Crestline x DJI - RS 181 SPECTRE Edition

[Jedman5c]

Beyond that, there's been a lot of discussion with previous Crestline frames needing to install at sag. This is recommended by Sram for some Fram types, not for Cresty's specifically but some people said it was necessary for proper shifting. Im wondering if that's the case for 181's or not?

Set mine up per SRAM app at full extension and shifting is dialed. Didn’t have to adjust a thing or micro-tune after install.. AXS XO on RH2 frame.

They are not critical. I swapped m8ne out to non rusting ti.

Leaving mine off till I get the rear shock dialed as it prevents access to the rebound adjuster.

 

[Jedman5c]

Nice, thanks for the tip!! Will get er done today!!

Extension cable installed. Pretty slick feature!!

 

[John_likes_bikes]

Set mine up per SRAM app at full extension and shifting is dialed. Didn’t have to adjust a thing or micro-tune after install.. AXS XO on RH2 frame.

Tranmission is a totally different animal than AXS but I'll start with suspension extended. It's only been an issue with past frames so it could be a nothingburger with the 181.

 

[Jedman5c]

Tranmission is a totally different animal than AXS but I'll start with suspension extended. It's only been an issue with past frames so it could be a nothingburger with the 181.

Clarifying… SRAM AXS XO Transmission.

 

[Suns_PSD]

Tranmission is a totally different animal than AXS but I'll start with suspension extended. It's only been an issue with past frames so it could be a nothingburger with the 181.

Probably has a lot to do with how much chainstay growth a particular platform experiences.

 

[John_likes_bikes]

Never seen this style of bushings before on the Vivid Air.
How do you remove it? I’d like to reuse the hardware if possibly on a Fox DHX2 Coil shock. Do you just use a big crescent wrench and loosen it? It’s got little dimples on one side and none on the other.

View attachment 165829

Nice little upgrade as standard.

 

[John_likes_bikes]

Probably has a lot to do with how much chainstay growth a particular platform experiences.

That's likely it. Sram notes high pivot bikes need it set at sag for that reason. I'm not too familiar with past Crestlines but I think I remember seeing chain/CS growth on the 181 isn't as high as past models.

 

[AlumiPro]

Did you bundle the rear brake hose and speed sensor cable into one shrink tube? Speed sensor cable is flimsy and vulnerable.

I was VERY tempted to but did not. The reason being the two wires make different radius’s in the exposed arch they make, so when the rear swing arm suspension cycles, the two cables need to move freely of one another. If you shrink tube them together it may want to bunch up the shrink tube and not bend as easily as the suspension cycles, due to the two wires/cable trying to bend independently.
I also find that area to be less vulnerable to rock and stick strikes. The rear swing arm/dropout area is much more vulnerable to strikes. Which pretty much always happens with my bikes in the conditions I ride. I think having the rear half/outside of the rear swing arm rubberized would be awesome! Like if the rubber chain stay guard completely wrapped the rear of the swing arm on both sides!

 

[BikingBad]

I was VERY tempted to but did not. The reason being the two wires make different radius’s in the exposed arch they make, so when the rear swing arm suspension cycles, the two cables need to move freely of one another. If you shrink tube them together it may want to bunch up the shrink tube and not bend as easily as the suspension cycles, due to the two wires/cable trying to bend independently.
I also find that area to be less vulnerable to rock and stick strikes. The rear swing arm/dropout area is much more vulnerable to strikes. Which pretty much always happens with my bikes in the conditions I ride.

Good to know, thanks, I would’ve never thought about the two cables needing to move independently.

On a separate note, I think the charge port door could’ve been designed better. Not easy to operate and flimsy. It’s better than many others out there but nowhere as good as Amflow’s magnetic charge port door.

 

[AlumiPro]

Good to know, thanks, I would’ve never thought about the two cables needing to move independently.

On a separate note, I think the charge port door could’ve been designed better. Not easy to operate and flimsy. It’s better than many others out there but nowhere as good as Amflow’s magnetic charge port door.

I agree.
It is better than my previous Crestline but I don’t like how it rotates on a plastic shaft. I feel like the little plastic nubs on the shaft are going to ware down or get hung up and result in a snapped shaft.
The inside looks decent though with more metal/stainless spring.

