Yes, I have both.
The base is easier to modulate as it is a more linear ramp up.
10 out of 10 dentists prefer the base brakes...
SRAM Maven B1: Same Power, Better Delivery, and Upgrade Kits from £65
- Thread starter EMTB Forums Staff
- Start date
Nobody questioned the power from them, it's the strongest brake SRAM have made.
The base is easier to modulate as it is a more linear ramp up.
10 out of 10 dentists prefer the base brakes...
florian808
New Member
- Mar 4, 2026
- 2
- 3
I’ve had the B1 linkage kit on my A1 installed for a few days and rode over the weekend. While the lever feel is certainly easier (not as easy as my Hayes), it has a much longer dead stroke to get the pads to hit the rotor.
So, back to the shop I went for a bleed and the same feeling. I don’t like my lever almost against the bars for full power. It’s the same feeling after a bleed even with the contact dialed all the way out. I got the bleed done with the dialled all the way in.
Not recommending them after my two rides based on how I like my brakes set up. I’m getting another bleed done on Saturday and can report back then.
Here is a photo where power would start to build:
So, back to the shop I went for a bleed and the same feeling. I don’t like my lever almost against the bars for full power. It’s the same feeling after a bleed even with the contact dialed all the way out. I got the bleed done with the dialled all the way in.
Not recommending them after my two rides based on how I like my brakes set up. I’m getting another bleed done on Saturday and can report back then.
Here is a photo where power would start to build:
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PeterHenric
Member
For those people not wanting a light switch feel and don’t want to go the route of new levers, check out the MTX Red pads. They have the same power but don’t have that initial bite that the stock pads do. I’ve been very happy with mine. Only put them on the front and that’s been the ticket for me.
TitusDC
Member
I did the same thing, MTX Reds on front only and for sure they are less grabby then the stock SRAM metals. If you want to go with MTX make sure to bed them in per MTX instructions. A proper bed-in really helps with brake performance.
I was considering the B1 kit but still want to see what testers post about them. Don't like that the lever travel increased according to post #32.
Gila Man
Active member
Are the MTX Red pads quieter than the stock sintered pads? I've done two clean and sand and cleans on my front pads and rotor and they still howl when braking.
Gila Man
Active member
Did you do a bleed when you changed out your pads? I'm thinking of trying the Reds but I don't have a bleed kit. My stock brakes only have 400 miles on them so maybe the stock pads haven't worn enough that I can't just slide in the new pads.
PeterHenric
Member
I have noticed no noise whatsoever
PeterHenric
Member
You don’t need to do a bleed when putting new pads in. You can just use a plastic lever to push the pistons back inside. Just do it gently, but they should slide in with no issue.
KillerbeeDH
New Member
I followed the Maven since it came out about 2 years ago, and did some reverse engineering on it after initial impressions that they were awfully unbalanced. I want to lend some clarity to some of the confusion in this thread. All of this revolves around SRAMs idea of using a handle linkage cam called swinglink that takes linearity out of the lever stroke, altering the leverage curve from beginning to end stroke. Without swinglink (gray line in the graph), the leverage is close to the same throughout the stroke. WITH the original a1 swinglink cam in the handle, the first part of the stroke (see red line in the graph) moves lots of fluid, has a comparatively heavy breakaway force and very low hydraulic power. As the lever stroke progresses, past the pad contact point, clamping power is magnified (too much for many riders, especially on the rear) and there is a steep sudden rise in that red curve. This is what "impresses" a lot of people, the shear power increase appeals to the notion of more is better. Fair. The controversy spills out around whether this power is useful in that configuration, referring back to old wisdom, surplus power without control is not useful. I agree.
1. First point out of the way, Greg is a compelling idiot. He has lots of information, but also has dementia and is easily confused. The stuff he is quoted on earlier in this thread is AI gibberish. The a1 is the original "on-off" brake that has led to lots of conversation. The b1 is the new, refined, more modulating design recently released to the public.
2. There has been a lot of thread confusion when discussing lever breakaway force and modulation. The "Base" version Maven has NO SWINGLINK (SL) LINKAGE, so the controversy does not apply the the Base brakes. In fact the Base version is widely considered an improvement. The Bronze, Silver and Ultimate are impacted by the SL controversy.
3. ALL a1 linkage equipped (original) brakes have a 2lb (8 newton) breakaway force from the time they were released. THIS is the biggest element of controversy, ahead of Mavens moving bite point and "piston massage" requirement. That 2lb pull is the largest in the industry. The controversy is whether that impacts braking effectiveness from rider to rider. I personally assert that this is a design impediment to effective, intuitive single finger braking.
4. The swinglink (gold, red or whatever) linkage is the same approx design as the Code (black) swinglink, just more magnified in function.
