Just be mindful that 680 is high strength - if you ever want to press the bushings out, it will be pretty hard to do. So clean well before install
.Relay Tips / Tricks
- Thread starter radchad
- Start date
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Has there been a new update?
Thank you, signs interesting! Just to be sure - there weren't any accidental profile changes when you updated?
I have about 7300km on my relay.
The chainstay bearings drive side just developed play the 3rd time now.
(Other bearings have been play free, but I‘m about to swap them also)
Anyone experienced the same?
The chainstay is using 2 x 6802 bearings back to back.
I made some research for longer lasting bearings for the chainstay and came along this double row bearing which is twice the width of the 6802 bearing (10mm instead of 5mm): Elvedes 3802
www.fahrradteile-outlet.de
Seams like only Elvedes from Netherlands is doing this cage free max double row bearing in 10mm width.
I‘ll let you know how long it holds up.
The 2x 6802 lastet always around 2000-2400km.
The chainstay bearings drive side just developed play the 3rd time now.
(Other bearings have been play free, but I‘m about to swap them also)
Anyone experienced the same?
The chainstay is using 2 x 6802 bearings back to back.
I made some research for longer lasting bearings for the chainstay and came along this double row bearing which is twice the width of the 6802 bearing (10mm instead of 5mm): Elvedes 3802
Elvedes Industrielager 3802 2RS MAX 24 x 15 x 10 Steuersätze kaufen? | Fahrradteile-outlet.de
Elvedes Industrielager 3802 2RS MAX 24 x 15 x 10 Steuersätze kaufst du bei Fahrradteile-outlet.de. Alles für dein Fahrrad, E-Bike und MTB ✔Großes Sortiment ✔Schneller Versand
www.fahrradteile-outlet.de
Seams like only Elvedes from Netherlands is doing this cage free max double row bearing in 10mm width.
I‘ll let you know how long it holds up.
The 2x 6802 lastet always around 2000-2400km.
Last edited:
Good timing to ask.
Just returned from some days riding in finale ligure. And Unfortunately the Elvedes bearing already developed play after ~500km of riding
So looks like 2 single bearings hold up better then 1 double row.
The pairs of bearings before all developed play also.
Next I will try to put a 0.3 thin spacer (15x21mm) inbetween the 2 bearings to ensure that only the inner rings are touching each Other.
With the current back to back setup it might be the case that the outer rings touch First which will result in axial load applied to the bearings when the pivot is tightened (which will degenerate roller bearings quickly).
If this also doesn‘t help i need to change the bearings frequently after about 2k km or ask transition if there is something wrong with my chainstay.
Just returned from some days riding in finale ligure. And Unfortunately the Elvedes bearing already developed play after ~500km of riding
So looks like 2 single bearings hold up better then 1 double row.
The pairs of bearings before all developed play also.
Next I will try to put a 0.3 thin spacer (15x21mm) inbetween the 2 bearings to ensure that only the inner rings are touching each Other.
With the current back to back setup it might be the case that the outer rings touch First which will result in axial load applied to the bearings when the pivot is tightened (which will degenerate roller bearings quickly).
If this also doesn‘t help i need to change the bearings frequently after about 2k km or ask transition if there is something wrong with my chainstay.
Thanks for the update - sorry to hear the experiment didn't work out.Good timing to ask.
Just returned from some days riding in finale ligure. And Unfortunately the Elvedes bearing already developed play after ~500km of riding
So looks like 2 single bearings hold up better then 1 double row.
The pairs of bearings before all developed play also.
Next I will try to put a 0.3 thin spacer (15x21mm) inbetween the 2 bearings to ensure that only the inner rings are touching each Other.
With the current back to back setup it might be the case that the outer rings touch First which will result in axial load applied to the bearings when the pivot is tightened (which will degenerate roller bearings quickly).
If this also doesn‘t help i need to change the bearings frequently after about 2k km or ask transition if there is something wrong with my chainstay.
To come back to the question of symptom - do you get side to side play around the rear derailleur?
When I was looking for bearings to replace my Trek Rail suspension pivot bearings I discovered that some bearings are designed for continuous rotation (as in wheel bearings) while others are designed specifically for the small movements in suspension bearings. Could this be a reason why your replacements didn't last long??
Yes, side to side play on the drive side chain stay bearings (next to the derailleur)only. Manifesting in a kind of knocking sound while descending, you can also feel it when wiggling hardly on the rear wheel while holding the pivot joint with your thumb and index finger.
@nickf
Unfortunately not, i always used max bearings (without cage) for high load low rotations intended for mtb suspension.
@nickf
Unfortunately not, i always used max bearings (without cage) for high load low rotations intended for mtb suspension.
Update:
I just disassembeled the chainstay pivot and inspected everything.
I finally found the root cause for the play.
It‘s not the bearings developing play, it‘s the bearing seat of the frame which is too loose
i can press through the bearing just with my fingers.
Also the drive side pivot hardware is showing wear (non drive side no wear).
So means I likely will need a new seat stay, i already reached out to transition.
—> the double row Elvedes bearing is still ok.
I just disassembeled the chainstay pivot and inspected everything.
I finally found the root cause for the play.
It‘s not the bearings developing play, it‘s the bearing seat of the frame which is too loose
i can press through the bearing just with my fingers.
Also the drive side pivot hardware is showing wear (non drive side no wear).
So means I likely will need a new seat stay, i already reached out to transition.
