eMTBs and overlanding: some thoughts

[srileo]

For the 4x4 crowd
Anyone see eMTBs as a neat supplement to long-distance overlanding? I have had 4x4 campers and a jeep, and have ridden multiple months on dualsport motorcycles, but i am seeing a scope with eMTBs to nicely supplement overlanding. The big advantage with eMTBs (or even regular MTBs) is that the temptation/need to go offroad in an expensive/unsuitable/ 4x4 rig is now happily reduced. I dont have to go with my entire rig - kit and kaboodle on that hairy dirt track just to get the offroad feel. I could just park the SUV/rig at nice comfy campspot and pull the eMTB in for a full day of riding in the gnarliest of trails with the least risk of injury, and just come back to the luxury of the campsite when done. Charge the battery while driving to the next spot and repeat. Any old SUV can now scratch my outdoor itch - no need for the 4x4, winches, recovery gear etc. Easy to do in large countries like the US and Australia with our huge public lands...

Coming from the motorcyle world, I find eMTBs to be a great alternatives to the 2 biggest problem with dirt motobikes - highway travel and risk of injury.
Let me elaborate. On a dirtbike, I have a minimum of a 3 hr ride to get anywhere you can find decent dirt trail (for me in california). If i pick a nice and light plated dirt bike, it will be uncomfortable riding it on the highway to get to the dirt. If i pick a heavier 650cc class dualsport bike, it will tolerate the highway miles easily, but will be a pig on the trails, and a bear to pick up everytime i drop it on the trails. With motorcycles, the risk of injury on the trail is much much much higher because of speed, weight of bike falling/picking up, and wearing all that armor makes it an uncomfortable experience. And worse, you had better be sure you have the skills to ride that trail, coz there is no "walking it up" with motorcycles. Add to that the very limited space and weight of camping gear that has to be on the bike 100% of the time while in travel mode.

With eMTBs, i have access to much more fun trails that a dirtbike will never have access to, have far less risk of injury, not have to wear really uncomofrtable armor, go at a much slower pace, and admire the scenery more often. Stop and starts are instant and casual and built into the ride.
I only have to worry about punctures, and smashed derellieurs, and battery juice. All of which are far easier to deal with than with anything mechanical on a motorbike in the middle of nowhere. And the best part is that i can throw the eMTB in the back of the car and drive on in comfort carrying all the camping gear and food and spares i want.

I dont see an eMTB replacing a nice dualsport bike for long-distance adventures of the type i have already done, but i see it as a way of scratching that itch for exploring terrain for a fraction of the risk, cost and effort that either 4x4s or motorcycles demand.

Thoughts?

 

[HikerDave]

I drove my jeep a lot less once I started mountain biking, so this makes sense to me. Years ago, I used to camp and backpack off of a DR350s, navigating with an old GPS and an aviation chart; I guess that’s what you call overlanding. An eBike might be good for this but the range seems a little low. Maybe someone will make a monster-battery equivalent of an Acerbis desert tank and you’ll be good to go.

 

[Pdoz]

I live at the base of motorbike heaven ( the victorian high country, australia) and have barely ridden my motorbike in the past 12 months - for the first time in 40 ish years I'm considering being motorbike free.

The emtb almost matches an enduro bike for single line technical riding - not quite the range, but a lot gentler on the tracks and more fun from my perspective. The kids can join in, and @s a bonus, there are purpose built options, so we can travel to new regions, open up trailforks and find legal riding options.

The multi week travel gets a bit more challenging - especially travelling in wet weather. I've had 2 trips across the alps in extreme rain, and both times the bike suffered water ingress issues. I'm not convinced the current bikes are designed to sit on a bike rack and bounce along a wet 4x4 track. Hopefully there will be enough warranty claims for the manufacturers to sort this out soon!

I can't see myself wanting to tackle true remote area travel on an emtb - dessert crossings or thousand km unsupported between supplies...

Now, image an expedition van - self sufficient all terrain van with a couple of ebikes parked INSIDE when travelling.....

 

[srileo]

I live at the base of motorbike heaven ( the victorian high country, australia) and have barely ridden my motorbike in the past 12 months - for the first time in 40 ish years I'm considering being motorbike free.

The emtb almost matches an enduro bike for single line technical riding - not quite the range, but a lot gentler on the tracks and more fun from my perspective. The kids can join in, and @s a bonus, there are purpose built options, so we can travel to new regions, open up trailforks and find legal riding options.

The multi week travel gets a bit more challenging - especially travelling in wet weather. I've had 2 trips across the alps in extreme rain, and both times the bike suffered water ingress issues. I'm not convinced the current bikes are designed to sit on a bike rack and bounce along a wet 4x4 track. Hopefully there will be enough warranty claims for the manufacturers to sort this out soon!

