Velduro Rogue 170/165 mullet Enduro with DJI

[zizajaun]

You know, the Rogue is basically a carbon copy of the Norco Sight/ Range VLT with the latter using a Bosch system instead. If they offered a frame (or even cheap build) of the Norco with a CX-R, a 600w battery and a matching skinny downtube, I'd buy it right now. Alas, the search continues.

I've tried to buy a Rogue in the USA and they pointed me to a Canadian distributor, which would currently mean a 30% tariff, meaning no savings over, well anything really.

How much would it cost for you to go to Canada and buy one? I briefly considered flying to NZ from the UK to get one as the £1000 price difference was similar to a return flight, but they were out of stock there anyway.

 

[Suns_PSD]

How much would it cost for you to go to Canada and buy one? I briefly considered flying to NZ from the UK to get one as the £1000 price difference was similar to a return flight, but they were out of stock there anyway.

Assuming they had one to sell me, well I'm pretty far from the border. But I was told by a friend last night that if you have some dirt on a bike, you can drive it right across no problem. On a plane, I can't say. If I was going to do it by plane, I'd pack a throw away bike, pay the shipping on it, and donate it when I got there.

If I lived near the border, I'd consider driving over. But I live very far from the border.

There is a better than 50% chance the Supreme Court of the USA will rule the Tariffs illegal, as only Congress has the power to tax it's citizens, which is exactly what these are. But the verdict has not been handed down yet.

 

[Plummet]

You know, the Rogue is basically a carbon copy of the Norco Sight/ Range VLT with the latter using a Bosch system instead. If they offered a frame (or even cheap build) of the Norco with a CX-R, a 600w battery and a matching skinny downtube, I'd buy it right now. Alas, the search continues.

I've tried to buy a Rogue in the USA and they pointed me to a Canadian distributor, which would currently mean a 30% tariff, meaning no savings over, well anything really.

Fly to nz, pick up.a Rouge and then We can rip rotorua for a coupla days. Fly home. Epic bike trip and a save the tarrif.

But you'd have to figure logistics go shop the battery.

 

[sethimus]

I would not want a 65' HTA on a bike like this.
You'll gain more traction up front dropping the fork to a 180mm anyways.

it would REALLY help if you‘d read more before jumping to conclusions. 64.1° is NOT 65°
thx

 

[Suns_PSD]

it would REALLY help if you‘d read more before jumping to conclusions. 64.1° is NOT 65°
thx

I thought the numbers were post -1' headset.

Apologies. Although I don't know why you are always insist on behaving rudely online.

 

[sethimus]

I thought the numbers were post -1' headset.

Apologies. Although I don't know why you are always insist on behaving rudely online.

because you are constantly post things that are simply not true? stick to the truth…

 

[Filth_88]

View attachment 172873

the geo i’m leaning into atm, with a 1° works compontens headset and a 594mm long fork, would result in a 1.82 fc:rc ratio at sag (+10mm cs)

I bought a 0.5 degree works components headset when I thought the WB was 1300, I am going to try it anyway to reduce the fc:rc ratio. It will be interesting to see what the as built HA comes in as, but 64 would be fine for my trails (I just don’t want to decrease the WB too much).

 

[Suns_PSD]

because you are constantly post things that are simply not true? stick to the truth…

I'm going to stick to not getting personal online. I don't know you; you don't know me. But we are going to end up with the same bike most likely.

However, a difference of opinion on motor efficiencies and me misreading your post or finding it unclear is not the same thing as an untruth.

It's bikes, it's online, relax and enjoy your bike.

 

[bmwpowere36m3]

Assuming they had one to sell me, well I'm pretty far from the border. But I was told by a friend last night that if you have some dirt on a bike, you can drive it right across no problem. On a plane, I can't say. If I was going to do it by plane, I'd pack a throw away bike, pay the shipping on it, and donate it when I got there.

If I lived near the border, I'd consider driving over. But I live very far from the border.

There is a better than 50% chance the Supreme Court of the USA will rule the Tariffs illegal, as only Congress has the power to tax it's citizens, which is exactly what these are. But the verdict has not been handed down yet.

