Poor man's CEF69 M510 FC4.0 with 1kWh battery

borysgo2

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Hi to all :D

Long story short, got the CEF69 build last week.

FORK: RS ZEB BASE 170MM (BUTTER CUP AIR SHAFT)
SHOCK: RS SELECT 205X65
BRAKES: SHIGURA
BRAKE ROTORS: IIPRO 203mm-front and 180mm rear
WHEELS: DT Swiss rims (models as on the photos), Sapim race spokes, brass niples and KOOZER 455 hubs (32 hole)
TYRES: ALBERT GRAVITY RADIAL, 2.5FRONT AND 2.4 REAR
DRIVETRAIN: 11S LINKGLIDE
CHAINRING: 38T (max size)
BATTERY: 13S4P 48V 1000Wh Samsung INR21700-58E (CC5563F101)
!!!BBR V2 FROM DADO !!! --> HIGHY RECOMMENDED
BACK FENDER: RRP Proguard Front Mudguard - SHORT
DROPPER: ONEUP 210mm slammed all the way down as insertion lenght of L frame is only about 295mm.
PEDALS, SADDLE, STEM, HANDLEBAR: got it on ALI
WEIGHT: 24.5kG

Additionally I made a small module (about 30W max) for automatic LED headlight. I used Magicshine ME2000 light, gives plenty of light.

Build wet nice and smooth, there was only one small surprise (experienced also with CEF55), frame motor mount have excessive clearance, in this case I had to add 1mm distance/spacer washers in order to bolt on the motor tight to the frame. My advice is to place those washers on non drive side as it affects chainring clearance.
CLEARANCE2.webpCLEARANCE3.webp

A few photos of finished bike bellow:
1.webp2.webp3.webp4.webp5.webp6.webp


Done first ride, bike feels great, goes through the corners. I was a bit afraid about bike balance due to a big battery stashed in the down tube but I turned out this is not a problem. IMHO this is a good platform to build a capable enduro bike.
One thing that might need improvement is the flex at the back wheel, it is not disturbing in any way but it could be better. If there was a bridge in between seat stay's it would be way better.

Now the M510 FC4.0 motor.
Done only 40km but first impression are:
-my motor is in noisier (motor+gear whining noise) than FC2.1 I had before (that one was super silent),
-clutch tolerances are tighter, there is a fair bit of a resistance (new motor) when trying to spin the cranks without the chain, but the other ting is, when I was rumbling around local forests/trails, it was perfectly silent when going down, I couldn't hear any noise coming from it at all. Maybe afet a good few km's it will loosen up a bit.
Power - max i was able to squeeze out of it was 680W.
ECO - 150W
TOUR - 280W
SPORT - 415W
SPORT+ - 540W
BOOST - 680W
So the stock tune is about 130W in between the modes.
Power is delivered smoothly, to reach max value You need to putt a fair amount of power into the cranks Yourself.
This motor with stock tune will NOT blow You away.

In next few weeks I am going the check motor efficiency and try to answer myself:

Is it really worth it to get M510 over M820 for sake of 80W extra power ?

Regards
Peter

cef69 first go.webp

first ride.webp
 
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Hi to all :D

Long story short, got the CEF69 build last week.

FORK: RS ZEB BASE 170MM (BUTTER CUP AIR SHAFT)
SHOCK: RS SELECT 205X65
BRAKES: SHIGURA
BRAKE ROTORS: IIPRO 203mm-front and 180mm rear
WHEELS: DT Swiss rims (models as on the photos), Sapim race spokes, brass niples and KOOZER 455 hubs (32 hole)
TYRES: ALBERT GRAVITY RADIAL, 2.5FRONT AND 2.4 REAR
DRIVETRAIN: 11S LINKGLIDE
CHAINRING: 38T (max size)
BATTERY: 13S4P 48V 1000Wh Samsung INR21700-58E (CC5563F101)
!!!BBR V2 FROM DADO !!! --> HIGHY RECOMMENDED
BACK FENDER: RRP Proguard Front Mudguard - SHORT
DROPPER: ONEUP 210mm slammed all the way down as insertion lenght of L frame is only about 295mm.
PEDALS, SADDLE, STEM, HANDLEBAR: got it on ALI
WEIGHT: 24.5kG

Additionally I made a small module (about 30W max) for automatic LED headlight. I used Magicshine ME2000 light, gives plenty of light.

