TQ Motor cost? Out of warranty

[JP-NZ]

Hi all,

Looking at a 2nd hand EX-E with 980km on it. Just thinking for worst case scenario... Has anyone had to buy a motor out of warranty and if so what is the cost? Or does TQ sell new motors or only through LBS?

Thanks

 

[Mteam]

Been wondering the same myself, I think my motor is on the way out and is now out of warranty.

Trek list the high pivot version of the motor for sale on their site in the UK for £1499, which seems a bit pricey, and it does specifically state high pivot, so I guess is in some way incompatible with the fuel-exe.

You can find the regular hpr50 for sale in the us for about $870 usd, link below.

TQ Systems GmbH HPR50 Drive Unit Set | Tree Fort Bikes

www.treefortbikes.com

I reckon if you took an out of warranty bike to your trek dealer they'd sort you out with a new one, but no idea on the cost, I'm guessing around £700, based on that us price

 

[mmcengineer]

Been wondering the same myself, I think my motor is on the way out and is now out of warranty.

Trek list the high pivot version of the motor for sale on their site in the UK for £1499, which seems a bit pricey, and it does specifically state high pivot, so I guess is in some way incompatible with the fuel-exe.

You can find the regular hpr50 for sale in the us for about $870 usd, link below.

TQ Systems GmbH HPR50 Drive Unit Set | Tree Fort Bikes

www.treefortbikes.com

I reckon if you took an out of warranty bike to your trek dealer they'd sort you out with a new one, but no idea on the cost, I'm guessing around £700, based on that us price

I wonder if bikes are included in the right to repair legislation

 

[Mteam]

I wonder if bikes are included in the right to repair legislation

They are not, I checked. Or at least were not about 12 months ago when I checked

 

[mmcengineer]

They are not, I checked. Or at least were not about 12 months ago when I checked

What 'Right to Repair' means for e-bike sellers and manufacturers

Repair will become the standard for all electronic consumer goods in the EU. What does this mean for the electric bicycle industry?

www.bike-eu.com

Is the reason I asked

About June this year article ?

 

[Mteam]

When I last looked, the right to repair mostly applied to household appliances, washing machines, dishwashers, TV etc, it didn't apply to bikes/ebikes.

It looks like the EU changed the laws recently to include more product types like mobile phones , but I still don't think (from a quick google) ebike motor systems are included Possibly li-ion battery packs are now included though...

 

[mmcengineer]

When I last looked, the right to repair mostly applied to household appliances, washing machines, dishwashers, TV etc, it didn't apply to bikes/ebikes.

It looks like the EU changed the laws recently to include more product types like mobile phones , but I still don't think (from a quick google) ebike motor systems are included Possibly li-ion battery packs are now included though..

I did a bit more reading up on it now and it seems like the blocker is the actual bike companies a couple of which are trotting out the non serviceable line ,

Having said that maybe it's just easier to buy a tqTQ as pin rings ( harmonic drives are a bit more highly strung than meshing gears) maybe we can both find out when my TQ fails I'll pull it to bits

 

[FuelEXe_fan]

My fuel EX-e has 5300Km, and the TQ motor works just fine.

 

[FuelEXe_fan]

Been wondering the same myself, I think my motor is on the way out and is now out of warranty.

Trek list the high pivot version of the motor for sale on their site in the UK for £1499, which seems a bit pricey, and it does specifically state high pivot, so I guess is in some way incompatible with the fuel-exe.

You can find the regular hpr50 for sale in the us for about $870 usd, link below.

TQ Systems GmbH HPR50 Drive Unit Set | Tree Fort Bikes

www.treefortbikes.com

I reckon if you took an out of warranty bike to your trek dealer they'd sort you out with a new one, but no idea on the cost, I'm guessing around £700, based on that us price

What makes you think your TQ motor is "on the way out"? I have 5300 km on my Fuel EX-e and it is working just fine, I asked Trek and TQ for any maintenance required and I have not heard back from them, does anybody know what kind of maintenance is needed? how often?

 

[Mteam]

What makes you think your TQ motor is "on the way out"? I have 5300 km on my Fuel EX-e and it is working just fine, I asked Trek and TQ for any maintenance required and I have not heard back from them, does anybody know what kind of maintenance is needed? how often?

The main bearing (the one that the chain ring rotates on) is really noisy and feels rough when it rotates, it makes the sound a wheel bearing makes when it has lost all it's grease and has gone slightly rusty.

Plus there is more resistance when you turn the cranks than it used to have.

The motor still seems to be working fine, but it doesn't sound or feel good.

 

[Mteam]

What makes you think your TQ motor is "on the way out"? I have 5300 km on my Fuel EX-e and it is working just fine, I asked Trek and TQ for any maintenance required and I have not heard back from them, does anybody know what kind of maintenance is needed? how often?

I don't think there is any maintenance you can do, it's a sealed unit. As far as I know it's not user serviceable.

 

[Jatem]

It is easy to side the axle out of the TQ towards the right side, when the chainring has been removed. The right main bearing isn’t sealed, and can let water into the crankshaft sprag clutch. The sprag clutch has a plastic carrier, and is breakable, so you can’t get a bearing puller behind the main bearing to slide it off the axle. I replaced the right main bearing with a 3d printed clamp in a vise, holding the outside of the bearing.

 

[Mteam]

It is easy to side the axle out of the TQ towards the right side, when the chainring has been removed. The right main bearing isn’t sealed, and can let water into the crankshaft sprag clutch. The sprag clutch has a plastic carrier, and is breakable, so you can’t get a bearing puller behind the main bearing to slide it off the axle. I replaced the right main bearing with a 3d printed clamp in a vise, holding the outside of the bearing.