 

[mtbmxr]

Anybody weigh their fully built bike yet?

I originally was trying to make it a superlight build, but after riding it I've changed a few things. The initial build weighed 49.25 lbs.
R2 frame with 29" 450mm dropouts
Lyrik Ultimate 160mm fork
Vivid Coil shock
I9 Hydra2 Enduro Carbon wheelset
Hope XCR Pro E4 brakeset
Continental Kryptotal 2.4 Trail tires
E13 Helix alloy 160mm crankset
Enve M7 bars and carbon stem
AXS 175 post
GX T-type derailleur
XS 1295 cassette
GX Chain
ODI Rogue grips
SLR carbon saddle
XT pedals

 

[Suns_PSD]

Must be a light rider. Even the Bosch to reach that kind of climb difference with 80% you eiher have to :

muscle it in ECO only
or be a super light rider.

Brian Cahal (has raced EWS, he's about 6'1"/ 170#s I think) on the Commencal SX800 (about a 58# bike) with the Bosch 100NM 800w did 7500' in Andorra.

I asked him details and here is his response: "Battery was cooked. 1%. I was using probably 85% tour the rest emtb+ and a handful of boost situations.".

 

[Zimmerframe]

Brian Cahal (has raced EWS, he's about 6'1"/ 170#s I think) on the Commencal SX800 (about a 58# bike) with the Bosch 800w did 7500' in Andorra.

I asked him details and here is his response: "Battery was cooked. 1%. I was using probably 85% tour the rest emtb+ and a handful of boost situations.".

I think as we've seen over and over and over on the forum, there are so many factors which can influence range and altitude.

I realise you're convinced the avinox system is 20% less "efficient" than the Bosch but from everything we've seen on tests, they seem to stack up pretty similarly and both operate in the 80ish % range. Agreed the Bosch has always been AMAZING on how it gets you to put more effort in to enable huge rides, but I suspect the Avinox is similar - tests where they're set the same give the same range, you also have the micro adjust now on the so you can be making small assistance adjustments on the go to stretch things out.

My only Andora example I can give you is a Spain/Andora crossover with a bafang M510 and 630wh. Less efficient than the Bosch and doesn't tease you into giving more. Plus, I was way off peak fitness and riding with a fractured sternum, so couldn't really push. Bike was derestricted as I was testing for motor overheat. About 30% left at the end.

Only 4500ft in your money. 30% more on the bafang would probably give me about 20% more altitude, but I was pedalling on the way down where ever possible, so it was using battery then too. So if you added 30% on that would give you about 6500ft even with a crappy bafang using mainly trail mode (most similar to EMTB mode).

My highest on a Bosch gen4, 625wh eco and pushing over the limit or riding the limit where the bosch just gives you a surge trickle (where you can get mega range). Physically exhausting and not actually fun, but was going for 5000 meters and failed due to physical exhaustion (despite stopping for beer twice and food once).

So that's 12500ft in pre-pharaoh measuring systems.

The point is - it proves nothing at all about the bikes/motors/batteries - rider will make a massive difference, that's before you take into account terrain/tyres/temperatures and the zillion other factors.

Stick Brian on an Avinox and limit his peak power to the same as the Bosch and I'd imagine you'd get the same performance. Likewise I'm pretty sure on an 800 Avinox system I could do 5000 meters.

Maybe we can stop cluttering every single avinox thread with "theories" of range and performance and if we're really that convinced, make a separate thread to discuss it to our hearts content ????

PS. Hope the divorce is going well (thought that's somewhat of an oxymoron I guess) .. Eitherway, hope it's not hurting too much.

 

[John_likes_bikes]

I originally was trying to make it a superlight build, but after riding it I've changed a few things. The initial build weighed 49.25 lbs.
R2 frame with 29" 450mm dropouts
Lyrik Ultimate 160mm fork
Vivid Coil shock
I9 Hydra2 Enduro Carbon wheelset
Hope XCR Pro E4 brakeset
Continental Kryptotal 2.4 Trail tires
E13 Helix alloy 160mm crankset
Enve M7 bars and carbon stem
AXS 175 post
GX T-type derailleur
XS 1295 cassette
GX Chain
ODI Rogue grips
SLR carbon saddle
XT pedals

I was originally thinking of going the 160mm route too but without it dropping the BB but it did steppen the headangle I figured I might as well take advantage of 20mm more travel.

