Kenevo and Levo stock Butcher tyres - grip questions ???
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Donnie797
Well-known member
oh yes, i had to deal the same mindfuck-problem when i tested my wifes bike and her huge 3.0 tyres ^^
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- #33
Wow 3.0 that really is Mega tyre... think thats wider than my car Lol
Its annoying the new eddy current only comes in a 2.8 in 27.5, would be really interested if it was 2.6/2.5. I find Plus tyres nightmare in the mud, and i don't think a huge tire not he back in necessary for generating grip form my experience with e-bikes
Just wondering reading this thread if reducing tyre size to 2.6 from 2.8 has made the biggest difference . Also some auite high pressures being used especially if they are 2.8 tyres .
I don’t doubt the Mary is probably the best front tyre out there though ,
I don’t doubt the Mary is probably the best front tyre out there though ,
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- #36
I am thinking the same thing ,I will order the Apex 2.8 and check it out in a month or so when I get used to the MM DH 2.6 .. and let you all know
Hi All,
Hold fire on ordering the Apex 2.8s until you read my next post.
As I own both, and have ridden both. I have been gathering a lot of interesting info to share with you on the 2.6 Ultrasoft DH MM's and the 2.8 Soft APEX MM's.
It's just taking a bit of time to get it all together sorry...
Hold fire on ordering the Apex 2.8s until you read my next post.
As I own both, and have ridden both. I have been gathering a lot of interesting info to share with you on the 2.6 Ultrasoft DH MM's and the 2.8 Soft APEX MM's.
It's just taking a bit of time to get it all together sorry...
- Thread starter
- #38
Hi All,
Hold fire on ordering the Apex 2.8s until you read my next post.
As I own both, and have ridden both. I have been gathering a lot of interesting info to share with you on the 2.6 Ultrasoft DH MM's and the 2.8 Soft APEX MM's.
It's just taking a bit of time to get it all together sorry...
Will do !!! Thanks Kiwi..
I've had my Levo with the 2.8 Butchers since February, so I've ridden in wet and dry conditions and I have found the grip outstanding.
I've noticed that a lot of the pressures being sited are much higher than what I'm running.
I'm 76kg and am running 14 psi front and 16 back.
I don't get any squirming or burping.
I've tried higher pressures, but I find it makes the bike feel harsh and bouncey.
I've noticed that a lot of the pressures being sited are much higher than what I'm running.
I'm 76kg and am running 14 psi front and 16 back.
I don't get any squirming or burping.
I've tried higher pressures, but I find it makes the bike feel harsh and bouncey.
- Thread starter
- #40
Ok cool, are you running tubeless ?
Mission MTB
New Member
I run MM on the front and Hans Dampf on back of my Enduro and I really like em. But I have to say I can't complain about the stock tyres on the Kenevo either. They run nice and fast and they slide predictably (I'm about 75kg running about 20psi). I'd say if you're washing out at the front, you're maybe sitting off the back of the bike a little too much (I think you mentioned that you suspected that in an earlier message).
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- #43
I agree my son also said the slide predictably and he is flying down.. for me after 3 outing with the MM DH on the front its much better and hasn't washed out once , but I am sitting off back a little to much for sure. but the new front grip is really nice maybe go back to stock tyres in a couple of month see how I am doing .. thanks
Tires, tyres come down to personal preference. On my first Levo with its 3.0 tyres were an experience.
The front Purgatory tyre would break loose all the time and the rear Purgatory had too much grip and I couldn’t drift the back end in corners.
I went with Maxxis DHF 2.8s and that fixed my cornering problems, but added more rotational weight.
I waited about 6 month before Spesh had the Butcher 2.8s in stock. The Butcher and the Minion DHF tyres are almost the same tread pattern. Both tyres are manufactured in the same place, but the Butchers were lighter. It took a few rides before I completely sorted out air pressures and I have been using them ever since. I added Cushcore tyre inserts a year ago and they added back some of the weight, but the increased grip and rim protection seems like an okay trade off.
The only reason I haven’t tried Schwalbe MM is we don’t have enough demand to stock them in the shop and I did like how fast they would wear out when I had them on my Lapierre. We used to call them 4 run tyres
The front Purgatory tyre would break loose all the time and the rear Purgatory had too much grip and I couldn’t drift the back end in corners.
I went with Maxxis DHF 2.8s and that fixed my cornering problems, but added more rotational weight.
