Shimano must have had like 80% of the market on eBikes 5 years ago, wonder what they have today on new eBike sales? 10%? It feels like they just gave up when Bosch came and took most of their sales and now with Avinox most people don't even mention Shimano anymore as they became totally irrelevant.
PinkBike Freak-Out on April 9th?
- Thread starter Larsey
- Start date
Yep, I don’t see any new emtb launching now with Shimano motors, I keep reading that Shimano have left the e-bike market now, but then I also read that they’re working on a new motor etc, albeit maybe focused on e-gravel and e-road stuff. Only Shimano know I suppose, but they’ll rock on at their own pace regardless.
The thing is, and I have a Shimano E8000 e-bike I still ride sometimes, they still work absolutely fine albeit they’re not the most powerful or feature packed, but as ever depends what bike they’re bolted to and what you’re doing with it. A new thing doesn’t stop an older thing working or being fit for purpose.
They still take the misery out of getting up hills though!
Yotaismygame
New Member
Right i have a marin with a e7000 and I really don't have complaints about the motor system. I have two 504wh batteries and its awesome. Power is just fine at 60nm/500w. But I also live in the PNW and basically just climb logging roads. I have ordered a new bike though but not because of the motor.
Shimano has never been known for rapid change. Instead, they have always focused on improvements and refinements in their products. Unfortunately Shimano decided to occupy the EMTB space where change has been happening very quickly. They got dropped by manufacturers because they don’t offer a competitive EMTB product compared to Bosch, Avinox, and Specialized. Now even Bosch is likely out by many manufacturers for 2026 because they believe sales partially depend on having an Avinox motor in your bike.
calnearlyebike
Member
lots of ppl will buy non Avinox motors as a lot of e-bikers rode bikes before the motor was a thing. Preferences towards brands, frame types , kinematics all out way an extra few watts on the climbs. This obsession with motos is a very ebike only rider thing. The lads i ride with on non motorised bikes , when discussing specific ebike we like , power output is hardly mentioned.
you miss the point entirely ... said so many times, this is not just about power but how it is delivered but also casing, overall integration and ultimately the weight.
You can say whatever you want but metrics shows clearly for emtb, first selector is motor then brand. We can like it or not and no, not a lot of people are buying full price historic brand this is absolutely false. They buy them because they becomes cheaper as most brand wants their stock drained asap.
We are talking about 8-10k+ bill so obviously you want something great. All other motor are just outdated from internal to casing. That does not make them bad but not as great in comparison (form factor, weight, casing blabla).
calnearlyebike
Member
I can tell you for a fact, amongst a lot for riders, brand affiliation and brand snobbery is a massive thing. Many riders who ride regularly and have been on the scene for a while Won’t buy an unheard of frame manufacturer to save a couple thousand and get a “better” motor
Is any of this an exciting new line of thought? Long before Avinox filled all the bandwith in this forum, it was wall to wall Levos round here. People have always flocked to whatever they perceive to be the best bang for their buck, motor, geo, integration, whatever. The pace of development is rapid in this space & there's always going to be a brand with a temporary edge but it is always temporary, that's just the nature of it.
It's now 9th April but I can see/hear neither whoops of joy nor clothing being rendered!
What's going on, are all the fanbois in hibernation or what?
What's going on, are all the fanbois in hibernation or what?
On Pinkbike? Most users of that site are in Canada/US so they are still asleep.It's now 9th April but I can see/hear neither whoops of joy nor clothing being rendered!
What's going on, are all the fanbois in hibernation or what?
Vision_Tim
New Member
Actually not so bad. Calls for lighter, less powerful versions with the tech. I get that dipping the toe in the water thought... but you can just turn it down right? To truly get lighter at this point, we need new battery tech or we're just doing the weight-weenie stuff with titanium bolts and 3D printed seats.
Well and then there is this which is what you'd expect to find " This might actually be a good thing...it might finally signal the end of Ebikes on trails in UE countries. With this unnecessarily powerful motor, I hope European regulations will finally recognize all ebikes as motorized vehicles that don't belong on trails."