I can't see myself wanting to tackle true remote area travel on an emtb - dessert crossings or thousand km unsupported between supplies...

Now, image an expedition van - self sufficient all terrain van with a couple of ebikes parked INSIDE when travelling.....

I agree, true remote singletrack travel on emtb like the Simpson crossing is next to impossible for a decade atleast, but given how easily it is to stow an eBike inside a vehicle (wheels off etc), i can easily see one an important accessory or a safety system incase the 4x4 fails.

For the past decade i have always had a street bike and a dualsport. Now, i am down to the streetbike and am lookng forward to the eBike to be my new dualsport in combinatin with my subaru.

 

[Pdoz]

I'm still trying to perfect this compromise - carrying bikes for a family of 5 but still being able to tackle moderate 4x4 and be self sufficient for a reasonable duration, yet have a reasonable set up time at camp. The trailer tow hitch needs raising ( there was30 psi in the rear airbags) , and if that doesn't work I need to consider moving the bike rack to the back of the trailer or enlisting our ford ranger instead..

 

[Telemarker]

My wife and I have travelled across Iceland, European Alps, Pyrenees and Massif Central in France and central Spain in our Toyota Hilux with rooftop tent - camping and driving on highways and also remote trails.
We have so far carried our two normal mountain bikes behind front seats in cab, with wheels and saddle removed. Bikes stored upside down with handle bars clamped with quickfist grips.
We would mix days driving on tracks and cycling.
Now trying to figure out how to transport ebikes. Her focus Jam2 will fit in the cab, but will need bars raising a bit to stop forks smashing side window, cos we can’t take saddle off quickly.
But my Sam2 won’t fit as bars too wide.... and snag with drivers seat.
Might try bike normal way around and makes new mounts, but bar may hit back of drivers head instead.
We do have a rear tow bar carrier we usually use in UK for transporting the bikes for rides, and it’s tilts so we can still lower tailgate and get in canopy to drawers and fridge.
But would need a cover for bikes when driving in rain and to hide them.
But still concerned about security, the carrier getting hung up on rough tracks we drive and also bikes and carrier getting in way during camp, the tilt function fine for a quick lunch or coffee stop, but not overnight camp. When we used stove on tailgate etc
So would need to take bikes and carrier off each night.

Got a 500w inverter fitted in cab, so could charge bike shop during day when driving or at campsite hookup if not wild camping.

 

[skyfree]

I'm with you, but it really depends on what kind of overlanding you like to do. I was at Overland Expo West last year and there were some eBikes there in the 2-wheel section, but most people walked right by them with hardly a glance. The overlanding people tend to gather large amounts of expensive gear and stuff it in a very expensive capable vehicle for a once-a-year off-road camping trip and a trip to Expo to show it off. They aren't really that interested in walking or pedaling as I've found. This is the "show off my stuff" overlander.

2 of us in our overlanding crew have eBikes, but we don't carry them with us because we tend to do more difficult, long routes off-road where anything sticking up or hanging off the back would get destroyed. There is just no way either of us could carry them, and no time to actually ride them because we are usually moving most of the day. This is the "no compromise off-road" overlander.

One of our group lives in their 4X4 Sprinter van year-round. They can't afford to carry anything more because space is at a premium and anything not locked down would be stolen when they leave the vehicle anywhere if it's stored on the outside. I've known several people who have lived in their vehicles for years at a time and bikes are never a possibility. These are the "full timers".

For car camping and then doing excursions into the wild it's perfect though, and it's a great way to get into areas that can't be accessed with a large 4-wheeled vehicle. This is more of a "casual overlander" experience which is more accessible to the average person and I think it's a good fit for that. I plan on a long trip up to Alaska in a couple of years pulling my Escape 17B trailer. I plan to take the eBike along so I can explore from camp.

 

[AML]

This is totally what I plan to do. Hardest part I think will be keeping the battery charged if I stay in one place for more than a couple days.

 

[Kernow]

Battery life is the drawback , your limited to half a days riding really unless the trails are very level and tame . Unless you lug an extra battery which for me just removes the riding pleasure .
Emtb has replaced my need for an enduro bike because you can ride almost anywhere . There’s just no where to ride motorbikes in uk with much freedom especially in the south west .

 

[flash]

Touring with eBikes isn't hard but it does take some planning, which is a problem for some off the shelf camper vans as their layouts suck. It also takes some cash to get charging and security sorted.

Currently my bikes (2) live in the back of my Landrover and I tow a small (13ft) caravan. The car has a 125aH Lithium system and the caravan has 400aH and 450 watts of solar. Charging the bikes obviously isn't an issue with this much power. My main bike is my Merida e160. Karen rides that when we ride together and I use it when out solo. I also have two spare batteries for my eZesty (three total) so I can ride all day. Well the bike will go longer than I will.... Bikes are stored diagonally with front wheels off and seats down using home made wheel blocks and a strap across the frames. They don't move an inch. This works for me, because...

