Forbidden DreadNought E

My experience has been that there's not much difference between the current model 38, zeb, and rxf38.
Slower speed comfort it's zeb, 38, then rxf.
For pushing the pace, it's the opposite, as one would expect.
It's shades of gray though. My old avalanche hybrid zeb still kicks all their asses noticeably. Particularly in rough, fast, off camber corners.

It's worth noting that grip 2 fox 38's had some wildly differing damping curves due to manufacturing tolerances, and many were completely unsuitable for lighter riders. My wife couldn't use one at all at 115 pounds riding weight.
 
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doochenozzle said:
I run way lower than recommended air pressure and have been happy. Prior to that my experience mirrors yours.
For fork, why not get a Dorado?
Click to expand...
ah, that's good info to have about the lower air pressures!

the Dorado Pro isn't approved for ebike use, and the Comp/Expert add substantial weight, I also know and like the RXF38 m.so I went with the Ohlins
 
I demoed two Tier 1 Dreadnought Es (S2 and S3) at Forest of Dean the other day. I started with the red Freeminers XC trail and skills area (jumps and drops), then mostly did repeated runs of black tech: Elephant Man, Y2K, Ski Run, Corkscrew, etc. Most climbs were on fire roads, but I also climbed up the loose bank at the bottom of Y2K/Elephant Man to test climbing traction. Here are my notes:
  • I'm 172cm tall with 32 inch inner leg and weigh about 108kg kitted up.
  • Current bike is a medium Geometron G1 (roughly 490 reach, 1310 wheelbase, 440 seat tube, depending on settings) with CYC X1 Pro motor and either a 750 Wh (4 kg) or 1300 Wh (8 kg) battery, giving a total weight of about 28 kg or 32 kg. The motor puts out up to 6kw and 28 Nm with a throttle (which I haven't installed) but 'only' 3kw and 210 Nm with pedal assist.
  • The S3 feels (and is) a similar size to my medium Geometron G1, and likewise was a bit hard to corner, tending to understeer. I didn't notice much benefit in terms of stability on the rough straights either, but it might be more apparent on proper DH tracks. It also has a 440 seat tube, which is too long for someone of my height. The remaining comments are about the S2, which I spent more time on.
  • With a 75mm-rise bar and 40mm stem to replace the stock ones, the S2 is almost the right size for me, but I'd want it to be 10mm longer reach ideally. Even after accounting for the high stack and growing chainstay, the S2 is a bit shorter than most mediums in other brands, and very similar to a small Geometron G1. Ideally the seat tube would be shorter as well (e.g. 400mm instead of 420) so I can run a Switchgrade and/or a comfy touring saddle without losing too much freedom of movement, but 420 is just about acceptable.
  • It is remarkably nimble and playful for a long-travel bike, even on tame, low-angle trails. I suppose anything would feel nimble compared to my current bike; but it also felt lighter and more chuckable than any of the Bosch bikes I've ridden (Vala, Bullit, Sight VLT, Regulator). It's possible some of that is due to my using my own high-rise bars for the Dreadnought demo; I felt way too hunched over with the stock bars, but I like an unusually high front end. Note also that the S2 has pretty middle-of-the-road geometry, e.g. 449mm chainstays, whereas the bigger sizes have chainstays and stack that are off the charts.
  • It wasn't an amazing jumper, but not terrible either - it just felt like there was a bit of a delay and a bit more effort was needed to pop, as the chainstays extend during preload.
  • I didn't notice any weird cornering characteristics. With the Norco Sight, which has mid-pivot iTrack suspension (same as the Velduro Rogue), it seemed to wallow and understeer in supported corners, but I didn't notice that on the Forbidden, despite the pivot being higher. This might be due to suspension differences: I think the Norco was undersprung, and not much effort was put into setting up the bike properly for me, whereas I had 30% sag and recommended clicker settings on the Forbidden. I actually found the bike excellent at cornering: both nimble (easy to tip over onto the side knobs, and to change direction) and stable, with good front-wheel traction. I did wash out the rear wheel a few times on very loose ground, but I think that's because the Mavens are super grabby and I have poor braking technique. The bike's traction and composure in rough corners is probably its stand-out characteristic for me.
  • The BB is pretty low so I had quite a few pedal strikes and down tube strikes. It might not be the best bike if you mostly ride natural tech with lots of big rocks/logs.
  • On the brakes: the Maven Ultimate B1 brakes on the S2 were by far the most powerful I've ever tried, even with just 200mm rotors. I've had Hope Tech 4 V4, Hope Evo GR4, Hayes Dominion A4, Radic Kaha, Shigura XT5, Shimano SLX, Maven Bronze A1, and a few others. None of those had as much power as I'd like, even with 223mm Galfer Shark rotors on both ends. Interestingly, the identical brakes on the S3 were much less powerful, so I guess a lot of it is down to the bleed/setup.
  • XO Transmission: Good, but not massively better than Linkglide, which is a fraction of the price. It still crunches if you shift more than one gear at a time under high power. The main benefit of SRAM wireless is coast shifting, which is genuinely helpful, though it would be better if you could shift at a complete standstill (you have to be rolling).
  • 2027 Zeb Ultimate Charger 3.2: Excellent overall. Much more supple and composed than my 2025/26 Charger 3.1 model with WPS Podium piston kit. I kept bottoming out with 23% sag, not realising that the ABO was at the minimum, because it was so linear, so I'd probably want to run 15-20% sag with 2-4 clicks of ABO.
  • Avinox M2S motor: Felt slow and underpowered on steep fire road climbs, even in 'Boost', but anything would next to the CYC. The 'traction-control' was impressive: not much slipping on steep, loose climbs that I struggle to clean on the much more powerful but much less refined CYC motor.
  • Battery lasted less than 2 hours. Unfortunately I left my phone in my van so I can't compare the range to my other batteries.
  • Overall, the S2 Dreadnought E was by far the best bike I've ever ridden, with the caveats that I haven't ridden a huge number of bikes, and that more effort was put into setting up the cockpit and suspension on the Forbidden than on other bikes I've demoed/rented.
  • Suggested improvements for the next iteration: shorter seat tubes, slightly longer reaches (ideally, more sizes with smaller gaps between them), high/low BB flip chip, frameset option, removable battery (which would make it easier to offer framesets, as batteries don't need to be shipped internationally), lower prices, maybe a cheap alloy option (but with the M2S motor or equally-powerful gearbox for us fatties).
 
