PinkBike Freak-Out on April 9th?
- Thread starter Larsey
- Start date
Rando_12345
E*POWAH Master
Depends how cheap and interesting the Amflow builds come in at, we already know there will be multiple sub €5k bikes available with Crussis and Megamo. I'd say it's going to be tougher and tougher for the big brands to push their overpriced, poorly specced bikes (emtb or not) out when so many new brands will have cheap avinox bikes available.
SL market is going to especially rough, should be some screaming deals this time next year on all ebikes as it really feels like the market is about to be flooded.
SL market is going to especially rough, should be some screaming deals this time next year on all ebikes as it really feels like the market is about to be flooded.
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Doesn't take much for the anti-e brigade to lose their collective shizz on PinkBike.
April 9th should be fun...although here it'll be 10th.
April 9th should be fun...although here it'll be 10th.
Keep an eye on embn. They have been known for releasing videos too early.
Not sure why people keep taking this somewhat dystopian view, Bosch are massive and e-bike motors are a tiny part of their business. They also have product life cycles, people wanted competition and now they have it, wait and see what they come back with.
Likewise Specialized, a huge bike company with products across the whole of the cycling spectrum, not just e-mtbs. I think they’ll be just fine and let’s see what direction they go in.
This. Who would buy a £3-5k e-mtb with an Avinox system on it from one of the ‘big brands’ over a boutique one at twice or three times the price?
I’d argue quite a few, for many they just want the motor/power, and they’ll live wit the rest of the bike.
It’s always been the case, even before Avinox was launched, it just happened to be launched on higher priced bikes first. I’d put the Amflow in the same category, even the cheapest Amflow at £6k is way above what many would spend on an EMTB.
I think the biggest outcry will come from the "all the trails will be closed" to all bikes now that these "motorcycles" will be everywhere doomsayers. As if an extra 100 watts will instantly make them as fast (and as dangerous) as (37.5 kW) 300 KTMs.
Just because a more powerful motor CAN go faster...it doesn't mean you HAVE to. Every car on the road today can go 100mph+...I don't go that fast..do you? The only place you're going to go faster with these motors is...uphill. The (ridiculous) 15 & 20 mph speed limiters will still be on these bikes, so what is the difference?? Oh yeah...trail damage...yeah r-i-g-h-t.
Thanks, you’ve just introduced a brand new and original perspective!
Oh wait, or has it been done to death a million times already, as people seek to oversimplify an issue that if taken to its logical conclusion risks trail access for ‘bicycles’ here in the UK?
I forget which it is…
Some of these Bosch bikes with a 600wh are going to get a run for their money too along with Giant being completely lost with their brand new Reign E+.
Even if Specialized were to release a longer travel Levo, I still believe this generation is cooked as per their fat battery strategy like Bosch. That high MSRP is very hard to swallow when your tech & design isn't the best anymore.
It's a great thing happening for the eMTB industry, I truly hope this is the final wake up call for some of these legacy brands.
This is all so similar to the language used when Tesla came to market, BMW, Toyota, VAG etc all described as ‘legacy brands’.
Fast forward a number of years and Tesla aren’t dominant, the legacy brands are still selling cars of all sorts and making Billions in profits.
Not least BYD are in a good place, a Chinese brand, with Chinese competitors.
Somebody somewhere will be working on the ‘Avinox killer’, it might even be a Chinese rival or it could be the so called legacy brands.
At least Tesla had some USP, a bit like DJI it was the software and vertical integration, but e-bike battery chemistries are all the same, just packaging differs and it’s laughable to think nobody else could make a slim battery pack nor build motors with 3000w if they have zero regard for the actual laws and regulations in place.
Don't weep for Tesla, they are worth 5 times as much as the next most valuable car company (Toyota) and 17 times as much as the next largest western company (GM). They are basically worth more than all other car companies combined.
Their profit margin is second only to Ferrari.
The Model Y was the world's best selling car (ICE or EV) for 4 years in a row with the Rav4 barely edging it out last year.
