CubeHead
Member
My Semi-Dysfunctional Love Affair with Bosch Powered E-Mountain Bikes
And Some Recommendations For Those That Get Equally Smitten
A Brief History
As with anyone who has experienced an e-bike for the first time, back in early 2016 my test ride at my LBS of a Bosch powered Cube Reaction 29er hardtail yielded instant ear-to-ear grins! It was love at first ride and shortly thereafter I stretched my budget to part with a small fortune and buy the bike.
Much joy on the trails ensued, punctuated by issues that saw my steed spending inordinate amounts of time back at the shop while the technicians and Bosch reps scratched their heads trying to figure out how to get the bike functioning properly again. I’ll outline all the issues and takeaways below.
In 2018, while picking up my now-not-so-beloved e-bike from the shop, after having its 3rd motor installed, I spotted what to me was the coolest looking bike I had seen to date – a Cube Nutrail Hybrid fat bike. I knew a test ride would be potentially dangerous, and it was…
My justification for the purchase was that this bike was an absolute beast with a big lump of a Bosch Performance CX motor (a step up from the current bike). The Nutrail looked as if it could survive the apocalypse! Surly this robust bike and motor system would be indestructible. Right?....
The decision to upgrade my bike was helped by the fact that both Cube and my LBS stepped up and offered a great deal on the Nutrail, after I reminded them of all the issues I had with the first e-bike I bought from them.
The Skinny On The Fat Story
Yes I was smitten again with the shiny new Bosch fat bike, but the tales of woe repeated themselves with this second love, to the point that I have considered, long and hard about going back to a standard meat-powered mountain bike.
Not-so-fun fact: The above idea was killed recently at the beginning of a three-hour ride in the hills outside Toronto, when the Nutrail popped an error code and the Bosch assistance ceased. Riding that long, or should I say riding and pushing a bike up hills, is not my idea of fun.
True Love
I’m currently reading Alain de Botton’s, “The Course of Love”, or at least the italicized philosophy bits – to cut to the chase in the reading. In the book he explains that we often put too much emphasis on the falling in love bit, as I have above. Turns out, true love happens over the long run, while enjoying the good times and hanging in there when the shitty stuff happens, which by the way is inevitable.
No doubt, I have been tested and I’m still hanging in there with my Nutrail. Having experienced years of e-mountain bike joy alongside the pain of ownership I feel equipped to offer some suggestions to those thinking about starting a relationship with an e-mountain bike.
I’ll start by stating the problems I’ve had with both bikes, for those that are interested:
2015 Cube Reaction Hybrid HPA Pro 29
This first e-mountain bike was fairly trouble-free to begin with, but developed ever-decreasing battery range estimates when riding on the same trails regularly. The bike made multiple visits to the shop and in the end the motor, battery, control unit, display and the wiring harness were all replaced – all under warranty.
Joyous rides resumed until the new motor started creaking when leaning into the pedals. The first trip to the shop after all of the above saw the motor mount bolts being retorqued. The subsequent trip to address the returning creak saw the dampening films between the motor and motor mounts being replaced. Another trip saw the motor mounts being retorqued again. The fourth trip saw the motor being replaced again as it was discovered that the bolts holding the two halves of the motor together were not properly torqued and the motor halves were rubbing together when cranking on the pedals thus creating the creaking. Retorquing these internal motor bolts was said to not be possible by the shop, thus the third motor.
As mentioned it was at this point that I bought the Nutrail Hybrid so I decided to shift this bike to a more distance biking role on gentler trails, to give it an easier life.
In the end I sold this original 29er to a friend who was aware of the history but took a chance on it when I offered it to him at a very attractive price. For me the electric fat bike did it all and I felt the second bike was redundant.
2018 Cube Nutrail Hybrid
As with the other bike, things started off rosey but it didn’t take long for the first issue to rear its ugly head. I’m happily riding the trails and my cranks start to disengage from driving the bike forward. As turns out a Cube engineer had not properly spec’d out the mating of the pair of cogs that connect the crank to the motor and drive line, and things just spun into a big mess.
As the cogs on the motor were all ground up in the process, the motor had to be replaced. So on to motor number two…
Number two was pretty good for a while and then it started making some clicking sounds, along with the dreaded motor creaking when really standing on the pedals. Internal gearing problems were identified and we were on to motor number three…
The third motor could be potentially the charm but the usual motor creaking has showed up again. This time I decided to take matters into my own hands and bought the tools to access to motor mount bolts and retorque them myself.
As expected, this worked for a while and the creaking returned. So now onto the dampening films…
Takeaways
When you are spending a pile of cash on a product that is supposed to be reputable, one does not expect the kind of issues that I have had. It seems to me, based on all the issues I’ve had and the reading I’ve done about e-bike systems, as of 2020 we’re all beta-testers – still at this point.
