Which Enduro Full face ? Fox ProFrame or Endura MT500 Full - Other ?

[Zimmerframe]

As someone who rides faster than their ability (anything above 0kph) I fall off a lot.

After a nasty crash and concussion last year I bought a Smiths Forefront 2 with Koroyd - as I wanted something with a crumple zone. I have an automatic monthly purchase for these on Amazon to keep me in stock.

I also have a crappy Kenny Full face, which is great for winter as it keeps your head nice and warm and dry, but in summer it's like riding round with a microwave on your head. You also can't get glasses on with it and goggles hang 1cm away from your face with it.

Whilst I now crash less often, when I do, I make up for lack of quantity with quality - it's generally faster and more spectacular !

I'd be an idiot basically not to ride with a Full Face, unless I'm pottering about. OK, I am an idiot, so I'm thinking I should be an idiot with an intact jaw.

My preference at the moment is the Endura MT500 Full face, with Koroyd ! The second option is the Fox Proframe.

There don't seem to be many/any direct comparisons between the two.

If this was Star Wars, @Rob Hancill , with his vast helmet collection would be Darth Vader - but even he doesn't seem to have one.

Maybe Endura would like to send me a small to try. I promise to repeatedly bash my head against the floor, rocks, trees - everything really.

Anyone have any experience of the two comparatively ?

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

I dont have a comparison for you mate but I can tell you that the proframe is very very well vented.. in the colder weather I blocked some vents. on the downside, I though that the 'fit system' (basically bits of shaped foam) were not enough and I had to tape some together in places.. its a good lid but I probably wouldnt buy another.

 

[Nicho]

I thoroughly recommend the MET Parachute MCR.
Very comfortable and well ventilated and can be worn with or without the chinbar depending on how idiotic you feel on the day (although I nearly always wear it with the chinbar as it feels far more protective, and you forget the chinbar is there until you try to take a drink!).
Quick and easy to attach and detach the chinbar.
Very good safety test ratings and certification.
It is also much easier than most other full-face helmets to put on and take off whilst wearing glasses, hearing aids etc due to the way you put it on in two parts (it will also make it easier for them to remove it when they wheel you into the hospital).

 

[Zimmerframe]

Just after I bought the Smiths, I wished I'd bought a convertible instead. Then I realised I was normally in a hurry (ok, lazy) . So for me a no face ? and a full face made more sense.

The MET looks really well thought out, but dropped off my list for being convertible. The Endura for instance only weighs 520g for a DH rated full face in size Small. The Met weighs 820 in small. That's a lot of extra weight on my regularly rag dolled small brained head trying to unscrew my neck.

it will also make it easier for them to remove it when they wheel you into the hospital

He knows me so well ...

 

[#lazy]

I dont have a comparison for you mate but I can tell you that the proframe is very very well vented.. in the colder weather I blocked some vents. on the downside, I though that the 'fit system' (basically bits of shaped foam) were not enough and I had to tape some together in places.. its a good lid but I probably wouldnt buy another.

Did you buy a size to big then as I got the dropframe which is basically the same and after measuring my head it fit perfectly ! Only downside is the peak is fixed and not replaceable, I think !
Edit ; peak is replaceable !

 

[Zimmerframe]

Did you buy a size to big then as I got the dropframe which is basically the same and after measuring my head it fit perfectly ! Only downside is the peak is fixed and not replaceable, I think !

Have you seen the size of his head ! They don't make one too big. He has to put it on using ratchet straps round his feet !

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

Did you buy a size to big then as I got the dropframe which is basically the same and after measuring my head it fit perfectly ! Only downside is the peak is fixed and not replaceable, I think !

no, I bought the exact right size after measuring my head.. the chin pads are too small for my face and the helmet drops too far onto my head and I have to pack the top of it..

 

[Doomanic]

I haven't worn my Proframe since dropping over 20KG, I hope it still fits...

 

[#lazy]

no, I bought the exact right size after measuring my head.. the chin pads are too small for my face and the helmet drops too far onto my head and I have to pack the top of it..

I suppose some helmets fit different shape heads

 

[R120]

You need to try them on - I have a couple of proframes and they are great helmets, and live up to the hype. One thing I really like about them is that the vents are big enough to easily feed a camelback tube etc through without having to think about it.

 

[MitchF]

Proframe here mate, can’t fault it.
Vent and comfort and the vision is great.

 

[Hobo Mikey]

Just got my Proframe last week. Have not used it yet but it looks well made, lighter than I thought it would be so that’s a bonus, fit is perfect Using the supplied pads to customise for different heads. Plenty of vents. I like the fixed visor having had a full face before with a visor was always a problem with it shifting and if you did it up tight then could not adjust while riding without stopping. Magnetic catch is a nice touch. And I can use it with sunglasses rarther than goggles.

