even the slightest pedal tap gave you 3 meters of no pedal power.
Joecrow
Active member
I got the go and updated the Flow app. yesterday evening and my 2 Haibikes today (a Gen 4 and 1a Gen 5) both updated successfully both have EMTB+ but although the Gen 5 has the 750W option there is no 100 Nm available, 85 max! I will try reloaded the Flow app. as per the post above by @Dennyf
Right? Linear gain is pretty crude. With EMTB+, there's no need for Race mode any more.
As nice as the new mode is, I'll still be doing most of my riding in EMTB Standard mode, unless I'm CERTAIN that the ride will be under 20 miles, 4000 feet, and not at racing speeds.
Honestly the modes are ridiculous and confusing, but I'm not surprised because the Germans complicate everything.
Now there are 8 modes to choose from with so much customization in terms of "assist" and "dynamics" on a -5 to +5 scale, without any concrete data about what those mean, or how the modes rank.
I want to see a table and/or graph for every mode:
-Power ratio or assistance vs input power curves
-Overrun amounts
-Peak power vs cadence curves
What does "dynamics" actually do and how does that relate to the arbitrary sliding scale number? Can you make Sport mode more powerful than Turbo by tweaking these sliders? Their communications on these modes could use some work. The Specialized app/system is so much more simple and intuitive.
Now there are 8 modes to choose from with so much customization in terms of "assist" and "dynamics" on a -5 to +5 scale, without any concrete data about what those mean, or how the modes rank.
I want to see a table and/or graph for every mode:
-Power ratio or assistance vs input power curves
-Overrun amounts
-Peak power vs cadence curves
What does "dynamics" actually do and how does that relate to the arbitrary sliding scale number? Can you make Sport mode more powerful than Turbo by tweaking these sliders? Their communications on these modes could use some work. The Specialized app/system is so much more simple and intuitive.
Update for Flow App iOS came today, 1.28.11 (178).
Roundbadge
Member
Tried for the 8th time just downloaded version , 1.28.11 (178). Still no 100nm.
What drag Bosch.
What drag Bosch.
Joecrow
Active member
Do you know if this version fixes the absence of the 100Nm option with the 1.28.09 (1104)?
bullit398
Member
I got this version yesterday and it gave me to 100nm.
dirt-diggler
Active member
I'm now more confused than ever by the different settings, how should I set it to get good range but still have a good level of assistance?
Dennyf
Member
The version of the flow app that I got to work was Android 1.28.9 in order to get the Bosch update.
Renton_Yorkshire
Active member
DangerousDave
Member
I agree. Bosch's descriptions are vague and confusing. Just give us the absolute values.
I assumed that overrun was adjustable through "dynamics," but the description from Bosch's website suggests otherwise,: "Dynamics: When starting, the drive unit can either provide gentle support or an immediate boost. The higher the value, the greater the acceleration. High dynamics can make hill starts and acceleration on steep ascents easier."
Quite frustrating that Bosch neither tells us how much overrun is provided in each mode, nor gives a way to adjust it. My biggest complaint with the regular e-mtb mode was the excessive overrun, especially when ratcheting. While some people may like it, I found it unintuitive and actually dangerous in certain situations to do a short 1/4 pedal and get several meters worth of acceleration.
Roundbadge
Member
I tried it
No go on 100nm
Went to the bike shop to look at my issue of only having 4 support modes total to choose from with EMTB+ not being one of them. This started after a warranty motor replacement. After updating the shop software they get an error stating that "there are no additional support modes available as it has been locked by the manufacture".
Rando_12345
E*POWAH Master
Just tested the bike with turbo 100nm 750w.
Good news: battery doesn't drain that much faster.
Bad news: system derated Hard after 26minutes. To be fair I did 500m ascending road climb in that time, but if you are aiming to get up big stuff, better to go down a level or two and take it easy. (It was pretty warm around 30c outside)
Good news: battery doesn't drain that much faster.
