Will the torque/power of the Bosch Gen 5 increase this year with a software update?

Pedec said:
Rocky Mountain been making a 107nm e-bike since 2022. It totally a different design than other e-bike motors. The crank arms are not part of the motor so pedal strikes are less likely to hurt motor. The actual motor does not see water or dirt from the environment you are riding in. Motor power is very adjustable with nice display that shows lots of extra things. But Nobody seems to talk about it.
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Probably because RM is restructuring and very close to filing for bankruptcy protection. I wouldn't buy a Rocky Mountain bike because of that.
 
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Ps, I'm mostly in emtb. If I had extra power no doubt I'd use it on occasions for shits and giggles, but mostly I'd role with the existing emtb setting.
 
Pedec said:
Rocky Mountain been making a 107nm e-bike since 2022. It totally a different design than other e-bike motors. The crank arms are not part of the motor so pedal strikes are less likely to hurt motor. The actual motor does not see water or dirt from the environment you are riding in. Motor power is very adjustable with nice display that shows lots of extra things. But Nobody seems to talk about it.
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The Dynamee motor wasn’t very successful for several reasons, including the fact that it was only used by a niche brand like RM, it had high resistance when pedaling without motor assistance, significant pulley noise, and poor reliability of the electronic components. But what really made it unsuitable for most riders was that to access those 107 Nm and 700 watts, the rider had to push hard and fast on the pedals. Any rider who was out of shape perceived it as less powerful than a Bosch, Brose, or Shimano. And I say this after two years of use. I’ve tried DJI, and it’s a completely different story — not comparable to the Dynamee in any way.
 
Boogz83 said:
I think Bosch need to fix the issue with the motor bushes falling out of various frames before worrying about increasing power to 100nm!
The issue is happening on various makes of bike with gen 5 and Bosch are absolutely useless and still haven’t provided anyone with a fix!
Shocking service from a brand like Bosch
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Ben riding my Rail 8 Gen 5 hard for the last 1000 miles, mostly jump parks, motor bolt bushes still fine and present.
 
Also, Spesh released their new Brose motor with 110nm or so, Bosch isn't going to sit this one out, power update is happening.
 
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Updated with the new Levo motor. Clearly some motors to avoid if you'd like to soft pedal once in a while.
 
Upping torque 20% on bearings, bushes and gears designed for 85Nm sounds like a recipe for disaster. Compounded by the guy saying you don’t need to change gears as much. Sounds like it’s aimed at the Turbo in the 10 ring brigade.
 
Old Codger said:
Upping torque 20% on bearings, bushes and gears designed for 85Nm sounds like a recipe for disaster. Compounded by the guy saying you don’t need to change gears as much. Sounds like it’s aimed at the Turbo in the 10 ring brigade.
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I'd say that 85nm is currently being pushed through bearings, bushings and gears designed for 100nm...
 
gbcoke said:
Is that a rumor or a fact ? If the regular cx5 is bumped to 100nm and 700+ peak,what can we expect from a race version ?
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Rumors, but backed up by some facts.
This appeared very briefly on the Bosch website:

1000079635.jpg


I'll put you the translated version:

1000079634.jpg


In addition, Bosch on 31 dec 24 registered the trademark "Performance Line CX-R" (as well as another mysterious "Performance Line PX" registered on 28 Jan 2025):

1000079636.jpg
 
Old Codger said:
Upping torque 20% on bearings, bushes and gears designed for 85Nm sounds like a recipe for disaster. Compounded by the guy saying you don’t need to change gears as much. Sounds like it’s aimed at the Turbo in the 10 ring brigade.
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The motor was designed from the start to go way beyond 85 Nm. It's been said many times, Bosch knew the large stock of gen 4 bikes flooding the market so they kept it detunded so people would not be tempted to the latest and greatest
 
killerade said:
Come on, guys. I’m pretty sure they know what they’re doing. They’re not stupid — they wouldn’t release something that doesn’t work. :cool: ;)
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Absolutely agree.

