Catalys Pedals by Pedaling Innovations

[grantini]

Has anyone used Pedaling Innovations Catalyst pedals? I just ordered some, interested to see how they work... https://pedalinginnovations.com/?gclid=Cj0

 

[kafkastan]

Good grief, no!

I followed the link as I’m debating new pedals and kept on reading out of curiosity. I looked up the inventor and even skimmed the two studies he referred to. I’m afraid I strongly suspect that the inventor is a crank and the ‘science’ is bunk. He’s taken – very selectively – some conclusions to two studies, put them together, and come up with the conclusion he wants. 2+2 = Unicorn!

In fact, the conclusions to one of the studies he quotes actually says: “the anterior–posterior foot position did not affect pedaling economy both for the population of competitive cyclists and for individuals within this population ... From a cycling performance standpoint, there is no benefit in moving the cleat posteriorly on the sole of the shoe.”

Switch off the shopping channel and/ or burn your credit card.

 

[grantini]

Good grief, no!

I followed the link as I’m debating new pedals and kept on reading out of curiosity. I looked up the inventor and even skimmed the two studies he referred to. I’m afraid I strongly suspect that the inventor is a crank and the ‘science’ is bunk. He’s taken – very selectively – some conclusions to two studies, put them together, and come up with the conclusion he wants. 2+2 = Unicorn!

In fact, the conclusions to one of the studies he quotes actually says: “the anterior–posterior foot position did not affect pedaling economy both for the population of competitive cyclists and for individuals within this population ... From a cycling performance standpoint, there is no benefit in moving the cleat posteriorly on the sole of the shoe.”

Switch off the shopping channel and/ or burn your credit card.

I watched/read a LOT of reviews and they are almost uniformly positive. It also makes sense... worth it to try and if, after thirty days I don't like em... back they go.

 

[kafkastan]

Righty-ho. Well, I hope I'm wrong and they work well for you! I'd a few glasses of wine, saw your post, and then disappeared down an internet rabbit hole looking into the 'science'. I still think the rationale offered on the website doesn't add up, and actually contradicts the overall conclusions of one of the studies he quotes, but that doesn't mean that he isn't on to something for other reasons or that individuals won't like them.

 

[grantini]

Righty-ho. Well, I hope I'm wrong and they work well for you! I'd a few glasses of wine, saw your post, and then disappeared down an internet rabbit hole looking into the 'science'. I still think the rationale offered on the website doesn't add up, and actually contradicts the overall conclusions of one of the studies he quotes, but that doesn't mean that he isn't on to something for other reasons or that individuals won't like them.

Yup, I might just be drinking the koolaid and I'll admit I was initially skeptical and felt like I was being sold snake oil, but the more I drilled down through different reviews the more bought in. Now I'm $130 in.. and if they would get here I could see for myself!

 

[Swan]

I have never run them as I am a pretty firm clipless believer for myself. But we have sold probably 10-15 pair of those pedals and have 5 or 6 pair on shop guys personal bikes. There are pretty much universal good reviews on them from everyone.


The only thing one of our guys suggested that I agreed would be a good idea is having 2 more pins in the center of the pedal where you could run a shorter pin. It's such a huge area that your foot grabs all the outside pins but he said he notices the lack of a pin in the center. We are going to drill and tap his set to see if it makes a difference.

 

[grantini]

I have never run them as I am a pretty firm clipless believer for myself. But we have sold probably 10-15 pair of those pedals and have 5 or 6 pair on shop guys personal bikes. There are pretty much universal good reviews on them from everyone.


The only thing one of our guys suggested that I agreed would be a good idea is having 2 more pins in the center of the pedal where you could run a shorter pin. It's such a huge area that your foot grabs all the outside pins but he said he notices the lack of a pin in the center. We are going to drill and tap his set to see if it makes a difference.

I wonder if it’s possible to add them?

 

[Swan]

I wonder if it’s possible to add them?

Drill bit, tap and a steady hand.. Would probably take 20 mins to add the 8 pins that we suggested to his pedals.. I was going to do it the other day, but he had dog poo on the pedals and my interest in the project was limited for the day. Ha

 

[grantini]

Drill bit, tap and a steady hand.. Would probably take 20 mins to add the 8 pins that we suggested to his pedals.. I was going to do it the other day, but he had dog poo on the pedals and my interest in the project was limited for the day. Ha

Nice. My dad has a Mack daddy drill press

 

[Slowroller]

Nice. My dad has a Mack daddy drill press

Put the tap in the drill press, it makes it easier with small taps to keep them square

 

[JimBo]

I'm prone to shin splints and got a pair of Catalyst pedals when they first came out ($85 back then). They helped!

