What's an "m2" dreadnaught ?
Forbidden Druid - Avinox Powered
- Thread starter jbrown15
- Start date
Updated Avinox motor. Current is the m1.
No confirmation but the chatter seems to indicate it.
I can almost gurantee that the Druid is more than enough bike for 99% of riders
Only need to see the stuff that Ollie and Brian rode on both the Lite and Core models.
But I guess more travel makes it easier for the less skilled.
Id maybe stick a 170mm air spring in my Zebs mind you
Indeed.
But count me as one of the less skilled I guess, I'll take an e-dreadnaught all day, every day.
My current e-bike is a 150mm rear end and it does most things decently, but more would be appreciated for the inevitable mistakes on larger features and poor line choice on faster chunk.
While I'm being contrary, I hope they use the tq 60 with a 580wh battery in the "e-dread". I found the 600wh in the lite to be a very large improvement in handling vs the 800wh in the core. And the dji is grossly overpowered, even detuned it's a power hog, so the 600wh is marginal. And it's all too easy to be lazy and let it do all the work.
That'd suck.
It's supposed to be 120+nm and heavier. I want lighter, as there's plenty of 52+ pound, longer travel e bikes on the market. And they all kind of ride the same.
45-49 pounds is where it needs to be.
Some people say that Bosch needs to redesign the 800w battery to be long and slender to compete with DJI aesthetics, but it turns out that maybe they knew exactly what they were doing by making it short and fat?
Perhaps, but I do feel it is the overall weight as well. 800wh bosch bikes feel heavy on the handling too.
With the bosch motor's "gut" sticking out in front of the bb, it makes it difficult to move the 600 or 800wh down really low and still maintain a reasonable aesthetic.
Once you go past 50 pounds, the weight just seems to become exponentially more noticeable on all bikes.
I can almost gurantee that the Druid is more than enough bike for 99% of riders
Only need to see the stuff that Ollie and Brian rode on both the Lite and Core models.
But I guess more travel makes it easier for the less skilled.
Id maybe stick a 170mm air spring in my Zebs mind you
I’m doing the 170mm air spring today! It’s an extremely capable 150mm bike. I ride pretty rowdy trails and usually look for more rear travel, but don’t feel I need it here at all. I just maybe run a little less sag % to an I would otherwise.
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Had my first proper ride out on the Druid over the weekend and loved it. Conditions here in UK are now wet and boggy so it will be a while before drier trails are available but actually the power of the bike really takes the winter grind away. Obviously feels a bit weightier than my White E-Lyte (20k.5g vs 23.5kg) but it doesn’t feel like it runs away with you due to the weight.
Glad I swapped the Maven’s out for Hope GR4’s, these felt great. Couldn’t get the Hope floating rotor to fit on the rear due to a clash with the speed sensor. Currently I have the SRAM rotors but will change to the Hope fixed rotors shortry.
Suspension felt good but still could do with a bit more adjusting. The harshness I felt on Friday after collection has gone by removing a couple of psi from the tyres so now I can just focus on the suspension. Feels plush bit not poppy, some return when I push in but not loads. Probably need a bit more air in both fork and shock for better mid stroke support. To be honest, not the best time to tune with all this boggy mud around so May take a while to get right.
SmoothShift is awesome
Being able to change whilst not turning a crank is just one of the best things. Took me a while to remember to use it but once I did start I was using it everywhere. Keeping your cranks out of harms way but being able to get in the right gear for what’s coming next is almost as game changing as a dropper post 
Plus I’m sure it make gear changing smoother as I think it backs the power off slightly??
Had a good play with the assist modes and have now tuned Auto mode pretty spot on for the sort of riding I like, longer distance but with technical along the way. Key seems to be turning the Assistance Range down so the motor will balance with your input. This was probably my biggest concern when buying the bike without even riding an Avinox motor but watching (too many) yt videos.
I think the only area where I would say the Bosch motor is better would be a standing start on an incline. The Bosch seems to sense the pedal input more and go from that whereas the Avinox needs movement so it relies on the speed sensor more? Once going it is probably smoother due to the better frequency of input than the Bosch but if you find yourself stuck on an incline, the Bosch you can just tap the pedal to get going.
Still need to tune Trail a bit more for when riding with other eebs but will adjust when I’m out with others to see what works. Being about to have these different personalities/modes in one bike is great and exactly what I wanted.
