Alexbn921
Well-known member
I wipe and lube after every ride. I like my drivertrain clean and noise free.
New Pinion integrated gearbox and motor (MGU)
- Thread starter Mteam
- Start date
yorkshire89
E*POWAH Master
This sounds really promising and something I want on my next ebike. Interested to hear how it rides and how battery life compares to other ebikes.
Are there any pics of the other screen options and how they're mounted? I'd be keen to get away from a screen next to the grips and have something a bit more minimal for changing gears/modes.
Are there any pics of the other screen options and how they're mounted? I'd be keen to get away from a screen next to the grips and have something a bit more minimal for changing gears/modes.
yorkshire89
E*POWAH Master
Just after posting I saw some other pics in your first link in this thread, thanks!
I guess you are going to want to see what gear you are in, I just want to get rid of anything that's likely to break off in a crash, and the screen next to the grip is still a bit exposed.
Maybe they can have something like the shimano screen tucked behind the bars, or just a set of LED's on the top tube for the future...
Still, it sounds like a big move forward
I think they have an option for a top tube display and simple switch unit.Just after posting I saw some other pics in your first link in this thread, thanks!
View attachment 118965
View attachment 118966
I guess you are going to want to see what gear you are in, I just want to get rid of anything that's likely to break off in a crash, and the screen next to the grip is still a bit exposed.
Maybe they can have something like the shimano screen tucked behind the bars, or just a set of LED's on the top tube for the future...
Still, it sounds like a big move forward
Rob Hancill on Instagram: "Holy sh1ft 🏅😱😱 @pinion.eu #emtb #shift"
266 likes, 16 comments - Rob Hancill (@robridesemtb) on Instagram: "Holy sh1ft 🏅😱😱 @pinion.eu #emtb #shift"
www.instagram.com
RiderOnTheStorm
Well-known member
More I read about integrated motor and gearbox units, more skeptical I become about the value add.
In my opinion, it's basically introducing more mechanical complexity, slapping more electronics prone to failure, making your bike's transmission more difficult to repair (on your own), creating a single point of failure, and all this at a higher cost!
Aren't we talking about ebikes here, and not about high powered motorcycles that would clearly justify the need of a gearbox?
C'mon, this sounds to me more like luxury than anything essential on eMTBs... It'll good for the business though!
In my opinion, it's basically introducing more mechanical complexity, slapping more electronics prone to failure, making your bike's transmission more difficult to repair (on your own), creating a single point of failure, and all this at a higher cost!
Aren't we talking about ebikes here, and not about high powered motorcycles that would clearly justify the need of a gearbox?
C'mon, this sounds to me more like luxury than anything essential on eMTBs... It'll good for the business though!
If you don’t want one, don’t buy one. For those of us that do, we can look forward to to it and talk about it until they arrive.
Well seeing as EMTB's are not essential at all then I don't understand your point.
CliffP
New Member
I feel like the time when most of the great sports cars went dual clutch (paddle shifting) something about a manual transmission on a race track… we know that the twin clutch cars were faster but took shifting and dumbed it down.
Now to EMTBs. I get it that this is progress but I like the work of shifting and being caught off guard from time to time. I need the mental stimulation. I know we will all get use to it and will be faster but with some progress the shift may be a down shift. Peace
It's about €1069 . So ballpark about the same as a Gen4, EP8, Mag S.
But then you don't have to spend another €3000 on a T-type transmission for longish lasting and smooth shifting. OK, that's with the necessary bits and you could be cheap and just spend an another €1000 for your mech/cassette etc .. So it would still be about double the price of the Pinion.
Even if you went with a basic Deore setup, still cheaper or similar ish once you take into account belt etc.
Yes, we get by with derailleurs ! They work, they're efficient .. but they're exposed to a permanently hostile environment. Putting all the transmission in a nice little box protects things and massively increases their longevity.
Arguably it's bad for business as you could buy that and then not spend hundreds or thousands each year on wear/damage replacement transmission parts.
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It’s no different in principle to SRAM AXS. You still press the shift button and it’ll shift a gear. Up or down. The actual process of shifting and the feel is very similar
Or, you can turn on auto shift. This will automatically shift for you, but only when you are coasting, to make sure you are in the best selected gear to start pedalling again.
I think this would be good when hitting a fast section of a trail - the cadence always in the sweet spot for when you start pedalling again.
If this is Mountain Biking for you, you really want to consider riding some different trails.
Hopefully your brains subconscious is doing all that for you and the stimulation is coming from everything else !!!
I can't remember the last time I had to consciously think about changing gear.
Here's an example of "Oh oh, wow, fantastic, a chance to change gear - some stimulation ..."
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yorkshire89
E*POWAH Master
We are going to have to wait and see how reliable the system is but I'd say it's better having a single point of failure (that will be a straight forward warranty swap) rather than many.
I've broken motors, ripped mechs/hangers off, snapped chains, broken teeth on cassettes, sheared chainrings off spiders. All repairable myself apart from the motor but a pain and expense.
Moving all the weight off the back wheel and low down on the bike will make handling and suspension work better.
Is it actually a higher cost than a top of the range current motor and groupset?
Just been able to change gear without spinning the cranks is a massive benefit.
It's not going to be for everyone but it makes sense to alot of people.
luna87824
E*POWAH Master
Not one NHRA Pro Stock Motorcycle uses a belt for better efficiency...They are not strong enough....
I get that but it certainly doesn't have to be depending on the ride. I hot wax mine till winter.
Just been looking at some weights. And costs.
Pinion 12 Speed MGU: 4.1 KG
720Wh 48v Battery: 3.8 KG
Total: 7.9KG
Bosch CX: 2.9KG
Bosch 36v 750Wh: 4.4KG
Total: 7.3KG
Pinion system is 600g heavier, but there’s no need for a derailleur or cassette. Caveat; there is a chainring at the back for the belt that I’ve not factored in.
SRAM XX Cassette: 384g
SRAM XX Mech: 472g
Total: 845g
Additional Cost (£1285 RRP)
So Bosch CX, 750wh and XX Transmission: 8145g
Pinion system and 720Wh battery: 7900g
I didn’t factor in the chain or belt, but a SRAM XX chain is 239g. From what I can see a Gates Carbon belt is 88g. So even more weight saving there.
All in the Pinion potentially will be quite a bit lighter than SRAM’s premium drivetrain and CX motor system.
Pinion 12 Speed MGU: 4.1 KG
720Wh 48v Battery: 3.8 KG
Total: 7.9KG
Bosch CX: 2.9KG
Bosch 36v 750Wh: 4.4KG
Total: 7.3KG
Pinion system is 600g heavier, but there’s no need for a derailleur or cassette. Caveat; there is a chainring at the back for the belt that I’ve not factored in.
SRAM XX Cassette: 384g
SRAM XX Mech: 472g
Total: 845g
Additional Cost (£1285 RRP)
So Bosch CX, 750wh and XX Transmission: 8145g
Pinion system and 720Wh battery: 7900g
I didn’t factor in the chain or belt, but a SRAM XX chain is 239g. From what I can see a Gates Carbon belt is 88g. So even more weight saving there.
All in the Pinion potentially will be quite a bit lighter than SRAM’s premium drivetrain and CX motor system.
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Is that because they aren't strong enough perhaps?
Alexbn921
Well-known member
Another great example. You're on a roll dude. I'll make sure to use a chain on my drag eMTB.
Alexbn921
Well-known member
I have a very hard time running XX1 on an ebike that seems to wear out parts at a very accelerated rate. I looks like the pinon MGU is cheaper than a Sram drivetrain and it includes the motor.
Doug Stampfer
Well-known member
Is there a variable speed motor that senses what output is required & supplies it that could eliminate the need for a gearbox? Seems to me all the required sensors & software is there just not the motor.