I waited about 6 month before Spesh had the Butcher 2.8s in stock. The Butcher and the Minion DHF tyres are almost the same tread pattern. Both tyres are manufactured in the same place, but the Butchers were lighter. It took a few rides before I completely sorted out air pressures and I have been using them ever since. I added Cushcore tyre inserts a year ago and they added back some of the weight, but the increased grip and rim protection seems like an okay trade off.
The only reason I haven’t tried Schwalbe MM is we don’t have enough demand to stock them in the shop and I did like how fast they would wear out when I had them on my Lapierre. We used to call them 4 run tyres
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- #45
Hi Kiwi , love your thoughts on the Apex 2.8s when you get a min. was thinking of trying one on the rear.
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- #46
So far I have found the MM DH 2.6 to be amazing both front and rear the ripe is insane. noting like the 2.8 Butcher in anyway . my son had a ride with the MM DH 2.6 and now what one for the front. I think after a while I will go back to the 2.8 Butcher on the rear (or try he Apex MM) as there is so much grip to the rear now it was a like more fun have the front grip hard and the rear slide a little . But while I am feeling so much better about the Kenveo I will stick to the pair for now. very happy
very happy- Thread starter
- #48
It does! not sue you really need the rear but with the 2.6 MM its a different bike.
I don't think you get any real grip benefit from having anything bigger than a 2.5 on any FS EMTB, i have 2.5 Minion DHR DD on my Vitus and one thing it doesn't lack is grip. On my HT i might go up to a bigger rear as it wheel spins a lot due to the back end skipping around.
I'd go as far as to say both points are especially true on 160mm+ travel bikes @R120
I explained all this in detail here over 3 months ago.
There's no concievable reason for Emtbs to 'need' bigger tyres than normal mtbs do unless they are going to be riding sand or snow.
But... well... you know... There are also folk happily trundling round purpose built armoured all weather trail centres every week on 4" fatbike tyres raving about their awesome levels of grip in the cafe at the end... After riding pretty much every corner too slow to even require the grip level provided by a Tioga farmer John that's sat sunbaked in a greenhouse for the last 30 years.
MasterFrat
New Member
Currently riding Maxxis DHF up front and DHR in rear both 2.8s. Night day grip difference compared to the stock butchers.
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- #52
May try these next then , Nice to have a 2.8 tyre feels like it protect the rims more also takes out the bumps a little more
Hi Grayedout.
Where did you purchase you MM for £35. I'm looking to buy two.
Ta
Pottsy
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- #54
i just ordered the MM from bikediscount.de, having used magic marys since they were called muddy marys and always loved them, i will test the shit out of it on the E and see how they compare to my trail bike version. Cant wait for it to come, lost the front 3 times in the last 4 weeks.
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- #56
Please up date use . nice to know its not my shitty riding style Lol
Hi @grayedout,
Apologies it has taken so long to get back to you, I have been busy with life in general and have been making the most of the weather in Wales and have been out riding as much as possible.
This is PURELY my own opinion and people are free to disagree with the content. I am only passing on my experience with said tyres/tires so at least you are a bit more informed and hopefully not even more confused
I fittted the Magic Mary APEX 2.8 Soft compound Folding tyres/tires 1050gms / 2.31lbs at the end of June. These replaced a set of Magic Mary DH carcass 2.6 Ultrasoft Non folding tyres/tires 1410gms / 3.08lbs
Since fitting them I have completed 24 rides and travelled 528km / 328 miles. (Ride and distance info captured using Starva)
I am running Tubeless on SRAM ROAM 60 30mm wide carbon rims with 120mls of Stans No Tubes Sealant
On the sidewalls the recommended pressures start from 17psi up to 35 psi
I am running Front 17 psi, Rear 17psi. You or others on the forum may prefer 'More' or 'Less' depending on how you like things set up.
Terrain where I ride
Typical Welsh slatey/rocky hard packed fire roads
Man made slatey/rocky hard packed trails.
Off Piste trails, very loamy, soft and rooty
Rider
73kgs to 75kgs with all my bike gear on and depending on how many burgers, chocolate, sweets and pints consumed the day before.....
I am a reasonably confident rider and more than happy to take on Reds runs and the occasional Black run. Jumps, gaps and drops are not an issue as long as they are not too crazy. Technical single track with roots and rock gardens are what I really like riding and now that I have an ebike I have effectively doubled the amount of trails I can ride as I can now do 95% of these trails in the reverse direction
. Obviously doing a run in the reverse direction needs to be carried out either really early in the morning or really late at night to avoid head ons with other riders riding the trail in the CORRECT direction..... Feedback
The Magic Mary APEX 2.8 Soft compound Folding tyres/tires seem to be holding up well apart from a few things.