 

[Zimmerframe]

I've been slowly drifting towards the Endura ... then read/saw more reviews which mentioned that the build quality's a bit lacking and it can be uncomfortable .. crap.. Though, it has the koroyd ..

Which shifted focus back towards the fox proframe .. Fox shows the small as 52-56cm , where as most places for sale show it as 55-56 cm .. which could just be a typo on the sizing for the shops for some reason. It would seem weird to do 4 sizes and start at 55. However all the other sizes are 2cm ranges 57-58 59-60 61-62

The other thing with the Fox is it's not just @dobbyhasfriends who mentions sizing/fit issues. When I read Dobby's comments I thought, Yeah, but you have a Hollywood head. It's genetically engineered just to look good on camera, rather than to do normal head type things - so it's probably going to be a weird shape to accommodate lens issues. I think the Fox is out for my tiny head. Maybe I should just cut holes in my RX7RR.

Anyway, this has expanded the search out further and brought things back in which I'd dropped off for various reasons.

The MET Parachute, none convertable - discounted again as the coverage is limited at the back of the head.

The Troy Lee Stage. Well received. like the Fox has three sets of pads to adjust sizing. Good air flow. Twin density polystyrene for better shock absorption.

The IXS Trigger FF .. No MIPS, but will MIPS do anything on a Full Face helmet which is secured to your head with pads to stop it moving ... Good air flow, possibly better fit options as it has a "dial" ...

I think someone needs to buy all these, wear them properly for more than 10 minutes, then beat the living crap out of them with a baseball bat with a mellon inside (the helmet) and see what's what. How come there's not much clarity on breakaway peaks ? Or Peaks aren't made from bendy plastic. I don't want a snapped neck from a crappy peak leverage incident... except the IXS : Adjustable, flexible nylon visor

 

[R120]

 

[Zimmerframe]

Watched that one last night Most of the video was taken up working out if you could eat a burrito whilst you were wearing the helmet - though the his summaries were helpful !

 

[R120]

Yeah, I though that when I originally watch it! However the points about what you can do without taking the helmet off are actually quite valid as if using a full face on longer rides being able to have a drink/quick snack without the faff of taking it off make sense - when I wear mine after a long period of not using it, I find myself glad I got the Proframe as I can easily use the camelback, eat some jellybeans, and even unlock my iPhone with the helmet on.

 

[wepn]

I've been slowly drifting towards the Endura ... then read/saw more reviews which mentioned that the build quality's a bit lacking and it can be uncomfortable .. crap.. Though, it has the koroyd ..

Which shifted focus back towards the fox proframe .. Fox shows the small as 52-56cm , where as most places for sale show it as 55-56 cm .. which could just be a typo on the sizing for the shops for some reason. It would seem weird to do 4 sizes and start at 55. However all the other sizes are 2cm ranges 57-58 59-60 61-62

The other thing with the Fox is it's not just @dobbyhasfriends who mentions sizing/fit issues. When I read Dobby's comments I thought, Yeah, but you have a Hollywood head. It's genetically engineered just to look good on camera, rather than to do normal head type things - so it's probably going to be a weird shape to accommodate lens issues. I think the Fox is out for my tiny head. Maybe I should just cut holes in my RX7RR.

Anyway, this has expanded the search out further and brought things back in which I'd dropped off for various reasons.

The MET Parachute, none convertable - discounted again as the coverage is limited at the back of the head.

The Troy Lee Stage. Well received. like the Fox has three sets of pads to adjust sizing. Good air flow. Twin density polystyrene for better shock absorption.

The IXS Trigger FF .. No MIPS, but will MIPS do anything on a Full Face helmet which is secured to your head with pads to stop it moving ... Good air flow, possibly better fit options as it has a "dial" ...

I think someone needs to buy all these, wear them properly for more than 10 minutes, then beat the living crap out of them with a baseball bat with a mellon inside (the helmet) and see what's what. How come there's not much clarity on breakaway peaks ? Or Peaks aren't made from bendy plastic. I don't want a snapped neck from a crappy peak leverage incident... except the IXS : Adjustable, flexible nylon visor

Zim you are the indisputable expert in emtb protection no joke so this might not be for you

Discover a world of smart features | Hövding - Airbag for urban cyclists

 

[Zimmerframe]

Zim you are the indisputable expert in emtb protection no joke so this might not be for you

View attachment 33707
Discover a world of smart features | Hövding - Airbag for urban cyclists

Looks perfect for that emergency rain protection if you're super worried about your hair getting wet !

