Puncture prevention

[KennyB]

Assuming I were to go tubeless and assuming I get nothing more than a couple of thorns each year, what maintenance is required? E.g topping up, or do I need to clear out the old sealant every so often. And if I’m topping up how do you know how much to put in each time and when.
Also do you have to be careful not the have the valve at 6 o’clock each time you store your bike in case the sealant gums up the valve?

sorry for all the questions but I’m considering having a go at this when I next get some new tyres. my currents ones have seen better days and and have been punctured loads of times. The beads don’t look too healthy either due to constant removing to fix punctures.

Use a syringe with a filling tube to dip the tyre and check the level and condition of the sealant (the Milkit system makes this so simple), add enough sealant to bring the volume up to a bit less than first time. Check every couple of months, or whenever you start worrying about it. Remember punctures from thorns aren't a problem, flats are, so it doesn't really matter how many you have. By the way I check for thorns every few rides and pull them out, rotating the tyre till the sealant fixes it - better a problem in the comfort of your own home. I rarely pull out thorns on the trail. Don't remove the tyre until you are going to changed it, getting old sealant off the bead is a PITA. Storing (I prefer "resting between rides" ) with the valve at 6 is ok, the sealant will pool in the bottom of the tyre.

 

[PhilBaker]

I've never worried about where I store my valves in a certain position, after a few years though they do occasionally get a bit stuck so perhaps that's why! Has never been a major issue though and have been running tubeless for 15 years and never looked at where I store them.

I tend to put more sealant in than the recommended in and probably need to top up at least once a year in practice but I have been caught out leaving it to long and getting a thorn once on a trail where there wasn't enough sealant left in the tyre to seal the hole, so prior recommendations seem like a good tip

I take the wheel off and shake it and you can hear how much is in there and gauge whether you need to add more. If you shake it and don't hea

With regards to the recommendation around also buying something like a Stans Dart, that's also a great point. If ever you get a puncture big enough (more than a 5-6mm wide thorn), there is a risk the sealant will just fly out the whole and not fix it. The reason I use MucOff sealant is in various reviews it did well at sealing larger holes than some sealants as it has larger bits in the fluid to plug slightly large holes. Saying that, it clearly isn't going to plug a big hole.

I've always used these types of solutions as do the folks I ride with, which work amazingly well. It's a really weird process pushing one of these into your tyre with a screwdriver, but it absolutely works!

 

[Doug e+]

Doug, if you haven't already ordered the messy expensive stuff, have a good long think about what you hope to achieve then decide between tubeless of tannus.

I run both in different bikes with different priorities.I advocate trying tannus before tubeless.( probably because I tried tubeless first?)

IMHO , tannus rules for puncture protection , but tubeless rules for weight / performance.

Tubeless is messy and when things go wrong it's incredibly frustrating, you run the real risk of being stranded trailside with goop pouring out of a sliced tyre and wishing you had a spare tube plus several litres of hand wash.....and you can guarantee just enough time between random flats to become a convert.....then the sneaky leaky hits

Tannus has a dead feel when riding , a bit like running too much compression dampening, and is a pita to learn to install. But the flip side is excellent puncture protection, the ability to ride with a flat tube, and even the ability to patch a flat tube / remove the tannus to get home if you decide riding on a squirmy tannus is hard work.

Did I mention tannus is a pita to install? A previous post:

Just been out in the shed fitting tannus to sprog 3's wheel , it had a previous tubeless failure mess and busted spoke so this was a complicated install - most of the time was spent cleaning the old tubeless mess, fitting some new rim tape ( gorilla tape), and washing up the tubeless mess.

Soooo.....my ten Tannus tips:

1 warm the tannus +/- tyre - a few minutes in the Aussie sun works. This seems to help them flatten out and lose the kinks from packaging.

2 make sure everything in spotless - especially inside the tyre if it's previously been tubeless

3 LOTSA talc. Then a bit more. Both inside and outside the tyre, all over the tannus, the tube, my face.....

4 Tannus in the tyre, then fit the disc side tyre / tannus into the well. IN THE WELL. Don't let it creep up on the edge if the rim. Make sure no tannus is trapped between the tyre and rim.

5 insert tube, just enough air to prevent a pinch flat , NOT enough to be completely round. Slip the valve into the rim but leave the screw loose, slip the tube into the tannus.

6 Juggling time - start installing the outside edge , making sure to slip the tannus in UNDER THE TUBE and then that section of tyre. Working around in small bites, and ensuring the tannus does NOT get between the tyre and rim.

