Bosch Smart system 750WH

[Oddy72]

Just bought a new Mondraker Chaser R , with smart system 750 WH BATTERY .
Did my first ride . 15 miles, and battery dropped to 64% , mainly eco mode, mainly on road.
Does this seem right or just because it new?
My Orbea wild 500 wh battery , does a similar range , mainly off road , lot of steep hills , and maybe only loses 20 % . Hoping this is just because it’s new. Any advise would be appreciated.

 

[JP-NZ]

There are a few posts on here already, I believe there is a patch/fix coming from Bosch for the Powertube 750

Ive also read that the Bosch system has to learn how you ride the bike as it starts to estimate your usage a bit more, and not negating the fact that batteries take 4-5 cycles to reach full capacity

 

[Oddy72]

There are a few posts on here already, I believe there is a patch/fix coming from Bosch for the Powertube 750

Ive also read that the Bosch system has to learn how you ride the bike as it starts to estimate your usage a bit more, and not negating the fact that batteries take 4-5 cycles to reach full capacity

Thanks for that info , wonder if anyone has had the same issue when buying a new bike, but then after a few charges the battery is better for range, charged mine to 100% on first day, checked it next day without riding it and it had dropped by 2%, my hard tail Orbea , never dropped % , even if left for a week . Hopefully Bosch , drop this update very soon eh

 

[Justinitus]

There was an app and software update recently, where they unlocked the anti-theft feature and a few other bits. My bike updated it’s software but not sure if this was the “fix” for the battery range as mines been ok.

 

[Oddy72]

There was an app and software update recently, where they unlocked the anti-theft feature and a few other bits. My bike updated it’s software but not sure if this was the “fix” for the battery range as mines been ok.

Thanks mate , yeah I did the software update yesterday, I’ve fully charged bike again, having a trek out today up Keswick area , skiddaw maybe . So will put to test . I was supprised how fast the battery % went down on my first short trip , I really hope it’s sorted.
what sort of range /% are you getting , which bike do you have mate. Cheers

 

[Fatsweaty]

Crafty R 750wh here. Sunday 24.5 miles left me 59% . Tame xc and roads with not a great deal of climbing . Bike is few weeks old. Also did the Update . My first Emtb so I have nothing to compare with or be concerned currently.

What I have noticed is the battery display goes down pretty quick in the first 5-10% battery of a ride then seems to level out .

 

[Yoak]

I’ve been surprised a few times now. I’m on a 2021 9.8, and my friend just got his 2022 9.8. When we have been out together the batteries seems to be depleted at the exact same range. He weighs a little bit more than me, but it wasn’t a big difference in range when we were both on 2021 Rails.

 

[Oddy72]

Crafty R 750wh here. Sunday 24.5 miles left me 59% . Tame xc and roads with not a great deal of climbing . Bike is few weeks old. Also did the Update . My first Emtb so I have nothing to compare with or be concerned currently.

What I have noticed is the battery display goes down pretty quick in the first 5-10% battery of a ride then seems to level out .

That don’t seem to bad I suppose , nearly 25 miles on 40%. I’ll be out this afternoon on mine. Ill out an update on later. Thanks for your input . Fingers crossed Bosch rope out an update to fix any issues

 

[Fatsweaty]

That don’t seem to bad I suppose , nearly 25 miles on 40%. I’ll be out this afternoon on mine. Ill out an update on later. Thanks for your input . Fingers crossed Bosch rope out an update to fix any issues
[/QUOTE

I weigh 100kg and bike is a Large probably 25-26kg . I updated my bike this week post last ride so I can’t say whether the update has had any affect.

 

[Oddy72]

I weigh 100kg and bike is a Large probably 25-26kg . I updated my bike this week post last ride so I can’t say whether the update has had any affect.

I’m

I weigh 100kg and bike is a Large probably 25-26kg . I updated my bike this week post last ride so I can’t say whether the update has had any affect.

I’m 82 kg , so 15 miles on 36% of my battery seems a bit crap . Really hope Bosch can sort it . I bought bike from Staffordshire, 140 odd miles away so I can’t be bothered taking it back of there’s a problem. See how this ride goes today

 

[Yoak]

For comparison, I get 35km on my 2021 Rail in EMTB mode. Single track only and usually around 1000m vertical. That’s riding quite hard and I’m pretty worn out myself by then. 80kg
Michelin Wild Enduro around 25psi. Tyres can make a difference of about 5 km in my experience.

 

[devargos]

have a few rides on it and see what the real world range is and if it changes its estimations. I do remember at first the range predictions on the app seemed low but when I rode i got much further than it was estimating.

I get way better range on it compared to my old bosch 500w it feels like I can almost do twice as far.

