Those who do bike parks or like to hit jumps

[Adyzakydany]

Are you all just ignoring the ASTM Cat 4 rating that the Bosch and Avinox motors have? Ie no jumps or drops greater than 1.2M, won’t that void your warranty?

Many of these bikes are sold as Enduro rigs yet aren’t rated to hit some blues round my way that have drops of greater than what rhe CAT rating allows, isn’t this all being overlooked?

 

[Brawwp]

Are you all just ignoring the ASTM Cat 4 rating that the Bosch and Avinox motors have? Ie no jumps or drops greater than 1.2M, won’t that void your warranty?

Many of these bikes are sold as Enduro rigs yet aren’t rated to hit some blues round my way that have drops of greater than what rhe CAT rating allows, isn’t this all being overlooked?

“Yes warranty, the drop was 1.1 meters.”

 

[Adyzakydany]

“Yes warranty, the drop was 1.1 meters.”

I guess what I’m trying to get at is that this rating tends to be overlooked be it for frame or motor or both, many high end enduro rigs are not even rated for CAT 5, so anything more than a mild drop or jump can potentially compromise the frames integrity.

 

[Brawwp]

I guess what I’m trying to get at is that this rating tends to be overlooked be it for frame or motor or both, many high end enduro rigs are not even rated for CAT 5, so anything more than a mild drop or jump can potentially compromise the frames integrity.

I’m not even gonna pretend I knew there were ratings to all this stuff. I just give it a good look and go, yep I think it’ll not break maybe, and then go for it.

Are you worried about your well-being or warranty? Because warranty should have never sold that damn lemon that cracked its frame while I was just checking sag.

 

[pagheca]

I wonder if the recent Flow 1.34 update, recording jumps and wheelies, doesn't serve the scope to record higher drops...

 

[Adyzakydany]

I’m not even gonna pretend I knew there were ratings to all this stuff. I just give it a good look and go, yep I think it’ll not break maybe, and then go for it.

Are you worried about your well-being or warranty? Because warranty should have never sold that damn lemon that cracked its frame while I was just checking sag.

No, more concerned that this seems to be overlooked, ie the CAT rating for frames, I thought any enduro rig could hit drops and jumps greater than 1.2M, but the Manufacturer’s say no? lol

 

[Dax]

Surely it all depends on the landing? Or is this a huck-to-flat rating?

 

[mooby77]

Surely it all depends on the landing? Or is this a huck-to-flat rating?

Just send it , if it goes wrong on the big stuff , it aint the bike that's breaking , well maybe . I have snapped carbon bars a few times , but broke ribs more and collarbones

 

[RustyMTB]

People huck cat 3 & 4 trail bikes round Dyfi & BPW every day without them folding in half. The categories are both real & an arse covering exercise that I wouldn't bother losing sleep over.

 

[Dax]

People huck cat 3 & 4 trail bikes round Dyfi & BPW every day without them folding in half. The categories are both real & an arse covering exercise that I wouldn't bother losing sleep over.

Was just thinking this is a bunch of USA CYA BS. You can snap any bike if you land it wrong, or you can hit massive jump lines on a 150mm trail bike if you land it right.

 

[cozzy]

The pole voima was cat 5 and that still fell to bits. Cant say im overly bothered by the rating.
Im more concerned about dual crown compatibility so the bumpers don't punch a hole in the frame during a crash.

 

[thevids]

I think those ratings are as a huck to flat measure. You could do a 3m drop with smoother landing than a 1.2m huck to flat.

What I heard a product-dev-guy from Canyon say on a podcast about the difference between their enduro emtb and freeride emtb, was that you could jump the same jumps, but if you hard case them multiple times, thats when you might experience the difference.

 

[RustyMTB]

I run a cat 4 Focus Jam2 & prior to that, briefly had a same generation cat 5 Sam2 enduro. The difference in weight & feel was obvious & led me to trade one for the other since the Sam didn't suit the riding I do. So I'm in no doubt manufacturers build to the categories but the Jam is still a 25kg Panzer & will take the hits all day long if you're happy to live with the inherent lighter suspension.

