- Thread starter
- #301
The market has already decided the answer to this.
Coulda / woulda / shoulda - doesnt matter - horse has bolted.
2027 Orbea Wild LT Released - Avinox Powered
- Thread starter Rob Rides EMTB
- Start date
Coulda / woulda / shoulda - doesnt matter - horse has bolted.
How do you know it's because of the "fake 750W cap" and not simply because they love the bike and that's the motor it comes with?
That speed sensor ring makes a significant difference. The others are only getting a speed reading every 2m + you ride. Avinox get that every 5cm. Their screen and software and integrations (GPS and upload to Strava seems so obvious ) are a big step ahead. - spesh and Bosch both missed a trick there as their head units looked flash enough to have that integrated.
Bosch are clearly not that far off Avinox in reality. Spesh messed up badly. They ignored that weight is important and delivered a huge heavy motor on heavy bikes that they’d held back after overstocking on the previous generation so was already passed by Bosch. You can understand why they prioritised reliability but having their own exclusive motors went very quickly from moat to millstone.
Shimano is the interesting one. I can’t believe they’ve given up but the ep801 felt a pretty minor update over the ep8, and that was 4 years ago. The software updates since didn’t set the world on fire (I like their fine tune mode to get something in between trail and boost but I don’t think anyone needs 15 power levels (and this stuff needs to be there by default - I’m sure the majority of riders never drove into the painfully slow app). Their lack of integrated screens looks shonky and the generally poor ergonomics of their controls (compared to the effort they put into their shifters and brakes) is just weird (Orbea developed their own ffs). There must surely be a new Shimano motor imminent
SRAM too. It’s nearly 2 years since they launched their motor and I can’t think I’ve heard of a single bike using it. I’ve definitely never seen anyone riding a bike with it on.
Ironically, as I understand it, when Bosch set about designing their latest batteries they consulted with the bike designers who all said they wanted a shorter battery so that more weight could be kept low on the bike. So that's what Bosch delivered and then Avinox came out with batteries with completely the opposite form factor and now that's all the bike brands want to have!
You'd have to say that the bike brands didn't understand their customers! Yes we're all geeks and want low CofG, but faced with that slim downtube we all go weak-kneed and glassy-eyed
Bosch actually discusses this exact item in a tech release And they state that the reluctor ring was a sloppy way to do this with an extra wire and poor sensitivity. They use an internal sensor that they claim picks up thousands of times per wheel rotation.
I think the lower reaction speed of the avinox made people think they were getting some sort of a magical torque sensing. But literally Orbea appears to have went more towards Bosch reactivity with their RS tune.
Don't confuse this with the max wheel speed sensor that only hits one time per wheel rotation.
My Kiox 400 does all of that and more such as jump count, etc. In fact I just did a brief ride in my hood and a friend of mine thumbed me up on Strava. I didn't even know it was linking to that as I didn't turn on Strava at all.
Oh so media = bad if they praise Avinox, but you expect Bosch to tell you if the Avinox sensor is better?
Ok guys, the Bosch is better in every way. The media saying otherwise are all bias. All of us avinox “fanboys” were paid by dji. We’re all weak power hungry beginners and power power power is all we care about. 28mph everywhere all the time. If someone says their avinox doesn’t rattle they’re lying. Reliability? Forget it. All the avinox tech, fake news and marketing.
Bosch is best. Everything else is fake paid off news and lying. I know you guys needed to hear that. Let’s move on now. If Avinox doesn’t interest you we can stop the comparisons since you guys don’t believe anything anyone says good about it anyway.
- Thread starter
- #307
Testing the Bike Handling Card:
Cheers Rob.
Interestingly, I just got back from a meal out with a bunch of folks I’ve been walking with today, and the guy I was sat next to mentioned he had an e-mountain bike.
Without me asking he told me it was an Orbea Wild, to which I asked if it was the Bosch version. He looked a bit puzzled so I mentioned the Avinox version that was just launched.
He had zero idea, said that he just purchased a bike he liked the look of and how it rode, and was in his budget. Said he hadn’t looked at a bike since.
That’s the reality of this isn’t it, for most, they buy a bike when they need one and whatever is available. A few years back that was a Bosch or a Specialized powered whatever, currently it’s lots of Avinox bikes, and in a few years time it will be who knows.
Quite why it causes the arguments it does I’m not sure!
