Santa Cruz Avinox , Fake or reality ?

[Astro66]

The rear end of the Teewing Turbo Force is far superior to the AMflow, try it when you have the chance.

I'd love to try it. But there is no LBS with it in stock to demo.

I am looking for a downhill sled with an Avinox Motor, to compliment the Amflow. I have decided not to Enduro the Amflow, and keep it super light. So I'm looking for something in 180/170 and 63 degree head angle. But I must be able to demo it before buying.

I mentioned it elsewhere. But I'm kind of hoping Avinox produce an MGU, then put it in a big hitting downhill rig. This I would buy in a heartbeat. If it was light enough. I might even sell the Amflow ......

 

[Biano44]

I'd love to try it. But there is no LBS with it in stock to demo.

I am looking for a downhill sled with an Avinox Motor, to compliment the Amflow. I have decided not to Enduro the Amflow, and keep it super light. So I'm looking for something in 180/170 and 63 degree head angle. But I must be able to demo it before buying.

I mentioned it elsewhere. But I'm kind of hoping Avinox produce an MGU, then put it in a big hitting downhill rig. This I would buy in a heartbeat. If it was light enough. I might even sell the Amflow ......

Maybe the M2 is an MGU.

 

[Astro66]

Maybe the M2 is an MGU.

Wishful thinking.

The only reports of an M2 are social media. So I'm not even sure it will happen. But even those reports say it will be heavier. I'd only consider lighter in a mid drive.

I would accept up to a 22-23kgs bike build in a MGU downhill sled.

 

[Polar]

I know what I'm talking about.

Impressive CV you're the man.

 

[Highland Wheels]

Wishful thinking.

The only reports of an M2 are social media. So I'm not even sure it will happen. But even those reports say it will be heavier. I'd only consider lighter in a mid drive.

I would accept up to a 22-23kgs bike build in a MGU downhill sled.

It's happening. Wait til Spring next year and there will be an abundance of new Avinox stuff and bikes using it

 

[Fangs2k]

My only advice. Get a life people.

I don’t think that dismissing anybody who doesn’t 100% agree with your view on something to ‘get a life’ exactly moves things forward either? This is a discussion forum, if it’s not for that then what is it for?

DJI/Amflow/Avinox threads do seem to have a sense of cult about them, it seems to go beyond pride in a ‘new toy’, and distills the whole essence of mountain biking down to one thing (power) and throws everything else out. Great if EMTB’ing for you is all about the power, somewhat grating to readers if it isn’t.

The ‘debate’, as we’ve seen on this thread, has people rushing to cite their qualifications and work experience in order to qualify their opinions, somewhat bizarre in itself, as well as again ignoring everything else that mountain biking is about.

Despite what you say, often first time e-bikers do regularly compare it to things they’ve never ridden or have any experience of and dismiss any criticism of what DJI are doing as just sour grapes.

Apple, DJI, Tesla, Bluetti to name but a few, all have a cult following. Great products? Undoubtedly. But, at some end of the scale, all are or have been pushed by social media influencers, including with free or loan product and that makes many people cautious or even cynical.

Throw in geo-politics, how social media has given everybody a platform right or wrong, AI, advertorial dressed as content, tribalism in an increasingly isolationist world and am I surprised that it ends up like it does? No.

I’ve said it before, everybody is on transmit, very few on receive and it seems incredible on some level that it’s filtering down to strangers discussing bikes on a forum, but here it is.

 

[Bomble]

So many threads on here about Avinox powered EMTBs, that people have tried, bought, tested, etc .... etc.... Nearly all on here have had a positive experience. None are getting free bikes.

Is is just possible that these Avinox powered EMTBs, are just good bikes, and there's no huge conspiracy going on here ? Just a thought ?

I waited 12 months for the hype to die down before trying the Amflow. But the hype remained and my experience when I tried, was also positive, and pretty much aligns with the reports. The hype appears to have substance. 9 months of ownership hasn't changed that opinion.

I own a Shimano motored EMTB and an Avinox powered EMTB. My content to this forum is almost exclusively on these bikes, and the components on them. I almost never enter Bose, Yamaha or Bosch threads, and the bikes they come on.

Here's the funny thing. No matter how much positive feedback I give on my Shimano motored EMTB, in the Shimano or Merida threads, I never get called names. Yet I cannot make a single positive comment on Avinox motored EMTB, in an Avinox thread, without being called a fanboy and weird.

That ^^^^^ is weird. Not people giving positive reveiws. It's also weird all these people who have no connection to Avinox, trolling Avinox threads to call out owners and testers who are having a positive experience with their new EMTBs.

