Riding position pain

[dobbyhasfriends]

when im riding in the 'attack position' generally im ok, I make sure im in line with the bottom bracket etc and is second nature now but when im on the really steep stuff or twisty steep wooded rooty sections I always get really bad pain in my trailing thigh. my forward (right) leg I have no problems with at all but the left thigh starts to hurt pretty quickly and feels like cramp.
I thought I would get rid of it just by paying more attention to my riding position but of course when things are steeper, you hang off the back more and I think this is causing it.
anyone had similar and solved the problem?

 

[Zimmerframe]

Flats or clips ?

Are you getting your heels down ?

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

Flats or clips ?

Are you getting your heels down ?

flats, heels down!
in fact the more I get my heels down, the worse the pain.. but I dont wanna NOT have my heels down

 

[slippery pete]

my forward (right) leg I have no problems with at all but the left thigh starts to hurt pretty quickly and feels like cramp.
I thought I would get rid of it just by paying more attention to my riding position but of course when things are steeper, you hang off the back more and I think this is causing it.

Usually with these things it is about a number of small things rather than one big factor.

#1 When you can, stand up tall

Attack position is a tough place to be for sustained periods. When you need grip and shock absorption, by all means get low; bend at the hips / knees / elbows etc. When you can though, stand up tall; it lets all the muscles relax.

#2 Do you really need to "hang off the back"?

"Hanging off the back" can mean different things to different people. "Heavy feet, light hands" is a description I prefer. When the bike is pointing downhill you can stay above the centre of the bike and stay good and relaxed. The bike moves under you so it might well meet somebody's idea of "hanging off the back" but it is key that you stay in a position where your elbows still have range of motion. If you can bend at the waist and stay low and relaxed through the hips and shoulders you will have excellent control.

#3 Be dynamic

When you try to hold yourself in a static position it is tough on the muscles. It can be a function of being relaxed or it can be a function of consciously making the effort, but getting to extend those tight muscles in micro movements throughout your descent will give those tight muscles a chance to ease up. On shallower trails this can take the form of pumping the trail / anticipating the bigger hits. On the steeper stuff it does get more challenging to keep loose but there's nothing for it but to keep practicing and make those tense situations more normal - your brain will do the rest.

#4 Relax

I think all my points have mentioned this but it is a topic in itself. Your musculature is an interconnected chain of systems. Gripping too tightly on the bars goes up through your wrists / forearms / elbows / shoulders and that can transfer to your hips and lower body. You've only got four contact points with your bike, so pay attention to them. It can be as simple as adjusting your brake levers or some other cockpit adjustment but if you can eliminate tension at source you'll have more capacity to handle the aggro the terrain is bringing to you.

 

[Zimmerframe]

Uhmmm ... I think you're going to get some stretching advice from @steve_sordy ...

Though it could be a lack of liquefied hops and barley in your diet ..

Do you get it other times, like when you're working and contorted for half an hour in some awkward position whilst trying not to blow torch your eye brows off ?

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

Usually with these things it is about a number of small things rather than one big factor.

definitely

#1 When you can, stand up

Attack position is a tough place to be for sustained periods. When you need grip and shock absorption, by all means get low; bend at the hips / knees / elbows etc. When you can though, stand up; it lets all the muscles relax.

yep doing that but I am guilty of often not hinging at the hips and going to lock out with my arms so ill keep an eye on that

#2 Do you really need to "hang off the back"?

yea deffo, I only really do this when the terrain is so steep that if you go straight down breaking, the tyres wont be able to grip its steep enough so that they slide. the sort of stuff where you may buzz your arse

#4 Relax

I think all my points have mentioned this but it is a topic in itself. Your musculature is an interconnected chain of systems. Gripping too tightly on the bars goes up through your wrists / forearms / elbows / shoulders and that can transfer to your hips and lower body. You've only got four contact points with your bike, so pay attention to them. It can be as simple as adjusting your brake levers or some other cockpit adjustment but if you can eliminate tension at source you'll have more capacity to handle the aggro the terrain is bringing to you.

this is probably it if im honest, I am usually relaxed but when it gets really scary I do tend to get tense.
I have seen a lot of the pro's using their knees and hips to soak up some crazy rolls/drops etc etc and I have been practising that.
I also have been riding more and more difficult stuff so this is the result I think.

ill just have to pay more attention

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

Is it happening climbing seated?
If so, is the saddle position too high? That might explain why it gets worse the more you extend the heel?
And it isn't uncommon for one leg to be shorter than the other, so extending more on that leg and pain manifests in that leg

no not at all mate, this is really only when I have the seat slammed and im descending

 

[steve_sordy]

Err, this may seem odd advice, but what happens when you lead with the other foot, so that your trailing leg is the one on the right.

Yes, I know, it will feel odd and a bit clunky; a bit like driving a left hand drive car when you are used to driving a right hand drive. But you soon get used to it.