5. IMPORTANT IN THE WHOLE lever feel debate. If you purchased new Mavens, or a bike with mavens, in the last few months, you may ALREADY HAVE the "improved" B1 linkage. This could be why you are on the side of this argument that just leaves you shrugging your shoulders. They simply feel and work in a way that feels familiar and may leave you puzzled about what everyone is talking about.
6. An a1 brake with the b1 upgrade kit does not have the same power as the new brake release, as claimed, however it is close enough for most people to not matter. It matters more if you are a BIG dude on a 60lb ebike. Mathematically the power increase of the original A1 equipped brake vs the latest b1 brake release (bronze, silver, ultimate) is about 8.5% due to different calipers pistons. The original larger 19.5mm caliper piston couple coupled with an 18mm in the original brakes makes the original A1 brake more powerful overall than the recently released dual 18mm caliper in the b1 brake. The new linkage kit does not change this.
7. The free stroke increase (undesired) of the upgrade kit is a result of the new linkage being less effective at moving fluid from the handle to the caliper. The same 8.5% hydraulic power disparity, yields commensurately more free stroke. More lever movement required to pad contact point. This can be compensated for in most cases by overfilling the caliper, I wont get into that here.
8. No, you cant swap only swinglinks around. The lever and SL design work together and go together.
Some thoughts. Going back to number 6, there is a case for using the newer (dual 18mm) caliper on the back, and older, stronger caliper on the front. The 9% less braking on the back will offer improved control in addition to using the kit to lessen the binary feel. Also food for thought, if you are going to find the strongest case for the upgrade kit, it is on the rear, for this and another reason explained here.
Several people like myself were loud about this brake when they first came out. One highly controversial video review was especially attention getting for Sram. My takeaway from the new kit is that Sram has acknowledged design mistakes and is trying to fix them here. They cut the breakaway force in half which is a big deal on 2 planes. If you ever spent 20 minutes on a long, moderately steep descent, say Porcupine Rim, it is self evident at the end of the run with reduced fatigue. More important to me, the traction control or "traction fidelity", particularly as felt on rear, is a clear improvement, and should leave anyone feeling safer on steeps. The higher lever breakaway force of the original brake (less finger fidelity if you will) makes it more difficult to not run into that brick wall of clamping power, IOW the original brake is easier to overshoot right into a rear tire lockup, noted by many many users
Master piston spring. The breakaway force with the B1 upgrade kit goes from 2 lbs to 1 lb. Considering that one of the next most powerful brakes (Dominion T4) dwarf even that number by 80% (3 oz breakaway), I still think there is improvement potential in using a lighter master piston spring, though that may require more trouble than sram was comfortable with. I also suspect that the spring was partly responsible for the bite point troubles many people were having. When combined with the aggressive swinglink, piston return was perhaps just too fast, possibly cavitating the piston area (bubbles coming out of solution), a hydraulic concept that I am going to avoid further describing. Sram seems to think that the new swinglink curve may address it just fine since it does slow down the rate of return of the caliper pistons. Somebody may dive into this theory with a spring company, probably not me.
Please feel free to sticky this.
1. First point out of the way, Greg is a compelling idiot. He has lots of information, but also has dementia and is easily confused. The stuff he is quoted on earlier in this thread is AI gibberish. The a1 is the original "on-off" brake that has led to lots of conversation. The b1 is the new, refined, more modulating design recently released to the public.
2. There has been a lot of thread confusion when discussing lever breakaway force and modulation. The "Base" version Maven has NO SWINGLINK (SL) LINKAGE, so the controversy does not apply the the Base brakes. In fact the Base version is widely considered an improvement. The Bronze, Silver and Ultimate are impacted by the SL controversy.
3. ALL a1 linkage equipped (original) brakes have a 2lb (8 newton) breakaway force from the time they were released. THIS is the biggest element of controversy, ahead of Mavens moving bite point and "piston massage" requirement. That 2lb pull is the largest in the industry. The controversy is whether that impacts braking effectiveness from rider to rider. I personally assert that this is a design impediment to effective, intuitive single finger braking.
4. The swinglink (gold, red or whatever) linkage is the same approx design as the Code (black) swinglink, just more magnified in function.
5. IMPORTANT IN THE WHOLE lever feel debate. If you purchased new Mavens, or a bike with mavens, in the last few months, you may ALREADY HAVE the "improved" B1 linkage. This could be why you are on the side of this argument that just leaves you shrugging your shoulders. They simply feel and work in a way that feels familiar and may leave you puzzled about what everyone is talking about.
6. An a1 brake with the b1 upgrade kit does not have the same power as the new brake release, as claimed, however it is close enough for most people to not matter. It matters more if you are a BIG dude on a 60lb ebike. Mathematically the power increase of the original A1 equipped brake vs the latest b1 brake release (bronze, silver, ultimate) is about 8.5% due to different calipers pistons. The original larger 19.5mm caliper piston couple coupled with an 18mm in the original brakes makes the original A1 brake more powerful overall than the recently released dual 18mm caliper in the b1 brake. The new linkage kit does not change this.