Well done Rob, been thinking about doing it yesterday as I had a feeling it could be close, decided to add up to your calculation, so checked the approximate weights of the gates rear and front sprockets as the front sprocket is probably not included into the MGU weight. There is also the belt tensioner and the belt snubber at the rear.
Rear sprockets: https://www.bike24.com/p2141322.html
So adding these into the calculation(using the happy medium as I do not know which tooth count sprockets are being used) it adds up to:
Rear sprockets: https://www.bike24.com/p2141322.html
- 22-Teeth CDX - 63g
- 24-Teeth CDX - 73g
- 26-Teeth CDX - 103g
- 39 teeth - 63 g
- 46 teeth - 95 g
- 50 teeth - 84 g
- Pinion BT1-Riemenspanner - 190 g
- Gates Carbon drive Snubber - 42 g
So adding these into the calculation(using the happy medium as I do not know which tooth count sprockets are being used) it adds up to:
- Pinion 12 MGU, FIT 720Wh 48v Battery, Gates belt & sprockets: 8388 g
- Bosch CX, 750wh and XX Transmission: 8384 g
+185g for SRAM XX Bosch 34t chainringWell done Rob, been thinking about doing it yesterday as I had a feeling it could be close, decided to add up to your calculation, so checked the approximate weights of the gates rear and front sprockets as the front sprocket is probably not included into the MGU weight. There is also the belt tensioner and the belt snubber at the rear.
Rear sprockets: https://www.bike24.com/p2141322.html
Front sprockets: https://www.bike24.com/p2181007.html
- 22-Teeth CDX - 63g
- 24-Teeth CDX - 73g
- 26-Teeth CDX - 103g
Belt tensioner: PINION BT1 Riemenspanner für Gates Riemen - Bikebude24 - Shop, 114,98
- 39 teeth - 63 g
- 46 teeth - 95 g
- 50 teeth - 84 g
Gates Belt Snubber: https://www.bike24.com/p2141597.html
- Pinion BT1-Riemenspanner - 190 g
- Gates Carbon drive Snubber - 42 g
So adding these into the calculation(using the happy medium as I do not know which tooth count sprockets are being used) it adds up to:
It all comes pretty much even
- Pinion 12 MGU, FIT 720Wh 48v Battery, Gates belt & sprockets: 8388 g
- Bosch CX, 750wh and XX Transmission: 8384 g
(I forgot to add that to my calcs!).Ps - XX Transmission group set for Bosch is £1800 RRP.
All motors are variable speeds. It's not the motor that needs the gearbox (or derailleur and cassette), it's your legs. Because an E-MTB are pedal assist you need to keep your cranks in a comfortable cadence, that is why you need gears of some sort. If you just purely had a motor driving the bike (a motorcycle) you wouldn't need any gears.
Awesome, so the MGU is still a few grams ahead+185g for SRAM XX Bosch 34t chainring
Ps - XX Transmission group set for Bosch is £1800 RRP.
... for your second point yeah exactly
I know, the MGU is basically a no brainer...of course after some first real world reviews...I just watched a really good YT half an hour interview from a guy of elektrofahrrad24.de with the representative from Pinion at the Eurobike...they have been testing and working on this for the last 5 years. In between he in a way mentioned that this is just the begining, and that their boss is hungry for more, so we can hope for further development. I am really looking forward to this...
Rob, if you haven’t already done so, please talk to Leo about this and see if you can nudge him in the right direction to either use the Pinion MGU with belt drive, or see how close Bosch is to developing their own and tell him we want it in the Voima or Sonni! either one or both! Since I already have the race pack Voima, I’d get the DH Sonni.+185g for SRAM XX Bosch 34t chainring
Ps - XX Transmission group set for Bosch is £1800 RRP.
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It looks a lot different to the E 1.8 from back in 2012. It ended up not making it to market. Maybe it needed more development.
Pinion Drive System = E-bike Porn
The Pinion E1.8 electric bike drive system will make any decent E-bike enthusiast’s mouth water. Pinion is another German manufacturer who is making huge strides in the high-end electric bi…
www.electricbike.com
Translation of the transcript from @emtbeast 's video above :
I've done it as a Spoiler so it doesn't fill the thread with 32 minutes of conversation !
I've done it as a Spoiler so it doesn't fill the thread with 32 minutes of conversation !
Intro and greeting
0:05
Welcome to ElektroFahn24 We are now at the pine stand
0:10
And behind us, which is probably one of the innovations here at the fair on the Oberbike
0:17
most vertebrae caused most sensation. It is about a unit
0:23
Motor and gearbox what that is exactly how it was developed and what the idea
0:29
Behind it is someone to explain to us by the subject, namely the Dirk von Bread
0:35
welcome thank you thank you for taking your time yes you are well informed what that
0:42
Good bit behind us here concern a bit yes you did something very special you actually have
0:48
yes, the drives how it has been dug up on the market with a blow with a blow and ensured that the
0:55
five years okay all right, we definitely started a lot
1:00
improve because we are no longer at zero in e-bike technology development but the whole
1:06
Industry and a lot of around the world have had their experiences with e-bikes and they are usually great
1:11
As for the driving experience but at the latest when it comes to combining two drive elements
1:18
If it goes really elementary for the savings of his e-bike, we now know that it is actually
1:25
Must get better if that means we have engines that simply circuit
1:31
In some form, destroy actually, so that means they are enormous maintenance and wear-prone
1:37
Yes, we have had this experience very often lately and we have started to say we develop two
1:43
Components that do not come from different manufacturers and somehow have to work with each other, but we connect the engine and gearbox circuit
1:50
In a hand made from one hand for each other, both the engine for the
1:55
Circuit as the circuit for the engine and we present it here that did not fall from heaven then we have been working for a very long time and
2:01
In recent years it has been asked again and again and that is so obvious and that is actually the logical consequence of dear people from within
2:08
But a motorcycle gear and we only had to nod friendly and say that is definitely a great idea and today we can finally say openly
2:15
We have been working on it for a very long time and can finally present this now that is mature. We present the system together with
2:22
new launch partners big brands from industry, I can then like this
2:27
To list again and then there are 30 models that are already starting this year in the series
2:33
means the first bikes on the street will be seen this year and in the course of next year the big fallout will go into detail
2:40
That was that now it is really the input from outside you
What was the impetus for the development of the drive?
2:45
you just explained you you have been asked about it very often or someone has simply internally
2:51
Boredom and said well our names are nice and nice but actually it is um
2:58
Of course and no so we hear exactly what we um what happens outside of course we are part
3:03
The industry we are cyclists from the heart we know e-bikes but by heart but of course we also have
3:09
To say an intrinsic motivation we want our drive technology that we have been in classic for 10 years now
3:16
Bicycles but also placed in e-bikes with rear engines have successfully placed it to a new level we want
3:22
that simply again on, so to speak, what is obvious that both systems interlock and
3:28
So that a lot of advantages combine that we also take it in hand and we were always clear we can
3:33
We do we have to find the right partners we have to have the right brands that start the start
3:39
enable and we found that five years ago and have now all gone this way together and only
3:45
Through the partners alone, such outstanding results occur incredibly compact if you
How does so much technology fit in such narrow space?
