Atherton S.170E eMTB

[BikeBert]

Looks like I’ve just made someone on the waiting list for the second batch happy. I had to cancel my first-batch S.170E.1 order

Unfortunately, the Croatian customs office is very rigid when it comes to imports from the UK. Based on my past experience and a recent confirmation from them, I would almost certainly be charged both VAT (25%) and customs duty (14%), regardless of the Certificate of UK Origin. I don’t want to go through another long dispute with customs and still risk ending up with extra costs.

I guess I’ll have to wait until Atherton has a European distributor, or offers a frame option within the EU.

Real shame, as I was genuinely excited about owning my first ever Atherton.

 

[whitymon]

Looks like I’ve just made someone on the waiting list for the second batch happy. I had to cancel my first-batch S.170E.1 order

Unfortunately, the Croatian customs office is very rigid when it comes to imports from the UK. Based on my past experience and a recent confirmation from them, I would almost certainly be charged both VAT (25%) and customs duty (14%), regardless of the Certificate of UK Origin. I don’t want to go through another long dispute with customs and still risk ending up with extra costs.

That is why I warned you in the first place, it becomes just too expensive for that it is, nice bike nothing of a revolution worth that price increased.

I would not bet on having an UE distributor btw, they would potentially face similar outcome.

 

[Endorium]

That is why I warned you in the first place, it becomes just too expensive for that it is, nice bike nothing of a revolution worth that price increased.

I would not bet on having an UE distributor btw, they would potentially face similar outcome.

The plan seems to be eventually buy a additive and cnc machine and base it in Europe. So bikes are made there. Gets around taxes. Then do the same in America etc

 

[whitymon]

The plan seems to be eventually buy a additive and cnc machine and base it in Europe. So bikes are made there. Gets around taxes. Then do the same in America etc

In the current state of industry this might be a madness perspective, it is not like brand are making tons of money so even if this is a plan I do not see it in a near futur, too risky, too expensive.

Despiste watching video and people saying I would buy a new bike, market is really awful.

 

[Endorium]

In the current state of industry this might be a madness perspective, it is not like brand are making tons of money so even if this is a plan I do not see it in a near futur, too risky, too expensive.

Despiste watching video and people saying I would buy a new bike, market is really awful.

Agreed, it's not a short term plan. But long term. If demand dictates, it will happen. I see a lot of atherton bikes around Europe now. Especially in the last 12 months.

 

[still20]

In the current state of industry this might be a madness perspective, it is not like brand are making tons of money so even if this is a plan I do not see it in a near futur, too risky, too expensive.

Despiste watching video and people saying I would buy a new bike, market is really awful.

Their business model is pretty good, people pay upfront so cash flow should be better than most, and the bikes are sold at a fair price considering they are hand made and available in 12 (S range) or 22 (A range) sizes.
People seem happy to pay potentially way more for Pivot, Santa Cruz and other expensive bikes that have only 4 or 5 sizes

 

[still20]

The plan seems to be eventually buy a additive and cnc machine and base it in Europe. So bikes are made there. Gets around taxes. Then do the same in America etc

Yeah I heard this, seems like a good plan to get around tariffs

 

[whitymon]

Their business model is pretty good, people pay upfront so cash flow should be better than most, and the bikes are sold at a fair price considering they are hand made and available in 12 (S range) or 22 (A range) sizes.
People seem happy to pay potentially way more for Pivot, Santa Cruz and other expensive bikes that have only 4 or 5 sizes

I do not see it like you at all.

Yes their bikes looks cool, but saying they are profitable and can sustain because they take cash upfront is absolutely not a recipe for success. If there is no order there is no money.

Do they have some order book full, maybe, good for them, saying also that they do things by hand is not entirely true, some part are still done by machine but we have to take into consideration that manual operation do not scale as work labor in UK is also pretty expensive. Saying there are tons of size is great but price still irrelevant for the consumer.

You mention other brand as expensive but this is just catalog price for dummies who can't wait, sorry for them, I have always secure a Santa or a Trek for 30-40% 2-3 months after they came out. On the opposite spectrum, Atherton, Nicolai, sale are really ... limited or non existant which basically make them more expensive.

Finally, let's still agree, that market is in a bad shape and even if saying of this is just 6-7k, most people out there are not able to spend that amount, nor they can salvate a good price for their previous bike.

Make no mistake I would like one but not till I cannot butt myself to UK to grab one, not that I am too far but lazy.