Meanwhile, the "legacy brands" took over $70B in losses over the past year as they can't seem to sell any EV's in open markets.
Bringing this back on topic, it seems obvious that DJI entering the emtb space was disruptive in the sense that other bike and motor brands can't ignore them. Much like when Tesla entered the market years ago, I would bet large sums that the "legacy" brands are having regular meetings planning how to either partner with or respond to the Avinox system.
I'm also sure Bosch & Specialized engineers are working full time on a better packaging of their system, this is the key part here that is allowing bike manufacturers to design very good looking eMTBs generating so much hype.
These smaller brands currently living on the Avinox hype will not survive the test of time as soon as another system will be competitive with Avinox or gain the edge against it.
This. It's not the power it's the packaging that makes the Avinox desirable. Most of us want good looking bikes that don't look too thicc.
Once we have parity with packaging, it all comes down to which overall bike is best for your needs. Which it should be all along.
I’m not weeping for Tesla, I’m just making the point that dominance doesn’t last forever, BYD for one is coming up fast and the so called legacy manufacturers are surviving and making money in what is admittedly a tough market.
It depends what lens you’re looking through, here in the UK the best selling car for 2025 is the Ford Puma, Tesla have totally dropped out of the top 10.
I’m not knocking Tesla here, we owned a Model 3 until last year, which is kind of the point because we replaced it with a Kia EV, such is the pace of competition and development.
I suspect it will be the same with e-bike motors, and at the end of the day the bike manufacturers make the bike great as much as the motor.
They're still selling, despite the fact that they don't compare well to their competition.
I'm not sure who is running the geo department over there, but they are asleep at the wheel.
Had you bothered to notice, this is only my 3rd comment on this board so I was unaware that this topic had been "done to death a million times" & a veteran (shut-in) like yourself felt impowered to ridicule someone expressing his opinion...mia copa. Here in Colonies our forefathers left England because of the oppressive gov't. Apparently the ones who remained are the progeny of the docile obedient dolts who were afraid to. Enjoy your servitude.Thanks, you’ve just introduced a brand new and original perspective!
Oh wait, or has it been done to death a million times already, as people seek to oversimplify an issue that if taken to its logical conclusion risks trail access for ‘bicycles’ here in the UK?
I forget which it is…
I seem to have missed your novel reasoned nuanced view on the subject beyond the condescension.
Thanks, you’ve just introduced a brand new and original perspective!
Oh wait, or has it been done to death a million times already, as people seek to oversimplify an issue that if taken to its logical conclusion risks trail access for ‘bicycles’ here in the UK?
I forget which it is…
Oh, I noticed alright, but you and me both knew which way you were heading.
Besides, before you come in and start shooting your mouth off at the bar, always a good idea to get a feel for the place I’d have thought.
You’re going to need a thicker skin I think, based on your response, and a bit more humour.
I haven’t spent much time on the Gen 4, but those who have and have lots of comparisons say it seems to be a sorted bike geometry wise?
Perhaps not for everybody, but probably works for a lot of folks.
I still see several times more Levo than I see Amflow at local Phoenix-area trails. I believe I've noticed 4-5 Amflow ever; while last Sunday alone I saw 6 Levo! Because there's so many Pivot riding here I expect to see a LOT of Shuttle Amp'd though.
The big s has essentially become mercedes. They build a refined product that is not necessarily performance oriented.
The phoenix area is not known for being particularly demanding on bike geo. Indeed, short rear centers are the go to there. Corners are few, and speeds are low.
Corners are few? Speeds are low? I may have only lived here for 15 months but that seems very inaccurate to my experience riding here.
Just my experiences there. It wasn't the kind of riding that was demanding upon geo, compared to the PNW/BC or even some California stuff. Still lots of fun, just different. More demanding on suspension tuning than overall bike balance I'd say.
But to be fair, when any modern bike/e-bike is tested in a vacuum, they're great. It's only when they're compared directly to one another that deficiencies tend to make themselves obvious. And if one didn't try a bunch regularly, you might never be aware.
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