3:51
I don't know that something really belongs here, which somehow somehow alone alone this little name
3:58
So because many engines have been so big so far and you still have the gearbox
4:04
somehow got with exactly exactly we are hardly bigger than one
4:09
Classic mid -engine so we combine here in Full Power Motor that is in comparison I catch with the
4:15
Hard in the middle of comparison we are at 85 Newton meters of torque we deliver why I say that in comparison
4:20
Or about that, I'll explain again later and then we combine the M
IT one with twelve gears so we have
4:27
Twelve gears integrated so far, two -way levels were already known in engines, which was available from some manufacturers
4:32
Others already offer this or have already presented it years ago as a concept studio is usually huge big and super heavy and
4:39
We have created a unit here because of our compact gearbox technology and the yes of the
4:44
Possibility through internal that we have built up in recent years keep the motor with electronics we look
4:49
To offer us very compact room again in detail and that means we have one
4:55
Unit is 4 kg difficult this is in summer if you compare the
5:00
Motors that are available so far are 2.6 2.7 2.8 kilos depending on
5:06
Three in front, yes we have then we have kilos more, so to speak that
5:13
We apologize yes all the more than that we will distribute it into the center of the wheel that
5:19
means we bring the complete weight into the middle and very deep and actually save what we do
5:26
All the pain already causes that we no longer need open cassettes we don't need a big one
5:33
Sharees that are exposed to the environmental influences and in the end the driver and the driver and in the end
5:38
of the engine somehow always have to take over and what we have experienced is that the circuit is becoming increasingly stable
5:44
had to turn backward development again, so to speak, as then more stable chains and so on because the drives just open for a very long time
5:51
more and more and so on were trimmed and so on and the e-bike use was developed a bit back again, the circuit was developed
5:57
No longer faster the circuit became more and more massive and you have more and more load on the hacker
6:03
has and what you actually have here is not what is there but what is gone and the payment of the Spaniards im
6:10
Upper 600 grams at the rear and if you actually compare that on a real level you actually have to
6:16
Compare an engine with a closed rear wheel hub and when you say it has two kilos here
6:22
in it and here a motor of the three is then kilos are lighter and of course it allows it to be completely
6:28
Other secondary drives you can see this in the TB frame
6:34
A timing belt is completely new and ensures that it is simply in the box and that
6:40
Pretty long balanced and that for a long time yes this unit you actually say the keyword for a long time
6:45
Wild get me just to the point I would like to deal with the fact that we because I also have a little bit of bashing against against
6:51
other circuit systems have made because they weld because they are exposed to the dirt and so
6:57
Further you have an uncanny effort you have a setting effort you have to live in the end that you often empty
7:03
Valance has because you have to buy a lot available is now also available
7:08
yes right and even if it is available that is not cheap and it can actually do that in the 21st century
7:14
no longer give that you produce so much throw away products just because in principle you have decided to shit at the wrong moment
7:20
has decided and breaking your teeth chain cracks are provoked to bend etc.
7:27
If you try to deal with it now, but actually flixschusteneren and our eyes and what we have here is a maintenance -free one is that
7:34
For the first time, an EMTB is as reliable as you know how to know electric vehicles. It should then be
7:40
Sits in the button, so to speak, drives and gets and gets a service interval and you don't have to do much anymore and we say about that about
7:46
Micromobility In order to really make a turnaround in mobility, you also need bicycles
7:52
E-bikes that have enough for the demands of customers as far as they are because they are used to them
7:59
Do not want to do with screws and tinkering and now do not do my bike here a bit but we talk about vehicle concepts
8:05
And we'll come right away. We have very exciting bikes that are also correct for everyday life and
8:10
We will be expectation interval of 10,000 km yes and everything it needs is I think an oil change when I
8:16
Right right right yes we have already written that on the walls and communicates in advance that is also what is in pine
8:21
Classically the case is we say an oil change every 10,000 km that ensures that
8:27
Simply for the fact that the gearbox remains smooth that everything is safe and because there is also condenses every now and then
can form in the gearbox due to
8:33
Temperature fluctuations are our recommendation and it actually signals again so we talk
8:38
Here of 10,000 km even for Heavy commuters or computers, this is already
8:44
a house number to drive together
Is there enough space for large batteries?
8:51
Is there a problem with your unit when it comes to thinking about the battery in such an e-bike here
8:58
It is a good keyword in it and then I have now spoken a lot about the drive unit and the entire drive train
9:04
also about the gates belt etc. but what is of course elementary that our unity is
9:09
The periphery needs and there are partners on board the one perfectly
9:15
has modified our claims and at the same time a big backing in the bicycle industry has the fit
9:22
System The fit systems are already established for many German manufacturers.
9:28
5000 dealers all over Europe means that we are also the best for the roof of Benelux and uh other regions
9:35
Equipped so that there is no inhibition threshold when we stop these bikes come into the market that the
9:40
Feel well picked up behind yourself from the front very important point that the circulation also works and if
9:45
You come to the peripheral components that is super good that we just all of our new ones
9:51
Launch partners offer completely different posts We take a look at this from the cargo bike via compact bikes with integrated external
9:58
Battery with the Superstell Textending variants ImtBs with super clean cockpits then again large displays or just one
10:04
App that also makes all the functions and adjustments possible for the NGU
10:10
It offers it all of this according to his needs to tuning all this is the periphery of fit and
10:15
That means the whole system is running on fit and so it is possible that we have a um battery here in one
10:23
Three different battery sizes can be accommodated from 500 700 to belief 960 watt hours okay
10:30
And that in turn still combined with Range extender etc. So we have great modularity and the manufacturers are looking for
10:35
the best concept of yes you have the reliability of the drive
How do the individual parts of the MGU work together?
10:41
emphasizes okay he definitely did it that you can see here visually
10:46
Get everything in a case with reliability, give us one
10:52
Small insight as he is so trusting at the point because
11:00
There are no bicycles outside on the market but you have to test it in any way
11:05
Have before how can you imagine what did you do so to climb the club I suggest we look at the little one
11:11
Cutting model on yes and then let's go into detail okay make a great reliability our keyword
11:16
Okay and why is it as credible or like at the moment
11:21
Of course, this is because what we do here in its border
11:26
proven technology is that means we have the evaluated pine switching system in it is one
11:31
BREINTREDY TRAVITION The total of over 100 manufacturers in total over several million kilometers in
11:37
Market is already exactly that and we have the reliability because it has long been proof, so to speak, because we have
11:43
Cyclists equipped worldwide, these are customers of us insane feedback we have
11:48
Mileage of over 100,000 kilometers near 200,000 kilometers are now in the past 12 years
11:54
Gathered together with a person in a gearbox and somehow with a maximum maintenance of one
12:00
Oil change in the year and we now have to gear into this same head wheel as we do in
12:06
The pine classic gears have just combined with a yes maintenance -free and above all
12:11
Wear wine brushless engine This engine of the one does not fall from the sky, but it is in the automotive industry
12:17
And we have already taken care of that in the automotive industry at 100,000 in steering drives
12:22
Motors that's so power steering engines The engine actually comes from
12:28
Germany we have with the manufacturer for which the e-bike application modified, which means that we
12:34
Have it with stronger magnet equips we have the control um again very precisely
12:39
looked at and just also developed the entire software in the house, which means that the complete electronics
12:44
Now you can see here on the other side with a chip of the chip is made for the Rob
12:50
and the
is in use when it is always controlled very quickly and very precisely engines
12:57
should and that means we have a high-end components through this combination of these this combination of these this combination of these this combination of these
13:03
Very, very sensitive control and, as I said, the engine as such works without wear that gearbox works without wear and tear.
13:10
Just days of the corridors. There is no great care to change oil all
13:15
10,000 km that was not wearing no Justays none
13:22
Nevertheless, the interaction with the engine is something new for those for the gearbox, at least you have at least on the
13:29
Materials on the forehead wheels What changed.
13:35
But at some point there is also it but it is definitely so that we are already a piece of technology
13:40
So have revised far as an example what you can feel it.
13:46
Interior toothing that of the gears in such a way that they simply grind more often and thus, so to speak, that the
13:54
The power transmission, so to speak, can be felt directly and we are not in large empty path in the IM
13:59
Crank arm is noticeable, so to speak, and then it is so that we
14:05
Technology, of course, as far as the noise technology is concerned, have revised a bit overall, which means that we have set it up on it
14:11
that is switched electrically.