 

[Justinitus]

I‘m also 100kg and bike is 25ish kg - Cube Reaction EXC750. I’ve done a total of 170km now on one and a half full charges ( currently reading 51%). Mainly tarmac, canal towpath, gravel tracks, light trails - some steep climbs in there too. I’ve ridden it on all modes, including ”off” for about 10km. I find the tour+ mode works really well for me and I seem to get the best range from it. Apparently it’s like a lower power emtb mode which varies the assistance depending on how much effort you put in. I think.

About 30km of that mileage is on Victoria Mezcal 29x2.35“ tyres, the rest on the standard Smart Sam 29x2.6” ones. Certainly easier on the Mezcals riding beyond the limiter or with the assistance off, so I guess they must use less battery too.

I haven’t ridden the bike since I did the software update yesterday though.

 

[Oddy72]

have a few rides on it and see what the real world range is and if it changes its estimations. I do remember at first the range predictions on the app seemed low but when I rode i got much further than it was estimating.

I get way better range on it compared to my old bosch 500w it feels like I can almost do twice as far.

Hi mate. Done 15 miles today off road mainly, probs more tour plus mode. Battery down to. 70% , seemed to drop quick to 82% . Stayed on that for a while , but mainly on down hill. Will see how things go from here . Only thing . My 500 battery don’t seem to drop much at all , did 2 miles today on the new bike , and started to lose battery ? Who knows. I thought my new bike. Would be far better on range. Maybe it’ll change in the coming weeks .

 

[Oddy72]

So I’ve done 8 full charges now on my bike. Noticed that the ranges are slowly going up now , fluctuating quite alot during the ride, which it never really did before. So at the min my start up eco mileage is 62 miles, think when I bought it the eco range was 45. Seems to be better now .

 

[JP-NZ]

So I’ve done 8 full charges now on my bike. Noticed that the ranges are slowly going up now , fluctuating quite alot during the ride, which it never really did before. So at the min my start up eco mileage is 62 miles, think when I bought it the eco range was 45. Seems to be better now .

near enough to 100km on eco. That’s nothing to be sneezed at.

 

[irie]

We have 2022 Trek Rail 5's with 500w batteries and Bosch Gen 4 CX motors. Reckon our range on ECO is well over 50 miles/80km. Higher motor modes do eat battery but that's to be expected. Wife and I about 80kg.

 

[Oddy72]

We have 2022 Trek Rail 5's with 500w batteries and Bosch Gen 4 CX motors. Reckon our range on ECO is well over 50 miles/80km. Higher motor modes do eat battery but that's to be expected. Wife and I about 80kg.

Well I hope my 750 battery keeps on improving , it’s slowly getting better. My mates 625 battery ranges seem better than mine , time will tell I guess

 

[Yoak]

When I’ve been out with friends on the 2022 rail 9.8s we have been surprised how close our range seems to be. Percentage sees to drop at the same level. I’m on a 2021 9.8. On top of that, my battery is 2500km “old”

 

[Oddy72]

My friend rides a cube 140 stereo with a 625 battery, his ranges seem better than my 750 . My battery drains quite quick. Especially the first 20 %.
estimated ranges from 100% seem accurate. My ranges at first never fluctuated ,it’s only started doing that now. Each full charge , my eco range goes up by about 2 miles ,I think from my first full charge my eco range was about 45 , now is about 65 miles

 

[Rusty]

I think from my first full charge my eco range was about 45 , now is about 65 miles

I would be happy with 65km on my 625Wh without excessive conservation attempts (riding power off).
504Wh Shimano or Spesh I was around 40-42km. With the Spesh 700Wh or the Bosch 625 I can do 50km normal riding or 60 if I use mainly Eco.
Rather than continuing to up the battery size ... AND bike weight, I would prefer lighter, more efficient battery packs at a price between 30 & 50% less than the current ridiculous prices they are charging. FFS, the retail cost of the batteries is only about a couple hundred quid.

 

[irie]

New battery technologies emerging in the next few years are expected to have at least 4 times the energy density of current batteries. Coupled with lighter more efficient motors this is expected to reduce a current (Bosch) motor+625 battery weight of 2.9+3.5 = 6.4kg to perhaps 1.8+1=2.8kg. So 20kg eBikes should be widely available.

Edit: Didn't know about the Trek Fuel EXe when the above post was made. Wonder how much they'll cost? No need for battery extenders with future increased battery power densities.