 

[Natch]

I didn’t know that there were ratings. I just eyeball the jump or drop and assess my skill level for it. For bigger features I’m going with my DH bike though.

 

[Pizzman]

Your personal skill rating matters more to the longevity of a bike.
I’ve jumped a Huffy with a .25 rating.
It was fine.
A bad gap case or misaligned landing, will turn a class 5 rated bike into 2, class 2.5 unicycles.

Jumping only requires………time and commitment. A bike and helmet can make it more fun.
Also if you want air. Ride with people who get it.

 

[bmwpowere36m3]

When I broke 2 rear triangles on a SCOR 4060z within 4 months… got similar responses from owners group. But it’s only rated to CAT 4… it’s a 170/160 mm enduro, what else would you use it for if not drops and jumps.

4’ drop, give me a break. I hit 6-7’ drops on my SB120 and it’s been solid. On my analog enduro, a Pivot Firebird, I regularly hit 9-12’ drops.

In the US, companies don’t advertise the CAT rating as it’s more an EU thing. Any good 160/170 mm bike should handle the average person sending park laps and trail riding.

CAT 5 should be a DH or super burly freeride bike. What folks send Rampage on…

 

[ozzybmx]

Had a laugh at a $1000 hardtail MTB a friend bought a while back, was either a Giant Talon, Spech Rockhopper or a Trek Marlin... had a sticker on it saying not suitable for off-road use.

 

[Mike O]

I’m not even gonna pretend I knew there were ratings to all this stuff. I just give it a good look and go, yep I think it’ll not break maybe, and then go for it.

Are you worried about your well-being or warranty? Because warranty should have never sold that damn lemon that cracked its frame while I was just checking sag.

Does the Avinox/DJI system have the ability to measure and store jump and drop info? Does any of that info get uploaded to the cloud for analysis or record keeping in an app?

 

[TheKaiser]

Does the Avinox/DJI system have the ability to measure and store jump and drop info? Does any of that info get uploaded to the cloud for analysis or record keeping in an app?

I would imagine it does. The new Bosch update gives users some sort of "airtime" measurement, and Specialized had something like that at least as far back as 2022, so it would be hard to imagine the newest most cutting edge motor not including sensors for that sort of thing. I've never heard of Specialized using that info to assess warranty claims, but Avinox is shaking things up, in a lot of different ways, so it'll be interesting to see how things progress on that front.

There is another thread on here started by a guy who's Amflow rear wheel dented on the 2nd ride. He said Amflow asked him to send the ride file, as part of reviewing the warranty claim. Not sure if that is just a GPX file, or if it has accelerometer data from the other sensors. As I'm sure you all know, for a lot of trails the GPS info isn't particularly meaningful, as you could be riding the smooth line and bailout routes around features, or you could be smashing every optional side-hit, jump, and drop, all on the same trail.

 

[B1rdie]

I think the restriction is not because of frame stiffness, but the fact that the bottom bracket is inside the motor cage, with all the circuit boards and sensors, that turns impossible to have a sturdy BB

 

[Plummet]

Are you all just ignoring the ASTM Cat 4 rating that the Bosch and Avinox motors have? Ie no jumps or drops greater than 1.2M, won’t that void your warranty?

Many of these bikes are sold as Enduro rigs yet aren’t rated to hit some blues round my way that have drops of greater than what rhe CAT rating allows, isn’t this all being overlooked?

First ive heard of the rating.. ....
I am easily riding well above that datum....

 

[Plummet]

When I broke 2 rear triangles on a SCOR 4060z within 4 months… got similar responses from owners group. But it’s only rated to CAT 4… it’s a 170/160 mm enduro, what else would you use it for if not drops and jumps.

4’ drop, give me a break. I hit 6-7’ drops on my SB120 and it’s been solid. On my analog enduro, a Pivot Firebird, I regularly hit 9-12’ drops.

