eMountain Biking with an Internal Geared Hub (the Rohloff)

[Philly G]

@paulmoir great video, thank you. Have you noticed any difference in rear shock responsiveness ? 1/2 kilo is quite an increase in unsprung mass

 

[paulmoir]

@paulmoir great video, thank you. Have you noticed any difference in rear shock responsiveness ? 1/2 kilo is quite an increase in unsprung mass

Personally I did not notice or feel any difference. I did adjust the shock air pressure and settings to best suit the Rohloff wheel, but they were minor adjustments. I asked also Nikko (who speaks/rides on the video) the same question as he is a suspension focused rider/racer, he had the same thought… no difference that he could notice or feel.

 

[SUBcyclist]

This is an excellent video; high production quality, and logical progression through the various aspects of the Rohloff hub and its advantages. I watch this on YouTube, so that I could give it a 'thumbs up.' As well, I saved it in my EMTB list, so that I can easily copy and share the link with people who I might discuss this with at some point. Thank you very much for making and sharing this.

 

[Elover]

I ran the Rohloff a few years back, along with a friend. We thought it was going to be a great solution to mountain biking, but found it a pain in the arse. The weak point was shit getting into the cables, making it virtually impossible to shift. On our 1st trip to Wales in winter I almost lost the will to live, having to stop and change gear with two hands. This happened on both our bikes. The cost of new cables and some other widget, was the same cost as an shomano Lx rear mech and new cables at the time. Luckily sold it a year later on ebay and only lost £50... If they sorted the weak points out it would be great, otherwise i`ll stick with ye olde rear mech.

 

[Pabloaguas]

I’m surprised there is no mention of the Kindernay 14-speed through-axle hub here… maybe because it is new no one knows about it?

Anyways, it has multiple advantages over the Roloff: it has a true through-axle, no spacers or adapters at all, and has an integrated brake rotor. Comes with thumb shifters.

The Kindernay is a modern design for modern bikes. Was specifically designed for EMTBs with 142 and 148 12mm through- axles. Although I believe it will fit other bikes with adapters….

 

[Zimmerframe]

maybe because it is new no one knows about it?

@knut7 reviewed it a couple of years ago :

 

[H.E.]

I have a kindernay did a little review here:

Kindernay XIV my experience so far

Hi, So, I actually bought the Kindernay for another bike, but since i have a new one i decided to try it out with that. I was about to get a Rohloff but Rohloff does not allow the online Sale of the hub you can adapt to 142/148mm. They are only to be sold localy and the dealer needs a certain...

www.emtbforums.com

 

[paulmoir]

I ran the Rohloff a few years back, along with a friend. We thought it was going to be a great solution to mountain biking, but found it a pain in the arse. The weak point was shit getting into the cables, making it virtually impossible to shift. On our 1st trip to Wales in winter I almost lost the will to live, having to stop and change gear with two hands. This happened on both our bikes. The cost of new cables and some other widget, was the same cost as an shomano Lx rear mech and new cables at the time. Luckily sold it a year later on ebay and only lost £50... If they sorted the weak points out it would be great, otherwise i`ll stick with ye olde rear mech.

Sounds like you have had a very unfortunate experience with your first Rohloff. I spend significant time making sure the cabling is right, no sharp bends etc as that makes the shifting tight and difficult, so does the adjuster screws done up tight with no free-play... otherwise the shifter is normally very easy to use. It sounds like the cables were not installed properly or the oem Rohloff cables were not used, as the Rohloff cable ends also have little orings to stop and water/dust/grit ingress? Normally you would only change the inner cables once a year (maybe twice) for mountain biking and they are GBP6.00 (US$8), otherwise a full cable set of housings and inners cables is GBP20 (US$25-30). I rode in Malaysia and Singapore for 6-7 years with the Rohloff... in the tropics, always very wet, always raining, always muddy etc - never an issue (again, there I probably changed the inner cables 2x a year). It sounds as though the Rohloffs were never installed correctly, and/or non-genuine parts were used. All the best for the future.

 

[TPEHAK]

So you also have to change cables with Rohloff setup 1-2 times per year? With Kindernay you do not change anything except gearhub oil (once per year).