7 deep sigh....cross fingers.....one last push on the valve to ensure the tube is free.....another deep sigh

8 pump the tyre up until the tyre is evenly seated. Or 60 psi.....anything above 60 psi deserves a coffee / beer break and a rethink afterwards . Coffee fixes everything - leaving the tyre sitting at 60 psi worked!

9 contemplate the best way to do this trailside . I really do need to work put a way to run the handpresso auto off the bikes battery so I can have coffee trailside.

10 ask the collective - should I carry a full size spare tube so if I get a flat with tannus I can remove the tannus and go old style? Or just ride on the tannus with the flat?

Thank you for taking the time to reply to my post with an excellent information. I had already ordered the parts needed to go tubeless as recommended by forum members. After reading all the replies I decided to try the tubeless tyres.
There has been some very positive feedback on the tubless tyres and some not so good. I rode my last EMTB with tubes and the green slime and it worked very well. Never had to change a tube in over a year with the slime in the tubes. Was going to do the same on my Cube but it has presta valves which are a bit more difficult to get the slime in.
Thanks again to all that replied to my post and that is how I joined the forum as there are many members with invaluable information.
I let you all know how I get on once the tubeless tyres are up and running. ?

 

[Doug e+]

Tubeless, tubeless, tubeless. Did I mention tubeless? Best money I ever spent on upgrading my bike. With regard to the purion dispay. I bought a rubber doughnut toy from a pet shop that slips over the handle bars and lifts the display clear of the ground. I prefer turning the bike upside down when replacing the front wheel. I find it easier to present the wheel to the bike rather than the bike to the wheel, if that makes sense.

Al

What a great idea as I would rather change the wheel when the bike is upside down when not at home to use the bike stand.
Hopefully ill be saying tubeless, tubeless, tubeless ??

 

[Doug e+]

Me again. Can you tell by looking at photo if these are tubeless ready as this is the rim tape as stock standard.

 

[Monkey Dog]

I run Tannus in both of my bikes. I got a slice in my rear tyre the other month & Tannus certainly saved me a walk home. With a tubeless set up, I would have still been waking as the cut was around 20-25mm.
There's for & against with both. It's down to personal preference & what you actually run over to get a flat.

 

[Mikerb]

Me again. Can you tell by looking at photo if these are tubeless ready as this is the rim tape as stock standard.

View attachment 42617

View attachment 42618

yep they are ready ......just put the valves in

 

[Doug e+]

yep they are ready ......just put the valves in

Thanks. Valves in tyre on but tried for ages to get tyre to seat on rim with no success. Just can’t get the tyre to stay in rim to blow it up.

 

[Pdoz]

Thanks. Valves in tyre on but tried for ages to get tyre to seat on rim with no success. Just can’t get the tyre to stay in rim to blow it up.

welcome to tubeless life 101...

you need a sudden burst or air . If you have a compressor , remove the valve core and inflate at speed ( local garage might be an option) . Alternatively there are lots of more expensive options like air cannisters ( which you can copy) . Good luck, and keep wondering how you could achieve that trailside...

 

[Beekeeper]

I’ve had to replace a lot of punctures but I’ve found this pump to be excellent for popping the tyres on. I just set to 30psi and switch on. They sell them in Argos and B & Q. I hear a couple of loud bangs at around 25psi and job done. Soapy water around the bead / tyre wall helps too.

The pump is also great for reading tyre pressures and you can set the pressure to the nearest 1 psi.
rechargeable from mains or cigarette car socket.

I do run tubes however. You will also need a schrader to presta valve adaptor. I got a load of those from amazon as I’m always losing them.

 

[KennyB]

Thanks. Valves in tyre on but tried for ages to get tyre to seat on rim with no success. Just can’t get the tyre to stay in rim to blow it up.

Use an inner tube to seat it, then break the bead on one side, reinstall valve and carry on.

 

[Doug e+]

Thanks all, I’ve got the bead in ok on one rim but I’m using a floor pump with no success. I’ll have a look at the Argos tyre inflator. I have tubeless valves fitted which I can remove the core. Does the pump just attach to the valve with the core removed or do I still need an adaptor from where the core fits to schrader?

 

[MrPeaski]

Sorry to say, but in my opinion the blue tape as fitted is NOT quite ready for tubeless.

The sealant will get underneath the edges and leak out. The tape needs to go from edge to edge inside the rim. The tyre then seals against the tape trapping the sealant in (simplified but you get the idea)

I'd pull all that off and start from scratch.