Well and then there is this which is what you'd expect to find " This might actually be a good thing...it might finally signal the end of Ebikes on trails in UE countries. With this unnecessarily powerful motor, I hope European regulations will finally recognize all ebikes as motorized vehicles that don't belong on trails."
In a way, I feel somewhat let down. They place a lot of importance on power and torque, but then you have to use it in a very limited way due to the size of the batteries and the 600Wh extender... in the end, we're back to bikes weighing 25/26kg.
If they applied that technology to create a motor with 800W/1000w boost, 100Nm/120Nmboost, weighing 2.3kg, along with batteries using cells that are still under development and a carbon fiber casing like Bafang has, to have an 800Wh ± 3.2kg / 900Wh ± 3.5kg battery, along with a 250Wh 1kg extender, I and a few other riders would be more than satisfied.
If they applied that technology to create a motor with 800W/1000w boost, 100Nm/120Nmboost, weighing 2.3kg, along with batteries using cells that are still under development and a carbon fiber casing like Bafang has, to have an 800Wh ± 3.2kg / 900Wh ± 3.5kg battery, along with a 250Wh 1kg extender, I and a few other riders would be more than satisfied.
Vision_Tim
New Member
I don't know how much more they can squeeze out of a motor to save weight. Casing maybe as you said. But the real next-gen will be new battery tech. Until then, get more titanium bolts.
CyclingInsights
New Member
Honestly yeah, the “purists” are probably already warming up their keyboards 
Every time something new drops it’s the same cycle: “this isn’t real riding anymore” followed by three days of comment wars, then everyone quietly goes back to being curious about the tech.
That said, the Avinox stuff is actually interesting. If it performs like the rumors say, Pinkbike comments are gonna be absolute chaos on launch day.
And lol at Spez dropping a long-travel Levo Evo the same day… that actually feels believable. They love a good “hold my beer” timing when competitors make noise.
Realistically though, most riders don’t care that much once they’re on the trail. The internet debates it for sport, then everyone just goes riding on whatever they can afford
Every time something new drops it’s the same cycle: “this isn’t real riding anymore” followed by three days of comment wars, then everyone quietly goes back to being curious about the tech.
That said, the Avinox stuff is actually interesting. If it performs like the rumors say, Pinkbike comments are gonna be absolute chaos on launch day.
And lol at Spez dropping a long-travel Levo Evo the same day… that actually feels believable. They love a good “hold my beer” timing when competitors make noise.
Realistically though, most riders don’t care that much once they’re on the trail. The internet debates it for sport, then everyone just goes riding on whatever they can afford
Now the cheapest Amflow is £4k.
Yes, I’m aware of the new launches since I posted that!
If anybody is looking for a full power EMTB they’d have to give that a serious look for sure.
I’ve been saving that exact argument in my back pocket for the next time I get into an e-bike flame war.
Don’t worry about him. He’s one of the Chicken Little Karen’s that thinks the sky is falling and all trails will close if the Avinox isn’t limited to the same power levels as Bosch. We now have new illnesses, EDS, (ebike derangement syndrome, lots of Pinkbikers have this) and ADS, (Avinox derangement syndrome) e-bikers, pinkbikers and paid Bosch influencers like Hans who like to scream that they have too much power and are going to ruin it for everyone else and cause trail closures.
Don’t worry about him. He’s one of the Chicken Little Karen’s that thinks the sky is falling and all trails will close if the Avinox isn’t limited to the same power levels as Bosch. We now have new illnesses, EDS, (ebike derangement syndrome, lots of Pinkbikers have this) and ADS, (Avinox derangement syndrome) e-bikers, pinkbikers and paid Bosch influencers like Hans who like to scream that they have too much power and are going to ruin it for everyone else and cause trail closures.
Oh you’re back with the Karen’s line.
Stop being a twat.
This is a very pertinent point, there’s no cheating physics at the end of the day.