My only complaint is that my old FiveTen Element shoes have slightly rounded soles, and don't sit flat across the long pedals so grip isn't great. My Freerider shoes, however, grip them nicely.

 

[grantini]

I'm prone to shin splints and got a pair of Catalyst pedals when they first came out ($85 back then). They helped!

My only complaint is that my old FiveTen Element shoes have slightly rounded soles, and don't sit flat across the long pedals so grip isn't great. My Freerider shoes, however, grip them nicely.

I was worried, I thought I had Elements but I have Freeriders!

 

[JimBo]

The only thing one of our guys suggested that I agreed would be a good idea is having 2 more pins in the center of the pedal where you could run a shorter pin. It's such a huge area that your foot grabs all the outside pins but he said he notices the lack of a pin in the center. We are going to drill and tap his set to see if it makes a difference.

I think they added center pins after getting a lot of similar feedback.

 

[Gary]

The only thing one of our guys suggested that I agreed would be a good idea is having 2 more pins in the center of the pedal where you could run a shorter pin. It's such a huge area that your foot grabs all the outside pins but he said he notices the lack of a pin in the center. We are going to drill and tap his set to see if it makes a difference.

Is that guy by any chance a beginner? Or fairly new to flat pedals?

Adding a pin in the centre of the pedal is going to reduce the concave shape of the entire pedal Not great for a flat pedal and actually removing centre pins normally affords a flat pedal more grip and better control

James Wilson's fitness/coaching is pretty sound but I feel he's just looking to make a buck and missed out on cashing in on other dumb ideas like Rev grips and manual machines
There are too many downsides to using an extra long pedal platform IMO
Maybe buy them if you have massive feet

 

[Gary]

Good grief, no!

I followed the link as I’m debating new pedals and kept on reading out of curiosity. I looked up the inventor and even skimmed the two studies he referred to. I’m afraid I strongly suspect that the inventor is a crank and the ‘science’ is bunk. He’s taken – very selectively – some conclusions to two studies, put them together, and come up with the conclusion he wants. 2+2 = Unicorn!

In fact, the conclusions to one of the studies he quotes actually says: “the anterior–posterior foot position did not affect pedaling economy both for the population of competitive cyclists and for individuals within this population ... From a cycling performance standpoint, there is no benefit in moving the cleat posteriorly on the sole of the shoe.”

Switch off the shopping channel and/ or burn your credit card.

Gotta agree

Seems he's simply trying to implement the mid cleat position from clipped in pedals (mainly a roadie thing) into flat pedal design. There are pluses and minuses of this position in regards to power and efficiency. But you need to retrain your muscles and pedlling style to benefit (not great for mtb riding, where control is more important than power at all)... But the oddest thing is flat pedals already do ride with a more mid foot pedal axle position.

Stability. Yes a larger foot platform should increase stability.. but since when is ultimate stability on a flat pedal a positive? FFS learn how to control a pedal and it's a non issue.

Comfort? Really? Uh huh

The one thing he failed to mention (intentionally?) in his advert was CONTROL . and these massive things (unless you have massive feet are actually going to reduce that.

 

[Eckythump]

A couple of years ago I twisted my ankle and had to adopt the above pedalling position for a number of months until it healed. It relieved a lot of stress the regular position imparts around the ankle & lower leg.
It was a temporary thing but I do still find myself using it riding in the saddle. It does seem to require less energy and is less fatiguing, probably just down to not using muscles to resist deflection of the foot/ ankle.
The position is next to useless when you are out of the saddle, your feet & toes catch everything, you cannot drive your knees round the turns and I cannot believe anyone can do a bunny hop or pop the bike from it.
If you have reasonably stiff 5tens and the like I don’t really see the benefit of these pedals over regular flats other than providing protection to the more exposed front foot.

 

[Gary]

The beauty of a flat pedal is that you're not locked into any one foot position at any point.
These things seem to be one man's mission against that freedom.

I cannot believe anyone can do a bunny hop or pop the bike from it.

Not being funny but anyone with half decent bunnyhopping technique should be able to hop a bike one footed. Using both feet you should be able to lift both wheels with their feet in pretty much any position on the pedals.
a lot of a bunny hop comes from your upperbody, hips and weight shift. You could still bunnyhop a bike with no movement in your ankles at all.
Practice your technique moar.