 

[John_likes_bikes]

FINALLY, I got my shipping notice.

 

[Plummet]

I originally was trying to make it a superlight build, but after riding it I've changed a few things. The initial build weighed 49.25 lbs.
R2 frame with 29" 450mm dropouts
Lyrik Ultimate 160mm fork
Vivid Coil shock
I9 Hydra2 Enduro Carbon wheelset
Hope XCR Pro E4 brakeset
Continental Kryptotal 2.4 Trail tires
E13 Helix alloy 160mm crankset
Enve M7 bars and carbon stem
AXS 175 post
GX T-type derailleur
XS 1295 cassette
GX Chain
ODI Rogue grips
SLR carbon saddle
XT pedals
View attachment 165863

Oh yeah, thats the lighest cresty dji build yet. I guess its more am build than full send mode build. No doubt it will be a fire cracker. I'm looking forward to the ride review.

 

[Plummet]

I think as we've seen over and over and over on the forum, there are so many factors which can influence range and altitude.

I realise you're convinced the avinox system is 20% less "efficient" than the Bosch but from everything we've seen on tests, they seem to stack up pretty similarly and both operate in the 80ish % range. Agreed the Bosch has always been AMAZING on how it gets you to put more effort in to enable huge rides, but I suspect the Avinox is similar - tests where they're set the same give the same range, you also have the micro adjust now on the so you can be making small assistance adjustments on the go to stretch things out.

My only Andora example I can give you is a Spain/Andora crossover with a bafang M510 and 630wh. Less efficient than the Bosch and doesn't tease you into giving more. Plus, I was way off peak fitness and riding with a fractured sternum, so couldn't really push. Bike was derestricted as I was testing for motor overheat. About 30% left at the end.

View attachment 165904

Only 4500ft in your money. 30% more on the bafang would probably give me about 20% more altitude, but I was pedalling on the way down where ever possible, so it was using battery then too. So if you added 30% on that would give you about 6500ft even with a crappy bafang using mainly trail mode (most similar to EMTB mode).

My highest on a Bosch gen4, 625wh eco and pushing over the limit or riding the limit where the bosch just gives you a surge trickle (where you can get mega range). Physically exhausting and not actually fun, but was going for 5000 meters and failed due to physical exhaustion (despite stopping for beer twice and food once).

View attachment 165905

So that's 12500ft in pre-pharaoh measuring systems.

The point is - it proves nothing at all about the bikes/motors/batteries - rider will make a massive difference, that's before you take into account terrain/tyres/temperatures and the zillion other factors.

Stick Brian on an Avinox and limit his peak power to the same as the Bosch and I'd imagine you'd get the same performance. Likewise I'm pretty sure on an 800 Avinox system I could do 5000 meters.

Maybe we can stop cluttering every single avinox thread with "theories" of range and performance and if we're really that convinced, make a separate thread to discuss it to our hearts content ????

PS. Hope the divorce is going well (thought that's somewhat of an oxymoron I guess) .. Eitherway, hope it's not hurting too much.

wowa.... 3835vert and 110km. That is an epic journey. Great work.

I also agree, vert m achieved is more about terrain and power levels used than efficiency.

I did 950mtr vert last night on my 400wh battery mostly in embt mode with some 100nm emtb+ for shits and giggles. Rode for 2.75 hours and had 20% battery left. No at first sight that seems efficient and awesome. But it steap as shit E-hike a bike with very little battery used on flat terrain and some battery used in walk mode and some no battery pushing.

Then the day before i did 2 hours 550mtr vert around town on a flatter rider, the same 400wh battery used the same amount of battery yet only 60% of the vert..... Was by motor more efficient on day two? No... Day one I was a lot flatter terrain and i burnt battery riding from a to b rather than converting to vert. Day two pretty much all battery was used to convert to vert.

Also i think Suns is confusion more power with less efficiency.... The more power the motor outputs and the less your legs need to over the same distance. People getting more efficiency are simply using more legs than motor. The higher you do on turbo modes the more battery you burn....