Not sure about protection though ... Looks like it extends down the back to try and give some rigidity, but you probably end up with a broken neck from the inflation and a missing eye from the securing strap flying around.

I like the none inflated look though... very discrete .. Doesn't look at all like you've just escaped from this situation ..

 

[Doomanic]

AIUI, most people in that situation don't want to escape...

 

[Zimmerframe]

And in conclusion ...

Fox Proframe .. very nice, but I think will be too large for a 54cm childs head on an adults body.

IXS Trigger FF .. Also nice, but with only two actual sizes in the range, most reports are that small heads don't fit so well. If anyone is interested in one of these, Amazon.co.uk have them at about £145 - though presently waiting for stock.

TLD Stage.. Probably the smallest external shell and maybe the nicest finished, but I'm not 100% sure it will fit me that well.

So back to the Endura MT500 Full Face... because it's adjustable. Also, you don't have to run the cheek pads if you don't want to, it will according to Endura, still sit correctly. And it's Koroyd. I like the crumple zone idea, it deforms with considerably less energy in a crash compared to the Foam helmets and for me, I just think the foam is ridiculous, both from how it works - or doesn't and carrying a slab of polystyrene/polyurethane insulation round your head seems crazy too if you want something cool.

Review to follow ....

 

[lookhear]

Anyone tried this one?

Invader

The Invader will be seeing more miles, because in addition to its chiseled good looks, understated finish & solid trail performance, front teeth are always in style. -The Loam Wolf [TECH] A Breath of Fresh Air If you occasionally find yourself in over your head, no pun intended, on your regular...

kaliprotectives.com

Review: Kali Invader Helmet

Kali Protectives brings a lot of features and ventilation to the market with the Invader. It's a pedal-friendly full face helmet designed to offer more protection with minimal trade off for comfort and heat management.

theloamwolf.com

 

[Zimmerframe]

Anyone tried this one?

Invader

The Invader will be seeing more miles, because in addition to its chiseled good looks, understated finish & solid trail performance, front teeth are always in style. -The Loam Wolf [TECH] A Breath of Fresh Air If you occasionally find yourself in over your head, no pun intended, on your regular...

kaliprotectives.com

Review: Kali Invader Helmet

Kali Protectives brings a lot of features and ventilation to the market with the Invader. It's a pedal-friendly full face helmet designed to offer more protection with minimal trade off for comfort and heat management.

theloamwolf.com

I'm glad I didn't add that to my list .. would have been more confusion. Though with only two shell sizes, the small would have been a compromise on my testicle sized head.

Nice helmet though, especially with the extra shock absorption. I like the free exchange if you crash is ! Even better than Enduro's 3 year half price crash exchange offer.

 

[Zimmerframe]

That black looks cool! Good deal to get a new helmet when the rest of your body is mangled.

As my brain is obviously already mangled ... it's curious why I spend so long trying to protect it from damage .... probably because it's mangled ....

All other breaks are presently fixed and well !

 

[Zimmerframe]

Man if you’re gonna pay a prostitute get a high class one for gods sake.

You pay by the Kilo - she's quite expensive ..

 

[Nicho]

As my brain is obviously already mangled ... it's curious why I spend so long trying to protect it from damage

You are probably subconsciously terrified that you might bang your head and become NORMAL.

 

[DynamicObserver]

Just to put my worth in-
Tried the fox helmet, with the sizes needing to be bang on it didnt quite fit right. The peak isn't adjustable either (not a deal breaker) but it was very light and well ventilated.

Tried on a 100% trajecta? That was very nice but not so ventilated but didnt have the colour scheme I wanted in stock in my size.

Finally tried the ixs trigger FF, i know its not mips, but the dial is perfect. I have a medium/large head, the medium helmets all fitted well, and after the initial wear in process no doubt all would probably be perfect.

I settled on the ixs, in the small/medium( the large was a little too big inside) its very lightweight, has different sized cheek pads for different fits, plenty of vents.

On the steepest of climbs I do lift it up. I get no fogging using goggles (ixs hack).

It was one of the cheaper, lightest and ticked the boxes for me.

 

[Zimmerframe]

Well .. it came ..

Colour wise, it looks better in real life than I expected ..

OK .. so that's the bright sides out of the way ....

Other than accidents with trees, barbed wire and smashing my head into things ... Putting my head into the MT500 and leaving it there for more than a few minutes is possibly the most uncomfortable experience I've ever had in my life.

Compared to the "no face" smiths forefront 2 (also a koroyd helmet) - which I hoped it would be similar to, it's nothing like. The smiths you can put on tighten a few clicks and it sits comfortably and in place and doesn't wobble around, even without the chin strap.