I've flown with my bike to/from Canada and elsewhere. I'd bring an empty bike bag and fly back with "my" bike... I doubt anyone would question you. If I was that paranoid, I guess, a throw away bike so you can claim you brought a bike in and are now bringing it back.

Typically with customs returning to US from Canada (from Vancouver), you don't have your luggage only carry-on at customs.

Now whether this is all worth the hassle... like you said, you can just get a Norco Range/Sight and be done. Probably get better support in NA and it comes from a proven company. What does the CX-R deliver? I thought you were coming from a lower power motor or didn't "need" the power...

DJI is cool and all, but I'm happy with my EP801... so a Bosch CX gen 5 with 100Nm and 750W will be great.

 

[Plummet]

Should the RC:FC ratio be calculated at sag? - I've been thinking about this too. I'm not so sure it should be. When we ride, of course we moving the suspension a lot, and we will travel at sag and way beyond that on a ton of the ride.

But, we are still in many situations that we are unweighted / less than 30% sag when riding. Popping over roots, jumps, whatever.

When this happens and we are unsagged, our rear lever point (the rear wheel) is still part of the FC:RC ratio, and can touch down further forward than a longer CS, which in turn effects the balance of the bike and the way it behaves.

I see the sagged chainstay measurement as just another data point to guide us on bike geometry. My crestline (not a High Pivot) also has a rearward axle path, not as aggressive as the Velduro, but still has a decent amount of growth at sag point.

If we start measing FC:RC at sag point, then we must also consider the fork is also sagged, further changing the FC:RC ratio.

Finally, bike geo charts are also just a guide. Almost every single one Many are incorrect when the real bike is measured! They are based on CAD, which ideally would be perfect. The closest I've ever found is Nicolai. Their bikes are exactly as the data shows on their chart (well, I measured 2 so far and they are spot on).


Crestline axle path
View attachment 172853

If i am correct, You are mainly considering this metric in relation to bike balance when cornering? if that is the case, loaded cornering never occurs unsagged. If its unsagged its not loaded.....

Therefore the most representative ratio is sagged.

For me its moot as I dont even look at this RC:FC ratio when considering bikes. I'm all about rear center, reach and head angle. The front center measurement is a product of reach, travel and head angle. Get those right and the ratio falls into line. I simply allow 5-10mm less rear center than my optimal for high pivot designs. That works for me.

My claymore runs 435 rc and the S180 445 both bikes rock.
I do enjoy the playfullness of the 435 cs on the claymore at low speeds then crank the speed up, settle into the travel, corner hard and boomshukalaka.

 

[Suns_PSD]

I've flown with my bike to/from Canada and elsewhere. I'd bring an empty bike bag and fly back with "my" bike... I doubt anyone would question you. If I was that paranoid, I guess, a throw away bike so you can claim you brought a bike in and are now bringing it back.

Typically with customs returning to US from Canada (from Vancouver), you don't have your luggage only carry-on at customs.

Now whether this is all worth the hassle... like you said, you can just get a Norco Range/Sight and be done. Probably get better support in NA and it comes from a proven company. What does the CX-R deliver? I thought you were coming from a lower power motor or didn't "need" the power...

DJI is cool and all, but I'm happy with my EP801... so a Bosch CX gen 5 with 100Nm and 750W will be great.

I'm working on a Rogue and plan to have it in my hands by early Spring as I already have the correct contact. More stoked on the DJI as well as the Rogue than before, because of a few things that I know, so I guess things all come around.

It's the closest to my ideal bike out of the current options.

I wanted the CX-R for the bit lighter weight and the ceramic bearings that very well might improve efficiency even further as that's what ceramic bearings do in most other use cases. And I like to have the best, I guess.

PS. Some pages back I mentioned that I did a PP case against Antidote for non-received product, they never responded so that's completed now, so I'm officially back in the market. I half hoped that they would send me a nasty e-mail or realistic explanation so that I could feel bad, reconsider the purchase, or something, but not even that! Needless to say, I'm over it and not even interested in that bike at any price any longer. A bit of wait for a new rig is no big deal as I currently have 2 bikes that I'm happy with.

 

[ntm95]

If i am correct, You are mainly considering this metric in relation to bike balance when cornering? if that is the case, loaded cornering never occurs unsagged. If its unsagged its not loaded.....

Therefore the most representative ratio is sagged.