 

[OldBean]

Latest Rollhofs are electric shift. No cables to jam .
paulmoir has cost me a lot of money......... his enthusiasm for the Rollhof has caused me to buy a R & M Delight Off Road with Rollhof and belt drive 3 months delivery ...should arrive just on time for the mud season .
There is a dealer network in UK which gives me confidence I hope !

 

[paulmoir]

So you also have to change cables with Rohloff setup 1-2 times per year? With Kindernay you do not change anything except gearhub oil (once per year).

To clarify, I change my cables 1-2 times a year as I only ride my bike on the trails… with the dirt, dust, mud etc and I do that 3-4 times a week. Many don’t change their Rohloff cables for years… my wife’s Rohloff cables have never been replaced and I fitted those in 2010. In the end, we all have our personal preferences and you cannot change gears on a Kindernay (in a mtb’ing application) as quick and as many gears at a time, as you can with a Rohloff twist shifter. So that is simply what I prefer and what I need for mountain biking and for racing mtbs… that’s the way I ride. Glad you like the Kindernay and it works for you.

 

[Gary]

But Wales ?

TBF new cables every 90 mtb rides doesn't sound all that bad but still sounds like you might be having to replace them a fair bit more frequently than a derailleur cable would require. (especially if your climate is drier than ours)?
I too have witnessed rohloff equipped bikes still shifting perfectly after many years on the original cables.. But none of those were mountain bikes used throughout a British winter.

 

[Dirtnvert]

I see on one of the latest embn's they mention a 6speed internal geared hub to be released. They said it was revolute.de but my search turned up nothing except a heavily spammed finance company. I was thinking less gears = less weight gained from traditional derailleur drivetrain and i dont need 14 gears on an emtb. I wonder if we see that company soon or rohloff or kindernay will be producing a lighter hub with less gears?

 

[Pdoz]

But Wales ?

TBF new cables every 90 mtb rides doesn't sound all that bad but still sounds like you might be having to replace them a fair bit more frequently than a derailleur cable would require. (especially if your climate is drier than ours)?
I too have witnessed rohloff equipped bikes still shifting perfectly after many years on the original cables.. But none of those were mountain bikes used throughout a British winter.

Pft, wales only gets 1100 to 1800 mm a year?

The op lives in an area that has already had 1200 mm and it's not even the wet season. They can get 200 mm in a day during the wet season - and that's without counting the sweat dripping from his groin from tropical humidity.

 

[Gary]

Isn't Google great.

But take a few minutes to think about what happens to rain when it reaches the ground in a cold climate in comparison to a hot one. Particularly in woodland and hills

 

[Pdoz]

Isn't Google great.

But take a few minutes to think about what happens to rain when it reaches the ground in a cold climate in comparison to a hot one. Particularly in woodland and hills

I live in a (cold for Australia) climate and have over 30 years of destroying dirt bikes in our mountains . I've also done annual once in a lifetime trips through both our outback and tropical regions - including an amazing 2 week trip at the tip of cape york in the wet season - 600 mm overnight on clay based tracks that turned into rapids and swamps.

I'll take maintaining a bike through cold wet winters over the tropics any day. But mostly because of the groin rash.

 

[Gary]

Cool (irrelevant) story bro

 

[Dirtnvert]

Interwebz = protective goggles

 

[valium97]

This is Rohloff focused. But for those interested... this is quite a detailed video I have put together explaining about the advantages and disadvantages of the internal geared hubs on eMtbs. The purpose of the video is to try and explain how the Rohloff works, how you change gears and what a Rohloff is really like in a mountain biking (and eMtb'ing) application. Along with some iconic Aussie trails and scenery and feedback from a couple of eMtb'ers who have recently converted over to the geared hub.

Amazing video, thanks a lot Paul!!!

 

[Hoozie]

Hi Paul,
I really like the look of this setup, and I have seen a few of your videos,
But nowhere you have spoken about the gear ratios, as in, with a cassette you have a 51-10 and a say 32 front chain ring, I find that I start pedalling too fast /or out pedal when I get on flat roads to get back home,

1; How does the Rohloff compare with this, as I have just bought a bigger chain ring (36) so I can get better peddling power on the flat/downhills,?

2; would your 1st gear compare to a 32 front and 10 back and last gear compare to 32 front and 51 back etc?

3:Another question is: how have you found your Battery usage in comparison , as we usually try to go for long rides in the forests around home 50km up to 70km, have you found the efficiency similar , better or worse?