 

[slickrock]

ok, I found a different image. Using the bottle cage bosses (64mm) as a closer size guide, I get the downtube external measurement at 66mm (can't vouch for my accuracy though )

Length of 54/56 might be possible, it's difficult to tell how far they'll run into the headstock area and how low it will actually go.

Doesn't look like the cables will run via the top tube/seat tube, so some space will be lost there, but the battery unit might not be 100% round, it might have a slightly flattened top (depending on sell choice/size/layout....) and those cage screws need some length/space.

View attachment 175047

Interesting photo capture that shows the bike in the raw. Is this most likely the end-state of the battery compartment design? The waterworks motif of Atherton bikes has always been appealing to me in a test-mule kinda way, but this may be pushing it too far. When the pipes are small diameter they remind me of feedlines, but that downtube looks like a sewage line, and looks out of place with the rest of the bike, not to mention the M-Series rear breaks the motif to begin with.

On of the best aesthetic advantages of bikes employing the Avinox is the frames have such a sleek downtube, like they masquerade as an analog bike (e.g. like the Unno). There's no masquerading here. I would have thought Atherton would ditch the pipe motif for a bonded slender rectangular downtube, space-optimized for the stock battey design, with a bottom dropout similar to Crestline, which itself has a svelte downtube. And it would have been less out place since the rear triangle is already rectangular. Sticking with pipes just makes the downtube appear ungainly large, unless you shove a 1200WH custom battery in there to make use of all that space.

 

[DylanJM]

Interesting photo capture that shows the bike in the raw. Is this most likely the end-state of the battery compartment design? The waterworks motif of Atherton bikes has always been appealing to me in a test-mule kinda way, but this may be pushing it too far. When the pipes are small diameter they remind me of feedlines, but that downtube looks like a sewage line, and looks out of place with the rest of the bike, not to mention the M-Series rear breaks the motif to begin with.

On of the best aesthetic advantages of bikes employing the Avinox is the frames have such a sleek downtube, like they masquerade as an analog bike (e.g. like the Unno). There's no masquerading here. I would have thought Atherton would ditch the pipe motif for a bonded slender rectangular downtube, space-optimized for the stock battey design, with a bottom dropout similar to Crestline, which itself has a svelte downtube. And it would have been less out place since the rear triangle is already rectangular. Sticking with pipes just makes the downtube appear ungainly large, unless you shove a 1200WH custom battery in there to make use of all that space.

Looks fine to me and it's still considerably slimmer than a Levo 4 or Bosch bike. I think you are overplaying how thick that tube is, it's 65-75mm diameter at most. Zero chance a 1200wh batter would fit in there.

 

[ericandrew]

I don’t really see it as that much of a risk.
The Atherton bikes are well regarded, this is very similar in geo to the existing s170
The full spec, the geo, the technology, the suspension platform, with exception of the motor and battery is basically known.

The existing avinox specs are known, the motor and battery options well understood.
Well reviewed with known strengths and weaknesses , 600 or 800 battery.

If it was the existing avinox they would not be under embargo.
So, that leaves 2 possibilities
1: it’s a cheaper version of the existing, and or with new ‘smaller’ batteries.
This strikes me as pretty unlikely. It’s described as a full size battery, so it most likely will be at least the size of the existing 600. I also having spoken to them think it’s unlikely to be a downgrade version of the current motor
2: it’s an upgrade to the motor and or battery, this strikes me as more likely
So at least 600 battery, and, if not a big motor upgrade at least refinements

Sure, not everyone’s use cases are the same.

If you use a lot of battery, and want to be along way from charge a lot then frankly the avinox doesn’t sound like the best option, and sure not knowing that it will have at least 800 might put you off, but I don’t see why it so alien an idea that others have other uses

8000ft of vertical is about 2400 meters, that’s a big day by anyone’s standards but not ‘that much’ climbing in 64km of distance.
I did a ride that was 7k with 900m of climbing not so long ago.
Personally, that would be a very occasional ride for me, and I would take my non e-bike for that and enjoy a full day out. No doubt your doing it more regularly and faster than I would be.
Its well outside most of their usual customer bases usual use case.



They say 1600 to 2000m id take that with a pinch of salt, but for your use does not sound like the right choice for you and your rides.

For a lot of uk riders, 1000m+ will cover a lot of riders needs especially with fast charging from a power station in the van and a lunch stop between doing laps.

To me, this is a winch and plummet bike, lapping downhills and getting to the top as quickly and as easily as possible to get more laps in than you would if you were unassisted.
It’s maybe not an ideal very big back country adventure bike.