 

[PetrD]

What about stronger/downhill tubes or using the sealant into the tube? With ebike we dont need solving a few grams vs reliability.

 

[nickfrog]

Doug, if you haven't already ordered the messy expensive stuff, have a good long think about what you hope to achieve then decide between tubeless of tannus.

I run both in different bikes with different priorities.I advocate trying tannus before tubeless.( probably because I tried tubeless first?)

IMHO , tannus rules for puncture protection , but tubeless rules for weight / performance.

Tubeless is messy and when things go wrong it's incredibly frustrating, you run the real risk of being stranded trailside with goop pouring out of a sliced tyre and wishing you had a spare tube plus several litres of hand wash.....and you can guarantee just enough time between random flats to become a convert.....then the sneaky leaky hits

Nothing messy about tubeless in my experience. The fact that you tried it first isn't conclusive. Or maybe it was conclusive to the fact that you were not very good at it, despite it being quite simple and not messy at all if done properly.

Nothing expensive either. £6 for a pair of valves, £16 for a litre of caffelatex that will do 10 wheels, a £10 roll of TESA that will last many years. That's the cost of x1 insert isn't it?

 

[Beekeeper]

Thanks all, I’ve got the bead in ok on one rim but I’m using a floor pump with no success. I’ll have a look at the Argos tyre inflator. I have tubeless valves fitted which I can remove the core. Does the pump just attach to the valve with the core removed or do I still need an adaptor from where the core fits to schrader?

yeah you will need an adaptor as the presta shaft is much narrower than the schrader. Keep the core in when inflating using the pump.

For tubeless setup definitely have a look at this video which someone posted on here earlier...

 

[Pdoz]

Thanks all, I’ve got the bead in ok on one rim but I’m using a floor pump with no success. I’ll have a look at the Argos tyre inflator. I have tubeless valves fitted which I can remove the core. Does the pump just attach to the valve with the core removed or do I still need an adaptor from where the core fits to schrader?

That little argos pump doesn't stand a chance of sealing tubeless - he runs tubes.

You need a quick burst of air to push the tyres against the rim. If you persevere with the floor pump and the core removed you MIGHT get lucky - you just need to get-a decent seal. A decent compressor is a great investment....

For what it's worth, I bet that blue tape works fine

 

[Beekeeper]

Sorry to say, but in my opinion the blue tape as fitted is NOT quite ready for tubeless.

The sealant will get underneath the edges and leak out. The tape needs to go from edge to edge inside the rim. The tyre then seals against the tape trapping the sealant in (simplified but you get the idea)

I'd pull all that off and start from scratch.

Yeah I was thinking the same thing and get new rim tape of the correct width for your rims. Muc Off do them.

 

[Pdoz]

Nothing messy about tubeless in my experience. The fact that you tried it first isn't conclusive. Or maybe it was conclusive to the fact that you were not very good at it, despite it being quite simple and not messy at all if done properly.

Nothing expensive either. £6 for a pair of valves, £16 for a litre of caffelatex that will do 10 wheels, a £10 roll of TESA that will last many years. That's the cost of x1 insert isn't it?

I ran tubeless on a fleet of 4 mtb for 3/4 years. Most of them were fine, but I had more than my fair share of issues. Many were user error, but a fair share if them were random tubeless gremlins.

Eg 2017 norco optic , I learnt a lot during hours spent watching the lbs unsuccessfully struggle to fix a stubborn sealant leak . There was a razor fine split in the factory fitted rim tape opposite the valve stem and sealant would track around the rim and out the stem. It took months of a slow leak before I found that , and the mess under that tape was unbelievable - gunk down every spoke and all through the inside of the rim.

Then there is all that dried gunk inside the tyres, the leaks from split sidewalls, or wasted sealant every time you change a tyre. At one stage I was swapping between down hill and x country rubber on a kids bike between events - most nights it was easy but when you wake up on the morning of a race to a flat tyre and can't be certain it's going to last the day - it's a PITA.

I still run tubeless on her bike because she likes the performance benefits, but for rock solid puncture protection I definitely prefer tannus , at least it's been trouble free during the year I've run it.

 

[iXi]

Rim tape should be fine, my gorilla tape covers roughly the same amount of surface area and is fine. With that said I do find it never holds up and needs to replaced if I ever remove the tyre.

Unsure where you are but servos have free tyre pumps in Aus. I just take mine there and hit the flat tyre button, pops the bead on in seconds and its free.