Oh 3 days ago i did 55 mins on full bannana emtb+ on the 400wh battery, had a bout 30% less at the end. Less legs more motor power.

DJI's simply give the operator an option for to use more battery. Therefore they do, thus the more battery usage.

 

[Suns_PSD]

wowa.... 3835vert and 110km. That is an epic journey. Great work.

I also agree, vert m achieved is more about terrain and power levels used than efficiency.

I did 950mtr vert last night on my 400wh battery mostly in embt mode with some 100nm emtb+ for shits and giggles. Rode for 2.75 hours and had 20% battery left. No at first sight that seems efficient and awesome. But it steap as shit E-hike a bike with very little battery used on flat terrain and some battery used in walk mode and some no battery pushing.

Then the day before i did 2 hours 550mtr vert around town on a flatter rider, the same 400wh battery used the same amount of battery yet only 60% of the vert..... Was by motor more efficient on day two? No... Day one I was a lot flatter terrain and i burnt battery riding from a to b rather than converting to vert. Day two pretty much all battery was used to convert to vert.

Also i think Suns is confusion more power with less efficiency.... The more power the motor outputs and the less your legs need to over the same distance. People getting more efficiency are simply using more legs than motor. The higher you do on turbo modes the more battery you burn....

Oh 3 days ago i did 55 mins on full bannana emtb+ on the 400wh battery, had a bout 30% less at the end. Less legs more motor power.

DJI's simply give the operator an option for to use more battery. Therefore they do, thus the more battery usage.

Turned off my motor but got mad efficiency yo!

 

[Plummet]

Turned off my motor but got mad efficiency yo!

I think for you and your quest between Vala and Crestline you should as these two questions.

Can you be a first adopter of DJI in the US? Ie withstand potential lack of parts and limited availability of expertise in your local area and resulting down time is an issue arises. If the answer is no. Then the decision is easy. Go the Vala, If the answer is yes.....

Then the next question is which is the better bike for you regardless of motor choice?
Choose based on which bike best suits your needs.

Both motor choices will be good as far as performance is concerned.
Do you want replacable battery option? to you want a smashing 180mm of travel. Do you want to be in the boutique frame club? If yes, go the cresty.

Do you want a 150mm lighter build integrated battery more mainstream build. Go the vala.

They really are two different fish. Efficiencies will be similar and not a deal breaker. Choose the bike based on the best bike style for best bike style for you.

 

[Suns_PSD]

OT:

Regulator (not Vala) set up 160/ 170 or Crestline Spectre set up 160/ 170 (same as Troyden actually) are my 2 top picks. This travel range suits my trails well. Both can reuse my Avy coil shock and fork which is nice. The Vala has too short of CS's for my tastes.

The Regulator has a large advantage in dropper insertion (210 vs. 180) and in my eyes, with the Horst Link, but people say the Crestline VPP is phenomenal. I'm sort of a Transition guy. I'm comfortable with the 600w battery with the Bosch, less so with the Avinox 600w based on what I'm seeing. YTBD.

The Crestline has an advantage in terms of adjustability on the surface, but I think I'd end up at 450mm CS anyways, same as the Regulator so maybe it doesn't even matter. The Reach adjustment on the Crestline messes up so much it seems useless. I don't care about going 180/ 180 so that doesn't matter either.

Crestline offers a frame only and is better looking so that's an easy win. The CX-R Regulator won't get a frame only and will probably cost an outrageous amount, but I get a hefty discount on Transition bikes.

Not interested in the Bosch Crestline, it's not attractive and my Avy shock won't fit either. Will they even make these any longer?

Both have bash ring protection, super important to me. Crestline covers a 34T, but not a 36T I think.

The top of the line Bosch Regulator CX-R will likely have the ABS, which sounds stupid as hell but is getting good reviews.

Bosch ABS Pro: Fancy Tech or Real Gamechanger?

Bosch ABS Pro on Test – We’ve put Bosch’s new eBike ABS Pro system through the wringer. Sensible safety feature or just another gimmick?

ebike-mtb.com

These are the reasons I study what you guys report back so carefully. Like you Plums, I get one good bike choice every year or two and want to make it count (less so with the divorce!).