In the US, companies don’t advertise the CAT rating as it’s more an EU thing. Any good 160/170 mm bike should handle the average person sending park laps and trail riding.

CAT 5 should be a DH or super burly freeride bike. What folks send Rampage on…

When I owned the 190mm voima, the majority of the voins riders were slow old men tootling along not getting off the ground.

I found that really odd, I jumped onto the pole Facebook group to talk dh e riding expecting 190mm bike owners being a bunch of hard core senders.... nope. Bunch of slow, soft riders. Odd.

 

[ntm95]

I found that really odd, I jumped onto the pole Facebook group to talk dh e riding expecting 190mm bike owners being a bunch of hard core senders.... nope. Bunch of slow, soft riders. Odd.

That tracks.
Specialized is the other one. I see someone on a levo, I just assume they're headed for the light blues for a couple runs before retiring to a six pack of beer and maybe an afternoon round of golf.

Now that I think about it, that doesn't sound like a terrible life .

 

[Plummet]

That tracks.
Specialized is the other one. I see someone on a levo, I just assume they're headed for the light blues for a couple runs before retiring to a six pack of beer and maybe an afternoon round of golf.

Now that I think about it, that doesn't sound like a terrible life .

Yeah, its just plain odd. Now i have a Crestline and the crestline bookface group is full of dudes sending choice lines.
Similar bike capability, absolutely different customer base. Ok there's a few in the venn diagram of pole/crestline cross over. But over all the crestline owners are senders and the pole owners are not.

I honestly don't get it. Why on earth have a heavy wollowy dirt couch and ride blues, greens and the occassional black run? There are far better and more enjoyable bikes for that trail range. The voima was worse than my mates trek rails for standard stuff. It only came into its own on the super chunk. Dudes owning that bike not hitting the super chunk .... wtf.

 

[ntm95]

Yeah, its just plain odd. Now i have a Crestline and the crestline bookface group is full of dudes sending choice lines.
Similar bike capability, absolutely different customer base. Ok there's a few in the venn diagram of pole/crestline cross over. But over all the crestline owners are senders and the pole owners are not.

I honestly don't get it. Why on earth have a heavy wollowy dirt couch and ride blues, greens and the occassional black run? There are far better and more enjoyable bikes for that trail range. The voima was worse than my mates trek rails for standard stuff. It only came into its own on the super chunk. Dudes owning that bike not hitting the super chunk .... wtf.

Part of it might be that when a more experienced (aggressive) rider looks at the crestline geo, they say "looks great".
The same individual looking at a voima might identify the shortcomings inherent in a long wheelbase with a longish front center.
I know I'd not want one for anything besides plowing straight ahead.

 

[Plummet]

Part of it might be that when a more experienced (aggressive) rider looks at the crestline geo, they say "looks great".
The same individual looking at a voima might identify the shortcomings inherent in a long wheelbase with a longish front center.
I know I'd not want one for anything besides plowing straight ahead.

You are probably right. My first choice was the cresty, but it was sold out in my size and the voima was the next best thing. If had some reservations about the geo but gave it a go. My reservations were justified, because what I didnt like about it was partly due to the wack geo. With that said I still podiumed on it in enduro and dh races. So it wasn't that bad. Just to quite my style.

 

[Emailsucks98]

Needs to be an ASTM rating for rear hubs. Seems to be a first point of failure on many meatbikes- broken axles and failed freehubs. There are some seriously garbage OE hubs out there (Raceface Trace). Might not result in serious injury, but you get a long walk out and a choice between buying a new rear wheel and an endless warranty cycle.

 

[Bndit]

I didn`t know that motors have ASTM rating, couldn`t find any information on Shimano/bullit user manual. On gen3 Levo whole bike is ASTM 4 and that probably because 150/160 bike is not intended to use on WC DH tracks, not because of motor. Just got my Bullit shimano motor replaced, they know I do bike parks with it but didn’t ask about size of the jumps