Shimano EP8 stops working while riding - no fault in log?

[a_double]

I have the E Tube app and PCE device but don't see an option to change the destination. Is it buried in the app somewhere not obvious?

 

[Backflip]

My EP801 was swapped but the assist limit is set to 25km/h

What are my options for setting the limit to 32km/h and changing the wheel circumference?

There are 2 choices:
There is the long version: Send the drive unit back and try to get a correct configured one.
Or there is the short and fast version: Contact the guys from eMax-Tuning and they will help you.

Cannot be done

For sure, the wheel circumference can be programmed (in the absolute "official" way) with a cable bound PCE - interface, the Windows based miniMax - program and a bike related eMax-Tuning licence key, see in chapter 12.2 of this document (you just need to get the "hidden sequence" for doing this from eMax-Tuning).

 

[Winford]

the wheel circumference

I know marcus. In context I meant you cannot change wheel circumference to make any gains. If your going to mess with speed limits, yes you use minimax

 

[Winford]

Canyon spectral on CF8. feels like it dropped power 2 weeks ago about 20%. then I got the new battery and that increased power 10% so now bike feels underpowered by 10% which may be weaker batteries that came with recall, or my motor is starting to take a dive

Was more like 30% power. Today put it in walk mode and it would not move but made a grinding noise and you can hear the motor spinning. So motor is toast

 

[Backflip]

Was more like 30% power. Today put it in walk mode and it would not move but made a grinding noise and you can hear the motor spinning. So motor is toast

This situation sounds like a mechanical problem inside the drive unit. If you are still within warranty time of 2 years (or slightly over this time period), most probably you will get a new drive unit from Shimano free of charge. However, please reset all settings done by eMax with the related tools, create a service report with the E-Tube-Project-Professional software and send this to the guys from eMax, so that they can double-check if the drive unit is in perfectly traceless state. In this way you will not get any problems when claiming a warranty issue.

 

[Backflip]

BTW.: Problems like described in this thread are almost always related to bad contacts or weak wirings of the cabling harness between battery and drive unit. Sometimes dirt or humidity will lead to corrosion and leakage currents of the contacts (e.g. at the battery or the related counterpart inside the bike frame), sometimes also vibrations while bike riding will widen the contacts of the battery and so force sporadic shutdowns of the bike. Very often the contacts of the main connector of the drive unit has some issues inside too due to e.g. cleanings with high pressure water cleaners or a strong garden hose (which should be avoided all the times). Sometimes a cable of the cabling harness was squeezed when mouning the drive unit to the bike frame, because space between drive unit and frame is very limited on some bikes.
Reading these posts maybe may help too, because it is very common the get some annoying E914 (E914100) and/or E201 (E201002) errors in such situations.

 

[Winford]

most probably you will get a new drive unit

This is second motor, never set to class 3, I used the program for electronic shifting

pretty piss poor 3600 miles of problems on second motor before failure.

First motor was 1600

 

[Backflip]

This is second motor, never set to class 3, I used the program for electronic shifting

pretty piss poor 3600 miles of problems on second motor before failure.

First motor was 1600

I agree, this low mileage is disappointing...

 

[Winford]

I agree, this low mileage is disappointing...

They replaced first motor as a blind guess to the shutting down while riding problem, problem still existed after motor swap. I ride hard and drain a 900w battery almost everyday for 14 months, as fast as these bikes can go.

But yes disappointing does not begin to address 12 months of constant problems with a Shimano motor/battery combination. Not ready for prime time

 

[Backflip]

They replaced first motor as a blind guess to the shutting down while riding problem, problem still existed after motor swap. I ride hard and drain a 900w battery almost everyday for 14 months, as fast as these bikes can go.