Build wet nice and smooth, there was only one small surprise (experienced also with CEF55), frame motor mount have excessive clearance, in this case I had to add 1mm distance/spacer washers in order to bolt on the motor tight to the frame. My advice is to place those washers on non drive side as it affects chainring clearance.
View attachment 182409View attachment 182410

A few photos of finished bike bellow:
View attachment 182403View attachment 182404View attachment 182405View attachment 182406View attachment 182407View attachment 182408


Done first ride, bike feels great, goes through the corners. I was a bit afraid about bike balance due to a big battery stashed in the down tube but I turned out this is not a problem. IMHO this is a good platform to build a capable enduro bike.
One thing that might need improvement is the flex at the back wheel, it is not disturbing in any way but it could be better. If there was a bridge in between seat stay's it would be way better.

Now the M510 FC4.0 motor.
Done only 40km but first impression are:
-my motor is in noisier (motor+gear whining noise) than FC2.1 I had before (that one was super silent),
-clutch tolerances are tighter, there is a fair bit of a resistance (new motor) when trying to spin the cranks without the chain, but the other ting is, when I was rumbling around local forests/trails, it was perfectly silent when going down, I couldn't hear any noise coming from it at all. Maybe afet a good few km's it will loosen up a bit.
Power - max i was able to squeeze out of it was 680W.
ECO - 150W
TOUR - 280W
SPORT - 415W
SPORT+ - 540W
BOOST - 680W
So the stock tune is about 130W in between the modes.
Power is delivered smoothly, to reach max value You need to putt a fair amount of power into the cranks Yourself.
This motor with stock tune will NOT blow You away.

In next few weeks I am going the check motor efficiency and try to answer myself:

Is it really worth it to get M510 over M820 for sake of 80W extra power ?

Regards
Peter

View attachment 182411

View attachment 182412
EDIT:
Forgotten to mention, from about 15% of the battery left, power is limited to about 350W.
 
its worth it over the m820 because m510 is fully tune-able with besst and i believe the m820 is more dependent of FW

anyway nice bike! Get a besst tool todo more adjusting, that is also worth it!
 
Hi to all :D

Long story short, got the CEF69 build last week.

FORK: RS ZEB BASE 170MM (BUTTER CUP AIR SHAFT)
SHOCK: RS SELECT 205X65
BRAKES: SHIGURA
BRAKE ROTORS: IIPRO 203mm-front and 180mm rear
WHEELS: DT Swiss rims (models as on the photos), Sapim race spokes, brass niples and KOOZER 455 hubs (32 hole)
TYRES: ALBERT GRAVITY RADIAL, 2.5FRONT AND 2.4 REAR
DRIVETRAIN: 11S LINKGLIDE
CHAINRING: 38T (max size)
BATTERY: 13S4P 48V 1000Wh Samsung INR21700-58E (CC5563F101)
!!!BBR V2 FROM DADO !!! --> HIGHY RECOMMENDED
BACK FENDER: RRP Proguard Front Mudguard - SHORT
DROPPER: ONEUP 210mm slammed all the way down as insertion lenght of L frame is only about 295mm.
PEDALS, SADDLE, STEM, HANDLEBAR: got it on ALI
WEIGHT: 24.5kG

Additionally I made a small module (about 30W max) for automatic LED headlight. I used Magicshine ME2000 light, gives plenty of light.