For me its moot as I dont even look at this RC:FC ratio when considering bikes. I'm all about rear center, reach and head angle. The front center measurement is a product of reach, travel and head angle. Get those right and the ratio falls into line. I simply allow 5-10mm less rear center than my optimal for high pivot designs. That works for me.

My claymore runs 435 rc and the S180 445 both bikes rock.
I do enjoy the playfullness of the 435 cs on the claymore at low speeds then crank the speed up, settle into the travel, corner hard and boomshukalaka.

I believe you are riding medium frames with more acceptable f/r ratios though, no ?

I had both an mx claymore (435mm chainstay) and a regular 29 claymore (444mm chainstay), large frames.
The mx was better overall in high traction, supported corners, but the 29'r was better in flat corners and loose conditions.
Neither one cornered particularly well honestly, in hindsight. A buddy and I were swapping an arrival 170 and claymore 29" back and forth at Sun Peaks, and it was almost comical how the claymore would cut time through the rough, and the arrival would cut time through the corners, for both of us. One was certainly a suspension bike, and the other a geometry bike.

 

[Suns_PSD]

I believe you are riding medium frames with more acceptable f/r ratios though, no ?

I had both an mx claymore (435mm chainstay) and a regular 29 claymore (444mm chainstay), large frames.
The mx was better overall in high traction, supported corners, but the 29'r was better in flat corners and loose conditions.
Neither one cornered particularly well honestly, in hindsight. A buddy and I were swapping an arrival 170 and claymore 29" back and forth at Sun Peaks, and it was almost comical how the claymore would cut time through the rough, and the arrival would cut time through the corners, for both of us. One was certainly a suspension bike, and the other a geometry bike.

This.

The longest CS I ever managed to ride on the same bike was a 452 or 453 and it was the best turning bike I've ever ridden and allowed me to add a lot of speed (it was adjustable) on a 495ish Reach bike.

That said e-bike battery weights and growing HP chainstays mean that possibly, none of that applies. I just don't know. But since I can't ride them all, I'll choose to stick with what I know has worked very well in the past and I want between 450-455mm CS's on my next bike.

I do find that when front traction is a bit off (not wildly off) there are several easy things that you can do to reign it back in including longer stem, wider bars, lower bars, less stem spacers, more front sag, less fork LSC, more fork rebound (slower), less rear sag, more rear LSC, less rear rebound/ extremely grippy front and less grippy rear, etc.... Pick what you can live with. I've also found that MX configurations have a lot less of this understeer problem where the bike wants to go straight. Just swapping to a 29er on an MX bike (and throwing the flip chip) has dramatically increased understeer on 2 bikes, for me, best helped by just going to a faster, less grippy rear tire.

When front traction is seriously lacking, which is more common with modern size L bikes, pressing down really hard on the outside handlebars works incredibly well at improving traction but is absolutely exhausting, puts you in a risky position if it does wash out, and makes it super hard to time weighting/ unweighting events mid-turn. Basically, it sucks!

There is a solid deal on a L Bullet frameset for sale and the too short chainstays (446) combined with that long FC are the primary reason I won't buy it, and testers acknowledge the lack of accurate steering. You're lucky if you ride mediums as it all works well.

 

[Taxi Man]

Finally finished the bike.

Had 2 installation rides and made a few tweaks. Heading out with the finished product later today.

Size L: 23.4kg (no pedals) Gravity casing rear and trail at the front.

 

[doochenozzle]

Assuming they had one to sell me, well I'm pretty far from the border. But I was told by a friend last night that if you have some dirt on a bike, you can drive it right across no problem. On a plane, I can't say. If I was going to do it by plane, I'd pack a throw away bike, pay the shipping on it, and donate it when I got there.

If I lived near the border, I'd consider driving over. But I live very far from the border.

There is a better than 50% chance the Supreme Court of the USA will rule the Tariffs illegal, as only Congress has the power to tax it's citizens, which is exactly what these are. But the verdict has not been handed down yet.

Forbidden has a few ebike sizes left in both Canada and the USA depending on your size and model desired. I haven’t seen the Valduros stocked here yet and thought it wouldnt be until spring 2026

 

[sethimus]

I'm going to stick to not getting personal online. I don't know you; you don't know me. But we are going to end up with the same bike most likely.