But yes disappointing does not begin to address 12 months of constant problems with a Shimano motor/battery combination. Not ready for prime time

Yes, that is definitely dissappointing and I can feel your anger.
It is also a shame that most dealers and even the bike manufacturers or Shimano absolutely ignore that shutting down issues normally are not addressed to the drive unit but to cabling and contact issues and just swap parts (one after the other, mostly drive unit, then battery and finally the complete cabing harness which then mostly in the end will solve the problem). Normally Shimano is willing to change drive units free of charge in such situation, which is fine on one side, but if it does not solve the problem, then this is not the way it should be.
I always suggest and advise to anybody with such "sporadic shutting down issues" or non power up problems to take a huge amount of patience, effort and time and dig very deep into the cabling and try to find the issue by yourself. Mostly it´s worth the effort and you will find the culprit. Just watch the many E914 stories in this forum too (very often e.g. the battery is not properly fixed and so creates contact problems).

 

[Winford]

then battery

they never did battery because the bike was on a stop riding order from canyon, due to a battery recall.

find the issue by yourself

They cannot.

I am as good as a mechanic as they come. The problem lies in the electronic board that controls the battery. Provided motor and cable are new.

Cables replaced, motor replaced, battery replaced, and it still shut off last night after 38 miles and 4200' of climbing.

So I used to see a symptom of washing the bike and shutting off, quit washing bike, and I had a few months of trouble free riding.

Put a new battery cable and id get 2 weeks of trouble free riding

Many times when it shuts down like last night the battery is throwing shimano codes with leds flashing which is the overload protection. But that is not always the shut down cause.

So one problem anywhere and it compounds into the other parts because the whole system is so sensitive.

 

[Backflip]

they never did battery because the bike was on a stop riding order from canyon, due to a battery recall.


They cannot.

I am as good as a mechanic as they come. The problem lies in the electronic board that controls the battery. Provided motor and cable are new.

Cables replaced, motor replaced, battery replaced, and it still shut off last night after 38 miles and 4200' of climbing.

So I used to see a symptom of washing the bike and shutting off, quit washing bike, and I had a few months of trouble free riding.

Put a new battery cable and id get 2 weeks of trouble free riding

Many times when it shuts down like last night the battery is throwing shimano codes with leds flashing which is the overload protection. But that is not always the shut down cause.

So one problem anywhere and it compounds into the other parts because the whole system is so sensitive.

Sorry, I didn´t realize that you are one of the guys who are affected by the CANYON battery fiasco. This is a real horrible situation for CANYON and for sure especially for all of the users of their bikes. I feel sorry also a bit for CANYON, but I don´t agree that they have done their best. I think they should have done better and faster.
And, yes, the whole Shimano STePS system is extremely sensitive (especially to humidity and micro leakages, causes by this humidity, dirt and corrosion of contacts and cabling).

 

[Winford]

I think they should have done better and faster.

Im not sure...... Trendpower and shimano screwed up. Leaving Canyon to have thousands of batteries to have made that did not exist. They had pissed off customers and were put in a bad spot as we all were. Not sure how they could have done it differently. I never even looked at new battery to see if trendpower made the replacement battery. But Canyon was at the mercy of the battery manufacturer, I doubt they waited when they could have shipped.

Not sticking up for them, just how I see it. They should have had all bikes returned and refunded people

extremely sensitive

Its weird my buddy washes his bike never had an issue until, like mine, after 1000 miles ish they start shutting off mid ride usually coasting down hills after 1500 of climbing. Mine did that religiously

 

[Backflip]

Im not sure...... Trendpower and shimano screwed up.

I only partially agree and I think CANYON should never have ordered and let develop a plastic casing for their batteries from TrendPower/SIMPLO. However, maybe it is not fair from me to give statements like this after the big issue happened.
I always use batteries with an aluminum housing (this gives me a much better feeling especially related to "fire resistance" and not just the broken plastics like in the case of CANYON currently) from DARFON and I am very happy with these batteries.
But as always: Sometimes you have luck, sometimes you don´t and you never know in advance.
I am crossing fingers that your bike will be fine soon (finally).

 

[Winford]

never have ordered

The vast majority had no issues, but a few did from weak plastic used in the trendpower factory. Shimano demanded good parts. Trendpower let the ball drop on their end with substandard plastic. Wrong temperature on a plastic batch and all those batteries that day will be weak, while the rest normal.

I did not miss a day of riding, and was credited over 500 bucks and have 2 batteries now. Same for 7 friends who never had an battery issue.