I actually admire what Avinox have done, I’ve always said that, but more power isn’t always the answer and there’s a balance to be struck.
I’ve owned some heavy ‘full power’ e-bikes in the past, fun at first, but it wears off as you find the downsides.
‘Powerful, light, cheap - choose two from three’ seems to have become the new choice triangle.
There’s a sweet spot for everybody now, just have to choose it.
calnearlyebike
Member
gotta love Americans bringing their beloved freedom even into an Ebike debate 
frrreeeeeeeeeddddoooooooommmmmm
frrreeeeeeeeeddddoooooooommmmmmIt's generally only the land of the free (lol) who have a problem with ebikes on trails. The rest of the world, not that your average American & you even less so has any great awareness of it, doesn't give a toss. You could call it geography derangement syndrome.
It’s other emtb riders that will mess everything up which is the sad part. New rules/laws will come about because of some jealous emtb guys that don’t have an avinox and complain enough about them.
The power isn’t that crazy. It’s not hurting the trails anymore than any other bike. Most people will not be blasting around in boost all day anyway.
How about we all just encourage each other and popularize getting out there and doing trail work in your area instead of trying to outlaw everything. If you’re putting the work in, then wtf does it matter how many watts your bike has..
The power isn’t that crazy. It’s not hurting the trails anymore than any other bike. Most people will not be blasting around in boost all day anyway.
How about we all just encourage each other and popularize getting out there and doing trail work in your area instead of trying to outlaw everything. If you’re putting the work in, then wtf does it matter how many watts your bike has..
Not sure what the setup is in Hawaii, but here in the UK/EU it definitely won’t be jealous non Avinox EMTB riders (is that a thing?!) who bring in negative trail access changes, it will be the bikes themselves.
We have very defined legal trail access for UK/EU legal EMTBs, they can go anywhere a normal pedal cycle can, which for riders in the UK is a huge thing.
I can legally ride a EAPC compliant EMTB on over 26k miles of Bridleways, 3k+ miles of restricted Byways as well as 16k miles of National Cycle Network.
Avinox equipped EMTBs are as far as I know EAPC compliant (although they are very easy to de-restrict) and so no problem with that for now.
The problem Isn’t now though, Avinox motors are legal, it’s where we’re headed that will be the problem. and regulators as well as other trail users (the walking and horse riding lobby are very influential here) are watching.
Idk we may have vastly different trails, but any legit mtb trail here nobody watching you would notice a difference between 1500 watts and 800 watts. You aren’t boosting 28mph up any legit trail. Maybe fire roads and stuff. Either way, it’s still limited to 28mph isnt it? So it doesn’t matter. Almost everyone finds ways to derestrict to the 28 on whatever motor system.
I agree that most EMTB riders are generally pretty sensible, and most other trail users won’t know whether it’s 800 or 1500w of e-bike if you’re riding considerately. Our assist limit is a lot lower here, like 16mph.
I don’t generally get any comments from other trail users when I’m out riding, the odd angry rambler who seem to get angry about everything anyway, but there are definitely lobbies here that want e-bikes (perhaps even bicycles) off trails and I guess that’s the same everywhere.
It’s not just an Avinox thing, but it is bringing things into focus and causing debate. On one hand that’s great, but it’s where the conversation ends up that’s got e-bikers worried.
I’m going to have disagree. I’ve seen plenty of whiners from all over the world who are going on and on and on about how we are all going to lose trail access and more if we don’t make new rules and regulations that limit the speed/power of all of e-bikes to a certain manufacturer’s level. It’s just so much unnecessary drama and it’s tiring. My comments/replies are not geographically based. If a person wants limits on their own bikes, that’s fine. But don’t try to limit what I and others have and try to manipulate the rest of world do do what you think is best for everyone else. That includes manufacturers like Bosch trying to get others to match what they have rather than trying to evolve and keep up with the progress that’s been made. Even paying influencers, like Hans to spout their propaganda. They can all f right off.
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