7. The free stroke increase (undesired) of the upgrade kit is a result of the new linkage being less effective at moving fluid from the handle to the caliper. The same 8.5% hydraulic power disparity, yields commensurately more free stroke. More lever movement required to pad contact point. This can be compensated for in most cases by overfilling the caliper, I wont get into that here.
8. No, you cant swap only swinglinks around. The lever and SL design work together and go together.
Some thoughts. Going back to number 6, there is a case for using the newer (dual 18mm) caliper on the back, and older, stronger caliper on the front. The 9% less braking on the back will offer improved control in addition to using the kit to lessen the binary feel. Also food for thought, if you are going to find the strongest case for the upgrade kit, it is on the rear, for this and another reason explained here.
Several people like myself were loud about this brake when they first came out. One highly controversial video review was especially attention getting for Sram. My takeaway from the new kit is that Sram has acknowledged design mistakes and is trying to fix them here. They cut the breakaway force in half which is a big deal on 2 planes. If you ever spent 20 minutes on a long, moderately steep descent, say Porcupine Rim, it is self evident at the end of the run with reduced fatigue. More important to me, the traction control or "traction fidelity", particularly as felt on rear, is a clear improvement, and should leave anyone feeling safer on steeps. The higher lever breakaway force of the original brake (less finger fidelity if you will) makes it more difficult to not run into that brick wall of clamping power, IOW the original brake is easier to overshoot right into a rear tire lockup, noted by many many users
Master piston spring. The breakaway force with the B1 upgrade kit goes from 2 lbs to 1 lb. Considering that one of the next most powerful brakes (Dominion T4) dwarf even that number by 80% (3 oz breakaway), I still think there is improvement potential in using a lighter master piston spring, though that may require more trouble than sram was comfortable with. I also suspect that the spring was partly responsible for the bite point troubles many people were having. When combined with the aggressive swinglink, piston return was perhaps just too fast, possibly cavitating the piston area (bubbles coming out of solution), a hydraulic concept that I am going to avoid further describing. Sram seems to think that the new swinglink curve may address it just fine since it does slow down the rate of return of the caliper pistons. Somebody may dive into this theory with a spring company, probably not me.
Please feel free to sticky this.
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Downhillr
Active member
Has anyone seen a review for update kit retrofit on A1? I read one somewhere (senility’s a bitch) but it was with caliper update as eell.
John_likes_bikes
Well-known member
Thanks for comfirming what SRAM said and saving me the time. My only slight gripe of the A1 is the free stroke, it's at the max of what feels right. No need to add more.
KillerbeeDH
New Member
After installing the b1 kit, you can lever stroke more fluid into the caliper with the wheel removed. Do it with the contact point adjusted all the way out. As the pads wear over time, use the adjuster to move the pads in. The free stroke is affected by the kit, and pad rub gets harder to adjust out. This is always the balancing act of the brake designer.
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TitusDC
Member
No I didn’t do a bleed. Just did the SRAM recommended massage.
Gila Man
Active member
I've installed the B1 lever tuning kit on my Bronze Maven A1 brakes and after some 10-20mph test runs on asphalt, find that they do a better progressive modulation of the brakes than the A1 levers. The initial "hard-bite" of the brakes is reduced and should make it easier to minimize lock-up once I try them in the dirt. Note, I still have the stock metal sintered brake pads in place. The free stroke of the lever, measured from out until pad contact, is approximately 1 inch. My testing is minimal at this point however, I like the "feel" of this setup better than the A1 stock levers. I'm not sure if this matters to anyone but, I wear size x-large gloves (long fingers).
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florian808
New Member
- Mar 4, 2026
- 2
- 3
Update to my first post: the B1 kit on the A1 Silver after another bleed have been spot on now. A tiny bit of free stroke, the bite point is noticeable but not as jerky as before. I can now build power similar to Hayes Dominion A4s. Yes they still have a heavier pull than Hayes. I’d say it sits between A1 Silver Mavens and Hayes Dominion A4. I’ll certainly update if things change but so far my original buyers remorse is completely gone.
Downhillr
Active member
Im considering tuning kit for my Silver A1, can you say where you've heard the modulation issue… trying to research before switching.
KillerbeeDH
New Member
Nothing could really make the original A1 swinglink (non-base model) modulation worse. There are many accounts of how the new b1 cam release has only improved lever modulation.