However, a difference of opinion on motor efficiencies and me misreading your post or finding it unclear is not the same thing as an untruth.

It's bikes, it's online, relax and enjoy your bike.

you are constantly misstating key facts about motors, about solid state batteries, it adds up over time and at some point i can’t shut up about it, especially if you continue after already being called up about it. you do this here, and you do this at other places on the internet. i see you, everywhere…

 

[Suns_PSD]

Forbidden has a few ebike sizes left in both Canada and the USA depending on your size and model desired. I haven’t seen the Valduros stocked here yet and thought it wouldnt be until spring 2026

Yah, there are quite a few new and one used E-cores in my size on PB for sale. The geo is just too much of a risk for me and reviews sort of seem to underscore the issues I'd be concerned with.

Unless something else hits my desires between now and availability, I'll almost certainly buy the Rogue. I think they did a great job with that bike! It's just going to be a while until I (hopefully) have it here in the USA so I'm just going to learn from you guys in the meantime.

thx!

 

[Filth_88]

Finally finished the bike.

Had 2 installation rides and made a few tweaks. Heading out with the finished product later today.

Size L: 23.4kg (no pedals) Gravity casing rear and trail at the front.



View attachment 172889

View attachment 172885 View attachment 172887

What a weapon. let us know how it rides, and also the MM/albert combo, I’ve been looking at giving that a go too.

 

[Taxi Man]

What a weapon. let us know how it rides, and also the MM/albert combo, I’ve been looking at giving that a go too.

On my first 2 rides the tyre combo seems great. Came from Assegai front and DHR2 rear with inserts on both and DH rear. They definitely have ride characteristics similar to running an insert. They feel gripper than the Maxxis but I'm comparing to tyres that we're 25% worn. 25psi F & 30psi R. Feels good and happy so far.

Update: Just finished ride 3. This bike absolutely rips. The rear end is on another level and the geo feels absolutely perfect. I honestly would not want a longer CS for myself and it feels plenty nimble in the tight stuff. I set Strava PBs everywhere up and down and I wasn't pushing overley hard except 1 up as I wanted to see how it would stack up (KOM) at the local hill.

Running 170mm F & R. I honestly wouldn't change a thing after that ride, without doubt the best bike I've ever ridden.

The only down side is my motor is slightly rattley but its not annoying as its a quiet rattle but its there. All of the upside outweigh this by a mile though.

Super stoked. WHAT. A. RIG.

Also a buzz having mostly NZ designed bike and some built right here products on the bike.

 

[rabitec]

On my first 2 rides the tyre combo seems great. Came from Assegai front and DHR2 rear with inserts on both and DH rear. They definitely have ride characteristics similar to running an insert. They feel gripper than the Maxxis but I'm comparing to tyres that we're 25% worn. 25psi F & 30psi R. Feels good and happy so far.

[....]

The only down side is my motor is slightly rattley but its not annoying as its a quiet rattle but its there. All of the upside outweigh this by a mile though.

Super stoked. WHAT. A. RIG.

Also a buzz having mostly NZ designed bike and some built right here products on the bike.

Such a beautiful custom bike, really well done!

I also went for a yellow accent (with limited edition mavic deemax wheels) - are these the yellow decals from invisiframe?

Is the invisiframe wrap matte or gloss? The bike looks glossier than original and I quite like it!

Your frame is a large: can you remind us again how tall you are (and ideally inseam) and what dropper you went for?

Have fun!!!

 

[Mars2]

I'd just drop the bar height, go to a 50mm stem, and ride that front wheel like it's 2018.

200% approve that.

 

[Highland Wheels]

What issues/risk?

You should go and ride one before writing it off as an option.

Thought you were dead set on a Bosch motor anyway. Because effeciency

Yah, there are quite a few new and one used E-cores in my size on PB for sale. The geo is just too much of a risk for me and reviews sort of seem to underscore the issues I'd be concerned with.

Unless something else hits my desires between now and availability, I'll almost certainly buy the Rogue. I think they did a great job with that bike! It's just going to be a while until I (hopefully) have it here in the USA so I'm just going to learn from you guys in the meantime.