Build wet nice and smooth, there was only one small surprise (experienced also with CEF55), frame motor mount have excessive clearance, in this case I had to add 1mm distance/spacer washers in order to bolt on the motor tight to the frame. My advice is to place those washers on non drive side as it affects chainring clearance.
View attachment 182409View attachment 182410

A few photos of finished bike bellow:
View attachment 182403View attachment 182404View attachment 182405View attachment 182406View attachment 182407View attachment 182408


Done first ride, bike feels great, goes through the corners. I was a bit afraid about bike balance due to a big battery stashed in the down tube but I turned out this is not a problem. IMHO this is a good platform to build a capable enduro bike.
One thing that might need improvement is the flex at the back wheel, it is not disturbing in any way but it could be better. If there was a bridge in between seat stay's it would be way better.

Now the M510 FC4.0 motor.
Done only 40km but first impression are:
-my motor is in noisier (motor+gear whining noise) than FC2.1 I had before (that one was super silent),
-clutch tolerances are tighter, there is a fair bit of a resistance (new motor) when trying to spin the cranks without the chain, but the other ting is, when I was rumbling around local forests/trails, it was perfectly silent when going down, I couldn't hear any noise coming from it at all. Maybe afet a good few km's it will loosen up a bit.
Power - max i was able to squeeze out of it was 680W.
ECO - 150W
TOUR - 280W
SPORT - 415W
SPORT+ - 540W
BOOST - 680W
So the stock tune is about 130W in between the modes.
Power is delivered smoothly, to reach max value You need to putt a fair amount of power into the cranks Yourself.
This motor with stock tune will NOT blow You away.

In next few weeks I am going the check motor efficiency and try to answer myself:

Is it really worth it to get M510 over M820 for sake of 80W extra power ?

Regards
Peter

View attachment 182411

View attachment 182412
Hi can you share your controleur hard and soft version and motor setting ? wich speed sensor have the M510 rev 4 ? and finally, does your battery level decrease when you going down (without motor assist)
i'm surprized that you have only 680W ? 510RS seem have controller FC0.4 like your and it can reach 750W (on HMI displayed)
1776603835961.webp
 
During the week I'll connect besst to it to check the settings, I will prapobly tune only ECO mode a bit.
My fc4.0 firmware is xxxx4814xxxxx which is about right. I have single 🧲 speed sensor.

I Feel that m510 efficiency is much lower than m820.
If I can compare those two motors with the same electric power displayed on HMI the m820 is way faster on eco and trail. Not sure about higher power modes.

Cheers
 
Can you talk through your automatic headlight situation? Thats something I'm looking to do here shortly.
I have prepared small DC-DC converters boards to run 25W me2000 LED lights. I can not live without anymore. IMG20260302085130.webp

Automatic mode can run either from bafang display or from headlight itself. No more worries about getting dark. Light is always on handlebar and always ready to go.
 
Hi can you share your controleur hard and soft version and motor setting ? wich speed sensor have the M510 rev 4 ? and finally, does your battery level decrease when you going down (without motor assist)
i'm surprized that you have only 680W ? 510RS seem have controller FC0.4 like your and it can reach 750W (on HMI displayed)
View attachment 182432
My battery percentage is controlled via BBR V2 device, so is motor FW independent.

Below my swIMG20260325071233.webp

Just wondering if I can upload 4816 RS firmware to it and run the motor on standard sensor?

Does anyone have RS firmware ?
 
Very nice build! May I ask how tall you are and your inseam length and what size you chose? Thanks a lot!
 
Very nice build! May I ask how tall you are and your inseam length and what size you chose? Thanks a lot!
Thanks

I am 183cm tall, about 100kG kitted, inseam about 86cm.
In L - frame You can slam 210mm oneup dropper post all the way in, but it ends up around charging port.

I got L frame and it is just about right size for me, but was considering to get M. If You get M size frame, You can always ''make'' it bigger with bike fitting stuff like stem, handlebar, seat etc.
But when You get L it is not always possible to ''make'' it smaller.

dropper post.webp


Cheers
 
During the week I'll connect besst to it to check the settings, I will prapobly tune only ECO mode a bit.
My fc4.0 firmware is xxxx4814xxxxx which is about right. I have single 🧲 speed sensor.