Wish the bike was reliable, and that is all Shimano problems

 

[Trickfox]

so there are two things happening. The battery has thermal protection, so when this triggers it shuts off while climbing, and sometimes it takes a few minutes or ten minutes to power back on.

So how you can tell-------- unplug the battery cable off the bike, and you should see two leds lit up. top and bottom and one is blinking. That is an error code the battery is spitting out.

A new cable will fix it, for two weeks, the cable is not the problem, but it has less resistance than an older cable so it mirrors a fix, but the real problem are the batteries and the Shimano electronic board/computer built in the battery.

The second part is the shutting off coasting which is what you get after a new battery cable is installed. Cleaning the cable where it attaches to the motor helps lower resistance, for a few rides using rubbing alcohol. No codes will be present on battery if you check for

I have a Canyon Spectral:ON CF8 with EP801 motor.

The most common issue I have is the random cutouts while coasting. 've had the motor replaced twice, and harness once.
@Winford, mentioned cleaning the harness terminals. Any idea if the main issue is at the battery end, or at the motor end? Also, anyone have any tips on cleaning the harness terminals? I used contact cleaner on a toothbrush, but I'm thinking maybe a small wire brush?

Thanks to everyone for posting in this thread. After dealing with this for over a year, this thread feels like a support group

 

[patdam]

I have a Canyon Spectral:ON CF8 with EP801 motor.

The most common issue I have is the random cutouts while coasting. 've had the motor replaced twice, and harness once.
@Winford, mentioned cleaning the harness terminals. Any idea if the main issue is at the battery end, or at the motor end? Also, anyone have any tips on cleaning the harness terminals? I used contact cleaner on a toothbrush, but I'm thinking maybe a small wire brush?

Thanks to everyone for posting in this thread. After dealing with this for over a year, this thread feels like a support group

"but I'm thinking maybe a small wire brush?" wire brush on battery contacts ?

 

[Winford]

After dealing with this for over a year

Drives me crazy

Trying to KOM a 9 mile intensive trail, and you kicked your ass trying to even get in the top 10, and at mile 8 the bike shuts off! was like 4 sec shy afterwards of the 10th spot.

Took me 3 tries to get a full run in, on a 3 mile section, because it shut off so many times when pushing.

 

[Backflip]

Also, anyone have any tips on cleaning the harness terminals? I used contact cleaner on a toothbrush, but I'm thinking maybe a small wire brush?

You can try to follow some guys in the German Pedelecforum regarding the question on what is best for cleaning the contacts, see e.g. here.
And "yes", take care with a wire brush on battery terminals (even if they normally don´t provide a voltage in non-used situations, you can force such a short power output by pressing the battery switch which may then damage the battery if you will create a shortcut on the power rails with a wire brush...)

 

[Trickfox]

"but I'm thinking maybe a small wire brush?" wire brush on battery contacts ?

I was thinking on the harness, not the battery. Just guessing there's a layer of corrosion building up, so trying to figure out best way to get rid of it.

 

[Trickfox]

Drives me crazy

Trying to KOM a 9 mile intensive trail, and you kicked your ass trying to even get in the top 10, and at mile 8 the bike shuts off! was like 4 sec shy afterwards of the 10th spot.

Took me 3 tries to get a full run in, on a 3 mile section, because it shut off so many times when pushing.

Yep. I'd like to do some enduro races, but getting a cutout mid run would suck.

 

[Trickfox]

You can try to follow some guys in the German Pedelecforum regarding the question on what is best for cleaning the contacts, see e.g. here.
And "yes", take care with a wire brush on battery terminals (even if they normally don´t provide a voltage in non-used situations, you can force such a short power output by pressing the battery switch which may then damage the battery if you will create a shortcut on the power rails with a wire brush...)

Great, thanks for the link!

 

[Winford]

"but I'm thinking maybe a small wire brush?

we appreciate any help. But these are carbon looking poles in the motor you dont want to damage. Cleaning with contact cleaner or rubbing alcohol helps, but the contact point is not the problem area.

There is thermal protection on battery and motor, sometimes they get tripped.