4; Do you think they are going to bring out an interchangeable hub, similar to the kindernay , where you can change out the gearbox without having to "respoke" the wheel, which would make it easier to service or repair or change to another bike / wheel for the same bike etc?

Thanks in advance for any more info and sorry if I have asked questions that were addressed before

 

[paulmoir]

Hi Paul,
I really like the look of this setup, and I have seen a few of your videos,
But nowhere you have spoken about the gear ratios, as in, with a cassette you have a 51-10 and a say 32 front chain ring, I find that I start pedalling too fast /or out pedal when I get on flat roads to get back home,

1; How does the Rohloff compare with this, as I have just bought a bigger chain ring (36) so I can get better peddling power on the flat/downhills,?

2; would your 1st gear compare to a 32 front and 10 back and last gear compare to 32 front and 51 back etc?

3:Another question is: how have you found your Battery usage in comparison , as we usually try to go for long rides in the forests around home 50km up to 70km, have you found the efficiency similar , better or worse?

4; Do you think they are going to bring out an interchangeable hub, similar to the kindernay , where you can change out the gearbox without having to "respoke" the wheel, which would make it easier to service or repair or change to another bike / wheel for the same bike etc?

Thanks in advance for any more info and sorry if I have asked questions that were addressed before

1. Rohloff has a 526% gear range, typical 11-speed 12-speed cassette around 480-510%... so the Rohloff will feel like it has an extra 1-2 gears compared to a cassette/derailleur.
2. 1st gear on the Rohloff would be similar or even lower geared than say a 51 rear, 32 front... similarly 14th gear would be similar of higher to 10 on the rear and 32 front. Typically the Rohloff can be setup up to feel a gear or 2 lower (or higher) than a standard 11 or 12-speed.
3. No difference with the battery. The Rohloff is the most efficient geared hub on the market, independently tested to around 95-96%. A perfectly clean chain/cassette drive (if in a straight line, not angled to the lowest or highest gears on the cassette) is around 98%.
4. No they won't change the design as far as I am aware. Regarding service, there is none... change the oil once a year yourself and look after your cables (like you would with any cables) - you don't need to remove the hub for either. I'm probably biased, but if you wanted to change the same wheel between 2 bikes, then have a shifter and cables setup on both bikes... it's then a 1-2 minute change ready to ride. You don't need two wheels (expensive) - and both systems you would need a shifter/cables (or hoses) on both bikes. Personally I don't see any real advantage, but I appreciate that others like the idea.

 

[OldBean]

I am 2 months into my new R&M Delight Rollhof / Gates this has electronic shift and is quite beautiful to change as long as you keep weight/load off the system momentarily whilst shifting....just the same as proper shifting with derailleurs. it has auto down shift when stopped but to avoid stress on the box I have disabled the feature ...... no problem as you can change gear to your best starting ratio when stationary .
I do not like the Rollhof gear change switch especially when wearing winter gloves Very vague MUCH prefer the Shimano levers .
The lack of lengthy cleaning during the muddy season (10 months of the year) is bliss Big downside for me is the overall weight
. Plan a short review of the bike shortly.

 

[Gary]

Is that a custom tensioner or does Rohloff/gates offer forwards frame/bb mounted tensioners now?

 

[Mabman]

Hey @OldBean what rear fender is that? Does it flap or brap?

 

[OldBean]

Is that a custom tensioner or does Rohloff/gates offer forwards frame/bb mounted tensioners now?

That is the stock tensioner . Needs disconnecting if you have to remove the rear wheel . Dealer showed me a trick of turning bike upside-down and with a long cable tie or similar pulling the spring out of the way...makes everything easier BUT remember which way the spring faces when refitting I did it wrong and had to start again. Have fun all.

 

[OldBean]

Hey @OldBean what rear fender is that? Does it flap or brap?

Its a Mudhugger medium....... with my own rear extender and frontend mudflap to keep muck out of the suspension bits / shock area..its crude but it works...I still get some spattering but it keeps most muck away.
It does vibrate quite a lot but I ignore it ...the biggest problem is when its on the car bike rack..... it then flaps around badly in the slipstream. Have tried bracing it with various stiffeners but no joy so far. I fix the MH with reusable cable ties but refitting it before each ride is a PITA so dont bother to remove it.