 

[Plummet]

OT:

Regulator (not Vala) set up 160/ 170 or Crestline Spectre set up 160/ 170 (same as Troyden actually) are my 2 top picks. This travel range suits my trails well. Both can reuse my Avy coil shock and fork which is nice. The Vala has too short of CS's for my tastes.

The Regulator has a large advantage in dropper insertion (210 vs. 180) and in my eyes, with the Horst Link, but people say the Crestline VPP is phenomenal. I'm sort of a Transition guy. I'm comfortable with the 600w battery with the Bosch, less so with the Avinox 600w based on what I'm seeing. YTBD.

The Crestline has an advantage in terms of adjustability on the surface, but I think I'd end up at 450mm CS anyways, same as the Regulator so maybe it doesn't even matter. The Reach adjustment on the Crestline messes up so much it seems useless. I don't care about going 180/ 180 so that doesn't matter either.

Crestline offers a frame only and is better looking so that's an easy win. The CX-R Regulator won't get a frame only and will probably cost an outrageous amount, but I get a hefty discount on Transition bikes.

Not interested in the Bosch Crestline, it's not attractive and my Avy shock won't fit either. Will they even make these any longer?

Both have bash ring protection, super important to me. Crestline covers a 34T, but not a 36T I think.

The top of the line Bosch Regulator CX-R will likely have the ABS, which sounds stupid as hell but is getting good reviews.

Bosch ABS Pro: Fancy Tech or Real Gamechanger?

Bosch ABS Pro on Test – We’ve put Bosch’s new eBike ABS Pro system through the wringer. Sensible safety feature or just another gimmick?

ebike-mtb.com

These are the reasons I study what you guys report back so carefully. Like you Plums, I get one good bike choice every year or two and want to make it count (less so with the divorce!).

Sounds like the regulator suits you better. Buy it and ride it like you stole it and report back.

PS Yeah, Crestline vpp is sensational.

Side note. Buying a Crestline and setting it up 160/170 just seems a waste to me.. Its so much fun and so capable in 180mm mode and yet still playful and not boring on the easier trails.

 

[westcoastmtbr]

ok, from someone who actually owns the Spectre running 180/180, just how playful is this bike. Can this be considered a "quiver killer" really?

 

[Bluedirtz]

OT:

Regulator (not Vala) set up 160/ 170 or Crestline Spectre set up 160/ 170 (same as Troyden actually) are my 2 top picks. This travel range suits my trails well. Both can reuse my Avy coil shock and fork which is nice. The Vala has too short of CS's for my tastes.

The Regulator has a large advantage in dropper insertion (210 vs. 180) and in my eyes, with the Horst Link, but people say the Crestline VPP is phenomenal. I'm sort of a Transition guy. I'm comfortable with the 600w battery with the Bosch, less so with the Avinox 600w based on what I'm seeing. YTBD.

The Crestline has an advantage in terms of adjustability on the surface, but I think I'd end up at 450mm CS anyways, same as the Regulator so maybe it doesn't even matter. The Reach adjustment on the Crestline messes up so much it seems useless. I don't care about going 180/ 180 so that doesn't matter either.

Crestline offers a frame only and is better looking so that's an easy win. The CX-R Regulator won't get a frame only and will probably cost an outrageous amount, but I get a hefty discount on Transition bikes.

Not interested in the Bosch Crestline, it's not attractive and my Avy shock won't fit either. Will they even make these any longer?

Both have bash ring protection, super important to me. Crestline covers a 34T, but not a 36T I think.

The top of the line Bosch Regulator CX-R will likely have the ABS, which sounds stupid as hell but is getting good reviews.

Bosch ABS Pro: Fancy Tech or Real Gamechanger?

Bosch ABS Pro on Test – We’ve put Bosch’s new eBike ABS Pro system through the wringer. Sensible safety feature or just another gimmick?

ebike-mtb.com

These are the reasons I study what you guys report back so carefully. Like you Plums, I get one good bike choice every year or two and want to make it count (less so with the divorce!).

I have both and maybe can shed some light. I live near Bellingham where these bikes were conceived and met both owners.

My Regulator CX is now 160/170 with vivid coil. I upgraded the dropper to 210 from 180. With all these upgrades, this bike is super dialed and on the same level as the crestline suspension feeling.