 

[Eckythump]

While I couldn’t possibly deem myself to have your lofty talents and agree gravity is never going to be kind to me I find; If the pedal axle is back by the bridge of your foot you cannot get any scoop to pick up the back end. If you try & tip your feet forward enough to scoop they hit the floor, not to mention all your ‘spring’ comes from your ankles

 

[Swan]

Is that guy by any chance a beginner? Or fairly new to flat pedals?

Adding a pin in the centre of the pedal is going to reduce the concave shape of the entire pedal Not great for a flat pedal and actually removing centre pins normally affords a flat pedal more grip and better control

James Wilson's fitness/coaching is pretty sound but I feel he's just looking to make a buck and missed out on cashing in on other dumb ideas like Rev grips and manual machines
There are too many downsides to using an extra long pedal platform IMO
Maybe buy them if you have massive feet

Actually far from a beginner or a flat pedal newbie. Very strong cat 1/pro level rider. Like crushes 10k climbing days on a 35lb bike multiple days in a row and can descend right with me as a pro DH racer the whole time. Very very accomplished rider.


He already runs huge pins on the outside perimeter of the pedal and we agreed that you would run a smaller pin in the center to keep some concavity to the pedals.



And that rev grip comment digs deep. They are my jam. I am too lazy to work on hand strength and anti hand fatigue workouts. Rev grips have absolutely let me buy a product instead of working on making myself better.. But then again, we are on a EMTB website, so that's par for the corse.. Lol

 

[Gary]

You race DH at pro level on Rev grips?
you're a far braver man than I. The disconnection would mean I'd have to clip in to cope even trail riding. They're the scariest thing ever to hold onto manualing. and I actually ripped the inserts clean out the collars of a punters pair bunnyhopping his bike.

does your mate at least have big feet?

 

[Gary]

While I couldn’t possibly deem myself to have your lofty talents and agree gravity is never going to be kind to me I find; If the pedal axle is back by the bridge of your foot you cannot get any scoop to pick up the back end. If you try & tip your feet forward enough to scoop they hit the floor, not to mention all your ‘spring’ comes from your ankles

There's no need to scoop mate with the correct timing.
Also all your spring DOES NOT come from your ankles.
Most of it comes from your thighs but also preload with your upper body more and physically tip the nose with your hands while pushing the bars forwards during the rear wheel lift/levelling out process.

 

[Swan]

You race DH at pro level on Rev grips?
you're a far braver man than I. The disconnection would mean I'd have to clip in to cope even trail riding. They're the scariest thing ever to hold onto manualing. and I actually ripped the inserts clean out the collars of a punters pair bunnyhopping his bike.

does your mate at least have big feet?

Yep.. "pro" is a relitive term. I win local races and top 10-15 at bigger races. You wouldn't know me. But I am competitive and well beyond cat 1 territory.


But yep. I have them on all my bikes. I run them pretty firm and I check the inserts regularly. But I really do appreciate them. I seem to be able to manual ok with them. But I also clip in on all my bikes too.

And homeboy has regular feet.. US12 I believe. And he actually rides rev grips too and is able to shread pretty well. ?

 

[grantini]

They arrived yesterday after I rode, it's POURING here in Delaware today, so I threw them on our exercise bike and pounded out ten miles on them. They felt really good and natural.... so far so good, I'll be swapping the short screws out for long ones during the game this afternoon.... may be too muddy to ride tomorrow, I hope not.

 

[Gary]

Yep.. "pro" is a relitive term. I win local races and top 10-15 at bigger races. You wouldn't know me. But I am competitive and well beyond cat 1 territory.


But yep. I have them on all my bikes. I run them pretty firm and I check the inserts regularly. But I really do appreciate them. I seem to be able to manual ok with them. But I also clip in on all my bikes too.

And homeboy has regular feet.. US12 I believe. And he actually rides rev grips too and is able to shread pretty well. ?

We only have Cat1 in road in the UK (it's the elite level of road)
in DH we have Elite, Expert and then the normal amature classes. I've never really understood the US DH ranking system. it doesn't seem to correlate with ours at all.
All UK Elite riders are capable of qualifying for a World Cup final and a fair few experts aren't far off.

US 12 is pretty big TBF

 

[grantini]

Just swapped about half the screws out for long screws

 

[grantini]

I like them. A lot!

 

[grantini]

First ride

 

[grantini]

 

[grantini]