Here in Australia, we are unencumbered by local manufacturing support, as there are no local manufacturers. My MTB club had a big ride on the weekend. We have over 900 members. All the new bike talk was of Avinox powered EMTBs.
I took my Teewing Flux on a club ride for the first time. The interest was through the roof.
Even those who are Anti-Chinese have viable options for purchasing Avinox motored EMTBs in Australia, like the Mondraker, Velduro, Orbea, Forbidden, Whyte and Propain.
I do believe there is some interest in the legacy motors. But it's all based around getting them discounted.
Orbea made the absolute right call putting the Avinox motor in the Wild. It will sell like hot cakes, without the need to offer discounts.
I took my Teewing Flux on a club ride for the first time. The interest was through the roof.
Even those who are Anti-Chinese have viable options for purchasing Avinox motored EMTBs in Australia, like the Mondraker, Velduro, Orbea, Forbidden, Whyte and Propain.
I do believe there is some interest in the legacy motors. But it's all based around getting them discounted.
Orbea made the absolute right call putting the Avinox motor in the Wild. It will sell like hot cakes, without the need to offer discounts.
deanFBM
Member
Something I would love manufacturers to post is the COG.
I genuinely believe getting into the weeds on weight and in part GEO isn't the be all and end all. Instead you're left to infer handling by weight figures and geo charts (which are often different to the spec chart).
I don't believe too much in demos either, when I ever Ive gotten a new bike, how it feels on a first ride versus how it rides 10+ rides in is always so different. Suspension settings develop, cockpit changes, it takes time.
Long term reviews can help, but you've always the caveat of where the reviewer rides, their style, their preferences, their body and riding style. Nick ADV seems closest to my style and riding style but our bodies are quite different.
Understanding how a bike rides without owning it seems nigh on impossible to me.
I sorta agree with the demo ride comment, but they still provide a wealth of insight compared to never riding the bike(s). It’s akin to meeting a potential mate in public. Sure, you’re only skimming the surface of getting to know them, but that’s still a really valuable interaction.
On specs-As a career audio guy, I have low confidence in specifications generally; and my confidence in comparing specs across manufacturers is significantly lower. Unfortunately I’ve seen many, many occasions where Marketing influences printed specifications. I’d like to think the relative simplicity of bikes makes trickery less prevalent, but I still look at specs with some level of skepticism.
Putting aside my personal feelings about Orbea’s European approach (to say it nicely) towards speed and power; it’s obviously a smart business decision to move towards Avinox in 2026. Avinox simply delivers in ways that’s easy for consumers to understand. It’s easy to understand 150Nm is more than the others; it’s easy to see the slimmer downtube, and fancier display. More sophisticated benefits like center of gravity, power delivery, efficiency, etc., aren’t nearly as obvious or easy to point to.
Like Rob mentioned earlier here, emtbforum participants are generally very knowledgeable on the subtleties of motor systems. However, I contend the average consumer is far less so. When they’re looking at two different bikes priced the same, and one has a more powerful motor, more svelte frame, and fancier display/interface; they’re likely buying that one.
Like Rob mentioned earlier here, emtbforum participants are generally very knowledgeable on the subtleties of motor systems. However, I contend the average consumer is far less so. When they’re looking at two different bikes priced the same, and one has a more powerful motor, more svelte frame, and fancier display/interface; they’re likely buying that one.
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This picture is quite misleading. The Avinox Drive unit is quite smaller than the Bosch Gen5 in reality
perfect looking bike, also wondering the exact colour of @Rob Rides EMTB Orbea wild. Closest MyOrbea Colour "Tanzanite Evo Carbon View", but it lacks the "carbon view"?
Thanks, seems like the 125kg is just the Orbea Standard for most Carbon MTB´s.
So my toddler isn´t allowed to gain more than 5kg over the next 2 years for riding shotgun on a Wild LT or I've to loose Weigth accordingly ... means less Ice Cream and more Veggies for both of us
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dadeadduck
New Member
I saw one of these today (Biketart Canterbury), a base carbon model, really nice bike despite the colour.
The top tube (not really a tube) is ridiculously thin.
Rear derailleur is wired Shimano, so is looks like you need to get the m-team to get wireless shifting (£££ ouch).
Top of the list to replace the PL.
The top tube (not really a tube) is ridiculously thin.
Rear derailleur is wired Shimano, so is looks like you need to get the m-team to get wireless shifting (£££ ouch).
Top of the list to replace the PL.
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