If the pain still occurs on the trailing leg, but now its the other one. Then swap from time to time, now that you have a new skill!

 

[RustyIron]

I thought I would get rid of it just by paying more attention to my riding position but of course when things are steeper, you hang off the back more and I think this is causing it.

I think Pete had some good suggestions and touched upon "hanging off the back." Generally, you're best off with your weight more evenly distributed between the wheels. When you're far back, you loose traction on the front, and your arms can be too stretched to provide the control you might need. It's a double whammy, and the result is a rocket ship pointed straight downhill. But the question was regarding sore thighs. Thighs are big muscles. You're working them out and making them stronger. That's a good thing.

If it makes you feel any better, on a long downhill run, my calves are on fire, my forearms are pumped, and my shoulders are screaming. If there's opportunity, I might set my ass on the saddle for two seconds to rest. The other option would be to just slow down and take it easy. But what's the fun in that?

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

I think Pete had some good suggestions and touched upon "hanging off the back." Generally, you're best off with your weight more evenly distributed between the wheels. When you're far back, you loose traction on the front, and your arms can be too stretched to provide the control you might need. It's a double whammy, and the result is a rocket ship pointed straight downhill. But the question was regarding sore thighs. Thighs are big muscles. You're working them out and making them stronger. That's a good thing.

If it makes you feel any better, on a long downhill run, my calves are on fire, my forearms are pumped, and my shoulders are screaming. If there's opportunity, I might set my ass on the saddle for two seconds to rest. The other option would be to just slow down and take it easy. But what's the fun in that?

well I guess there are a lot of positives to take away from that then
I guess because of my job I am ok with upper body, I might ache a little the day after if ive been muscling it around a bit but I dont get arm pump, I managed to sort that one out on MX bikes and it works for mtb as well. calves are fine, shoulders are fine etc.
so yea, positives. I dont do a lot of 'leg work' in my job apart from walking up and down stairs a zillion times a day

 

[Mikerb]

I am curious why your trailing leg suffers the pain. I ride left foot forward so opposite to you but the majority of the effort is through my front foot with heel down. The rear leg is is a full 2 cranks length further back so unless you are really hanging over the rear axle it is really in no position to do anything other than maintain your balance side to side. So maybe in your effort to push forward with heel down on your rear leg it is actually in no position in relation to your hips ( ie it is behind them) to do so!!

 

[Zimmerframe]

I am curious why your trailing leg suffers the pain.

I think if he kept it on a pedal instead of dragging it along to keep his penis straight, he'd be in a lot less pain.

 

[Gary]

You're overthinking it. you're just not fit/strong enough.

ride more

 

[Zimmerframe]

You're overthinking it. you're just not fit/strong enough.

ride more

He is 97 years old and has a home gym he made from polystyrene off cuts.

 

[B1rdie]

honestly it’s just conditioning man.
the body takes time to adapt to the new stresses. You’re not 20 anymore so that means more time.
what I’ve been doing is riding goofy footed half and normal footed half. If you think riding switch footed is crazy it isn’t. @Zimmerframe is bi and he rides any way he can get it.

-ohh. Hopefully you’re not overthinking and think switch footed is left foot on right pedal. But if you do master that I’ll buy you a beer.
Seriously. Develop your back and hip muscles evenly and switch your stance. Just be sure to transition where it’s safe to pedal and not through some shit that’ll kill you.

Agree with switching foots.
biking is not like skating or surfing, there in not such thing as front and back foot, keep switching the feet all the time until it become natural.
watch slopstile crankworks to see how judges value riders that can trick both sides.

 

[Gary]

slopstile crankworks to see how judges value riders that can trick both sides.

Watch a little more closely next time and you'll see very few (pretty much none) of the worlds top slopestyle riders actually ever ride switch footed
True ambi-footed riders are an extremely rare breed.

 

[Gary]

Seriously. Develop your back and hip muscles evenly and switch your stance. Just be sure to transition where it’s safe to pedal and not through some shit that’ll kill you.

Seriously. Just ride more and you'll not need to "rest" your rear biased foot.
And if going fast is the reason you're trying to learn to ride switch it's totally not worth it. you'll never go faster than in your preferred dominant stance.
I had to learn to ride switch for a few years when recovering/re-building from a serious foot injury and because of this am now pretty close to truely ambi-footed. Infact I sometimes switch feet mid turn or mid jump into a turn and I'm so comfortable with it I sometimes don't even realise I've done it til the next turn. But now that my injury is less problematic, guess what? When confidence is needed for taking a shady line, launching a big jump or making rapid turn. my original dominant foot forward is always the better option.
No World Cup DH racers corner switch unless it's because of a mistake or an unforseen obsticle they've had to dodge.

 

[apac]

What size crank arms are you using? You may need shorter cranks so your legs/stance are not so wide apart when your pedals are level ... but I do agree that riding more will help.