So, I may get proven wrong, but doesn’t strike me as a big risk, given what I know and am looking for.
And doesn’t seem like it is a big risk for you, it seems very unlikely to be the right choice for your rides

 

[slickrock]

Looks fine to me and it's still considerably slimmer than a Levo 4 or Bosch bike. I think you are overplaying how thick that tube is, it's 65-75mm diameter at most. Zero chance a 1200wh batter would fit in there.

Agreed on the Levo / Bosch front when it comes to frames that support the chubbier 800WH battery. And Specialized is reacting to it's ungainliness by coming out with an updated design fresh on the heels of the current model.

What I'm referring to is the bikes' Avinox brethren, that take full advantage of the hyper slim, but lengthy FP battery. The problem with tubes is that on-profile or off (as in the above picture), it will appear the same thickness. The advantage of rectangular tubing or CF, is that on-profile is designed to look slimmest. Other than that, If you dig the pipe aesthetic it's all good.

 

[Weeksy]

I do not see it like you at all.

Yes their bikes looks cool, but saying they are profitable and can sustain because they take cash upfront is absolutely not a recipe for success. If there is no order there is no money.

Do they have some order book full, maybe, good for them, saying also that they do things by hand is not entirely true, some part are still done by machine but we have to take into consideration that manual operation do not scale as work labor in UK is also pretty expensive. Saying there are tons of size is great but price still irrelevant for the consumer.

You mention other brand as expensive but this is just catalog price for dummies who can't wait, sorry for them, I have always secure a Santa or a Trek for 30-40% 2-3 months after they came out. On the opposite spectrum, Atherton, Nicolai, sale are really ... limited or non existant which basically make them more expensive.

Finally, let's still agree, that market is in a bad shape and even if saying of this is just 6-7k, most people out there are not able to spend that amount, nor they can salvate a good price for their previous bike.

Make no mistake I would like one but not till I cannot butt myself to UK to grab one, not that I am too far but lazy.

But (without hopefully sounding arrogant) not everyone factors costs/sales as being the deciding factor when purchasing. I bought our Atherton knowing i could buy 10 other makes/models of bikes for less money because of many other reasons, from UK based production, to actual speed, weight, feedback, support. The fact it was more expensive than the rest, wasn't a deciding factor. I was buying into the bike overall, buying into the ethos, buying into the fact i've seen the A200 turn riders from stupid fast into STUPID fast....

Based upon every time we go to Dyfi (couple of times a month) or Caersws, etc... I'm a long way from the only one.

 

[Citylad77]

Been to the Factory today for size fitting, as you would expect didn’t get to see the new EMTB, but the build QC on the normal bikes was about the best I have seen on any MTB, and by a considerable margin. So looking forward to my new EMTB from them. Size 7 fits perfectly.

 

[TG73]

Been to the Factory today for size fitting, as you would expect didn’t get to see the new EMTB, but the build QC on the normal bikes was about the best I have seen on any MTB, and by a considerable margin. So looking forward to my new EMTB from them. Size 7 fits perfectly.

What height are you? I'm 5 10 and it came out as an 8. The stack and reach are very similar to my current Vala but the wheelbase is shorter which seems a bit surprising with the extra travel

 

[TG73]

I've gone for the 2nd build kit as I want to go RS. The cranks seem like the main thing I want to swap just beacuse I think the GX look bad once they get marked up. Anyway, I've asked them to confirm the spec for the arms so I can get the 5Dev or Forx alloy arms, they've told me to hold fire. Not sure what to make of that.

 

[Citylad77]

What height are you? I'm 5 10 and it came out as an 8. The stack and reach are very similar to my current Vala but the wheelbase is shorter which seems a bit surprising with the extra travel

6ft, size L In AMflow, S4 in Spec, I just can’t get comfortable on an UNNO S2 to small and S3 to big. I like a close fit bike. So you feel part of it. I know some one that has ridden this new bike and the new AMflows, says the Ath is the nuts.

 

[Nomadic Dad]

Maybe the bike will come with some of these they emailed out about?

 

[TG73]

Maybe the bike will come with some of these they emailed out about?

View attachment 175144

I didn't get that email, interesting

 

[Endorium]

I've gone for the 2nd build kit as I want to go RS. The cranks seem like the main thing I want to swap just beacuse I think the GX look bad once they get marked up. Anyway, I've asked them to confirm the spec for the arms so I can get the 5Dev or Forx alloy arms, they've told me to hold fire. Not sure what to make of that.