 

[HiGer]

Is the rear axle included in the framekit? Not really clear to me from the description on the site...
And if not: what do I need?

 

[Suns_PSD]

What issues/risk?

You should go and ride one before writing it off as an option.

Thought you were dead set on a Bosch motor anyway. Because effeciency

IMO, the M2 will be quieter and more efficient due to less drag. It'll also be in some of the best bikes.
That's good enough for me.

Regarding the E-core, super interesting bike but without an opportunity to really ride one for a day fully set up for me (not possible) the geo is out there from what I know works for me. Also, they currently all have the M1.

 

[Highland Wheels]

The M2 is gonna be their cheaper motor version with an update to the M1 or something.

Same mounting as the current M1 though so that'll extend the life of any current Avinox powered motor. I'd definitely swap mine out for a revised one if it really is an improvement over

 

[Mikects]

Got the dimensions and logo files from velduro and used a cricut machine to cut them out with a friend

Great idea. Any chance you could upload the logo files here?

I'm thinking I'll laser print my own on waterslide decal paper, in DVO green.

 

[Suns_PSD]

The M2 is gonna be their cheaper motor version with an update to the M1 or something.

Same mounting as the current M1 though so that'll extend the life of any current Avinox powered motor. I'd definitely swap mine out for a revised one if it really is an improvement over

I've heard a few different things. But there's going to be a motor that's more efficient, a motor that's quieter, a motor that's heavier, a motor that's more powerful.
But I don't know which characteristics above will be on the future M1 & which will be on the future M2.
The motor that Crestline chooses and that'll we'll all likely see on the spec sheet next month, will be the quiet one that much we know.

 

[Filth_88]

On my first 2 rides the tyre combo seems great. Came from Assegai front and DHR2 rear with inserts on both and DH rear. They definitely have ride characteristics similar to running an insert. They feel gripper than the Maxxis but I'm comparing to tyres that we're 25% worn. 25psi F & 30psi R. Feels good and happy so far.

Update: Just finished ride 3. This bike absolutely rips. The rear end is on another level and the geo feels absolutely perfect. I honestly would not want a longer CS for myself and it feels plenty nimble in the tight stuff. I set Strava PBs everywhere up and down and I wasn't pushing overley hard except 1 up as I wanted to see how it would stack up (KOM) at the local hill.

Running 170mm F & R. I honestly wouldn't change a thing after that ride, without doubt the best bike I've ever ridden.

The only down side is my motor is slightly rattley but its not annoying as its a quiet rattle but its there. All of the upside outweigh this by a mile though.

Super stoked. WHAT. A. RIG.

Also a buzz having mostly NZ designed bike and some built right here products on the bike.

Good to hear you are enjoying the bike, smaller CS are beneficial at my local Nelson trails too.
The tyre combo sounds good, I think I’ll give it a try when I can find the right compound at a good price. Assegai/DHR is my go to just now too.
The motor rattle is the only thing I’m apprehensive about the bike, I hate noise. People on another thread were floating the idea of the battery engaging slightly whilst going DH to mitigate the free play, interesting idea.

 

[Filth_88]

The M2 is gonna be their cheaper motor version with an update to the M1 or something.

Same mounting as the current M1 though so that'll extend the life of any current Avinox powered motor. I'd definitely swap mine out for a revised one if it really is an improvement over

Just rumours like, but I heard the new Avanox motor will be heavier, more power and not interchangeable with the M1.

 

[Taxi Man]

Good to hear you are enjoying the bike, smaller CS are beneficial at my local Nelson trails too.
The tyre combo sounds good, I think I’ll give it a try when I can find the right compound at a good price. Assegai/DHR is my go to just now too.
The motor rattle is the only thing I’m apprehensive about the bike, I hate noise. People on another thread were floating the idea of the battery engaging slightly whilst going DH to mitigate the free play, interesting idea.

The bike is good to go as is on Mutleys .

I was actually thinking about the engagement of motor too. Could a software update cause the motor to turn slowly when it senses your going downhill? It can sense everything else, not sure if the noise sits independent of this but if it didn't this would get rid of it in almost all scenarios. It would suck a bit of battery doing this so an on/off in the advanced feature menu would be ace. I also wondered if the free hub engagement was a software update to target reduced rattle? (It didn't)