1. I can drop the camper at a *base camp* and tour using the car with the bikes always available, if I want them.
2. It's relatively secure. The bikes are secured in the car with a gold level lock and the car has an alarm.
3. Bikes are dust and water free when travelling. Dust is more of an issue than water in Oz.
4. It keeps the load weight in the car down. Too many people here towing while being dangerously over legal weights. We do trips for a couple of months and you really don't need all that crap you're carrying.
5. I can charge while I drive and at camp. I'm completely self sufficient and really only need to get water once a week or so.
6. Both bikes are ready to roll in about 3 minutes. A couple more if I need to adjust the suspension settings on the Merida.

Mostly we just want to explore. I'm not into motocross and I'm definitely not into winching. When we hit a place where there's some trails we can go for a ride. And we use the bikes to get around small towns as well.

I'm also in the process of converting a Ford Transit to a camper van. It'll also take two bikes internally with a full charging station and wash station. It's an essential part of the build. My daughter is taking it on a *big lap* in June. Maybe I'll get to use it after that. This one is a *no gas* install with induction cooking and 480aH of Lithium and 600W of solar. The bikes will be important just to get around. You don't want to pack up camp just to go buy milk.

Gordon

 

[GrantMeThePower]

For the 4x4 crowd
Anyone see eMTBs as a neat supplement to long-distance overlanding? I have had 4x4 campers and a jeep, and have ridden multiple months on dualsport motorcycles, but i am seeing a scope with eMTBs to nicely supplement overlanding. The big advantage with eMTBs (or even regular MTBs) is that the temptation/need to go offroad in an expensive/unsuitable/ 4x4 rig is now happily reduced. I dont have to go with my entire rig - kit and kaboodle on that hairy dirt track just to get the offroad feel. I could just park the SUV/rig at nice comfy campspot and pull the eMTB in for a full day of riding in the gnarliest of trails with the least risk of injury, and just come back to the luxury of the campsite when done. Charge the battery while driving to the next spot and repeat. Any old SUV can now scratch my outdoor itch - no need for the 4x4, winches, recovery gear etc. Easy to do in large countries like the US and Australia with our huge public lands...

Coming from the motorcyle world, I find eMTBs to be a great alternatives to the 2 biggest problem with dirt motobikes - highway travel and risk of injury.
Let me elaborate. On a dirtbike, I have a minimum of a 3 hr ride to get anywhere you can find decent dirt trail (for me in california). If i pick a nice and light plated dirt bike, it will be uncomfortable riding it on the highway to get to the dirt. If i pick a heavier 650cc class dualsport bike, it will tolerate the highway miles easily, but will be a pig on the trails, and a bear to pick up everytime i drop it on the trails. With motorcycles, the risk of injury on the trail is much much much higher because of speed, weight of bike falling/picking up, and wearing all that armor makes it an uncomfortable experience. And worse, you had better be sure you have the skills to ride that trail, coz there is no "walking it up" with motorcycles. Add to that the very limited space and weight of camping gear that has to be on the bike 100% of the time while in travel mode.

With eMTBs, i have access to much more fun trails that a dirtbike will never have access to, have far less risk of injury, not have to wear really uncomofrtable armor, go at a much slower pace, and admire the scenery more often. Stop and starts are instant and casual and built into the ride.
I only have to worry about punctures, and smashed derellieurs, and battery juice. All of which are far easier to deal with than with anything mechanical on a motorbike in the middle of nowhere. And the best part is that i can throw the eMTB in the back of the car and drive on in comfort carrying all the camping gear and food and spares i want.

I dont see an eMTB replacing a nice dualsport bike for long-distance adventures of the type i have already done, but i see it as a way of scratching that itch for exploring terrain for a fraction of the risk, cost and effort that either 4x4s or motorcycles demand.

Thoughts?

totally agree...I think overlanding and emtb really go hand in hand. You have to be careful not to push it on crazy stuff I’d think. An injury is worse further out.

Where do you like overlanding in California?

 

[Driller_AU]

Touring with eBikes isn't hard but it does take some planning, which is a problem for some off the shelf camper vans as their layouts suck. It also takes some cash to get charging and security sorted.

Currently my bikes (2) live in the back of my Landrover and I tow a small (13ft) caravan. The car has a 125aH Lithium system and the caravan has 400aH and 450 watts of solar. Charging the bikes obviously isn't an issue with this much power. My main bike is my Merida e160. Karen rides that when we ride together and I use it when out solo. I also have two spare batteries for my eZesty (three total) so I can ride all day. Well the bike will go longer than I will.... Bikes are stored diagonally with front wheels off and seats down using home made wheel blocks and a strap across the frames. They don't move an inch. This works for me, because...