14:18
Sensors actually and um the interaction of motor power that in
14:23
Every situation can be switched, so we can switch in the stand under load always the same in every course
14:30
Precise and we also switch on the stand, which is also in many of them with naturally with chain circuit
14:36
Actually not working at all and that means we combine that on top still with semi -automatic
14:41
Switching processes that means there is a function that works that is embedded in the smartphone system in the
14:47
SmartShift technology yes and the selection already means that I can
14:53
So roles always sounds so banal but while I don't pedalate, for example, in the trail or just if I just drive down a mountain
14:59
Always adjust the gear to the speed so that when I step back I am in the right course and that does that
15:05
In the trail incredibly a lot of fun, I can say that you can simply concentrate on it if you stop in the flow trail
15:11
rises above the group is still in the third gear of climbing has a bit of a tunnel view of
15:17
The effort goes into the trail in the trail that it goes on the left and right and you do not switch and the good one is in that in that
15:23
You don't have to do it for a moment because the system is on and the other is when I am silent from the traffic lights, I always drive in
15:29
Right gear pure that we actually mean that we have a starting gear that is automatically when I stop
What proportion did the bicycle manufacturers have in the development?
15:36
How such an engine should feel or he has the driving experience with it
15:41
from somewhere got a bit of expertise since it was a lot of dangers that you have done there
15:47
So maybe that's even a component so we have a new launch partner who accompany them
15:52
We have shown us the first ideas very early on.
15:58
We can do that we want to do that, think you want to participate and then all those who stand here say yes
16:04
Let's do it no matter what comes that is a great idea. We believe that the future we do that and this
16:09
Brands that we have we speak of redwild Simplon Bulls Flyer are there
16:14
Heads in the background they have so many e-bike experience if you bring it all together in collectively and have that
16:20
We did and we listened here and we made the coordination with the one. Then it creates a system what benchmark is that
16:27
So in terms of sensitivity, it also falls into the fate out coordination of the individual support modes
16:33
Need that progressive mode must be integrated that means adaptive to the power of the driver, so to speak, the driver react
16:41
we did with humans yes that is an industry sizes again Lutz Schäfer, for example, at Rotwild yes or
16:46
Stefan Sahms who is on the road for Bulls and also for flyers that means that means
16:52
Are people who have a lot of EMTB experiences but we also have a very big pool on
16:58
Test drivers in the house The incognito prototypes come every day
17:
04
From the logs on everything that occurs in the test drive, so to speak,
17:09
Is and give us indications of the modification or settings.
17:15
So last five years in the overall picture that has already been created very down. The units now offers the opportunity
Why does the first MGU now have twelve gears?
17:20
There were 12 gears to drive you considering you also have other gears with fewer gears
17:28
I somehow keep going to 9 or 6 or so, of course, and of course we always have that
17:33
made that we looked in which area of application how many corridors we are sensible how much bandwidth are full and what we have here is
17:40
In fact, a wide variety of variants of the MG are that makes it possible again so many different ones
17:46
To bring models and as you can see here there is a small abbreviation on this badge this is that
17:52
Speed in the electrical version actually differs in the power of the engine, but in the total in the total in
0:05
Welcome to ElektroFahn24 We are now at the pine stand
0:10
And behind us, which is probably one of the innovations here at the fair on the Oberbike
0:17
most vertebrae caused most sensation. It is about a unit
0:23
Motor and gearbox what that is exactly how it was developed and what the idea
0:29
Behind it is someone to explain to us by the subject, namely the Dirk von Bread
0:35
welcome thank you thank you for taking your time yes you are well informed what that
0:42
Good bit behind us here concern a bit yes you did something very special you actually have
0:48
yes, the drives how it has been dug up on the market with a blow with a blow and ensured that the
0:55
five years okay all right, we definitely started a lot
1:00
improve because we are no longer at zero in e-bike technology development but the whole
1:06
Industry and a lot of around the world have had their experiences with e-bikes and they are usually great
1:11
As for the driving experience but at the latest when it comes to combining two drive elements
1:18
If it goes really elementary for the savings of his e-bike, we now know that it is actually
1:25
Must get better if that means we have engines that simply circuit
1:31
In some form, destroy actually, so that means they are enormous maintenance and wear-prone
1:37
Yes, we have had this experience very often lately and we have started to say we develop two
1:43
Components that do not come from different manufacturers and somehow have to work with each other, but we connect the engine and gearbox circuit
1:50
In a hand made from one hand for each other, both the engine for the
1:55
Circuit as the circuit for the engine and we present it here that did not fall from heaven then we have been working for a very long time and
2:01
In recent years it has been asked again and again and that is so obvious and that is actually the logical consequence of dear people from within
2:08
But a motorcycle gear and we only had to nod friendly and say that is definitely a great idea and today we can finally say openly
2:15
We have been working on it for a very long time and can finally present this now that is mature. We present the system together with
2:22
new launch partners big brands from industry, I can then like this
2:27
To list again and then there are 30 models that are already starting this year in the series
2:33
means the first bikes on the street will be seen this year and in the course of next year the big fallout will go into detail
2:40
That was that now it is really the input from outside you
What was the impetus for the development of the drive?
2:45
you just explained you you have been asked about it very often or someone has simply internally
2:51
Boredom and said well our names are nice and nice but actually it is um
2:58
Of course and no so we hear exactly what we um what happens outside of course we are part
3:03
The industry we are cyclists from the heart we know e-bikes but by heart but of course we also have
3:09
To say an intrinsic motivation we want our drive technology that we have been in classic for 10 years now
3:16
Bicycles but also placed in e-bikes with rear engines have successfully placed it to a new level we want
3:22
that simply again on, so to speak, what is obvious that both systems interlock and
3:28
So that a lot of advantages combine that we also take it in hand and we were always clear we can
3:33
We do we have to find the right partners we have to have the right brands that start the start
3:39
enable and we found that five years ago and have now all gone this way together and only
3:45
Through the partners alone, such outstanding results occur incredibly compact if you
How does so much technology fit in such narrow space?
3:51
I don't know that something really belongs here, which somehow somehow alone alone this little name
3:58
So because many engines have been so big so far and you still have the gearbox
4:04
somehow got with exactly exactly we are hardly bigger than one
4:09
Classic mid -engine so we combine here in Full Power Motor that is in comparison I catch with the
4:15
Hard in the middle of comparison we are at 85 Newton meters of torque we deliver why I say that in comparison
4:20
Or about that, I'll explain again later and then we combine the M
IT one with twelve gears so we have
4:27
Twelve gears integrated so far, two -way levels were already known in engines, which was available from some manufacturers
4:32
Others already offer this or have already presented it years ago as a concept studio is usually huge big and super heavy and
4:39
We have created a unit here because of our compact gearbox technology and the yes of the
4:44
Possibility through internal that we have built up in recent years keep the motor with electronics we look
4:49
To offer us very compact room again in detail and that means we have one
4:55
Unit is 4 kg difficult this is in summer if you compare the
5:00
Motors that are available so far are 2.6 2.7 2.8 kilos depending on
5:06
Three in front, yes we have then we have kilos more, so to speak that
5:13
We apologize yes all the more than that we will distribute it into the center of the wheel that
5:19
means we bring the complete weight into the middle and very deep and actually save what we do
5:26
All the pain already causes that we no longer need open cassettes we don't need a big one
5:33
Sharees that are exposed to the environmental influences and in the end the driver and the driver and in the end
5:38
of the engine somehow always have to take over and what we have experienced is that the circuit is becoming increasingly stable
5:44
had to turn backward development again, so to speak, as then more stable chains and so on because the drives just open for a very long time
5:51
more and more and so on were trimmed and so on and the e-bike use was developed a bit back again, the circuit was developed
5:57
No longer faster the circuit became more and more massive and you have more and more load on the hacker
6:03
has and what you actually have here is not what is there but what is gone and the payment of the Spaniards im
6:10
Upper 600 grams at the rear and if you actually compare that on a real level you actually have to
6:16
Compare an engine with a closed rear wheel hub and when you say it has two kilos here
6:22
in it and here a motor of the three is then kilos are lighter and of course it allows it to be completely
6:28
Other secondary drives you can see this in the TB frame
6:34
A timing belt is completely new and ensures that it is simply in the box and that
6:40
Pretty long balanced and that for a long time yes this unit you actually say the keyword for a long time
6:45
Wild get me just to the point I would like to deal with the fact that we because I also have a little bit of bashing against against
6:51
other circuit systems have made because they weld because they are exposed to the dirt and so
6:57
Further you have an uncanny effort you have a setting effort you have to live in the end that you often empty
7:03
Valance has because you have to buy a lot available is now also available
7:08
yes right and even if it is available that is not cheap and it can actually do that in the 21st century
7:14
no longer give that you produce so much throw away products just because in principle you have decided to shit at the wrong moment
7:20
has decided and breaking your teeth chain cracks are provoked to bend etc.