Sad really.
That said, I don’t want to be completely negative here – my bikes have been an absolute joy when they are working properly and not disturbing what, to me – on a good day, is an amazing meditation.
Recommendations
1. Know that when you buy an e-mountain bike, you are going to increase your maintenance regime beyond that of a normal bike.
2. Compare warranties from the various bike companies. You’ll need them. One good thing about the Bosch warranty is that if you replace a component, you get a fresh two-year warranty on the replacement part. This has been especially important to me, as you can tell above.
3. If you are new to e-bikes I would seriously consider buying your first e-bike from a reputable bike shop that is as close to you as possible. Confirm that the shop has a fully trained electric system tech so they’re not shipping your bike to another location, thus wasting more of your precious riding time.
4. Check to see if the shop stocks e-bike parts, like the motors, batteries, controllers, speed sensors, etc. This is rare, at least where I am located, and at best it takes a few days to get the required parts shipped to the shop. One time, I had to wait for few months for the next shipment of Bosch motors to arrive in Canada. Thankfully I was able to ride my clicking, creaking bike until the new motor arrived.
5. With the Bosch bikes and likely other brands, do retorque your motor mount bolts after the first good ride. This is made easier on certain new models where the manufacturers have smartened up and given access to the motor mount bolts without having to buy a bunch of special tools to access them. If I buy another bike, I’ll be looking for this feature.
6. if you’re not handy, when you are buying your bike, ask if the shop will include the retorquing of your motor mount bolts and a general check over of the bike after the first good ride – with the purchase price of the bike. Or better yet, get the shop to give you a deal on the tools and learn to access the bolts yourself. You’ll need these tools and the knowledge in the long run.
7. Most importantly, know that things will go wrong no matter how much your salesperson tells you how trouble-free these e-bike systems are. If you think otherwise, prepare to have your heart broken, again and again.
Rider Specs
I’m 6’ 1” and weigh 204lbs. I’ve always cycled a bit but really got into it after buying my first e-mountain bike. Prior to that my two-wheeled drug of choice (for almost forty years) were motorcycles, both on and off road. My e-mountain bike has now replaced my motorcycles. I ride the Nutrail as it was intended, on some wonderful trails in and around the Greater Toronto area.
Enjoy the meditation,
CubeHead
* See three year update further along in this thread.
And Some Recommendations For Those That Get Equally Smitten
A Brief History
As with anyone who has experienced an e-bike for the first time, back in early 2016 my test ride at my LBS of a Bosch powered Cube Reaction 29er hardtail yielded instant ear-to-ear grins! It was love at first ride and shortly thereafter I stretched my budget to part with a small fortune and buy the bike.
Much joy on the trails ensued, punctuated by issues that saw my steed spending inordinate amounts of time back at the shop while the technicians and Bosch reps scratched their heads trying to figure out how to get the bike functioning properly again. I’ll outline all the issues and takeaways below.
In 2018, while picking up my now-not-so-beloved e-bike from the shop, after having its 3rd motor installed, I spotted what to me was the coolest looking bike I had seen to date – a Cube Nutrail Hybrid fat bike. I knew a test ride would be potentially dangerous, and it was…
My justification for the purchase was that this bike was an absolute beast with a big lump of a Bosch Performance CX motor (a step up from the current bike). The Nutrail looked as if it could survive the apocalypse! Surly this robust bike and motor system would be indestructible. Right?....
The decision to upgrade my bike was helped by the fact that both Cube and my LBS stepped up and offered a great deal on the Nutrail, after I reminded them of all the issues I had with the first e-bike I bought from them.
The Skinny On The Fat Story
Yes I was smitten again with the shiny new Bosch fat bike, but the tales of woe repeated themselves with this second love, to the point that I have considered, long and hard about going back to a standard meat-powered mountain bike.
Not-so-fun fact: The above idea was killed recently at the beginning of a three-hour ride in the hills outside Toronto, when the Nutrail popped an error code and the Bosch assistance ceased. Riding that long, or should I say riding and pushing a bike up hills, is not my idea of fun.
True Love
I’m currently reading Alain de Botton’s, “The Course of Love”, or at least the italicized philosophy bits – to cut to the chase in the reading. In the book he explains that we often put too much emphasis on the falling in love bit, as I have above. Turns out, true love happens over the long run, while enjoying the good times and hanging in there when the shitty stuff happens, which by the way is inevitable.
No doubt, I have been tested and I’m still hanging in there with my Nutrail. Having experienced years of e-mountain bike joy alongside the pain of ownership I feel equipped to offer some suggestions to those thinking about starting a relationship with an e-mountain bike.