The bike is not shutting off under load, most of the time. And the system is so sensitive, that one problem will show up in different areas. I have had battery motor and cable replaced. Generally replacing motor or cable results in 2 weeks of clean operation, then it starts acting up again. Replaced battery and it has really cleaned up the problem, then motor fell apart before I could see ho wlong that lasted.

Thing is we 7 Spectrals all our friends ride, and those who ride a lot. have had this problem.

 

[Winford]

Great, thanks for the link!

wont help, I know those guys really well. But it is a great resource for information on this motor. probably as good as it gets

 

[Winford]

Just guessing there's a layer of corrosion building up,

Nope. No corrosion or dirt at all. Its just so sensitive cleaning residue from the contacts making contact, makes a difference sometimes.

The contacts always look like brand new.

The batter has a built in computer, it is in this electronic board where the faults lie. Its why it shuts off coasting, not under load. But 1 out of 20 shut downs might be under load. It just happens much less.

 

[Backflip]

we appreciate any help. But these are carbon looking poles in the motor you dont want to damage. Cleaning with contact cleaner or rubbing alcohol helps, but the contact point is not the problem area.

There is thermal protection on battery and motor, sometimes they get tripped.

The bike is not shutting off under load, most of the time. And the system is so sensitive, that one problem will show up in different areas. I have had battery motor and cable replaced. Generally replacing motor or cable results in 2 weeks of clean operation, then it starts acting up again. Replaced battery and it has really cleaned up the problem, then motor fell apart before I could see ho wlong that lasted.

Thing is we 7 Spectrals all our friends ride, and those who ride a lot. have had this problem.

The "contact point" may definitely also be one of the (many) culprit for these situations!
Maybe check this German forum post of a CANYON biker and the related following ones where a new cable between battery and drive unit (with the Rosenberger plug) solved the issue. Maybe you should get a pile of these cables (seriously)?

 

[Trickfox]

we appreciate any help. But these are carbon looking poles in the motor you dont want to damage. Cleaning with contact cleaner or rubbing alcohol helps, but the contact point is not the problem area.

There is thermal protection on battery and motor, sometimes they get tripped.

The bike is not shutting off under load, most of the time. And the system is so sensitive, that one problem will show up in different areas. I have had battery motor and cable replaced. Generally replacing motor or cable results in 2 weeks of clean operation, then it starts acting up again. Replaced battery and it has really cleaned up the problem, then motor fell apart before I could see ho wlong that lasted.

Thing is we 7 Spectrals all our friends ride, and those who ride a lot. have had this problem.

Ah, guess I'll stick with contact cleaner.

I have the 720 battery since mine is the size small. I've been hoping the new battery helps (like maybe they updated the communication components or firmware), but I won't be getting a new battery until at least September.

 

[Trickfox]

Nope. No corrosion or dirt at all. Its just so sensitive cleaning residue from the contacts making contact, makes a difference sometimes.

The contacts always look like brand new.

The batter has a built in computer, it is in this electronic board where the faults lie. Its why it shuts off coasting, not under load. But 1 out of 20 shut downs might be under load. It just happens much less.

Glad you said it. I've been thinking the same thing. The battery is "talking" to the motor and visa versa, and it seems obvious that's where the issue lies.

 

[Trickfox]

The "contact point" may definitely also be one of the (many) culprit for these situations!
Maybe check this German forum post of a CANYON biker and the related following ones where a new cable between battery and drive unit (with the Rosenberger plug) solved the issue. Maybe you should get a pile of these cables (seriously)?

I'm about to take my bike to the LBS again to see if they can get a replacement harness from Shimano again. My cutouts seem to be getting worse lately, even after cleaning the contacts.

 

[Winford]

you should get a pile of these cables

Had 3 replaced already, it helps for a few weeks that it.

Its not the problem, as much as the design itself. Meaning the electrical connection at the motor itself, is not a good one.

But the problem shows up in the battery, so a Shimano battery when it shuts down will throw error codes, many times it is the battery itself that is shutting power off, indicated by such codes.

I know all those people very well you suggested and its a great resource, and it was a great suggestion of your part. Marcus has been very helpful.

This system is so finicky, if you wash your bike. that will start random shut offs. They are not even water resistant