7:27
If you try to deal with it now, but actually flixschusteneren and our eyes and what we have here is a maintenance -free one is that
7:34
For the first time, an EMTB is as reliable as you know how to know electric vehicles. It should then be
7:40
Sits in the button, so to speak, drives and gets and gets a service interval and you don't have to do much anymore and we say about that about
7:46
Micromobility In order to really make a turnaround in mobility, you also need bicycles
7:52
E-bikes that have enough for the demands of customers as far as they are because they are used to them
7:59
Do not want to do with screws and tinkering and now do not do my bike here a bit but we talk about vehicle concepts
8:05
And we'll come right away. We have very exciting bikes that are also correct for everyday life and
8:10
We will be expectation interval of 10,000 km yes and everything it needs is I think an oil change when I
8:16
Right right right yes we have already written that on the walls and communicates in advance that is also what is in pine
8:21
Classically the case is we say an oil change every 10,000 km that ensures that
8:27
Simply for the fact that the gearbox remains smooth that everything is safe and because there is also condenses every now and then
can form in the gearbox due to
8:33
Temperature fluctuations are our recommendation and it actually signals again so we talk
8:38
Here of 10,000 km even for Heavy commuters or computers, this is already
8:44
a house number to drive together
Is there enough space for large batteries?
8:51
Is there a problem with your unit when it comes to thinking about the battery in such an e-bike here
8:58
It is a good keyword in it and then I have now spoken a lot about the drive unit and the entire drive train
9:04
also about the gates belt etc. but what is of course elementary that our unity is
9:09
The periphery needs and there are partners on board the one perfectly
9:15
has modified our claims and at the same time a big backing in the bicycle industry has the fit
9:22
System The fit systems are already established for many German manufacturers.
9:28
5000 dealers all over Europe means that we are also the best for the roof of Benelux and uh other regions
9:35
Equipped so that there is no inhibition threshold when we stop these bikes come into the market that the
9:40
Feel well picked up behind yourself from the front very important point that the circulation also works and if
9:45
You come to the peripheral components that is super good that we just all of our new ones
9:51
Launch partners offer completely different posts We take a look at this from the cargo bike via compact bikes with integrated external
9:58
Battery with the Superstell Textending variants ImtBs with super clean cockpits then again large displays or just one
10:04
App that also makes all the functions and adjustments possible for the NGU
10:10
It offers it all of this according to his needs to tuning all this is the periphery of fit and
10:15
That means the whole system is running on fit and so it is possible that we have a um battery here in one
10:23
Three different battery sizes can be accommodated from 500 700 to belief 960 watt hours okay
10:30
And that in turn still combined with Range extender etc. So we have great modularity and the manufacturers are looking for
10:35
the best concept of yes you have the reliability of the drive
How do the individual parts of the MGU work together?
10:41
emphasizes okay he definitely did it that you can see here visually
10:46
Get everything in a case with reliability, give us one
10:52
Small insight as he is so trusting at the point because
11:00
There are no bicycles outside on the market but you have to test it in any way
11:05
Have before how can you imagine what did you do so to climb the club I suggest we look at the little one
11:11
Cutting model on yes and then let's go into detail okay make a great reliability our keyword
11:16
Okay and why is it as credible or like at the moment
11:21
Of course, this is because what we do here in its border
11:26
proven technology is that means we have the evaluated pine switching system in it is one
11:31
BREINTREDY TRAVITION The total of over 100 manufacturers in total over several million kilometers in
11:37
Market is already exactly that and we have the reliability because it has long been proof, so to speak, because we have
11:43
Cyclists equipped worldwide, these are customers of us insane feedback we have
11:48
Mileage of over 100,000 kilometers near 200,000 kilometers are now in the past 12 years
11:54
Gathered together with a person in a gearbox and somehow with a maximum maintenance of one
12:00
Oil change in the year and we now have to gear into this same head wheel as we do in
12:06
The pine classic gears have just combined with a yes maintenance -free and above all
12:11
Wear wine brushless engine This engine of the one does not fall from the sky, but it is in the automotive industry
12:17
And we have already taken care of that in the automotive industry at 100,000 in steering drives
12:22
Motors that's so power steering engines The engine actually comes from
12:28
Germany we have with the manufacturer for which the e-bike application modified, which means that we
12:34
Have it with stronger magnet equips we have the control um again very precisely
12:39
looked at and just also developed the entire software in the house, which means that the complete electronics
12:44
Now you can see here on the other side with a chip of the chip is made for the Rob
12:50
and the
is in use when it is always controlled very quickly and very precisely engines
12:57
should and that means we have a high-end components through this combination of these this combination of these this combination of these this combination of these
13:03
Very, very sensitive control and, as I said, the engine as such works without wear that gearbox works without wear and tear.
13:10
Just days of the corridors. There is no great care to change oil all
13:15
10,000 km that was not wearing no Justays none
13:22
Nevertheless, the interaction with the engine is something new for those for the gearbox, at least you have at least on the
13:29
Materials on the forehead wheels What changed.
13:35
But at some point there is also it but it is definitely so that we are already a piece of technology
13:40
So have revised far as an example what you can feel it.
13:46
Interior toothing that of the gears in such a way that they simply grind more often and thus, so to speak, that the
13:54
The power transmission, so to speak, can be felt directly and we are not in large empty path in the IM
13:59
Crank arm is noticeable, so to speak, and then it is so that we
14:05
Technology, of course, as far as the noise technology is concerned, have revised a bit overall, which means that we have set it up on it
14:11
that is switched electrically.
14:18
Sensors actually and um the interaction of motor power that in
14:23
Every situation can be switched, so we can switch in the stand under load always the same in every course
14:30
Precise and we also switch on the stand, which is also in many of them with naturally with chain circuit
14:36
Actually not working at all and that means we combine that on top still with semi -automatic
14:41
Switching processes that means there is a function that works that is embedded in the smartphone system in the
14:47
SmartShift technology yes and the selection already means that I can
14:53
So roles always sounds so banal but while I don't pedalate, for example, in the trail or just if I just drive down a mountain
14:59
Always adjust the gear to the speed so that when I step back I am in the right course and that does that
15:05
In the trail incredibly a lot of fun, I can say that you can simply concentrate on it if you stop in the flow trail
15:11
rises above the group is still in the third gear of climbing has a bit of a tunnel view of
15:17
The effort goes into the trail in the trail that it goes on the left and right and you do not switch and the good one is in that in that
15:23
You don't have to do it for a moment because the system is on and the other is when I am silent from the traffic lights, I always drive in
15:29
Right gear pure that we actually mean that we have a starting gear that is automatically when I stop
What proportion did the bicycle manufacturers have in the development?
15:36
How such an engine should feel or he has the driving experience with it
15:41
from somewhere got a bit of expertise since it was a lot of dangers that you have done there
15:47
So maybe that's even a component so we have a new launch partner who accompany them
15:52
We have shown us the first ideas very early on.
