Avinox launch 1500w M2S motor and cheaper M2 motor

Highland Wheels said:
View attachment 181333

Bravo.


Extends the life of my Forbidden then by being able to go for the M2S down the line.
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I like the idea of being able to keep an older bike going down the line, are we sure that you’ll be able to buy an M2S off the shelf at some point though and retrofit it to an M1 equipped bike?

I took the above to read that all the various components are modular, but more for the flexibility it would give a manufacturer?
 
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I'd also hazard a guess that down the line, those folk thsy may need a new M1 motor through warranty or whatever may end up with an M2S as M1 stocks get used up?


Or I'm way off but it makes sense in my head 😂
 
Highland Wheels said:
One of my local dealers is going to find out for me. He's also planning in stripping a new AMflow later and seeing if the new stuff will fit straight into an older M1 bike
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I’m presuming you’d need the motor and display controller at the very least, although always possible that Avinox could provide a software update to enable M1 displays to work with M2S etc. Will the M1 batteries work with it, albeit in some kind of de-rated mode?

Good point about warranty replacements once M1 stock dries up though.

Edit: Reading again seems to say that previous generation displays and batteries compatible and vice versa. Perhaps some software updating necessary (OTA?) but can you buy the new motors standalone?
 
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Polar said:
Not all likes Avinox

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He speaks a lot in the video but does not seem to say very much in terms of actual facts.

At one point he says that, when starting pedaling, the Avinox motors take a 100-180 degree crank rotation before they kick in, while Bosch is only about a 10 degree rotation, so the Bosch is more responsive. I have yet to ride an Avinox, but that is a pretty stark contrast between 10 degrees and over 100 degrees, and I am surprised that I have not heard the point raised before. Anyone with Avinox and Bosch motors care to clarify the truth of the matter on how fast the motor kicks in when you start pedaling?

At another point in the video he says that the Avinox power delivery determination is cadence based, whereas the Bosch is torque based. I can't imagine that to be true as all high end mid-drive bikes use torque sensors to determine rider output, and scale the motor power delivery correspondingly. I think he may have been using sloppy languaging to describe a different "feel" in how the motor delivers the power, and different output characteristics for a given rider input. What he really may be feeling is a 800% support ratio vs. a 400% one. To him, that gives a feeling of a sort of autopilot on the Avinox where as long as your legs are moving (ie. cadence) the Avinox delivers a lot of power, while the Bosch requires more leg power, which he is calling "torque" and he interprets that as better "feel" for what the rear tire contact patch is doing on tech climbs. He doesn't address how dialing back the Avinox to eco or trail mode changes the picture.

I would genuinely like to see some other content from him on the topic that makes his case in a more clear and concise manner, and has less of a sort of "I'm telling you the real deal, but the other guys are just blowing smoke" attitude.
 
why is PX Carbon more expensive than PR: it has 100wh less battery and non removable battery?!
 
I've got an Amflow and a Canyon with CX5 and he is talking utter nonsense with cadence and torque.

I think he is just farming controversy and is not in any way presenting a serious balanced view. Not gonna give him the clocks anymore.
 
dadeadduck said:
I've got an Amflow and a Canyon with CX5 and he is talking utter nonsense with cadence and torque.

I think he is just farming controversy and is not in any way presenting a serious balanced view. Not gonna give him the clocks anymore.
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I think as @TheKaiser alluded to, it’s perhaps a language thing.

I’ve only ridden an M1 motor in the past, but it’s obvious it’s torque sensor based over cadence, but you do get more assistance per rider input watt, but that’s just a result of the power and torque outputs and the 800% assistance.

You only need 125w to generate the 1000w on that motor, even an updated Bosch CX Gen 5 requires 187w of rider input to deliver the max 750w, so they do feel very different.

Perhaps that’s what he’s describing, but in a clumsy way. I don’t really watch his output much anyway.
 
Wojtek said:
why is PX Carbon more expensive than PR: it has 100wh less battery and non removable battery?!
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The PX has the more powerful and slightly more efficient M2S motor rather than the cheaper less powerful but slightly lighter M2 motor. Also the 700w battery uses different cells that let it output more power all the time. It also allows for a more compact looking downtube.
 
Astro66 said:
Utter utter nonsense. When I pull up for a break. I always switch my Amflow to Eco or Off. Because if you put weight on the pedal. The bike tries to move off.
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You need to turn hill start/fast start or whatever it's called. off, mine doesn't do that at all but I've got everything switched off
 
Fangs2k said:
I’m presuming you’d need the motor and display controller at the very least, although always possible that Avinox could provide a software update to enable M1 displays to work with M2S etc. Will the M1 batteries work with it, albeit in some kind of de-rated mode?

Good point about warranty replacements once M1 stock dries up though.

