Speed limit petition

[Flatslide]

Here in New Zealand the e-bikes are limited to 32kph which is 19.8839mph

We also have the 45km/h speed pedelecs available. Under NZ law, e-bikes are limited to 300W nominal output. If the bike is capable of more than 50km/h assisted it is automatically classed as a motorcycle under existing legislation. Power between 300W - 2kW automatically becomes a moped and is covered by existing legislation. Not that anyone is policing it really.

 

[Am Mtn Bike Riders]

A reaction from across the pond. Any mention of higher speed for eMTBs here would be harmful to us. Don't remember who above said no access problems here. We have nothing but access problems. For example barred completely from the 2 largest systems of trails on all federal lands, the US Forest Service and Bureau of Land Management. all those great BLM desert trails, closed almost completely to eMTBs. BLM is just starting to be open to proposing eMTB access, but it will take environmental reviews, very likely contested by the same crowd of organizations for hikers, horse-riders and conservationists that still oppose all MTB access. A quick glance of the comments they file will tell you that the 1st thing they mention is SPEED of eMTBs. Not actual speed on ST terrain. To them a restriction of 20mph means that a eMTB goes 20 mph in most situations, uphill or over technical terrain, where most of us know that eMTBs don't go much faster than other MTBs. Me, I'd lower the cut-off on the power assist. in the US, eMTB access is an all uphill battle, and we are only starting up the hill.

 

[Tedgar]

Anyone who races or knows people who race mtb would never make these arguments as they know that even an armature racer on a regular bike will run off and leave the average ebike rider. All my mtb buddies who really ride are very ebike friendly. I think this ebike hate in the US comes from newbs who can not afford them. Who knows?

 

[johnf0246]

A reaction from across the pond. Any mention of higher speed for eMTBs here would be harmful to us. Don't remember who above said no access problems here. We have nothing but access problems. For example barred completely from the 2 largest systems of trails on all federal lands, the US Forest Service and Bureau of Land Management. all those great BLM desert trails, closed almost completely to eMTBs. BLM is just starting to be open to proposing eMTB access, but it will take environmental reviews, very likely contested by the same crowd of organizations for hikers, horse-riders and conservationists that still oppose all MTB access. A quick glance of the comments they file will tell you that the 1st thing they mention is SPEED of eMTBs. Not actual speed on ST terrain. To them a restriction of 20mph means that a eMTB goes 20 mph in most situations, uphill or over technical terrain, where most of us know that eMTBs don't go much faster than other MTBs. Me, I'd lower the cut-off on the power assist. in the US, eMTB access is an all uphill battle, and we are only starting up the hill.

Am: my understanding is that Ebikes are allowed on all BLM non motorized trails in the USA, unless the head ranger limits their use in his or her district. One of the most popular BLM areas in the US is Moab. As of two months ago not one Ebike citation had been issued on all Moab BLM trails.

Give them a call and see how many citations have been issued in the Moab District. Lake Tahoe has recently opened to Ebikes and Park City has opened all its non motorized trails to Ebikes for people 65 or older. The acceptance of Ebikes is certainly growing in the US on Federal BLM land. Many State, County and City trails are Ebike friendly.

 

[lightning]

Well, l very rarely see emtb's tearing past me when l am out on my regular mountain bike. They do overtake, but not at a speed that would be seen as excessive.
lt may be the 15.5mph limit or it may be that that they are all at the trail centres.

Many emtb's here seem to be ridden by newcomers or older riders and they don't seem to ride that fast.

When l have seen groups of younger riders on emtb's they always seem to be riding at sensible speeds.

lt's the off road motorcycles that are an issue here, they are always ridden badly and with no regards to other trail users.

 

[Bravestarr]

Don’t know why you want to change things.If you need to go uphill at more than 15 mph ,go get a proper motorcycle,and if you can‘t pedal faster than 15 mph downhill with your motor switched off you need to get bigger balls,simples.

Not quite as simples as your trite response though.....
For most people the issue is likely to be whilst riding on the road on the way to the trails.

 

[lightning]

Exactly.

On the trails 15mph is fine, on the road it's a pain.
Unfortunately if the bike will assist up to 20mph that's the speed they will get ridden on the trails and that is where the problems start.

Having said all that, you don't need motor assist to achieve (and exceed) 20mph when going downhill off road, or on the flat for some riders.

 

[lightning]

Most road bike riders ride faster than 20mph unless they are going uphill and they don't seem to encounter any issues, only when they jump red lights or don't give way.

 

[Slowroller]

Am: my understanding is that Ebikes are allowed on all BLM non motorized trails in the USA, unless the head ranger limits their use in his or her district. One of the most popular BLM areas in the US is Moab. As of two months ago not one Ebike citation had been issued on all Moab BLM trails.

Give them a call and see how many citations have been issued in the Moab District. Lake Tahoe has recently opened to Ebikes and Park City has opened all its non motorized trails to Ebikes for people 65 or older. The acceptance of Ebikes is certainly growing in the US on Federal BLM land. Many State, County and City trails are Ebike friendly.