15:58
We can do that we want to do that, think you want to participate and then all those who stand here say yes
16:04
Let's do it no matter what comes that is a great idea. We believe that the future we do that and this
16:09
Brands that we have we speak of redwild Simplon Bulls Flyer are there
16:14
Heads in the background they have so many e-bike experience if you bring it all together in collectively and have that
16:20
We did and we listened here and we made the coordination with the one. Then it creates a system what benchmark is that
16:27
So in terms of sensitivity, it also falls into the fate out coordination of the individual support modes
16:33
Need that progressive mode must be integrated that means adaptive to the power of the driver, so to speak, the driver react
16:41
we did with humans yes that is an industry sizes again Lutz Schäfer, for example, at Rotwild yes or
16:46
Stefan Sahms who is on the road for Bulls and also for flyers that means that means
16:52
Are people who have a lot of EMTB experiences but we also have a very big pool on
16:58
Test drivers in the house The incognito prototypes come every day
17:
04
From the logs on everything that occurs in the test drive, so to speak,
17:09
Is and give us indications of the modification or settings.
17:15
So last five years in the overall picture that has already been created very down. The units now offers the opportunity
Why does the first MGU now have twelve gears?
17:20
There were 12 gears to drive you considering you also have other gears with fewer gears
17:28
I somehow keep going to 9 or 6 or so, of course, and of course we always have that
17:33
made that we looked in which area of application how many corridors we are sensible how much bandwidth are full and what we have here is
17:40
In fact, a wide variety of variants of the MG are that makes it possible again so many different ones
17:46
To bring models and as you can see here there is a small abbreviation on this badge this is that
17:52
Speed in the electrical version actually differs in the power of the engine, but in the total in the total in
And part 2 as it was too long for a forum post
18:00
The hardware actually does not mean that this NGU in the S version
18:05
actually transports the bike 45 km/h here and that very effortlessly with 800 watts at the top yes and um that
18:14
is, for example, a variant that we offer, which means that we always have Pedelec variants and normal pedelec so e-bike variants and then comes
18:21
On the number of number, this is so that of course we also in the
18:27
Send classic gears up to 18 courses and in the arrest we arrest ourselves on the twelfers
18:33
Because the um more is more than enough with 600% unintelligible and then we have a variant with
18:38
Larger gear jumps, for example, for example, we believe that it is very, very good, which actually also also in the S variants
18:45
Bring because you just have a lot of speed growth very, very quickly, you might need bigger ones
18:50
Gang jumps in order not to have as many gait levels but you still have a large spectrum of
18:56
560-68 I think I'm not getting myself right now that means we still have big bandwidths that is
19:01
Our trademark then stops to change larger gear jumps for greater speed then in the IM
19:07
S-Pedelect Area are the units, we also talk about other dimensions or do you have
19:12
Housing on as with the C line agreed on a housing size and the
19:19
We just used it up to the last millimeter on the twelve course and that definitely offers us that
19:25
We are also very, very warm, that means that we bring incredibly tightly
19:32
uncanny density in a smallest room and that means that, so to speak,
19:38
Heat effects that arise in the system are then distributed to very much yes in this case steel tooth bikes and
19:43
At the same time, the oil bath is also also his contribution that then also the temperature and the
19:49
Warmth of a housing can also be handed over and the power electronics then result in yes
19:55
The corresponding heat also off and it is then derived from cooling ribs in the outer area
20:00
Housing is made of which material yes, as I already said, all components are actually the essentials
20:06
Made in Germany The um the entire unit is composed by hand in Germany and on
20:11
Machines checked We also have the housing in Germany with one
20:17
So certified with one with a long -time partner and structured. This consists of magnesium
20:23
And is okay from a very renowned yes manufacturer for aluminum for magnesium housing
20:30
The name of is otherwise not ahead no. We will reveal our suppliers not good is also okay it is all anyway
20:37
Exciting you have told somehow for five years you have been working on it it would be a topic for your own video like
20:43
Has it managed to keep all of it for five years to keep anything like that somehow we drink
20:50
are of course all professionals and we do not go to things that just don't finish yet
20:56
some players on the market that have to drum very early on also for them
21:01
to get the necessary attention as a whole but we were very firm in the saddle with our gearbox technology anyway.
21:07
Greater successes achieve ever larger quantities make the whole thing a bit of long -compatible and we have stop
21:13
In addition, we keep the complete development department even further expanded and the whole team enlarged
21:19
Um that we are able to make such development in parallel and the topic was not that they were tight
21:25
then hold
The topic was that of course you hold together for over 5 years and that you also quote one of what
21:31
Five years we said together which battery cells will be there how big are the batteries what the customers want in 5 years for batteries what
21:38
Do they want for drive systems what do they need anyway and yes I think the present is right for us that we are there
21:46
are not quite unrolished by but pretty much hit what today
21:52
Announcement is nevertheless if you would start with the project today and again
What future updates can be expected?
21:57
There would be something five years ahead of thought that you would say that you may be different today
22:03
Point for you you told me at the beginning you want to ask me a question that nobody has asked and you
22:08
You really did it and yes very good yes, of course that is also a very, very good question because of course you always have
22:15
Again new ideas and our development department and especially the founders in the back indo, which are also mastermind for the Antju, so to speak,
22:21
And together with the team of wonderful engineers software developers and so on of course further ideas and willing
22:28
Therefore bring to more and more variants or see now
22:34
Even if the full potential after you really did something um, I only did yesterday we
22:39
Yesterday won the euro at gold and I got exactly thank you
22:45
So from the crowd my boss and founder Christoph noise asked and is
22:51
Now too, so now everything could be finished until now and that means it goes on and on
22:58
there are always new ideas and that means we would of course start again with a look into the future
23:04
of our expertise and the other and the new partner what are what are the goals we view
23:10
To always do the goal of what I also wish for the mobility of us what I do the people
23:16
just want to be mobile from us and we see that as I said, always holistical that we say we don't just want a sports equipment
23:22
We also want to develop a contribution to the yes for a successful turn.
First e-bikes with the Pinion MGU
23:30
In any case now the is the actual, maybe we'll take a look at two three more opposite bikes as
23:37
So in the end it is in what kind of bike ends up.