My only advice. Get a life people. Ride the bikes you own, and make constructive reviews of them. Whether a positive or negative comment is not important. This helps people reading these threads, that are here to read FIRST HAND reports of bikes they are interested in.

If you really just want to read threads and partisipate, no matter the brands. Then maybe go in with an open mind, that the people who own these EMTBs, might actually know what it is truly like to live with these EMTBs. Once again, just a thought.

I do actually agree it’s a great bike

 

[Fangs2k]

It's a leading e-bike in terms of power-to-weight ratio; only time will tell if it lives up to the hype.

View attachment 170901

Sure, but again, are Santa Cruz going with an Avinox option or not?

 

[Bomble]

Mondraker are

 

[Fangs2k]

Although there are rumors and expectations in forums and social media about the possibility that brands like Santa Cruz will adopt Avinox in the future, to date there is no official confirmation nor any models in the catalog that include it.

You wonder why you sound like AI?

You said almost identical in posts #53 and #68?

 

[Plyphon]

I think the "fervour" goes equally hard both ways. Many posters desperate to cling onto the status quo and incumbent brands. Often using 'moral highground' as ways to look down on those who support Amflow. Even going as far to create (quite frankly hilarious) allegations that the Chinese are using these bikes to spy on them doing absolutely mediocre laps around the blue route at their local trail centre.

 

[RustyMTB]

I think the "fervour" goes equally hard both ways. Many posters desperate to cling onto the status quo and incumbent brands. Often using 'moral highground' as ways to look down on those who support Amflow. Even going as far to create (quite frankly hilarious) allegations that the Chinese are using these bikes to spy on them doing absolutely mediocre laps around the blue route at their local trail centre.

Moral high ground, evidence based observation, take your pick.

China intimidated UK university to ditch human rights research, documents show

Sheffield Hallam University apologises to Professor Laura Murphy for restricting her academic freedom.

www.bbc.co.uk

If you think the Chinese are all about rating your awesome whips, then I can explain it to you but I can't make you understand it.

Most people retain the ability to hold competing notions simultaneously - clearly that doesn't apply universally but it ought to be possible to grasp that an Amflow is a genuine disruptor, irrespective of (endlessly) whining about derestriction or the frame or whatever & also retain a healthy distrust based in reams of evidence over the independence of the manufacturer.

 

[Powerslider]

While the concern has been centered around drones and not mountain bikes, DJI being considered a national security threat is well established and goes back to at least 2017. Odd that people aren’t seemingly aware of this. The US Department of Defense has officially classified DJI a “Chinese military company” since 2024. But hey, maybe some guy in his shed setting sag on his mountain bike has better information.

 

[Fangs2k]

The English say "There's nothing so queer as folk" the Spanish say "Those were the days when there was only one fool in every town."
Or
"The knowledge chases you, but you run faster."

Nothing you carry on saying convinces me you aren’t an AI chat bot.

Actual people usually spot rhetorical questions, bots less so.

Oh, by the way, that translation sucks, the two don’t mean the same at all.

But, thanks for the insults regardless, you’re fast fitting in here…

 

[Biano44]

Wishful thinking.

The only reports of an M2 are social media. So I'm not even sure it will happen. But even those reports say it will be heavier. I'd only consider lighter in a mid drive.

I would accept up to a 22-23kgs bike build in a MGU downhill sled.

Moral high ground, evidence based observation, take your pick.

China intimidated UK university to ditch human rights research, documents show

Sheffield Hallam University apologises to Professor Laura Murphy for restricting her academic freedom.

www.bbc.co.uk

If you think the Chinese are all about rating your awesome whips, then I can explain it to you but I can't make you understand it.

Most people retain the ability to hold competing notions simultaneously - clearly that doesn't apply universally but it ought to be possible to grasp that an Amflow is a genuine disruptor, irrespective of (endlessly) whining about derestriction or the frame or whatever & also retain a healthy distrust based in reams of evidence over the independence of the manufacturer.

Love my Amflow but would say that Avinox (DJI) is the disruption and not the fairly average frame of the Amflow.

 

[Polar]

While the concern has been centered around drones and not mountain bikes, DJI being considered a national security threat is well established and goes back to at least 2017. Odd that people aren’t seemingly aware of this. The US Department of Defense has officially classified DJI a “Chinese military company” since 2024. But hey, maybe some guy in his shed setting sag on his mountain bike has better information.

Privacy is gone long time ago whether it's your grocery store, local or foreign authorities or your neighbors, accept it and live with it.

 

[RustyMTB]

In fair

Love my Amflow but would say that Avinox (DJI) is the disruption and not the fairly average frame of the Amflow.