1. I can drop the camper at a *base camp* and tour using the car with the bikes always available, if I want them.
2. It's relatively secure. The bikes are secured in the car with a gold level lock and the car has an alarm.
3. Bikes are dust and water free when travelling. Dust is more of an issue than water in Oz.
4. It keeps the load weight in the car down. Too many people here towing while being dangerously over legal weights. We do trips for a couple of months and you really don't need all that crap you're carrying.
5. I can charge while I drive and at camp. I'm completely self sufficient and really only need to get water once a week or so.
6. Both bikes are ready to roll in about 3 minutes. A couple more if I need to adjust the suspension settings on the Merida.

Mostly we just want to explore. I'm not into motocross and I'm definitely not into winching. When we hit a place where there's some trails we can go for a ride. And we use the bikes to get around small towns as well.

I'm also in the process of converting a Ford Transit to a camper van. It'll also take two bikes internally with a full charging station and wash station. It's an essential part of the build. My daughter is taking it on a *big lap* in June. Maybe I'll get to use it after that. This one is a *no gas* install with induction cooking and 480aH of Lithium and 600W of solar. The bikes will be important just to get around. You don't want to pack up camp just to go buy milk.

Gordon

yea i agree what your saying about off the self campers i am just trying to work out a good way to carry my two Emtb on the back of my sprinter 4x4 on the back doors is not a option with the weight .Anyway my question when charging the Emtb batteries are you using a inverter to 240v or have you got something that can charge at 12v ?

 

[Kernow]

yea i agree what your saying about off the self campers i am just trying to work out a good way to carry my two Emtb on the back of my sprinter 4x4 on the back doors is not a option with the weight .Anyway my question when charging the Emtb batteries are you using a inverter to 240v or have you got something that can charge at 12v ?

I think the only way to safely carry ebikes outside a vehicle is a towbar mounted ebike rack . I just sold my normal bike rack, an Atera Strada because enduro bikes and ebikes are just too big for it . With the fear of theft These days I find room inside the van which is surely possible on a sprinter

 

[Akiwi]

Battery life is the drawback , your limited to half a days riding really unless the trails are very level and tame . Unless you lug an extra battery which for me just removes the riding pleasure .
Emtb has replaced my need for an enduro bike because you can ride almost anywhere . There’s just no where to ride motorbikes in uk with much freedom especially in the south west .

Or you take the charger with you, and plan a tour where you can stop for lunch, or make a couple of shorter stops where you can load your battery.
I have managed full day tours of up to 100km with 2000m or up to 3000 meters climb by adding some loading stops. Last year I bought the Bosch 6A fast charger to help pack the electrons into my battery faster when stopping for a break. I guess living in Europe and doing tours in the Alps has its advantages. The Australian Whopwhops are a little more sparsely populated.

 

[Zimmerframe]

Emtb on the back of my sprinter 4x4 on the back doors is not a option with the weight

I'm not sure if you have a tow bar on it, or what sort. Mine sticks out a bit and on the frame I've made a removable bracket which lets me mount ramps on, I drive a 900+kg mower up there no problem. I wonder if you could make a custom mount there with a removable rack ? (thinking it could be more secure than just tow ball mounting a rack if you're 4x4 driving). Even if you used the 4 tow hitch bolts to just bolt a frame to and re-attached the tow hitch with longer through bolts ?

 

[flash]

yea i agree what your saying about off the self campers i am just trying to work out a good way to carry my two Emtb on the back of my sprinter 4x4 on the back doors is not a option with the weight .Anyway my question when charging the Emtb batteries are you using a inverter to 240v or have you got something that can charge at 12v ?

I have a 2000w inverter in each plus shore power if at a commercial campground. The car has an 800W inverter. I use the inverters for a lot more than just the bikes. The campervan build has induction cooking, for example.

A 12V charger has just been released for my eZesty though and I think it would be useful to have one. Inverters are lossy (they aren't transferring 100% of the power they use) so sometimes staying with 12V can be useful. OTOH 12V chargers are usually slower.

A towbar hitch is really the only option. You'll need to factor in some sort of dust and rain cover as well. One that's closed at the bottom as most gunk is sprayed up from the rear wheels. It might be possible to fashion a swing away box that the bikes are stored in.

Gordon

 

[Driller_AU]

Thanks for the replies guys , my van has a 1000w inverter which i am thinking of running as i am driving around sounds like it will be ok will test next run.
As you can see in the pic the van already has swing away mounts making a box for the bikes is a interesting idea i haven't considered, using the towbar is definitely the easy solution but it will make the departure angle horrendous it's bad even now so i want to mount up higher