Interesting thoughts on the Zebs


I've got 25/26 Uktimates and was gonna fire a WPS piston in them come service time but if the MY27s are still better then maybe I'll not bother and just go for them
 
Highland Wheels said:
Interesting thoughts on the Zebs


I've got 25/26 Uktimates and was gonna fire a WPS piston in them come service time but if the MY27s are still better then maybe I'll not bother and just go for them
Click to expand...

I have 25/26 with the WPS. FWIW I find the only way to get decent levels of mid support is by using 3 tokens, but then they lack composure over rougher riding terrain where I need to drop back to 1 token, at which point they lack decent mid support. I like them a lot but they aren't as good as Ohlins RXF.

I thought the WPS was very subtle (have it in my vivid too), worth doing? Maybe.

ntm95s post above sums it up nicely.​

 
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The Ohlins are quite a firmly camped fork arn't they? In comparison to soemthing like the Zeb that is a little more plush?

If the WPS wasn't a massive difference then maybe not worthwhile doing then
 
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Highland Wheels said:
The Ohlins are quite a firmly camped fork arn't they? In comparison to soemthing like the Zeb that is a little more plush?
Click to expand...

They can feel woody off the top until you get moving (mine are Jtech tuned with the spacer removed), definitely suit a faster rider but once I got a taste for the mid support I couldn't go back to anything else. Hence the 3 spacers in the Zebb.
 
mike172 said:
I have 25/26 with the WPS. FWIW I find the only way to get decent levels of mid support is by using 3 tokens, but then they lack composure over rougher riding terrain where I need to drop back to 1 token, at which point they lack decent mid support. I like them a lot but they aren't as good as Ohlins RXF.

I thought the WPS was very subtle (have it in my vivid too), worth doing? Maybe.

ntm95s post above sums it up nicely.​

Click to expand...
Sounds like they gave you the wrong tune. I think the piston kit has 5 possible shim stacks, so you might want to ask them to give you a firmer one on the next service. Unfortunately they won't share the details with customers so you can't easily do it yourself. I got the second-stiffest tune and the fork seemed to feel harsher after they installed the kit, but I can't be sure as I was off the bike for a few months with injury between riding the stock fork and the one with the kit.

I certainly wouldn't expect it to have a dramatic difference on performance, unless the tune is very different from the original, so I'm pretty sure the 2027 fork would be better for most people.
 
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