- I have had a few wash outs on the front where I just lost grip almost as though I hit some really loose fine gravel. The first one spat me over the bars and the others I managed to rescue just in time (More luck than rider skill….). I am not sure if this is just down to very dry conditions at the moment...... I think I need to put the 2.6 Ultrasofts back on again and ride the same trails where the wash outs occured to compare.
- They do not like damp rooty sections as much as the 2.6 Ultrasofts. They are okay, but you definitely have to reduce your speed and be a bit more cautious compared to the 2.6 Ultrasofts.
- The carcass of the tyre/tire appears to be much more prone to cuts and slices than the 2.6 Ultrasofts. The good news is I have not had any of the side knobs tear off like the old versions of Nobby Nics used to so this is a positive. The rear tyre/tire appears to suffer a lot more damage than the front for some reason.... The front only appears to suffer cuts to the knobs while the rear suffers cuts and slices to the knobs and the carcass. It could be that the damage on the rear is actually being done whilst braking which sort of makes sense to me. Please see the photos below showing the damage to the rear tyre/tire as there are a number of cuts and slices around the entire circumference which is more than a bit concerning.
- Wear rate seems to be okay apart from all the cuts and slices. However, saying that I think these tyres/tires are not going to last much longer than the 2.6 Ultrasofts. Before I took the 2.6 Ultrasofts off I had completed 83 rides and travelled 1450km /900 miles. I would be more than happy to put them back on although I would put what was on the rear on the front and what was on the front on the rear. Doing that I would be confident that I would get at least another 600 to 800km / 370 to 500 miles out of them before having to get a new set.
As I stated above, this is PURELY my own opinion and people are free to disagree with the content.
The Magic Mary APEX 2.8 Soft compound Folding tyre/tire is a good tyre/tire and most people that try them on the 'right terrain' I feel, will be more than happy with them. The main negative point is how easy it is to cut and slice the carcass of the rear tyre/tire in the terrain that I have been riding in compared to the 2.6 Ultrasofts which have done almost 3 times the distance with very minimal damage. If you ride in the type of terrain I do there are better tyres/tires out there. I am glad I tried them as it has made it clear to me that the Magic Mary DH carcass 2.6 Ultrasoft Non folding version is still my first choice 'Go to' tyre/tire.
Alternative option - Magic Mary DH carcass 2.6 Ultrasoft Non folding 1.4kgs/3.08lbs
- The 2.6 Ultrasofts are almost indestructible, you can run them at reasonably low pressures as they have a super thick carcass and DH sidewalls. (Check out the Screen shot below). The yellow bit in the screen shot is some sort of hard composite material that you cannot physically bend, unlike the almost 'paper thin' sidewalls of the 2.8 Butchers or for that matter most of the other PLUS tyres out there for sale.
- They are super grippy and very confidence inspiring on all the terrain noted above in the dry. I also had the same experience when it was damp/wet.
- Point and shoot the 2.6 Ultrasoft at any rock garden and she will deliver her magic. With the super thick carcass and DH sidewalls you do not need the latest craze of moose/foam inserts available. The 2.6 Ultrasofts really are ‘that good’ at protecting your rims from damage and giving you almost zero punctures.
- The 2.6 Ultrasofts are heavy, 1.4kgs/3.08lbs plus for each tyre.... Who cares!!!... Well, some of you probably will but on the positive side, you have an ebike, it has a motor and to be honest I did not feel I was having to push any harder to get up to speed or to get up steep hills or my battery ran out any earlier.
- Almost the same wear rate as the Magic Mary APEX 2.8 Soft compound but less prone to cuts and slices
- Sticky clay conditions tend to clog them up. However, Sticky clay conditions tend to clog most tyres/tires up. Changing over to Maxxis Shortys or Maxxis Wet Screams or any other purpose built mud tyre will get around this issue. However you will lose the indestructible sidewalls of the 2.6 Ultrasoft by doing so and risk dented rims and pinch punctures unless you can get a mud tyre/tire with a DH rated carcass or Super Gravity rated carcass.
The soon to be released Schwalbe Eddy Current will probably be another strong contender although it only comes as a 2.8 in the 27.5 format.... Which means having to switch to 29er wheels if I want to go to 2.4 or 2.6.
Hope the above info and photos below helps with your decision.
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Mary's all day long for me. Although I have Schwlabe's NEW Eddy Current on back order.
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