Bad news: system derated Hard after 26minutes. To be fair I did 500m ascending road climb in that time, but if you are aiming to get up big stuff, better to go down a level or two and take it easy. (It was pretty warm around 30c outside)
Truckeemtb
Member
Just got out on my new Vala today. Only 300 miles and 3 weeks in. Update came through on my android this am. Dual updates, one watts and one torque. Emtb+ , I quickly changed to minus three on dynamic and the surge is mostly gone. Traction is pretty solid. I went to 95 nm and 700 watts max. It's pretty amazing. Way more powerful than emtb with plus 3 assistance (minus 2 or 3 dynamic) that I was riding. I really can't get used to the dynamic mode, especially on the tech and chunk. Overall very impressed. Not as simple to tune as Levo or Fazua ride 60 since the adjustments are fairly meaningless. I really like the Fazua with rider watts in and motor watts out curve for tuning. Simple and easy to tune like other bikes, then acceleration way way down and good to go. Sold Gen3 Levo. Happy with the Vala and CX mototlr and 600 wh battery. I can get about to 6k climbing (before the update). Just bummed Bosch doesn't pair to Garmin watch. I don't really care a out the screen but like battery percentage and watt/ rider stats on watch like Specialized and Fazua motors. Anyway, overall stoked.
Truckeemtb
Member
Agreed I did the same today. I would like to have 5 options for eco on big days. I rarely use eco or turbo
JackieA
🚵♀️ Atalanta 💪
Managed yesterday to install the upgrade using my pixel 8 phone. Did need initially to remove my bike then reconnect it. The torque upgrade was available afterwards after switching the unit on
Sverre Andre
Member
Gen 5 ride impressions after 150km on the new update. (90% commuting so far.)
I'm really impressed by the performance.
The extra torque gives a much stronger acceleration and the additional watts are very noticeable when trying to maintain high speed up fast steep climbs.
My settings are:
Turbo +5 / +1 100Nm/750W
Emtb+ +5 / +1 100Nm/750W (might tune down dynamic to Zero. Need more testing)
Emtb +5 / 0 85Nm/600W
Tour+ 0 / 0 85Nw/600W
Weather's been warm lately. 20-30C . In this temperature, I see close to no change in battery consumption on my daily commute. 45km - 500meter elevation.
My tip is to play with the setting in the app.
Personally I like Turbo for transport, commuting and gravel transfers between trails. For trail riding I use Emtb (Now emtb+). Sometime Turbo if I'm hunting KOM's.
I hear some say that now Turbo and Emtb+ is the same, and others also that it's too much. Then I think you should try to tune down the dynamic on Emtb+ to have a more controllable experience. I's nice to feel you're in charge of the bike, not the other way around
Another thing I don't see many users mentioning, is how much smoother everything feels. Bosch did not only add a ton of power, but it seems like they also refined all the details on every aspect, and it's the total package that impresses me.
I'm really impressed by the performance.
The extra torque gives a much stronger acceleration and the additional watts are very noticeable when trying to maintain high speed up fast steep climbs.
My settings are:
Turbo +5 / +1 100Nm/750W
Emtb+ +5 / +1 100Nm/750W (might tune down dynamic to Zero. Need more testing)
Emtb +5 / 0 85Nm/600W
Tour+ 0 / 0 85Nw/600W
Weather's been warm lately. 20-30C . In this temperature, I see close to no change in battery consumption on my daily commute. 45km - 500meter elevation.
My tip is to play with the setting in the app.
Personally I like Turbo for transport, commuting and gravel transfers between trails. For trail riding I use Emtb (Now emtb+). Sometime Turbo if I'm hunting KOM's.
I hear some say that now Turbo and Emtb+ is the same, and others also that it's too much. Then I think you should try to tune down the dynamic on Emtb+ to have a more controllable experience. I's nice to feel you're in charge of the bike, not the other way around
Another thing I don't see many users mentioning, is how much smoother everything feels. Bosch did not only add a ton of power, but it seems like they also refined all the details on every aspect, and it's the total package that impresses me.
Prisondude
New Member
Didn’t help either but my bike needs a first service appointment so I’m dealing with it then.
Another guy with that problem found that his cellphone display was too small to fully scroll down and see the 100Nm option. Maybe same with you?
Prisondude
New Member
My cellphone is a huge screen I did manual check for updates. Bosch told me to contact my dealer since it could be Haibike not allowing it
Joecrow
Active member
Please let me/us know how that goes, I got the Flow app update to 1.28.11 (1105) today but still no 100 Nm on my Gen 5 Haibike.
Quick test of the upgrade/emtb+ addition on my Gen4 CX today via 1200m of Yorkshire Dales climbing confirms that emtb+ at +5 is much the same as Turbo @ +2. Switching between the two felt seamless/no difference. As suggested elsewhere has Turbo become redundant, I didn’t use it today. In the end tuned emtb+ down to + 2 as @ +5 I felt I was using more power/battery than needed and going faster uphill than necessary! Great to have the extra power, but it will drain the battery quicker…