You have it backwards, ebikes are legal on BLM non motorized trails only if the local district authorizes them. They aren't legal on non motorized in Moab regardless of how many tickets you know of being handed out or not. You can certainly make the argument that no one is handing out tickets, so who cares?

E-bikes on public lands | Bureau of Land Management

www.blm.gov

My guess is that with the new administration, incoming lawsuits will gum up the works for years on federal land. The real battle for access is only just beginning.

Suit to Bar E-Bikes from Park Trails Gets Greenlight - PEER.org

A lawsuit challenging the Trump administration’s approval of electronic bicycles anywhere in the National Park System where traditional human-pedaled bicycles are allowed has survived dismissal and will now be heard in full.

www.peer.org

 

[johnf0246]

You have it backwards, ebikes are legal on BLM non motorized trails only if the local district authorizes them. They aren't legal on non motorized in Moab regardless of how many tickets you know of being handed out or not. You can certainly make the argument that no one is handing out tickets, so who cares?

E-bikes on public lands | Bureau of Land Management

www.blm.gov

My guess is that with the new administration, incoming lawsuits will gum up the works for years on federal land. The real battle for access is only just beginning.

Suit to Bar E-Bikes from Park Trails Gets Greenlight - PEER.org

A lawsuit challenging the Trump administration’s approval of electronic bicycles anywhere in the National Park System where traditional human-pedaled bicycles are allowed has survived dismissal and will now be heard in full.

www.peer.org

Slowroller: So thousands of Ebikes are being ridden in Moab each year and the local BLM has decided to not ticket Ebikes on BLM trails in the Moab area. Why do you think they have decided not to ticket Ebike there?

It’s pretty obvious that rather than argue with the local Ebike haters they will just work on much higher priority issues. They realize Ebikes will be allowed in Moab in the future, so they have decided to not waste time on ticketing Ebikers for riding on the vast non-motorized trail system.

As far as the BLM allowing Ebikes in National Parks that sounds like a great idea also. The intent is to allow more people to get out and recreate on public lands which improves people’s lives immensely.

 

[Am Mtn Bike Riders]

Am: my understanding is that Ebikes are allowed on all BLM non motorized trails in the USA, unless the head ranger limits their use in his or her district. One of the most popular BLM areas in the US is Moab. As of two months ago not one Ebike citation had been issued on all Moab BLM trails.

Give them a call and see how many citations have been issued in the Moab District. Lake Tahoe has recently opened to Ebikes and Park City has opened all its non motorized trails to Ebikes for people 65 or older. The acceptance of Ebikes is certainly growing in the US on Federal BLM land. Many State, County and City trails are Ebike friendly.

John, I genuinely wish you were right. The BLM rule is that an eMTB is a motorcycle and banned from non-motorized trails UNLESS, the local BLM office proposes to make a trail or are eMTB accessible and does so after an environmental assessment. This is as of 12/2021. New trails or areas have not yet been proposed.
In the Lake Tahoe the US Forest Supervisor opened 200 miles of non-motorized trails to eMTBs, and the Washington office reversed him. No trails open to eMTB. As of today, all USFS non-motorized trails are closed to eMTBs.
I ride mostly USFS trails and local rangers strictly enforce any encroachment on mtn bike-hiking trails by eMTBs.
In gen., its the most experienced MTB riders that are hostile to eMTB. A study by the bike industry (People for Bikes) found that 1) mountain bike riders were more hostile to eMTBs than other users, and 2) advocates for mountain bikes, such as IMBA members, were the most hostile. It's ironic, b/c both eMTBs and MTBs face the same opposition to access and should be working together.
Fortunately, as you said, most states and counties in US are much more open to eMTB access. There are many successes at the local level.

 

[johnf0246]

John, I genuinely wish you were right. The BLM rule is that an eMTB is a motorcycle and banned from non-motorized trails UNLESS, the local BLM office proposes to make a trail or are eMTB accessible and does so after an environmental assessment. This is as of 12/2021. New trails or areas have not yet been proposed.
In the Lake Tahoe the US Forest Supervisor opened 200 miles of non-motorized trails to eMTBs, and the Washington office reversed him. No trails open to eMTB. As of today, all USFS non-motorized trails are closed to eMTBs.
I ride mostly USFS trails and local rangers strictly enforce any encroachment on mtn bike-hiking trails by eMTBs.
In gen., its the most experienced MTB riders that are hostile to eMTB. A study by the bike industry (People for Bikes) found that 1) mountain bike riders were more hostile to eMTBs than other users, and 2) advocates for mountain bikes, such as IMBA members, were the most hostile. It's ironic, b/c both eMTBs and MTBs face the same opposition to access and should be working together.
Fortunately, as you said, most states and counties in US are much more open to eMTB access. There are many successes at the local level.

Am:

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What is 12/21?