 

[Voluptua]

I must be lucky, as my own old bike, with tubes, doesn't get many punctures.

I must also be unlucky, as the only tubeless I've tried got me a puncture. Nothing out of the ordinary, just a tiny hole next to a knobble. It took a day or two to settle down, quietly hissing and oozing until it finally sealed. Perhaps the gunk was a bit stale.

 

[Mikerb]

I think that blue tape is ok. It sounds like like you just need a compressor or air tank both of which can deliver a high volume of air in a short time. With a track pump you are leaking as much air as you pump. Even with an air tank it is best to remove the valve core. Air tanks come equipped to connect to prestatyn valves. A garage service will likely only be shraeder

 

[Monkey Dog]

Nothing expensive either. £6 for a pair of valves, £16 for a litre of caffelatex that will do 10 wheels, a £10 roll of TESA that will last many years. That's the cost of x1 insert isn't it?

Plus the cost of a compresser.

 

[nickfrog]

Plus the cost of a compresser.

Not really. I made one with an old bottle of Coke and 2 old valves. It inflates the rare tubeless tyres that don't come up with a track pump and a bit of fairy liquid.

 

[Doug e+]

We update everyone. Removed tube, inserted tubeless valve, used the stock tape on rim. After several attempts I could not get the tyre to seal on the rims. I tried my local Halfords thinking they could help with seating the tyre.....hopeless as they couldn’t manage it either. I then went a LBS where they told me my stock schwable smart sams were not tubeless tyres ?. So I ended up buying a set of Pirelli Scorpions which the LBS fitted them and also filled with sealant.
The stock rim tape was okay but tyres were not.
So in the end I’ve got tubeless tyres fitted as I wanted although it cost me for the new tyres. Been out on bike for 6 miles to make sure the sealant works it’s way in to make them air tight.
Ill now be in a position shortly to see for myself if going tubeless was the correct way ?.

Thanks again to all members for there feedback and I have learned a lot from this. I am so glad I found this forum as the advice and comments are Very helpful.
Cheers
Dougie ?

 

[brizi2003]

+1. You’ll never you back to tubes.

Guess what...I went back to tubes...with Tannus armour. Try re-inflating your tubeless tyre with a dinged rim or ripped sidewall? With Tannus I had a side wall split and didn't even loose any air - continued my ride as normal! Amazing! And that dinged rim I couldn't use with a tubeless setup - no problem with Tannus! Is a slightly more difficult to fit than just an inner tube but that's the only downside. Once fitted - forget and run pressures as low as you like!

 

[nickfrog]

Guess what...I went back to tubes...with Tannus armour. Try re-inflating your tubeless tyre with a dinged rim or ripped sidewall? With Tannus I had a side wall split and didn't even loose any air - continued my ride as normal! Amazing! And that dinged rim I couldn't use with a tubeless setup - no problem with Tannus! Is a slightly more difficult to fit than just an inner tube but that's the only downside. Once fitted - forget and run pressures as low as you like!

Do you use Tannus?

 

[High Rock Ruti]

Hi all, I’m looking for some advice as I’ve had a couple of punctures recently. I have a cube reaction hybrid pro 625 running on stock schwalbe smart Sam 29x2.6 with inner tube.
What do you all do to prevent punctures or what’s the best way to repair or just change inner tube. Also what way up should the bike be to take wheel off as I noticed when bike upside down the bosh purion display could get damaged.
Cheers Dougie.

High Rock Ruti

Cushcore and stans race or Orange brand liquids, it's heavy but not nearly as heavy as pushing your 50 pound bike out of the woods, and it's nearly indestructible also if you don't care you can ride out on the flat tire the cushcore will support the tire and rim within limits.

Warm Regards Ruti

 

[High Rock Ruti]

Guess what...I went back to tubes...with Tannus armour. Try re-inflating your tubeless tyre with a dinged rim or ripped sidewall? With Tannus I had a side wall split and didn't even loose any air - continued my ride as normal! Amazing! And that dinged rim I couldn't use with a tubeless setup - no problem with Tannus! Is a slightly more difficult to fit than just an inner tube but that's the only downside. Once fitted - forget and run pressures as low as you like!
View attachment 42751

High Rock Ruti

Wow split tire and glove, did they fail on the same obstacle?


Warm Regards Ruti

 

[Gary]

Once fitted - forget and run pressures as low as you like!

You do realise the irony of this comment?

Your tyre sidewall split BECAUSE of running too low pressure