While I was referring specifically to the motor, they are still indivisible though.

And Tooks, if you accuse someone of being an AI, then you should expect a response in kind before reflexively casting yourself as a victim. Maybe try taking your own medicine for once.

 

[Astro66]

While the concern has been centered around drones and not mountain bikes, DJI being considered a national security threat is well established and goes back to at least 2017. Odd that people aren’t seemingly aware of this. The US Department of Defense has officially classified DJI a “Chinese military company” since 2024. But hey, maybe some guy in his shed setting sag on his mountain bike has better information.

You seem to have left out that when DJI appealed the ruling in court. The court confirmed DJI’s long-held position that DJI is not controlled by the government and has no ties to the military.

But don't let the facts get in the way of a good American Story .......

https://www.dji.com/au/media-center/announcements/dji-statement-us-court-ruling-regarding-department-of-defense

We can go back and forth about this all day. But in an EMTB forum. Can we talk about bikes here, or are you guys going to turn this site into another political battleground ? I ride my EMTB to get away from this crap.

Fella's. Try riding your bikes.

 

[Fangs2k]

In fair

While I was referring specifically to the motor, they are still indivisible though.

And Tooks, if you accuse someone of being an AI, then you should expect a response in kind before reflexively casting yourself as a victim. Maybe try taking your own medicine for once.

View attachment 170904

Why are you so exercised about my views?

It’s a moderator in this very thread that first played the AI card, and the poster was addressing me so kind of my business to address as I see fit and not yours.

If you want an argument please carry on, and please understand I’m not wounded, just sick of contributions from needlessly antagonistic posters who get distressed when the discussion gets a bit more than black and white.

 

[Fangs2k]

Google Traslate

No, not the actual post translation, but it doesn’t matter, let’s move on.

 

[RickBullotta]

FI don’t think that dismissing anybody who doesn’t 100% agree with your view on something to ‘get a life’ exactly moves things forward either? This is a discussion forum, if it’s not for that then what is it for?

DJI/Amflow/Avinox threads do seem to have a sense of cult about them, it seems to go beyond pride in a ‘new toy’, and distills the whole essence of mountain biking down to one thing (power) and throws everything else out. Great if EMTB’ing for you is all about the power, somewhat grating to readers if it isn’t.

The ‘debate’, as we’ve seen on this thread, has people rushing to cite their qualifications and work experience in order to qualify their opinions, somewhat bizarre in itself, as well as again ignoring everything else that mountain biking is about.

Despite what you say, often first time e-bikers do regularly compare it to things they’ve never ridden or have any experience of and dismiss any criticism of what DJI are doing as just sour grapes.

Apple, DJI, Tesla, Bluetti to name but a few, all have a cult following. Great products? Undoubtedly. But, at some end of the scale, all are or have been pushed by social media influencers, including with free or loan product and that makes many people cautious or even cynical.

Throw in geo-politics, how social media has given everybody a platform right or wrong, AI, advertorial dressed as content, tribalism in an increasingly isolationist world and am I surprised that it ends up like it does? No.

I’ve said it before, everybody is on transmit, very few on receive and it seems incredible on some level that it’s filtering down to strangers discussing bikes on a forum, but here it is.

FWIW - I'm very critical. skeptical and analytical on of any kind of tech, including and especially bikes, and just recently purchased an Amflow PL Pro. I am blown away how well this bike performs, on every level. Extremely happy with it. I've owned KTM, Specialized, and Pivot eMTBs previously for reference (as well as many XC, trail, and enduro MTBs). It's the best handling eMTB I've ridden. Feel very close to my Hightower or Ripmo. And that power - wow.

 

[Fangs2k]

FWIW - I'm very critical. skeptical and analytical on of any kind of tech, including and especially bikes, and just recently purchased an Amflow PL Pro. I am blown away how well this bike performs, on every level. Extremely happy with it. I've owned KTM, Specialized, and Pivot eMTBs previously for reference (as well as many XC, trail, and enduro MTBs). It's the best handling eMTB I've ridden. Feel very close to my Hightower or Ripmo. And that power - wow.

I’ve seen your posts about the new bike and glad you’re stoked with it!

I don’t think most people are trying to say it’s a terrible bike, myself included, if I needed or wanted more power from my current e-bikes I’d likely have one already.

I think it’s just the baggage that goes with it and how it must have rendered all other bikes pointless and irrelevant that irks.

I hold more store on a view from folks like yourself who’ve been riding a while and have had a number of bikes and motors to compare to. Those who’ve had one other old bike to compare and have gone from inexperienced to ‘expert’ on the back of spending a few thousand bucks not so much.