Let's remember that Bosch has been in the ebike market long before other competitors, and I have no memory of a single “major” issue in any of their products.

And it is also the reason why I have always bought Bosch, and will probably continue to do so in the future.
 
I think the rumoured update really could be the great leveller - which will really leave Shimano as the only motor manufacturer with an 85Nm full fat motor.
Which makes me question whether they’ve got something up their sleeve as well.
 
Old Codger said:
Upping torque 20% on bearings, bushes and gears designed for 85Nm sounds like a recipe for disaster. Compounded by the guy saying you don’t need to change gears as much. Sounds like it’s aimed at the Turbo in the 10 ring brigade.
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The bearings don't die from torque figures, especially because that force dissipates into rotational energy. Bearings usually die from water ingress and letting them stay like that over winter or an excessive time, rust builds up, the tiny rust particles grind down the surfaces, slowly there is more and more play in them, add hard impact forces(jumps, rock strikes, etc...)acting onto them just adds up to a failure point.

I am running the same bearings on my emtb frame and wheels for the last 2,5 years 5000km later except for an occasional squeak no issues. What I do is after washing do a short ride km or 2 to press out the possible water that got in and after the season end open the seals with a pick clean out with degreaser and fill with new grease. On the frame I turn them for about 180° as these don't turn but stay in the same position.
It works for me and the only expense is the grease.
 
Old Codger said:
So if we upgrade to 100Nm all of the headroom has gone.
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I can’t believe that any motor company, especially one with the resources of Bosch, would design any motor to only just meet a power requirement.

Far more likely that they’ve designed it from the outset to take 3x the output torque/power, it’s an e-bike motor designed to last at least the warranty period and not an F1 car to last 1 race where they pare things back until it fails and then go back one step.

If Bosch are offering this to existing CX Gen 5 units then it’s a fair bet that they wouldn’t be doing it if they weren’t confident it wouldn’t increase motor failures and by extension warranty claims.
 
Increased torque/power is one thing but what will this do to efficiency / range? Hoping that it won't result in more battery sappage, I guess you can always tune the modes down a bit in the flow app
 
RSG said:
Increased torque/power is one thing but what will this do to efficiency / range? Hoping that it won't result in more battery sappage, I guess you can always tune the modes down a bit in the flow app
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No such thing as a free lunch, more power = more energy consumed all other things being equal.

Good to have the option though!
 
Power sells (like mega pixels in cameras and phones, even if u don´t need it). So customers and also brands are asking for it for sure to keep up with competion. So supose we are going to have it : Power numbers and maybe some algorythm improvement. THere are not free lunches, so maybe some less autonomy.
 
ggx said:
Power sells (like mega pixels in cameras and phones, even if u don´t need it). So customers and also brands are asking for it for sure to keep up with competion. So supose we are going to have it : Power numbers and maybe some algorythm improvement. THere are not free lunches, so maybe some less autonomy.
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That's the game that DJI are playing, for commercial gain of course.
 
zizajaun said:
I heard a bike industry guy predict that they would bump it up to 100+ Nm this year to compete with the DJI Avinox. I don't know if he was just speculating or he had insider knowledge. (He sold bikes with Bosch so it's also possible he was intentionally spreading misinformation.) This is important for me as I'm looking for an emtb and I don't know how much advantage there is to getting a DJI-equipped bike vs Bosch Gen 5.
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Someone has done a video on YouTube about it but with the new 750w capping regulations away to come in force anything above what they offer now will end up being banned! Look at the testing from The guys at Emtb think tank are we dumb 2025 testing over 30 ebikes Bosch came in second on a really tough technical climb way ahead of DJi! The article it's really needs to be read through though its very interesting!
E-MOUNTAINBIKE Think Tank 2025 – Are we dumb?

Source: E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine
E-MOUNTAINBIKE Think Tank 2025 – Are we dumb?
 
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