I Feel that m510 efficiency is much lower than m820.
If I can compare those two motors with the same electric power displayed on HMI the m820 is way faster on eco and trail. Not sure about higher power modes.

Cheers
4814 =>48V and 14A => max power 672. In line with that you seen. Request to your dealer an software update (510RS with controller rev 4 have 16A). And check your motor modes seeting, normally in lower mode M510 is powerfull than M820
 
My battery percentage is controlled via BBR V2 device, so is motor FW independent.

Below my swView attachment 182499

Just wondering if I can upload 4816 RS firmware to it and run the motor on standard sensor?

Does anyone have RS firmware ?
May be couldn't use the RS firmware dedicated to multipoint speed sensor. But a 4816 firmware, normally yes. It's seem exactly the same controller. I don't think that any customers have another firmware available at this moment. To early. But tour dealer can request one to bafang. Good luck
 
I have the FC4.0 but i think you need the new sensor to run the RS firmware :( You could ask Dado from K1 Flash he has the M510RS or firmware but for 36v just need to change the settings for power management.

I just picked up Eggrider C1 i want to see what i can change on the fly, Plan on flush mount it to where Bafang screen is on the CEF69. in Few weeks as im heading overseas to Bali end of the week for work so on the back burner for now, Need to design a nice bracket.
 
4814 =>48V and 14A => max power 672. In line with that you seen. Request to your dealer an software update (510RS with controller rev 4 have 16A). And check your motor modes seeting, normally in lower mode M510 is powerfull than M820
I got the motor with frame from SZZS maybe ill ask for 16A FW. But just in case my plan does not work I will need the stock firmware to have some kind of come back :D

The sensor:

- old - simple single magnet sensor
- new - hall sensor with multi hole disc + some magic box

Now the question is what happens in ''magic box'' ?

Did Bafang went in to some shortcut and just converted hall sensor to the old single magnet sensor signal ?
 
4814 =>48V and 14A => max power 672. In line with that you seen. Request to your dealer a software update (510RS with controller rev 4 have 16A). And check your motor modes seeting, normally in lower mode M510 is powerfull than M820
4814 version is actually only 12A. ( logged on battery ). Be careful with overheating of the motor guys with 16A.
 
I got the motor with frame from SZZS maybe ill ask for 16A FW. But just in case my plan does not work I will need the stock firmware to have some kind of come back :D

The sensor:

- old - simple single magnet sensor
- new - hall sensor with multi hole disc + some magic box

Now the question is what happens in ''magic box'' ?

Did Bafang went in to some shortcut and just converted hall sensor to the old single magnet sensor signal ?
I don't think it's only converting multipoint signal in single. You clearly seen speed displayed more reactive and lower speed displayed, than single point signal. I feel also torque lowered when wheel start slide and grown progresivelly when you recover adhesion
 
4814 version is actually only 12A. ( logged on battery ). Be careful with overheating of the motor guys with 16A.
I use it since 2 months. very low time in boost 750W (+-16A). But often 680W (+- 14A). No failure at this time and motor don't overheat.
 
When the m820 is run above 400 watts it's horribly inefficient. I have mine paired to a 700wh battery and I only get about 3,000 feet of climbing out of it. Riding buddies on shimano with their motors set to the middle position have the same assistance but way more range
 
Is there any rattling in the engine when going downhill? What is it like when accelerating suddenly, does it accelerate or lose power?
 
Is there any rattling in the engine when going downhill? What is it like when accelerating suddenly, does it accelerate or lose power?
Going downhill motor is extremely quiet! IMHO it is due to tighter tolerances.

Done a few kilometers today and only one used boost mode. Do I need more power ? I do not think so.

I can always ramp up current limit and give it a try.
 
With 2.6" front and 2.5" rear tires BB is at 337mm.

Cheers
fork 170 travel, 205x65 rear shock, 29"x 2.6/2.5 and only 337 mm between crankcase arms axel and ground ? it's the first rev linkage or the later adapted for X2 shock ?
 
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