The bike itself, I was surprised how quickly I got on with the geometry. I was a little concerned about the short reach as I’ve come from bikes with really long reach numbers. Spent 5 years on a Geometron G1 with 535mm reach! Then a KenevoSL with 515mm reach. Both of these were epic at descending, extreme amounts of confidence in the bikes and felt like you could hit anything. The G1 although good just wasn’t ideal for most of my riding in my sedate trails with tighter singletrack being the main terrain. It was good but you had to work hard. The KSL was better and assisted but couldn’t ride with other eebs.
I really like the high stack height on this and the short reach seems to work with that setup. I did read a comment from the designer regarding some of the thought process behind this including the short cranks on eebs being a consideration for high stack, short reach as it gives you better stability.
Love the way the back of the bike feels so far, together all the numbers place you in a good central place and it feels easier to keep weight on the front when cornering.
Still managed an over the bars moment on one descent
Really annoyed me as this has been a mind game for me this year since I crashed earlier and fractured my tibia! I’ve always loved the steep descents, much more than jumping, which I can’t do well. So to have a couple of OTB moments is messing with my head. Need to sort out what I am doing wrong body position wise. I think my previous long bikes flattered whatever I was doing or have given me some habits that don’t carry well back to normal sized bikes… not sure.
Can’t wait for my next chance to get out and ride again. Rubbish time to buy a new bike, winter in the UK!
Glad I swapped the Maven’s out for Hope GR4’s, these felt great. Couldn’t get the Hope floating rotor to fit on the rear due to a clash with the speed sensor. Currently I have the SRAM rotors but will change to the Hope fixed rotors shortry.
Suspension felt good but still could do with a bit more adjusting. The harshness I felt on Friday after collection has gone by removing a couple of psi from the tyres so now I can just focus on the suspension. Feels plush bit not poppy, some return when I push in but not loads. Probably need a bit more air in both fork and shock for better mid stroke support. To be honest, not the best time to tune with all this boggy mud around so May take a while to get right.
SmoothShift is awesome
Being able to change whilst not turning a crank is just one of the best things. Took me a while to remember to use it but once I did start I was using it everywhere. Keeping your cranks out of harms way but being able to get in the right gear for what’s coming next is almost as game changing as a dropper post Plus I’m sure it make gear changing smoother as I think it backs the power off slightly??Had a good play with the assist modes and have now tuned Auto mode pretty spot on for the sort of riding I like, longer distance but with technical along the way. Key seems to be turning the Assistance Range down so the motor will balance with your input. This was probably my biggest concern when buying the bike without even riding an Avinox motor but watching (too many) yt videos.
I think the only area where I would say the Bosch motor is better would be a standing start on an incline. The Bosch seems to sense the pedal input more and go from that whereas the Avinox needs movement so it relies on the speed sensor more? Once going it is probably smoother due to the better frequency of input than the Bosch but if you find yourself stuck on an incline, the Bosch you can just tap the pedal to get going.
Still need to tune Trail a bit more for when riding with other eebs but will adjust when I’m out with others to see what works. Being about to have these different personalities/modes in one bike is great and exactly what I wanted.
The bike itself, I was surprised how quickly I got on with the geometry. I was a little concerned about the short reach as I’ve come from bikes with really long reach numbers. Spent 5 years on a Geometron G1 with 535mm reach! Then a KenevoSL with 515mm reach. Both of these were epic at descending, extreme amounts of confidence in the bikes and felt like you could hit anything. The G1 although good just wasn’t ideal for most of my riding in my sedate trails with tighter singletrack being the main terrain. It was good but you had to work hard. The KSL was better and assisted but couldn’t ride with other eebs.
I really like the high stack height on this and the short reach seems to work with that setup. I did read a comment from the designer regarding some of the thought process behind this including the short cranks on eebs being a consideration for high stack, short reach as it gives you better stability.
Love the way the back of the bike feels so far, together all the numbers place you in a good central place and it feels easier to keep weight on the front when cornering.
Still managed an over the bars moment on one descent
Really annoyed me as this has been a mind game for me this year since I crashed earlier and fractured my tibia! I’ve always loved the steep descents, much more than jumping, which I can’t do well. So to have a couple of OTB moments is messing with my head. Need to sort out what I am doing wrong body position wise. I think my previous long bikes flattered whatever I was doing or have given me some habits that don’t carry well back to normal sized bikes… not sure.Can’t wait for my next chance to get out and ride again. Rubbish time to buy a new bike, winter in the UK!
Still managed an over the bars moment on one descent
Very strong chance that you're used to riding that front end like a unicycle from experience with the kenevo. It has a rather extreme rear bias and low stack.