It's running a new unreleased motor so may have a different crank nut shape

 

[Eckythump]

Maybe the bike will come with some of these they emailed out about?

View attachment 175144

No, they are not available for ISIS/Avinox yet but are in the pipeline.

 

[irie]

No, they are not available for ISIS/Avinox yet but are in the pipeline.

"A.GR.TI Crank

Configure your crank length, chainline, finish and axle diameter.

Finish option charges are applied when cranks are added to cart.
Raw: + £0.00
Burnished: + £30
Tumbled: + £50

£845.00"

£845???

 

[Endorium]

"A.GR.TI Crank

Configure your crank length, chainline, finish and axle diameter.

Finish option charges are applied when cranks are added to cart.
Raw: + £0.00
Burnished: + £30
Tumbled: + £50

£845.00"

£845???

Yep, oddly, quite a bit cheaper than other titanium cranks. Premium part. Noone needs them, just bling

 

[still20]

Yep, oddly, quite a bit cheaper than other titanium cranks. Premium part. Noone needs them, just bling

Do you know if they get printed at the same time as a set of lugs

 

[Endorium]

Do you know if they get printed at the same time as a set of lugs

They get created in the same additive machine, yes. Won't be at the same time though due to how they map the lugs out for creation

 

[earleb]

These cranks imply to me they have excess capacity on their printers....lower sales of the A series than their production capacity.

 

[still20]

These cranks imply to me they have excess capacity on their printers....lower sales of the A series than their production capacity.

Or the the profit margin is higher

 

[still20]

I don’t really see it as that much of a risk.
The Atherton bikes are well regarded, this is very similar in geo to the existing s170
The full spec, the geo, the technology, the suspension platform, with exception of the motor and battery is basically known.

The existing avinox specs are known, the motor and battery options well understood.
Well reviewed with known strengths and weaknesses , 600 or 800 battery.

If it was the existing avinox they would not be under embargo.
So, that leaves 2 possibilities
1: it’s a cheaper version of the existing, and or with new ‘smaller’ batteries.
This strikes me as pretty unlikely. It’s described as a full size battery, so it most likely will be at least the size of the existing 600. I also having spoken to them think it’s unlikely to be a downgrade version of the current motor
2: it’s an upgrade to the motor and or battery, this strikes me as more likely
So at least 600 battery, and, if not a big motor upgrade at least refinements

Sure, not everyone’s use cases are the same.

If you use a lot of battery, and want to be along way from charge a lot then frankly the avinox doesn’t sound like the best option, and sure not knowing that it will have at least 800 might put you off, but I don’t see why it so alien an idea that others have other uses

8000ft of vertical is about 2400 meters, that’s a big day by anyone’s standards but not ‘that much’ climbing in 64km of distance.
I did a ride that was 7k with 900m of climbing not so long ago.
Personally, that would be a very occasional ride for me, and I would take my non e-bike for that and enjoy a full day out. No doubt your doing it more regularly and faster than I would be.
Its well outside most of their usual customer bases usual use case.



They say 1600 to 2000m id take that with a pinch of salt, but for your use does not sound like the right choice for you and your rides.

For a lot of uk riders, 1000m+ will cover a lot of riders needs especially with fast charging from a power station in the van and a lunch stop between doing laps.

To me, this is a winch and plummet bike, lapping downhills and getting to the top as quickly and as easily as possible to get more laps in than you would if you were unassisted.
It’s maybe not an ideal very big back country adventure bike.

So, I may get proven wrong, but doesn’t strike me as a big risk, given what I know and am looking for.
And doesn’t seem like it is a big risk for you, it seems very unlikely to be the right choice for your rides

I've seen rumours that the new batteries are 700 or 900W and if it's a new motor it could also be more efficient, but agree with you 600w is plenty for winch and plummet and most UK riding (especially if a range extender is available).
Loving that people that know are keeping tight lipped, there's not many surprises in life and it's not long to wait now...

 

[Eckythump]

"A.GR.TI Crank

Configure your crank length, chainline, finish and axle diameter.

Finish option charges are applied when cranks are added to cart.
Raw: + £0.00
Burnished: + £30
Tumbled: + £50

£845.00"

£845???

For SRAM dub. No ISIS yet.

 

[TG73]

These cranks imply to me they have excess capacity on their printers....lower sales of the A series than their production capacity.

Maybe they are just the right shape to fit in between some lugs to fill the build plate.