E-MTB-Fully Simplon Rapcon Pmax Pinion
23:44
Number one two number one but one of many but certainly a highlight absolutely for us like many others too
23:51
is of course an MTB with belt drive that is something that obviously simple
23:56
It looks innovative and that is here with the NGUE integrated in the center, Simplon forms by bike
24:03
Just get a high -end model so a top model, so to speak, in
24:09
Lineup where a new era power emts are simply taking place
24:15
Of course it has a custom program that means that you can choose a wide variety of displays hmi's so you can choose controls
24:22
Can choose different battery sizes if you configure the wheel and that means have in the variant
24:28
We are now a 720 watt hour of battery in it, which for many of course I don't get a good thing about myself now, of course, now
24:34
This is now owed to the exhibit, a larger display is installed here than that would actually do, there are also
24:40
A Remot in a small display and that stops the cockpit very, very clean, but you can also do this display
24:45
Simply lose weight and actually only with a drive screen from the app or do without it has the uh tensioner for the belt drive
24:52
Here is the gifted job that the bicycle manufacturers
24:58
In fact, everything that concerns the Drive United, of course, it is everything from the
25:05
Home penny that means cranks come from us the gear elements for the stick axis, of course that we are here
25:11
have the interlinking points and that the curves of us are and the tensioner
25:16
Anyway, that is a system that we have validated again and again in cooperation with Gates
25:21
And this tensioner simply ensures that we have a maximum of large enclosure and always the right correct one
25:28
Tension on the rear sweater so that the strap tension is always guaranteed over the entire spring rate
25:34
Is a self -development good then show us something completely different
25:40
Yes, very happy, of course, is very different, of course than an EMTB, an e-cargobike is here from the Kettler brand
E-load bike Kettler Cargoline
25:46
This is based on one
Very successful model at Kettler Now keep the NGO carefree bike for
25:52
The whole family for children's transport for daily purchasing is of course extremely in demand
25:59
We can look at another manufacturer Easy later that also offer Long John in compact format
26:04
If that means 20 inch wheels are then at the front and back and there are short and long version of very exciting wheels find
26:11
I also personally very very aesthetic but this wheel is an absolute highlight is multiple design price
26:18
Excellent the frame geometry and yes is something completely different from one
26:23
EMTB and you can also look at the advantages here and obviously I just wanted to say because Elastenrad is likely
26:29
Somehow a type of e-bike that benefits the most from your innovation
26:35
Let's see it so, so we have here is simply to do in the plastic that also just want to rely on the bike
26:42
To get to work too late to work in time to the daycare center and so on you don't want to have as much time yourself
26:47
Spend all the technology with technology but with family or in your free time and then it is good if
26:52
you can rely on it as well as on any other mobility uh offer what you have in the garage
26:59
or anything else
27:09
Exactly yes really yes, very exciting yes if you then do the with numbers
E-Reiserad Toutterrain Pamir
27:15
Look again in a different direction then it goes from the few kilometers in the city that you can do every day
27:21
By the way, our first customer then moves back on a Tutera bike
27:26
In general at Pinia they believed in gearbox technology at the time and then really have the first reason
27:32
Serial wheels equipped with pine gearbox circuit at that time the P18 and this time they are again
27:39
Launch partner out of the earth out of the earth, so to speak, if you will
27:45
also and simply out of loyalty and good old friend we have it
27:50
Very many dead people also said from 5 years ago okay we go the way with all the difficulties it it
27:57
will give because even for five years not everyone was on the level when it comes to e-bikes and um but does
28:04
Has the path went consistently and it remained true to itself and then he has a travel bike on his feet
28:09
placed on the bikes that has none we are looking for three
28:15
Sorry for this always stands for the highest quality bicycles for the yes
28:22
Exposed use yes and yes here a bike also has on that you can rely on pine and yes very clear
28:30
Ultra long absolutely remote on the way somehow is also feeding exactly anecdote
28:38
The bike was already on our press event in Riva or Arco at the beginning of May
28:44
Had invited the press there and the bikes had already presented and
28:50
In fact, the founder and managing director of the Oliver Römer von Tote had ran back to Freiburg by bike over the old ones
28:57
With the bike better publicity better experience it cannot
29:03
Give he wanted to know what to do what it is doing what how did I create here for a wheel and
29:08
wanted to find out yourself okay and with the Flyer brand we have here in
E-SUV Flyer Goroc TR: X
29:15
Crossoverad also called the SUV so colloquially, of course I also find
29:20
Very charming because you actually occupy the word positively because it finds it absolutely more charming with such a
29:26
To drive up the bike than with such a big one and apart from that it is so that
29:34
That of course a vehicle category is a bicycle e-bike category that is incredibly popular because of that
29:40
Because you can do everything with it, it is super good for the very long tours at the weekend for the excursions
29:46
But also for the daily you always have enough security on board you wide tires you have big wheels you have before
29:53
all things travel at the front and back and that I also find that modern e is that they just comfortable
30:00
Very safe suspensions have due to the weight and because of the speed and so on it is
30:06
Simply extremely good to have a very good chassis that offers flyers here this model actually also comes in
30:11
a speed version yes and is also exhibited here as a speed version and can also use a battery range extender
30:18
So to be equipped in the complete fit would be found for you a wide variety of batteries
30:24
For the bicycle manufacturers and here the choice for optional Manchester Center both with and without exactly okay that
30:31
were quite a ride, but my god was a lot of information
30:37
Is there really a lot about telling about it
and um also appears
30:44
A few questions I have a few of them could answer you at the end a question for density why should
Does the simple e-bike engine lose its justification?
30:51
Uhm engine manufacturers continue to manufacture in the e-bike engine without gearbox
30:58
You have already prepared me that will be given a question that I would not come to, so actually
31:05
there is no reason for me so if I then sit it and if I would sit the corresponding tables and
31:10
Think about how I develop a company further then I would say that the next step
31:18
It must be to really hit what today's mobility need okay
Farewell and Outro
31:24
This is a announcement, I'm curious to see what will happen if you are excited about it
31:32
Just stay tuned on our channel that also likes to escape this, not many thanks to Dirk
31:38
As long as we took the time for us, thank you for the Insight very much fun here at the fair.
31:45
Press I need I think I don't because the little one is so safe so safe yes no
31:52
We are simply extremely confident because age all partners believe in us
31:57
This is very much I think a bit deserves to you, thank you very much
32:02
Thank you for watching and then bye
The hardware actually does not mean that this NGU in the S version
18:05
actually transports the bike 45 km/h here and that very effortlessly with 800 watts at the top yes and um that
18:14
is, for example, a variant that we offer, which means that we always have Pedelec variants and normal pedelec so e-bike variants and then comes
18:21
On the number of number, this is so that of course we also in the
18:27
Send classic gears up to 18 courses and in the arrest we arrest ourselves on the twelfers
18:33
Because the um more is more than enough with 600% unintelligible and then we have a variant with
18:38
Larger gear jumps, for example, for example, we believe that it is very, very good, which actually also also in the S variants
18:45
Bring because you just have a lot of speed growth very, very quickly, you might need bigger ones
18:50
Gang jumps in order not to have as many gait levels but you still have a large spectrum of
18:56
560-68 I think I'm not getting myself right now that means we still have big bandwidths that is
19:01
Our trademark then stops to change larger gear jumps for greater speed then in the IM
19:07
S-Pedelect Area are the units, we also talk about other dimensions or do you have
19:12
Housing on as with the C line agreed on a housing size and the
19:19
We just used it up to the last millimeter on the twelve course and that definitely offers us that
19:25
We are also very, very warm, that means that we bring incredibly tightly
19:32
uncanny density in a smallest room and that means that, so to speak,
19:38
Heat effects that arise in the system are then distributed to very much yes in this case steel tooth bikes and
19:43
At the same time, the oil bath is also also his contribution that then also the temperature and the
19:49
Warmth of a housing can also be handed over and the power electronics then result in yes
19:55
The corresponding heat also off and it is then derived from cooling ribs in the outer area
20:00
Housing is made of which material yes, as I already said, all components are actually the essentials
20:06
Made in Germany The um the entire unit is composed by hand in Germany and on
20:11
Machines checked We also have the housing in Germany with one
20:17
So certified with one with a long -time partner and structured. This consists of magnesium
20:23
And is okay from a very renowned yes manufacturer for aluminum for magnesium housing
20:30
The name of is otherwise not ahead no. We will reveal our suppliers not good is also okay it is all anyway
20:37
Exciting you have told somehow for five years you have been working on it it would be a topic for your own video like
20:43
Has it managed to keep all of it for five years to keep anything like that somehow we drink
20:50
are of course all professionals and we do not go to things that just don't finish yet
20:56
some players on the market that have to drum very early on also for them
21:01
to get the necessary attention as a whole but we were very firm in the saddle with our gearbox technology anyway.
21:07
Greater successes achieve ever larger quantities make the whole thing a bit of long -compatible and we have stop
21:13
In addition, we keep the complete development department even further expanded and the whole team enlarged
21:19
Um that we are able to make such development in parallel and the topic was not that they were tight
21:25
then hold
The topic was that of course you hold together for over 5 years and that you also quote one of what
21:31
Five years we said together which battery cells will be there how big are the batteries what the customers want in 5 years for batteries what
21:38
Do they want for drive systems what do they need anyway and yes I think the present is right for us that we are there
21:46
are not quite unrolished by but pretty much hit what today
21:52
Announcement is nevertheless if you would start with the project today and again
What future updates can be expected?