Try that with the endura and it feels like several sharp bits of plastic are being wedged into your head in multiple positions (even though you can't find anything when you take it off and look).

Putting it on and taking it off can only be classed as in a similar pain zone to either giving birth (which I've only done from the receiving end) and Kidney stones .

Endura suggest you can use it without the cheek pads. I have the small pads in and an XS 54cm head and the body fat of a shrew. Without the pads - putting it on and off is far more reasonable .. but it ends up moving about like a large breast in a washing up bowl during an earthquake.

The straps are not Y straps, so if you grab the peak (which is fixed - solidly and a great way to break your neck) or the chin piece, you can rotate the thing half way off your head, so it's not really going to give much protection in a crash ! not one of my crashes anyway.

Endura list size S/M as "S/M: 520-550g," It's actually 580g, so even that's crap.

Uhm... initial assessment .. crap ..

Maybe even crap crap crap.

My head hurts.

Am I expecting too much from a "cycling helmet" compared to a motorcycle helmet ? Something which is comfortable, stays in place ? There's absolutely no point in wearing a full face helmet if it doesn't stay in place, it's actually increasing the chances of an injury from the helmet, never mind all the things you're trying to avoid.

It's so crap I might have to write a review ..

Even my really really really, really really really crap Kenny full face helmet - is ten times better in comfort, build quality, finish, thought, design.

 

[DynamicObserver]

Well .. it came ..

View attachment 34168

Colour wise, it looks better in real life than I expected ..

OK .. so that's the bright sides out of the way ....

Other than accidents with trees, barbed wire and smashing my head into things ... Putting my head into the MT500 and leaving it there for more than a few minutes is possibly the most uncomfortable experience I've ever had in my life.

Compared to the "no face" smiths forefront 2 (also a koroyd helmet) - which I hoped it would be similar to, it's nothing like. The smiths you can put on tighten a few clicks and it sits comfortably and in place and doesn't wobble around, even without the chin strap.

Try that with the endura and it feels like several sharp bits of plastic are being wedged into your head in multiple positions (even though you can't find anything when you take it off and look).

Putting it on and taking it off can only be classed as in a similar pain zone to either giving birth (which I've only done from the receiving end) and Kidney stones .

Endura suggest you can use it without the cheek pads. I have the small pads in and an XS 54cm head and the body fat of a shrew. Without the pads - putting it on and off is far more reasonable .. but it ends up moving about like a large breast in a washing up bowl during an earthquake.

The straps are not Y straps, so if you grab the peak (which is fixed - solidly and a great way to break your neck) or the chin piece, you can rotate the thing half way off your head, so it's not really going to give much protection in a crash ! not one of my crashes anyway.

Endura list size S/M as "S/M: 520-550g," It's actually 580g, so even that's crap.

Uhm... initial assessment .. crap ..

Maybe even crap crap crap.

My head hurts.

Am I expecting too much from a "cycling helmet" compared to a motorcycle helmet ? Something which is comfortable, stays in place ? There's absolutely no point in wearing a full face helmet if it doesn't stay in place, it's actually increasing the chances of an injury from the helmet, never mind all the things you're trying to avoid.

It's so crap I might have to write a review ..

Even my really really really, really really really crap Kenny full face helmet - is ten times better in comfort, build quality, finish, thought, design.

Gutted it doesn't fit correct/feel right.

Are you close to the south wales area? Your more than welcome to try mine to see how you find it

 

[Zimmerframe]

Gutted it doesn't fit correct/feel right.

Are you close to the south wales area? Your more than welcome to try mine to see how you find it

Me too, really had high hopes.

Thanks for that, I am relatively close, but Cornwall and the English channel get in the way ?

 

[Nicho]

Putting it on and taking it off can only be classed as in a similar pain zone to either giving birth (which I've only done from the receiving end) and Kidney stones .

Endura suggest you can use it without the cheek pads. I have the small pads in and an XS 54cm head and the body fat of a shrew. Without the pads - putting it on and off is far more reasonable .. but it ends up moving about like a large breast in a washing up bowl during an earthquake.

The straps are not Y straps, so if you grab the peak (which is fixed - solidly and a great way to break your neck) or the chin piece, you can rotate the thing half way off your head, so it's not really going to give much protection in a crash ! not one of my crashes anyway.

Send it back and try a Met Parachute MCR.

As I said a few days ago, it excels in how easy it is to put on and take off in 2 pieces (the previous version with the fixed chinbar was very tight and difficult to put on/take off, which is why I bought the MCR).

It adjusts to your head size (unless you have a head like a shrew) stays firmly in place, and is so comfortable I nearly always wear it with the chinbar in place, and it really feels nothing like a motorbike helmet except that it gives you the same feeling of all-round head protection.