—> the double row Elvedes bearing is still ok.
transition agreed to send a new seat stay.
Maybe it would be better to use retaining compound loctite 641 (mid strength) or 603 (high strength, specialized is using it) instead of grease when replacing the besrings to avoid movement in the seats which will cause a loose seat finally.
Anyway, transition is not recommending it because of the fear that the seat is damaged when pressing out the bearings.
Maybe it would be better to use retaining compound loctite 641 (mid strength) or 603 (high strength, specialized is using it) instead of grease when replacing the besrings to avoid movement in the seats which will cause a loose seat finally.
Anyway, transition is not recommending it because of the fear that the seat is damaged when pressing out the bearings.
I would avoid high strength for that reason. I've used 641 on bearing seats and also the motor bushings with good success. High strength may not be necessary.
I had the same issue and had to tighten those chain stay to seat stay pivot bolts 1/8 of a turn (even though they met torque specs) and I've never heard it since.
Turns out the reason those pivot bolts met torque spec is because someone assembling them used red loctite on them rather than blue and was ever so slightly under tightened and locked in place.
Clipped it to the brake cable and then just made the leap into the head tube.
I still love it and will likely be keeping it as a spare and a "loaner" bike for when friends visit.
I scooped up the Crestline because I'm moving to Utah and for climbing, a full power bike makes more sense. The GEO on of the two bikes are pretty similar and I hope to be a comfortable on the Crestline as I am on the Relay.
Hey guys, i need your help
I have some play on the non drive side (left side) on my main pivot.
It‘s not the bearing, since i replaced them and the bearing seat is tight and snug.
I think it‘s the chainstay bore „floating“ on the main pivot axle head:
View attachment 174417
Is it normal that these 2 have some relative movement when axial force is applied to the real wheel?
I‘m quite sure i didn‘t had any movement there before
, maybe it‘s because i put also grease on the main pivot axle head?
View attachment 174416
Should it be grease free to have a better friction to the chainstay bore when the main pivot taper nut is torqued?
the play is easily detectable by shaking the rear wheel left and right with one hand while holding the pivot joint by my thumb and index finger.
Maybe you guys can check if you can also feel any play there.
Thanks!
I have some play on the non drive side (left side) on my main pivot.
It‘s not the bearing, since i replaced them and the bearing seat is tight and snug.
I think it‘s the chainstay bore „floating“ on the main pivot axle head:
View attachment 174417
Is it normal that these 2 have some relative movement when axial force is applied to the real wheel?
I‘m quite sure i didn‘t had any movement there before
, maybe it‘s because i put also grease on the main pivot axle head?View attachment 174416
Should it be grease free to have a better friction to the chainstay bore when the main pivot taper nut is torqued?
the play is easily detectable by shaking the rear wheel left and right with one hand while holding the pivot joint by my thumb and index finger.
Maybe you guys can check if you can also feel any play there.
Thanks!
@jever98
Thanks mate
My issue is the press fit of the opposite side of the axle thread which is fixing the axle to the chainstay by spreading the slotted axle head by screwing in the nut.
Axle or chainstay is worn at that contact area.
I already ordered a new axle to check that first, if still play persists I need also a new chainstay besides the seatstay which developed bearing play at the seat.
Will take a bit of time until i can test it since i had a smaller knee surgery today.
Thanks mate
My issue is the press fit of the opposite side of the axle thread which is fixing the axle to the chainstay by spreading the slotted axle head by screwing in the nut.
Axle or chainstay is worn at that contact area.
I already ordered a new axle to check that first, if still play persists I need also a new chainstay besides the seatstay which developed bearing play at the seat.
Will take a bit of time until i can test it since i had a smaller knee surgery today.
Squeaking noise: for the record:
After doing the bushing service with anti-seize about 4–5 times, the last time I tried the Santa Cruz method using green Loctite (638).
It lasted about 2300 km, then the creaking started. But not the typical kind that begins with ticking on the drive side—rather a classic creaking noise on both sides. It might also not be coming from the bushings themselves but from the bushing/frame interface, meaning that area may just need to be cleaned again.
In any case, today I did a new bushing service using green Loctite 603. Let’s see how long that lasts. (+ interface treated with anti-slip carbon paste)
The bushings came out just as easily/difficult as they did when using worn-out assembly paste.
So as expected, it lasts significantly longer than with assembly paste, which for me usually lasted around 200–800 km.
After doing the bushing service with anti-seize about 4–5 times, the last time I tried the Santa Cruz method using green Loctite (638).
It lasted about 2300 km, then the creaking started. But not the typical kind that begins with ticking on the drive side—rather a classic creaking noise on both sides. It might also not be coming from the bushings themselves but from the bushing/frame interface, meaning that area may just need to be cleaned again.
In any case, today I did a new bushing service using green Loctite 603. Let’s see how long that lasts. (+ interface treated with anti-slip carbon paste)
The bushings came out just as easily/difficult as they did when using worn-out assembly paste.
So as expected, it lasts significantly longer than with assembly paste, which for me usually lasted around 200–800 km.
I'm on my second motor (first one had the loose silver ring). Both have always worked for me so far.
My impression is the motor is becoming a bit rougher over time - slightly noisier and slight vibrations coming through the pedals. Does anyone else have the same experience?
My impression is the motor is becoming a bit rougher over time - slightly noisier and slight vibrations coming through the pedals. Does anyone else have the same experience?