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John_likes_bikes
Well-known member
I don't know who the quote is attributed to but from the Pinkbike release review:
"All Maven (B1) calipers now feature four 18mm pistons, a configuration selected to optimize the hydraulic ratio when paired with the updated SwingLink architecture. Maven B1 Tuning kits are fully compatible with Maven A1 calipers that use the 19.5/18 mm piston layout. When installed on A1 systems, riders can expect a marginal increase in deadband—due to the slightly larger piston volume—and a subtle boost in peak power stemming from the higher mechanical advantage at full stroke."
Downhillr
Active member
Thanks, interesting, however, I’m less concerned with overall power and dead-band… looking for findings regarding modulation with this setup.
cosas_genericas
Member
Now this is the kind of content I want - BTW SRAM made undisclosed inline changes to the A1 without changing their consumer facing mfg SKU, but they were never able to resolve the piston issues and certainly weren't gonna fix the breakaway force as that was a function of the lever spring design. They spent quite a bit of time gaslighting people that their brakes were fine.
John_likes_bikes
Well-known member
My red splatter Mavens were a mess every 3 months. The Teal ones have been flawless since day 1. I always suspeced something changed.
KillerbeeDH
New Member
The lever torsion spring in the kit plays no role in lever tension. If you mean the piston compression spring, I never pulled it out to measure it, and doubt that is has a significant % of that 8 N pull. You can get rid of 20% of that breakaway force just by turning in the pad contact knob, that is all swinglink.
As to when they changed the SL in production, we may never know for sure. But that would explain a lot of online arguments.
Gaslighting is a common experience everywhere you go. Sadly it works on most idiots, which is most of us. Kudos to sram for doing anything with the copious amounts of feedback that they gathered. Shame on them for releasing a product that arguably was not the best version of itself. Water under the bridge, mostly.
KillerbeeDH
New Member
Perhaps someone with the kit can post some photos of the 2 swinglinks side by side.
From the SRAM Maven service manual under "Compatibility"
Full manual here: Maven Ultimate / Silver / Bronze / Base | SRAM
Gila Man
Active member
Today was my first ride in the dirt with the B1 levers. I find it much easier to modulate the brakes with the new levers. I have no buyer’s remorse at all.
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bmwpowere36m3
Member
Finally got around to installing a set of base Mavens and I'm not sold yet.
I've been using Shimano XTs for the last 5 years across multiple bikes, so I know them well. My last bike, first eMTB came with Code R brakes and surprisingly I got along with them fine... based on all the hate they get. They felt more familiar to XT, than not. Whereas the base Mavens are very different.
Only one ride so far on them and I have mixed feelings. While certainly powerful, they don't give me omg OTB vibes. Its the free stroke and soft bite point that's getting me. I bled and massaged them per various sources after installing them. The technique, after pushing and pulling on repeat, was to close off the lever first and get some spillage. Followed by piston massage. Then pressing fluid and lightly pulling at the caliper end. Finishing off by pressing fluid in and letting the system relax for a few seconds before closing of the BE port. I'm pretty sure that's overfilling the system (forcing it against the diaphragm in the lever body). A final advance of the pistons/pads against the thin pad spacer.
They just feel softer than Codes and certainly way softer than any Shimano servowave system. The free stroke and ramp in power also feels slow. I suppose, some of this was a given with the bases.
I've been using Shimano XTs for the last 5 years across multiple bikes, so I know them well. My last bike, first eMTB came with Code R brakes and surprisingly I got along with them fine... based on all the hate they get. They felt more familiar to XT, than not. Whereas the base Mavens are very different.
Only one ride so far on them and I have mixed feelings. While certainly powerful, they don't give me omg OTB vibes. Its the free stroke and soft bite point that's getting me. I bled and massaged them per various sources after installing them. The technique, after pushing and pulling on repeat, was to close off the lever first and get some spillage. Followed by piston massage. Then pressing fluid and lightly pulling at the caliper end. Finishing off by pressing fluid in and letting the system relax for a few seconds before closing of the BE port. I'm pretty sure that's overfilling the system (forcing it against the diaphragm in the lever body). A final advance of the pistons/pads against the thin pad spacer.
They just feel softer than Codes and certainly way softer than any Shimano servowave system. The free stroke and ramp in power also feels slow. I suppose, some of this was a given with the bases.
Singletrackmind
Well-known member
Very information information gents! Have a new bike arriving in June and it comes with Maven Ultimates & 200mm rotors f/r.
What size rotors are you riding and what would be your recommendation?
It seams SRAM recommends using smallest rotor possible because the Maven are so powerful. Thinking it's just marketing hype.
What size rotors are you riding and what would be your recommendation?
It seams SRAM recommends using smallest rotor possible because the Maven are so powerful. Thinking it's just marketing hype.
The B1 Tuning Kit is amazing and fixed the Mavens on and off feeling. I also love the Galfer Purple pads. I run 220mm rotors front and rear. My whole crew all got MTX Golds and we ALL hated them. They made so much noise and just sucked. I have no idea why people like them.
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