Rail (750Wh) Why does an EBIKE have no ...........

Richiefromboston

Richiefromboston

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CLutch built in?? I mean seriously if the battery power fails, why is there no disengage so you can simply use your 10K 12 speed as such? Ever try to pedal when the bike either runs out of juice or with Trek one if its many "errors" that pop and disable the bike. I really wondering why this even a thing. Help me understand. thanks
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I think there is a difference between selecting "off" using the mode switch, and turning the system off ( at least on some bikes). If selecting "off" on the mode switch merely reduces motor assistance to zero, the bike CAN is still powered and for the motor to be able to seen by the controller on the CAN it must still be recieving power from the battery. If the bikes system is switched off the battery is not switched on....so the motor has no electrical connection.
 
Richiefromboston said:
CLutch built in?? I mean seriously if the battery power fails, why is there no disengage so you can simply use your 10K 12 speed as such? Ever try to pedal when the bike either runs out of juice or with Trek one if its many "errors" that pop and disable the bike. I really wondering why this even a thing. Help me understand. thanks View attachment 160659View attachment 160660View attachment 160661View attachment 160662
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Maybe if you didn't have 155mm cranks it would be easier to pedal!
 
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My 2023 Orbea Rise has zero resistance when switched off. I sometimes ride it locally without turning it on for a short workout, just feels like a heavy manual bike.
 
I’ve ridden my YT Decoy MX with the motor off when riding on the flat with my kids. I just didn’t see much point in Turing it on until it was time to push them up the hills. The only thing that made be struggle was the fact it weighed a ton
 
TimC7 said:
My 2023 Orbea Rise has zero resistance when switched off. I sometimes ride it locally without turning it on for a short workout, just feels like a heavy manual bike.
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Me too often with the Rail (Bosch CX Gen 4) if it's level and no headwind.
 
Richiefromboston said:
you cant simply pedal your pedaling through either powerless motor or through a error riddled motor both of them are NFG
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Uhhh yes you can. It’s just varying degrees of unpleasant depending on which motor system you have. Both of mine pedal fine with the motor off, I quite often do it on the KSL for XC days.
 
Richiefromboston said:
CLutch built in?? I mean seriously if the battery power fails, why is there no disengage so you can simply use your 10K 12 speed as such? Ever try to pedal when the bike either runs out of juice or with Trek one if its many "errors" that pop and disable the bike. I really wondering why this even a thing. Help me understand. thanks View attachment 160659View attachment 160660View attachment 160661View attachment 160662
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Hi, unsure what you mean by 'many Trek errors'.
The motor in my Trek Rail (2023 model) is a Bosch and as such it is the Bosch Flow software that' glitches' to produce errors... although the number of times it has done that in the 9061 kilometres (5663 miles) I have travelled I could count on one hand... If I could remember even one.
I can pull the battery out of the bike and it only gets easier to ride because of the weight reduction. Of course this means the software isnt logging power, speed, cadence etc so that is pretty boring. If your machine is regularly throwing up errors and your pedaling is driving the motor then it sounds like there is a problem in the Bosch motor.
 
Richiefromboston said:
really?? never thought of that. was really hoping for answer here. Lets just wrap this thread up.
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What you are referring to as a clutch as far as our motors are concerned is in fact a sprag/one way bearing. It operates in a similar fashion as the freehub in your back wheel. Since it only operates in one direction it delivers motor output to the cranks.........the cranks cannot however drive the electric motro since that baring operates in one direction only ( same as the freewheel operation of freehub). The motor design is however not simply a one way bearing connection between the motor and cranks since in order to control power delivery the main crankshaft in the motor also carries the torque sensor.
With the bike system switched off you are still having to drive the main crankshaft of the engine and if the bearings and/or torque sensor is knackered you will feel quite a bot of extra drag. Add to that the weight of the bike compared to one with no motor/battery, knobbly tyres, may be soft tyre compound and low tyre pressures all of which cause extra drag. If however you feel the motor is faulty, you should take it a dealer to be checked over.
 
There minimal resistance in the motor, prove it to yourself by taking the chain off and turn the pedals with your hand (with the motor switched off, or in no assist mode or with the battery removed), you'll find there's only slightly more resistance than you get if you do the same with a regular pedal bike.

What you're feeling when you ride with no assist is what it feels like to pedal a full sus mtb that weighs ~25kg.

If you do feel a significant amount of resistance turning the pedals by hand with no chain, then your motor has a fault - probably with the one way clutch or the bearings or both
 
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When I first got my Giant Elite, I would turn it off on gentle terrain when riding with my lovely bride. No problem. Now, I have a Nebo. In both cases, I've found that riding with the power on, but not applied to the motor, and power completely off are pretty much the same.
No resistance. There are bikes where I expect that's not the case, but I don't think it's much of a problem with newer systems.
 
Mteam said:
There minimal resistance in the motor, prove it to yourself by taking the chain off and turn the pedals with your hand (with the motor switched off, or in no assist mode or with the battery removed), you'll find there's only slightly more resistance than you get if you do the same with a regular pedal bike.

What you're feeling when you ride with no assist is what it feels like to pedal a full sus mtb that weighs ~25kg.

If you do feel a significant amount of resistance turning the pedals by hand with no chain, then your motor has a fault - probably with the one way clutch or the bearings or both
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My Bold, but if anybody is old enough to have owned and ridden a Raleigh Grifter as a kid, they’ll know all about pedalling a heavy bike…

It was actually easier to try and pedal a farm gate.
 
Tooks said:
My Bold, but if anybody is old enough to have owned and ridden a Raleigh Grifter as a kid, they’ll know all about pedalling a heavy bike…

It was actually easier to try and pedal a farm gate.
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I think that bike came out 15 years or so after my folks got me a Schwinn Stingray in the early 1960's!
 
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