The g1 has a closer ratio to the druid, but it's stack/reach/wheelbase numbers are on the extreme side for a given size, and still not as balanced as the druid-e.
Most of the forbidden bikes take an adjustment period, particularly for taller riders that are used to getting chainstays that were originally designed for a size medium bike.
It took me about a week with my dreadnought v2 to really learn to corner the bike with my feet, pay attention to where my knees are, and stay off my hands in corners. It's the kind of stuff that will hurt you on a more unbalanced bike, but equates to speed and confidence once you get comfortable with it on a bike that's around that 1.8 f/r ratio range.
Wanted to post with a little info for others in here. I picked up a LitE base build in a size 3 with a 600wh battery. Before taking delivery I swapped the shocks to a 150 deluxe and 160 lyrik set up. Came in at 48.3lbs with pedals, cut bars, GX axs t-type, and tubeless sealant. I updated the bars, stem, axs dropper (heavier), and found a deal on some take off XX cranks. Side note the cranks clear by a few mm on the idler. This brought the weight down to 47.3lbs. The wheels are heavy. While assembling I weighed the complete rear at 3050g and front at 2410g. Hope to drop another 1-2lbs swapping out the wheels to end up with a mid 40lb bike in the end.
Yes I agree on the sag. Did you initially run at 160? I went straight to 170 sowould be interested to hear your feedback
That's really good and useful feed, thanks. Hadn't considered it in that way and good to hear the comparison between the bikes I've been used to riding for so long. Now just need to go through that adjustment period.
Just got back from a ride that I had to cut short due to failed electric shifting I can only think that the power cable has been pinched somewhere in the routing through the pivot area as if I get off the bike, shifting works, as soon as I put weight on the saddle, it stops. Anyone experienced this issue?
I can only think that the power cable has been pinched somewhere in the routing through the pivot area as if I get off the bike, shifting works, as soon as I put weight on the saddle, it stops. Anyone experienced this issue?Just installed the 170mm airspring, coil shock, +5mm reach adjust headset, 50mm stem and a few bits and pieces. Looking forward to the first ride with this setup!
That’s a lot of extra reach with the longer stem and headset adjustment, were you not gelling with the high stack / short reach theory? Or just experimenting?
Nice setup though and interested to hear your feedback on this lot.
andreaverona
New Member
Coil users, how do you feel the middle travel support vs air one?
I replaced a Deviate Highlander with a Druid CorE, and swapped over my RS SDU Coil RCT2 with a springdex, I'm using 490 spring rate, with calculators recommending 475 spring rate for aggressive riding - I think my rear SAG is around 24-26%. For context I'm on an S2, I'm 5'9" 145lbs geared. With that said the druid is very good with this setup, much better than the Vivid Air it came with, which I couldn't get setup to my liking - it just felt harsh with lower sag and blew through the travel with higher sag. The druid feels more playful than the Highlander, rear end is more comfortable, and it still very supportive when pushing hard for big jumps and berms. I do get occasional pedal strikes, but less than I did with the Vivid Air and feels better, could mean it gets deep in the travel more or the BB is low like I hear others say, but I never feel like its sitting to low with my setup.
Everyone sets up their suspension differently, even though the druid has a relatively linear leverage curve, it can be setup just fine with coil, personally I've been very happy with the coil setup.
Hi All, I'm new to the forums. I've seen a lot of discussion about the weight and I'm curious about everyone's reason for the concern?
I'm 145lbs geared, not exactly strong, nor do I regularly workout at gym etc, sit at a computer all day for work. As a former weight weenie I get the concern of a heavy bike, but after a month and about 200 miles of riding (enduro trails like Kanuga, jumps etc), I can't find many downsides to a 54lb Druid CorE, actually the opposite.
Comparing it to my previous bike, an analog Deviate Highlander which was about 35lbs, both about 160/150 travel, same fork and shock, and general setup, the Druid is just better in every way and I believe the extra 18+ lbs is helping that. The Druid is smoother over fast rocky/chunky terrain - it doesn't ping around as much and get thrown off line - I don't have to muscle it around as much, it carries momentum better, It jumps better - I don't have to push as hard into jumps or pull up the bars up as much to get same result, in the air the weight doesn't seem to affect my ability to whip or move the bike around, nor am I more sore after a 5-6hr ride or long weekend. The weight is a non-issue leaning in turns, and the Druid feels better for that likely b/c it's a MX setup vs full 29er on the Highlander, and obviously it's a non-issue for climbing b/c it has a motor! The suspension seems to work better, both my hands and feet feel better after long rides. So I can't really find a downside, only positives out on the trails. It's yet to be seen how annoying it might get for lift parks and shuttles, but that seems like a small price to pay for such goodness.