 

[Zimmerframe]

What size crank arms are you using? You may need shorter cranks so your legs/stance are not so wide apart when your pedals are level ... but I do agree that riding more will help.

He's quite tall ...

Actually I'm assuming that, I only know his weight, so he must be quite tall ?

 

[apac]

He's quite tall ...

Actually I'm assuming that, I only know his weight, so he must be quite tall ?

I hope he is quite tall, or your comment could be quite an awkward one.?

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

I used to 6'2" but rugby and time made me 6'1(and a bit)
I used whatever crank arms came on the levo

I think @Gary is pretty much right, in my mind im still rugby fit but the last time I played was 2 years ago and the fitness is gone, I just keep forgetting it as im used to being fit, fairly strong and its just weird getting used to being old and unfit

 

[Gary]

with fatigue from riding dropping a little body weight helps tons too... probably more than you'd think.

 

[B1rdie]

Watch a little more closely next time and you'll see very few (pretty much none) of the worlds top slopestyle riders actually ever ride switch footed
True ambi-footed riders are an extremely rare breed.

I did not say the riders ride switchfooted.
The judges value triks done both ways because despite/besides being more difficult, they result in a cleaner, more aesthetical and capable ride.
Switching foot may be the solution for the problem described.
Riding more, simply, may not be the solution.
Riding more, may even make things worse, if not considering some scientific aspects.
I watch slopestyle to see the chics but do listen to the crew comments ….

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

with fatigue from riding dropping a little body weight helps tons too... probably more than you'd think.

been working on that, unfortunately the weight I lost as flab came back as muscle and I weigh exactly the same
I have also made quite a few changes to the front end of the bike to make standing more natural, I had it more setup for seated long rides but its shit when I stand then.
anyway, it allows me to be more relaxed and less compressed when standing..

 

[Gary]

You're right @B1rdie pulling tricks "opposite" or "fakie" has absolutely nothing to do with riding sawitch footed. it also has nothing to do with Dobbies current discomfort. and I've absolutely no idea why you even brought it up.

Riding more (if you don't actually ride all that often or regularly) will absolutely make you a stronger rider. even more so if you get off an Ebike and switch up your riding a little more. Whether it's a viable solution for everyone is clearly debatable.
There are very few of us on here at risk of overtraining or over exerting ourselves so stop kidding yourself it could be an issue..

I watch slopestyle to see the chics but do listen to the crew comments ….

Better still go outside and talk to chics. eventually you might even find one who'll listen

 

[Gary]

I have also made quite a few changes to the front end of the bike to make standing more natural, I had it more setup for seated long rides but its shit when I stand then.

I've always set up every mountainbike front end I've ever had for stood up riding. Seated position doesn't really matter greatly for control. just comfort and that (if you're reasonably flexible and strong) is just a case of having your saddle in a comfortable position.

 

[flash]

I had some pain when in the attack position for extended periods of time. Moving my foot forward on the pedal fixed it. Basically I was over stretching my calf and thigh muscles. Years of road riding had me with the ball of my foot over the axle of the pedal. It took a bit but being more central on the pedal helped me heaps. Too a bit of getting used to though.

Gordon

 

[Gary]

Oh... and I'm not talking about suddenly jolting yourself from one ride at the weekend to riding 40 miles every day. I'm talking about upping the regularity and duration of your rides gradually over time and resting well after particularly tiring rides. which incidently doesn't actually have to mean a complete day off the bike. That's where switching up bike disciplines is great.

 

[Jeff McD]

Hey dobby, Have you ever had a lower back injury? The pain you describe in that particular riding position could be due to compression of the left lumbar L4 nerve root as it exits the spine from a bulging disc or enlarged bone spur nudging up against the nerve root. The fact that dropping the heel increases the pain suggests this especially if it is slowly increasing with time. Mild L4 nerve root compression would cause a burning type of pain starting in the left lateral hip and radiating diagonally across the anterior thigh to just above the knee on the medial side with a sensation that the muscle is getting tight or about to cramp. Might be something to check out with your doc.

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

Oh... and I'm not talking about suddenly jolting yourself from one ride at the weekend to riding 40 miles every day. I'm talking about upping the regularity and duration of your rides gradually over time and resting well after particularly tiring rides. which incidently doesn't actually have to mean a complete day off the bike. That's where switching up bike disciplines is great.

I wish I could, for some reason the trades have exploded in my area and I have more work than I can cope with, ive been doing the kind of weeks what means even weekends im too tired to ride (yea even an ebike) and I simply spend the weekend recovering, im hoping im over the hump of that though..

interestingly I was watching the innsbruck DH on redbull earlier and Ben Cathro had a very short piece on riding position about not being a passenger over the back etc.. I dont do that much but I definitely do it when things get really steep and thats usually because im riding a trail that im not really skilled enough for.
I live near bike park wales so think im just gonna get some time in there