21:57
There would be something five years ahead of thought that you would say that you may be different today
22:03
Point for you you told me at the beginning you want to ask me a question that nobody has asked and you
22:08
You really did it and yes very good yes, of course that is also a very, very good question because of course you always have
22:15
Again new ideas and our development department and especially the founders in the back indo, which are also mastermind for the Antju, so to speak,
22:21
And together with the team of wonderful engineers software developers and so on of course further ideas and willing
22:28
Therefore bring to more and more variants or see now
22:34
Even if the full potential after you really did something um, I only did yesterday we
22:39
Yesterday won the euro at gold and I got exactly thank you
22:45
So from the crowd my boss and founder Christoph noise asked and is
22:51
Now too, so now everything could be finished until now and that means it goes on and on
22:58
there are always new ideas and that means we would of course start again with a look into the future
23:04
of our expertise and the other and the new partner what are what are the goals we view
23:10
To always do the goal of what I also wish for the mobility of us what I do the people
23:16
just want to be mobile from us and we see that as I said, always holistical that we say we don't just want a sports equipment
23:22
We also want to develop a contribution to the yes for a successful turn.
First e-bikes with the Pinion MGU
23:30
In any case now the is the actual, maybe we'll take a look at two three more opposite bikes as
23:37
So in the end it is in what kind of bike ends up.
E-MTB-Fully Simplon Rapcon Pmax Pinion
23:44
Number one two number one but one of many but certainly a highlight absolutely for us like many others too
23:51
is of course an MTB with belt drive that is something that obviously simple
23:56
It looks innovative and that is here with the NGUE integrated in the center, Simplon forms by bike
24:03
Just get a high -end model so a top model, so to speak, in
24:09
Lineup where a new era power emts are simply taking place
24:15
Of course it has a custom program that means that you can choose a wide variety of displays hmi's so you can choose controls
24:22
Can choose different battery sizes if you configure the wheel and that means have in the variant
24:28
We are now a 720 watt hour of battery in it, which for many of course I don't get a good thing about myself now, of course, now
24:34
This is now owed to the exhibit, a larger display is installed here than that would actually do, there are also
24:40
A Remot in a small display and that stops the cockpit very, very clean, but you can also do this display
24:45
Simply lose weight and actually only with a drive screen from the app or do without it has the uh tensioner for the belt drive
24:52
Here is the gifted job that the bicycle manufacturers
24:58
In fact, everything that concerns the Drive United, of course, it is everything from the
25:05
Home penny that means cranks come from us the gear elements for the stick axis, of course that we are here
25:11
have the interlinking points and that the curves of us are and the tensioner
25:16
Anyway, that is a system that we have validated again and again in cooperation with Gates
25:21
And this tensioner simply ensures that we have a maximum of large enclosure and always the right correct one
25:28
Tension on the rear sweater so that the strap tension is always guaranteed over the entire spring rate
25:34
Is a self -development good then show us something completely different
25:40
Yes, very happy, of course, is very different, of course than an EMTB, an e-cargobike is here from the Kettler brand
E-load bike Kettler Cargoline
25:46
This is based on one
Very successful model at Kettler Now keep the NGO carefree bike for
25:52
The whole family for children's transport for daily purchasing is of course extremely in demand
25:59
We can look at another manufacturer Easy later that also offer Long John in compact format
26:04
If that means 20 inch wheels are then at the front and back and there are short and long version of very exciting wheels find
26:11
I also personally very very aesthetic but this wheel is an absolute highlight is multiple design price
26:18
Excellent the frame geometry and yes is something completely different from one
26:23
EMTB and you can also look at the advantages here and obviously I just wanted to say because Elastenrad is likely
26:29
Somehow a type of e-bike that benefits the most from your innovation
26:35
Let's see it so, so we have here is simply to do in the plastic that also just want to rely on the bike
26:42
To get to work too late to work in time to the daycare center and so on you don't want to have as much time yourself
26:47
Spend all the technology with technology but with family or in your free time and then it is good if
26:52
you can rely on it as well as on any other mobility uh offer what you have in the garage
26:59
or anything else
27:09
Exactly yes really yes, very exciting yes if you then do the with numbers
E-Reiserad Toutterrain Pamir
27:15
Look again in a different direction then it goes from the few kilometers in the city that you can do every day
27:21
By the way, our first customer then moves back on a Tutera bike
27:26
In general at Pinia they believed in gearbox technology at the time and then really have the first reason
27:32
Serial wheels equipped with pine gearbox circuit at that time the P18 and this time they are again
27:39
Launch partner out of the earth out of the earth, so to speak, if you will
27:45
also and simply out of loyalty and good old friend we have it
27:50
Very many dead people also said from 5 years ago okay we go the way with all the difficulties it it
27:57
will give because even for five years not everyone was on the level when it comes to e-bikes and um but does
28:04
Has the path went consistently and it remained true to itself and then he has a travel bike on his feet
28:09
placed on the bikes that has none we are looking for three
28:15
Sorry for this always stands for the highest quality bicycles for the yes
28:22
Exposed use yes and yes here a bike also has on that you can rely on pine and yes very clear
28:30
Ultra long absolutely remote on the way somehow is also feeding exactly anecdote
28:38
The bike was already on our press event in Riva or Arco at the beginning of May
28:44
Had invited the press there and the bikes had already presented and
28:50
In fact, the founder and managing director of the Oliver Römer von Tote had ran back to Freiburg by bike over the old ones
28:57
With the bike better publicity better experience it cannot
29:03
Give he wanted to know what to do what it is doing what how did I create here for a wheel and
29:08
wanted to find out yourself okay and with the Flyer brand we have here in
E-SUV Flyer Goroc TR: X
29:15
Crossoverad also called the SUV so colloquially, of course I also find
29:20
Very charming because you actually occupy the word positively because it finds it absolutely more charming with such a
29:26
To drive up the bike than with such a big one and apart from that it is so that
29:34
That of course a vehicle category is a bicycle e-bike category that is incredibly popular because of that
29:40
Because you can do everything with it, it is super good for the very long tours at the weekend for the excursions
29:46
But also for the daily you always have enough security on board you wide tires you have big wheels you have before
29:53
all things travel at the front and back and that I also find that modern e is that they just comfortable
30:00
Very safe suspensions have due to the weight and because of the speed and so on it is
30:06
Simply extremely good to have a very good chassis that offers flyers here this model actually also comes in
30:11
a speed version yes and is also exhibited here as a speed version and can also use a battery range extender
30:18
So to be equipped in the complete fit would be found for you a wide variety of batteries
30:24
For the bicycle manufacturers and here the choice for optional Manchester Center both with and without exactly okay that
30:31
were quite a ride, but my god was a lot of information
30:37
Is there really a lot about telling about it
and um also appears
30:44
A few questions I have a few of them could answer you at the end a question for density why should
Does the simple e-bike engine lose its justification?
30:51
Uhm engine manufacturers continue to manufacture in the e-bike engine without gearbox
30:58
You have already prepared me that will be given a question that I would not come to, so actually
31:05
there is no reason for me so if I then sit it and if I would sit the corresponding tables and
31:10
Think about how I develop a company further then I would say that the next step
31:18
It must be to really hit what today's mobility need okay
Farewell and Outro
31:24
This is a announcement, I'm curious to see what will happen if you are excited about it
31:32
Just stay tuned on our channel that also likes to escape this, not many thanks to Dirk
31:38
As long as we took the time for us, thank you for the Insight very much fun here at the fair.
31:45
Press I need I think I don't because the little one is so safe so safe yes no
31:52
We are simply extremely confident because age all partners believe in us
31:57
This is very much I think a bit deserves to you, thank you very much
32:02
Thank you for watching and then bye
Has anyone actually weighed an MGU yet ? Pinion state 4.1kg, but Fit state 3.9kg. I wonder if one is wet and one dry ?
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