I have zero desire to lighten this bike.
I'm 145lbs geared, not exactly strong, nor do I regularly workout at gym etc, sit at a computer all day for work. As a former weight weenie I get the concern of a heavy bike, but after a month and about 200 miles of riding (enduro trails like Kanuga, jumps etc), I can't find many downsides to a 54lb Druid CorE, actually the opposite.
Comparing it to my previous bike, an analog Deviate Highlander which was about 35lbs, both about 160/150 travel, same fork and shock, and general setup, the Druid is just better in every way and I believe the extra 18+ lbs is helping that. The Druid is smoother over fast rocky/chunky terrain - it doesn't ping around as much and get thrown off line - I don't have to muscle it around as much, it carries momentum better, It jumps better - I don't have to push as hard into jumps or pull up the bars up as much to get same result, in the air the weight doesn't seem to affect my ability to whip or move the bike around, nor am I more sore after a 5-6hr ride or long weekend. The weight is a non-issue leaning in turns, and the Druid feels better for that likely b/c it's a MX setup vs full 29er on the Highlander, and obviously it's a non-issue for climbing b/c it has a motor! The suspension seems to work better, both my hands and feet feel better after long rides. So I can't really find a downside, only positives out on the trails. It's yet to be seen how annoying it might get for lift parks and shuttles, but that seems like a small price to pay for such goodness.
I have zero desire to lighten this bike.Yes a 170mm will shorten the reach, which is why I counteracted this with the Works +5mm headset. With the stem, I’m just trying to get the most reach out of the bike without being ridiculous. I’m a bit over 188cm or 6’2” on an S3. It’s the shortest bike I’ve ever owned but with this setup it feels great.
jcmonty
E*POWAH Master
Nice! Yeah I am 6’1 on an s3. Feels pretty good with 170mm and spacers under the stem but I have wondered about trying a longer stem or reach adjust . Gtk it works!
Hi All, I'm new to the forums. I've seen a lot of discussion about the weight and I'm curious about everyone's reason for the concern?
I'm 145lbs geared, not exactly strong, nor do I regularly workout at gym etc, sit at a computer all day for work. As a former weight weenie I get the concern of a heavy bike, but after a month and about 200 miles of riding (enduro trails like Kanuga, jumps etc), I can't find many downsides to a 54lb Druid CorE, actually the opposite.
Comparing it to my previous bike, an analog Deviate Highlander which was about 35lbs, both about 160/150 travel, same fork and shock, and general setup, the Druid is just better in every way and I believe the extra 18+ lbs is helping that. The Druid is smoother over fast rocky/chunky terrain - it doesn't ping around as much and get thrown off line - I don't have to muscle it around as much, it carries momentum better, It jumps better - I don't have to push as hard into jumps or pull up the bars up as much to get same result, in the air the weight doesn't seem to affect my ability to whip or move the bike around, nor am I more sore after a 5-6hr ride or long weekend. The weight is a non-issue leaning in turns, and the Druid feels better for that likely b/c it's a MX setup vs full 29er on the Highlander, and obviously it's a non-issue for climbing b/c it has a motor! The suspension seems to work better, both my hands and feet feel better after long rides. So I can't really find a downside, only positives out on the trails. It's yet to be seen how annoying it might get for lift parks and shuttles, but that seems like a small price to pay for such goodness.
agree with all of this.I would suggest trying out the druid lite now and report back. I think you'll be surprised.I can't find many downsides to a 54lb Druid CorE, actually the opposite.
.
Nobody is saying the core is not great, but it's even better when lighter. Truly a pity the core wasn't offered with a 600wh.
And as a former claymore owner, the deviate vs forbidden performance comparison isn't really fair. Even in highlander to druid acoustic, you'd have been blown away.
Mike29
New Member
Local bike shop I picked my core up from said DJI are discontinuing the 600w at the end of this year so will have to get the lites whilst you can!
sethimus
😠 Donald Duck 😠
what about the one rumor that claimed the new bigger battery will be the size of current 800wh, could that mean that there will be a bigger battery in the size of the current 600wh?
Mike29
New Member
I’ve also heard about the 1000w battery same size as the 800w also from a sponsored rider for Amflow. Can only hope, half tempted to pull the trigger on the fast charger to get a top up at lunch time as it’s just not enough for occasional bigger days
Highland Wheels
Well-known member
Would be nice. Or the bigger one that'd coming is the same size as the current 600
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