I’ll start by stating the problems I’ve had with both bikes, for those that are interested:
2015 Cube Reaction Hybrid HPA Pro 29
This first e-mountain bike was fairly trouble-free to begin with, but developed ever-decreasing battery range estimates when riding on the same trails regularly. The bike made multiple visits to the shop and in the end the motor, battery, control unit, display and the wiring harness were all replaced – all under warranty.
Joyous rides resumed until the new motor started creaking when leaning into the pedals. The first trip to the shop after all of the above saw the motor mount bolts being retorqued. The subsequent trip to address the returning creak saw the dampening films between the motor and motor mounts being replaced. Another trip saw the motor mounts being retorqued again. The fourth trip saw the motor being replaced again as it was discovered that the bolts holding the two halves of the motor together were not properly torqued and the motor halves were rubbing together when cranking on the pedals thus creating the creaking. Retorquing these internal motor bolts was said to not be possible by the shop, thus the third motor.
As mentioned it was at this point that I bought the Nutrail Hybrid so I decided to shift this bike to a more distance biking role on gentler trails, to give it an easier life.
In the end I sold this original 29er to a friend who was aware of the history but took a chance on it when I offered it to him at a very attractive price. For me the electric fat bike did it all and I felt the second bike was redundant.
2018 Cube Nutrail Hybrid
As with the other bike, things started off rosey but it didn’t take long for the first issue to rear its ugly head. I’m happily riding the trails and my cranks start to disengage from driving the bike forward. As turns out a Cube engineer had not properly spec’d out the mating of the pair of cogs that connect the crank to the motor and drive line, and things just spun into a big mess.
As the cogs on the motor were all ground up in the process, the motor had to be replaced. So on to motor number two…
Number two was pretty good for a while and then it started making some clicking sounds, along with the dreaded motor creaking when really standing on the pedals. Internal gearing problems were identified and we were on to motor number three…
The third motor could be potentially the charm but the usual motor creaking has showed up again. This time I decided to take matters into my own hands and bought the tools to access to motor mount bolts and retorque them myself.
As expected, this worked for a while and the creaking returned. So now onto the dampening films…
Takeaways
When you are spending a pile of cash on a product that is supposed to be reputable, one does not expect the kind of issues that I have had. It seems to me, based on all the issues I’ve had and the reading I’ve done about e-bike systems, as of 2020 we’re all beta-testers – still at this point.
Sad really.
That said, I don’t want to be completely negative here – my bikes have been an absolute joy when they are working properly and not disturbing what, to me – on a good day, is an amazing meditation.
Recommendations
1. Know that when you buy an e-mountain bike, you are going to increase your maintenance regime beyond that of a normal bike.
2. Compare warranties from the various bike companies. You’ll need them. One good thing about the Bosch warranty is that if you replace a component, you get a fresh two-year warranty on the replacement part. This has been especially important to me, as you can tell above.
3. If you are new to e-bikes I would seriously consider buying your first e-bike from a reputable bike shop that is as close to you as possible. Confirm that the shop has a fully trained electric system tech so they’re not shipping your bike to another location, thus wasting more of your precious riding time.
4. Check to see if the shop stocks e-bike parts, like the motors, batteries, controllers, speed sensors, etc. This is rare, at least where I am located, and at best it takes a few days to get the required parts shipped to the shop. One time, I had to wait for few months for the next shipment of Bosch motors to arrive in Canada. Thankfully I was able to ride my clicking, creaking bike until the new motor arrived.
5. With the Bosch bikes and likely other brands, do retorque your motor mount bolts after the first good ride. This is made easier on certain new models where the manufacturers have smartened up and given access to the motor mount bolts without having to buy a bunch of special tools to access them. If I buy another bike, I’ll be looking for this feature.
6. if you’re not handy, when you are buying your bike, ask if the shop will include the retorquing of your motor mount bolts and a general check over of the bike after the first good ride – with the purchase price of the bike. Or better yet, get the shop to give you a deal on the tools and learn to access the bolts yourself. You’ll need these tools and the knowledge in the long run.
7. Most importantly, know that things will go wrong no matter how much your salesperson tells you how trouble-free these e-bike systems are. If you think otherwise, prepare to have your heart broken, again and again.
Rider Specs
I’m 6’ 1” and weigh 204lbs. I’ve always cycled a bit but really got into it after buying my first e-mountain bike. Prior to that my two-wheeled drug of choice (for almost forty years) were motorcycles, both on and off road. My e-mountain bike has now replaced my motorcycles. I ride the Nutrail as it was intended, on some wonderful trails in and around the Greater Toronto area.
Enjoy the meditation,
CubeHead
* See three year update further along in this thread.
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