 

[RickBullotta]

I’ve seen your posts about the new bike and glad you’re stoked with it!

I don’t think most people are trying to say it’s a terrible bike, myself included, if I needed or wanted more power from my current e-bikes I’d likely have one already.

I think it’s just the baggage that goes with it and how it must have rendered all other bikes pointless and irrelevant that irks.

I hold more store on a view from folks like yourself who’ve been riding a while and have had a number of bikes and motors to compare to. Those who’ve had one other old bike to compare and have gone from inexperienced to ‘expert’ on the back of spending a few thousand bucks not so much.

I was super skeptical as well - particularly wasn't psyched about the risk to trail access that megapower bikes could cause, and also concerned about the spyware aspect of a connected bike. Once I realized those were avoidable concerns I decided to give it a go. That plus the fact that I was able to sell my Levo at a decent price!

I'm sure there are other midweight eMTBs that can provide similar handling (Shuttle SL/AM, perhaps), but I'm digging the Amflow thus far.

 

[Plyphon]

If your concern is "The Chinese™" tracking you they do not need to employ expensive ebikes in order to do so.

They can do that just fine today.

 

[Ndanger]

The lacquered interior of the Teewing Turbo Force frame, showcased by Paco from Ebike Guadarrama in his engaging video, perfectly reflects the combination of groundbreaking price and premium quality that distinguishes this brand.

First off, I really appreciate the perspectives you bring to the forum, and I respect your passion for the sport, I'm not looking to sound overly critical at all. In fact, I think Teewing has all the right elements to become a successful brand, and it's definitely something I’d consider myself. I just wanted to offer a different take on the sentence you mentioned above, which I feel could be a little over-inflated.

Regarding the frame's interior: the gloss near the opening looks more like overspray from a coating applied to the exterior of the frame for that glossy finish, rather than a true "lacquered interior." If you take a closer look at the picture, the inside of the frame has more of a dull, chalky finish, which suggests it’s not actually coated with lacquer. Any finish on the inside of a frame would most likely be mold release.

In fact, it’s unlikely the interior is finished with lacquer at all. More realistically, it’s probably one of the following:


2K Urethane Clear Coat: This is a durable, UV-resistant coating that gives a deep, glossy finish. It's commonly used in both automotive and bike frames because it's tough and resistant to scratches and chemicals.

Polyurethane Clear Coat: Also a great choice for carbon fiber and composite materials, it’s tough and offers long-lasting protection. It’s a popular option for frames that need to withstand wear and tear.

Acrylic Urethane Clear Coat: A higher-end product that’s often used for more specialized, premium finishes.

Again, I'm not trying to take away from the quality or market approach of Teewing, it's a solid brand with a lot of potential. Just thought I'd share my take on the finish, as it's a bit different from what's been described.

 

[ZR1]

Is that a press release or something, looks like a pretty standard carbon frame, if anything - missing premium features like fancy cable routing that some have

 

[Zimmerframe]

Is that a press release or something, looks like a pretty standard carbon frame, if anything - missing premium features like fancy cable routing that some have

Reads like a press release from Teewing or associated promoters.

It's getting tiresome - he's been doing it for what ? a year now ?? Longer ?? Not sure what the point is of endlessly posting press releases and adverts from elsewhere on the forum.

Half the time I think he just randomly copies posts from facebook about any bike. Thanks, but I hate facebook and don't use it - I don't want the same junk thrust in my face endlessly here. Maybe I'm a minority and people just love reading self gratification promotion material ?

Once again, it's got absolutely feck all to do with the actual thread.

Just to make everything even more scintillating on the forum for us - he's posted exactly the same thing in the teewing thread - obviously there was nothing Santa Cruz on facebook to post in there today.

Is he a bot ? or a bored 8 year old ?

 

[Katmandou]

No recent information on a partnership between Avinox and Santa Cruz ?

 

[Geew]

If Pivot presents an Avinox m.2 model on April 9 (from a reliable source). Why wouldn't Santa Cruz do it?

 

[TheKaiser]

If Pivot presents an Avinox m.2 model on April 9 (from a reliable source). Why wouldn't Santa Cruz do it?

Pivot? Didn't they just introduce a new Bosch Enduro bike a few weeks ago? That would be pretty far out if they have an Avinox bike coming out less than 2 months later. If true, it will be interesting to see if they are going for a different travel bracket with the Avinox bike, or if they are trying to do different motor options on the same platform, kind of like Crestline was for a little while, before they phased out the others in favor of Avinox.