Edit: Reading again seems to say that previous generation displays and batteries compatible and vice versa. Perhaps some software updating necessary (OTA?) but can you buy the new motors standalone?
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Tbf I'd wait until the 900+ battery is available later this year before considering doing it anyway. Providing it fits like the current 800wh
 
action99 said:
Come to Ticino we have plenty of (non published) tours of 1600-2000m with no restaurants or huts and best of all not many people around...
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i ride there all the time, lots of grottos with power connections?
 
Now I understand why Rennie stocks went so high in Germany!
Man, what a blow...

The good thing about having MO'POWA, is that you can tone it down on your usual Mode, and let it rip on thise step inclines!

The only thing I think about all that power, is that, hopefully VPN will easily "adjust" Speed Limit!
 
Roughshod said:
The PX has the more powerful and slightly more efficient M2S motor rather than the cheaper less powerful but slightly lighter M2 motor. Also the 700w battery uses different cells that let it output more power all the time. It also allows for a more compact looking downtube.
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Im talking PR Pro not standard.
 
@Rob Rides EMTB

In your video, you say the crestline can take the 600, 700 or 800Wh battery, but it seems the AMFLOW PR's battery is a new 800Wh. Can the PR take the 700Wh?
 
Rando_12345 said:
@Rob Rides EMTB

In your video, you say the crestline can take the 600, 700 or 800Wh battery, but it seems the AMFLOW PR's battery is a new 800Wh. Can the PR take the 700Wh?
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PR= removable battery, the RS800.

Crestline uses the existing 600wh and 800wh but also can fit the new 700wh.

The PR has a different interface to connect the battery to the motor. It wont be able to take the new 700 (it wont fit physically either).
 
TheKaiser said:
He speaks a lot in the video but does not seem to say very much in terms of actual facts.

At one point he says that, when starting pedaling, the Avinox motors take a 100-180 degree crank rotation before they kick in, while Bosch is only about a 10 degree rotation, so the Bosch is more responsive. I have yet to ride an Avinox, but that is a pretty stark contrast between 10 degrees and over 100 degrees, and I am surprised that I have not heard the point raised before. Anyone with Avinox and Bosch motors care to clarify the truth of the matter on how fast the motor kicks in when you start pedaling?

At another point in the video he says that the Avinox power delivery determination is cadence based, whereas the Bosch is torque based. I can't imagine that to be true as all high end mid-drive bikes use torque sensors to determine rider output, and scale the motor power delivery correspondingly. I think he may have been using sloppy languaging to describe a different "feel" in how the motor delivers the power, and different output characteristics for a given rider input. What he really may be feeling is a 800% support ratio vs. a 400% one. To him, that gives a feeling of a sort of autopilot on the Avinox where as long as your legs are moving (ie. cadence) the Avinox delivers a lot of power, while the Bosch requires more leg power, which he is calling "torque" and he interprets that as better "feel" for what the rear tire contact patch is doing on tech climbs. He doesn't address how dialing back the Avinox to eco or trail mode changes the picture.

I would genuinely like to see some other content from him on the topic that makes his case in a more clear and concise manner, and has less of a sort of "I'm telling you the real deal, but the other guys are just blowing smoke" attitude.
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It's lots of different opinions in how a motor feels and what's considered "best".
Also some of these reviewers get paid big money for each review.
All of these reviews should state what they earn on each video.
I like the bike and don't car what Rob or Alex say.
 
Polar said:
It's lots of different opinions in how a motor feels and what's considered "best".
Also some of these reviewers get paid big money for each review.
All of these reviews should state what they earn on each video.
I like the bike and don't car what Rob or Alex say.
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Lots of marketing BS that needs to be put on side.

There is a power limit for the older batteries with M2s that only one reviewer mentioned.

700wh gets full power. Not sure if the 800wh removeable one also gets peak 1500w or 1300w.

Nobody mentioned it specifically.

Love the bike and all updates, disapoointed with lack of 930wh battery only. And not sure if they fix the wheel issues, again nobody mentioned. Thats the problem with sponsored videos.
 
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Wojtek said:
Lots of marketing BS that needs to be put on side.

There is a power / torque limit for the older batteries with M2s that only one reviewer mentioned.

700wh gets full power. Not sure if the 800wh removeable one also gets peak 1500w or 1300w.

Nobody mentioned it specifically.

Love the bike and all updates, disapoointed with lack of 930wh battery only. And not sure if they fix the wheel issues, again nobody mentioned. Thats the problem with sponsored videos.
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The power outputs dependant in battery are mentioned in a couple articles I've read today.

I dont care so much for videos on them as they are all pretty generic but at least some of the articles have actual testing and figures in them.
 
PR got the removable battery many wanted but no one want to use a key to remove it instead of a bolt.
Bad research by Amflow.
 
Highland Wheels said:
The power outputs dependant in battery are mentioned in a couple articles I've read today.

I dont care so much for videos on them as they are all pretty generic but at least some of the articles have actual testing and figures in them.
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Thx. Which batteries get full power?
 
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