Trek unveils the all-new Fuel EXe - A fresh mid-powered e-mountain bike

The brand new Fuel EXe from Trek claims to balance the line between an acoustic mountain bike and a full e-bike, claiming to have developed the world's most invisible assist. It gets a motor designed by TQ, a 360Wh battery, and is said to weigh just 18.4kg. Here's everything you need to know.

off.road.cc

 

[Swissrider]

I think comparing range with others, even with the same bike is not very helpful. We all know that it is very difficult to calculate range because it can vary greatly as there are so many factors involved. However, with several years and thousands of ebike kilometres behind me I reckon I can calculate my individual range quite accurately, certainly more accurately than either my Bosch or Shimano does (my Brose doesn’t bother). The bike estimates range on a combination of how much battery charge one has left and what type of riding one has been doing. The bike assumes you are going to continue do do the same, whether uphill, downhill or flat but of course it doesn’t know so it can be wildly out. The biggest variable for range is the rider, how strong they are, how much effort they put in and how heavy they are. For an individual rider, weight is not going to change and most will put in similar amounts of effort each ride. Thus, for an individual rider range is pretty consistent and relatively easy to predict. For myself, I find altitude gain is by far the most significant factor affecting range. On my Kenevo with a 500w battery I know I can do 1000m of uphill with about 30k of distance. More than that, I’m probably going to run out of battery. If I do a ride down to the valley from the ski resort I live in, I know that I need 60% battery to go ride back home. I’ve quite often got home with only 5% left but only once run out completely, with about 200 painful metres left to go!I think this is one of the reasons it’s a good idea to record rides so that one builds up a kind of data base to be able to plan rides that are within range. If one buys a bike with a bigger battery this opens up new possibilities as do the increasing amount of charging stations being set up, at least here in Switzerland. I have been surprised by how much difference weight makes and ebikeing is one sport where being light is a distinct advantage. Quite often I’ve read with various devices I’ve owned with lithium batteries that full performance is not obtained until several complete charge and discharge cycles, so this might explain disappointing Bosch 750w batteries. The best thing to do would be to have a standard ride, preferably with lots of climbing, do the whole lot in Turbo and repeat this several times to see if less battery is used over time.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Crap posts deleted. Be nice

 

[JP-NZ]

Just to bump this back up, after a 58km (36 mile) ride on the weekend, I observed some interesting behaviour from the range estimates.

Someone on another thread mentioned the range estimates work like a car so if your driving foot flat everywhere after a while the range will drop very fast. On the bike whilst I was halfway (2km) into 400m elevation climb the battery was dropping quite quickly, once I reached the top it was 62% and started down a traverse downhill the battery remaining at 62% the whole way (1km+/-), then as I started finished another climb of around 200m elv it stayed at 62% and range stayed the same.

I can only imagine it works by analysing the last few minutes of riding and then bases its range estimates off that

 

[Bummers]

Just to bump this back up, after a 58km (36 mile) ride on the weekend, I observed some interesting behaviour from the range estimates.

Someone on another thread mentioned the range estimates work like a car so if your driving foot flat everywhere after a while the range will drop very fast. On the bike whilst I was halfway (2km) into 400m elevation climb the battery was dropping quite quickly, once I reached the top it was 62% and started down a traverse downhill the battery remaining at 62% the whole way (1km+/-), then as I started finished another climb of around 200m elv it stayed at 62% and range stayed the same.

I can only imagine it works by analysing the last few minutes of riding and then bases its range estimates off that

Surely range estimation and battery % level are not related like that. Range estimation is exactly that, a guess at how far you can go based off whatever parameters it uses for the calculation.
Battery % is just monitoring the stored energy of the battery?

 

[JP-NZ]

Surely range estimation and battery % level are not related like that. Range estimation is exactly that, a guess at how far you can go based off whatever parameters it uses for the calculation.
Battery % is just monitoring the stored energy of the battery?

I was as confused as you, was the 1st charge cycle so perhaps BMS is still learning the ropes?

 

[Landy Andy]

Just to bump this back up, after a 58km (36 mile) ride on the weekend, I observed some interesting behaviour from the range estimates.

Someone on another thread mentioned the range estimates work like a car so if your driving foot flat everywhere after a while the range will drop very fast. On the bike whilst I was halfway (2km) into 400m elevation climb the battery was dropping quite quickly, once I reached the top it was 62% and started down a traverse downhill the battery remaining at 62% the whole way (1km+/-), then as I started finished another climb of around 200m elv it stayed at 62% and range stayed the same.

I can only imagine it works by analysing the last few minutes of riding and then bases its range estimates off that

Isn't that how they all work??

I assumed so as that is how my 625 Bosch works. If I cycle with m6 trailer in the back my range plummet, and takes a while to get it back to standard range. And on the other side if I do loads of road cycling the range goes way higher. So it adjusts your range to how much effort the motor is putting in.

 

[Rusty]

I was as confused as you, was the 1st charge cycle so perhaps BMS is still learning the ropes?

Ride by ride. Started today going up Apoamoana in Tour and was at 82% at the top, but at the bottom of Te Poaka I was showing 85%. Think there is some smart tech going on under the hood.

 

[Mikerb]

Not sure why folk pay any attention to range predictions! The only time it will be anywhere near accurate is when you have been riding for a mile or two and the rest of your planned ride will be the same terrain in the same power mode and gear.