The Crestline s180 came as stock. The only change was the Axs dropper to 170 and 65mm rise handlebars. Super capable bike and the added battery is nice.

Now that I have a few months with them, I am now leaning towards the Regulator for these reasons:


1. The regulator allows the longer dropper which helps in steep terrain.
2. The lighter weight of the Regulator is nice to have and I get more playful with it.

3. The Regulator gives me the feeling that I am more connected to the bike and feels like more of “cycling”. It just feels more rewarding after the ride than the Crestline for some reason.

4. The Regulator requires me to be more intentional about my route and limit my ride to 2 hours.

I would be happy to own any of them and I am super blessed to get to ride both depending on my mood. If I were to keep one, I’d pick the Regulator.

If you’re near Bellingham, hit me up.

 

[John_likes_bikes]

Sounds like different strokes for different folks as the two are more different than same, but good to read the comparison. Nice read.

 

[Plummet]

I have both and maybe can shed some light. I live near Bellingham where these bikes were conceived and met both owners.

My Regulator CX is now 160/170 with vivid coil. I upgraded the dropper to 210 from 180. With all these upgrades, this bike is super dialed and on the same level as the crestline suspension feeling.

The Crestline s180 came as stock. The only change was the Axs dropper to 170 and 65mm rise handlebars. Super capable bike and the added battery is nice.

Now that I have a few months with them, I am now leaning towards the Regulator for these reasons:


1. The regulator allows the longer dropper which helps in steep terrain.
2. The lighter weight of the Regulator is nice to have and I get more playful with it.

3. The Regulator gives me the feeling that I am more connected to the bike and feels like more of “cycling”. It just feels more rewarding after the ride than the Crestline for some reason.

4. The Regulator requires me to be more intentional about my route and limit my ride to 2 hours.

I would be happy to own any of them and I am super blessed to get to ride both depending on my mood. If I were to keep one, I’d pick the Regulator.

If you’re near Bellingham, hit me up.

Do you have an 800wh in the Cresty? How heavy is the regulartor?

 

[Plummet]

ok, from someone who actually owns the Spectre running 180/180, just how playful is this bike. Can this be considered a "quiver killer" really?

That's going to be a real subjective answer....

I can say that my bosch build Cresty is a quiver killer for me. I have no need for more or different E bikes. But I chase everything dh and gnar so don't need for a less bike. The capability of the bike is exactly what i want for an E. For many coozing more standard tracks its probably overkill and i could see a case for less travel/less weight options in the quiver.

 

[Tmbjorkman]

Do you have an 800wh in the Cresty? How heavy is the regulartor?

Does anyone have a 600wh battery on their spectre? Waiting on some stuff to build mine up and looking forward to it - but would love the 600wh battery. Was under the impression that 800 at this point are the only option.

 

[Posvar1]

Does anyone have a 600wh battery on their spectre? Waiting on some stuff to build mine up and looking forward to it - but would love the 600wh battery. Was under the impression that 800 at this point are the only option.

No 600 available yet.

 

[arhamrasool]

I have both and maybe can shed some light. I live near Bellingham where these bikes were conceived and met both owners.

My Regulator CX is now 160/170 with vivid coil. I upgraded the dropper to 210 from 180. With all these upgrades, this bike is super dialed and on the same level as the crestline suspension feeling.

The Crestline s180 came as stock. The only change was the Axs dropper to 170 and 65mm rise handlebars. Super capable bike and the added battery is nice.

Now that I have a few months with them, I am now leaning towards the Regulator for these reasons:


1. The regulator allows the longer dropper which helps in steep terrain.
2. The lighter weight of the Regulator is nice to have and I get more playful with it.

3. The Regulator gives me the feeling that I am more connected to the bike and feels like more of “cycling”. It just feels more rewarding after the ride than the Crestline for some reason.

4. The Regulator requires me to be more intentional about my route and limit my ride to 2 hours.

I would be happy to own any of them and I am super blessed to get to ride both depending on my mood. If I were to keep one, I’d pick the Regulator.

If you’re near Bellingham, hit me up.

Sounds like you might be willing to sell your crestie? If it’s an rh3 I’m ready to buy!

 

[Posvar1]

Sounds like you might be willing to sell your crestie? If it’s an rh3 I’m ready to buy!

It’s the Bosch one