That's interesting, got any pictures of the process to replace the main bearing?

Or could you describe the process in more detail?

 

[Jatem]

That's interesting, got any pictures of the process to replace the main bearing?

Or could you describe the process in more detail?

Here’s the non sealed bearing that comes in the right side of the hpr50. They should have used a double sealed 2rs version.
With the chainring and lockring removed, and the two wavy washers removed, tap the axle gently towards the right.
Need to use the blue axle cover to safely reinstall the lockring when done.


Don’t wedge the bearing off the axle with a screwdriver or similar, you will damage the plastic sprag clutch.
I couldn't fit a bearing puller between the bearing and the sprag clutch, so I designed & 3d printed some clamps for my vise that grab onto the outside of the 6806 bearing, and I tapped the axle out of the cartridge bearing.

 

[Mteam]

And as if by magic my motor has started giving error 049c drv sens err when it is switched on.

It was running fine yesterday, I did 14 miles, but this morning it just gives this error when you turn it on


Will let you know what trek/tq say.

This is my second motor to fail, the first was replaced under warranty in early 2023.

 

[whitymon]

FYI the pivot is only going to work with the slash+ and there is no reason it would be less or more expensive.

You can find the classic motor for 850€ at the moment.

@Jatem feel free to share with us the 3D model might be useful for us. You replace the bearing then? Any reference ?

 

[Jatem]

FYI the pivot is only going to work with the slash+ and there is no reason it would be less or more expensive.

You can find the classic motor for 850€ at the moment.

@Jatem feel free to share with us the 3D model might be useful for us. You replace the bearing then? Any reference ?

I replaced the 6806 bearing with a double sealed version (6806-2RS or 6806-LLB). The clamp was very simple, two halves that sit around the outer surface of the bearing, allowing it to be clamped in a vice.

 

[whitymon]

I think I get it @Jatem but still wish to get your 3D model either by DM or on thinkgiverse something like that, if it work community would be pretty pleased of this.

I found also some repair shop saying the same about the bearing with some reason without seal but not really to them either.

I get we could all do this but it is still unclear to me how hard it would be to do so, can’t picture clearly how to remove the shaft and bearing or should it wait warranty expired?

 

[Mteam]

I think I get it @Jatem but still wish to get your 3D model either by DM or on thinkgiverse something like that, if it work community would be pretty pleased of this.

I found also some repair shop saying the same about the bearing with some reason without seal but not really to them either.

I get we could all do this but it is still unclear to me how hard it would be to do so, can’t picture clearly how to remove the shaft and bearing or should it wait warranty expired?

Whilst its true that bearing has no seals, it is situated behind the chain ring lock ring (when the chain ring is fitted) which has 2 seals, one lip seal that seals round the pedal crank shaft, and another o ring seal that seals the thread that the chain lock ring screws into (you can see in the picture below). So I'm not sure that this bearing really should be replaced with a bearing with seals - I guess it can do no harm to replace it with one with seals except to add a small amount of friction and void the motor warranty.

I'd be surprised if thats a major weakness ,as its a pretty big thing for TQ to miss , the rest of the motor seems well engineered and thought out.

I've seen the same post on facebook by the australian (I think) motor repair company talkign about the lack of seals on that bearing, and in the photos it certainly looked like water had got in- maybe the very early motors didnt have the seals on the lock ring?!

 

[whitymon]

I read that one too, this is a good question, is this just not enough or is it new?
I don’t think this is new tbh, found no info of it and the blue cap seems to be there since day one.

 

[Mteam]

So, last week (as per my post up there) my motor failed outside of warranty, I took it back to my local trek dealer and trek have fitted a new motor free of charge outside warranty, so that's great service from trek and the bike shop.

So I still can't answer what it would have cost to replace it if I were paying....

 

[Mteam]

I got my bike back today with my outside of warranty but foc motor, while I was in I asked what it would have cost if I was paying. The answer was that the official list price is 877 euro inc vat etc

 

[Magnacus]

A question for those who have replaced the motor themselves: does the new motor have to be "married" to the system, or does it make no difference to the TQ system if you replace a single component?

 

[Jatem]

A question for those who have replaced the motor themselves: does the new motor have to be "married" to the system, or does it make no difference to the TQ system if you replace a single component?

In order to load firmware into a new (blank) TQ motor, the serial number of your frame needs to be entered into the TQ service software. The serial number needs to be valid in the TQ database, as a bike that originally comes with a TQ. It is helpful to have a shop that can do this for you.

 

[whitymon]

Is there really blank motor you can get?

I am also not sure you can put the firmware you want on any motor, or maybe only once if it is blank?.

For example the slash+ use a peculiar version of the TQ motor which is explicitly mentioned several times in the manuals. Maybe the motor have different parts which I doubt or already custom settings that no dongle can override.

If it was only sync/update from dongle they would certainly just warn us to do the update/upgrade/sync first.

 

[Magnacus]

In order to load firmware into a new (blank) TQ motor, the serial number of your frame needs to be entered into the TQ service software. The serial number needs to be valid in the TQ database, as a bike that originally comes with a TQ. It is helpful to have a shop that can do this for you.

Thank you. That clarifies that you can replace the motor yourself, but not put it into operation. All components are connected and registered.
At the very least, you would need the dongle, the software, and a registered dealer or service access to TQ.
Basically the same as with Bosch.

 

[Theragra]

TQ Dealer Portal B2B shop says "Motor in stock only for warranty claims". This makes me really nervous, as i might be in need of a new motor soon. Bike is bought a few years ago, warranty long gone.
Moreover, I bought over internet, because I live in a small country and town. At the moment when I bought my bike, there were even no my bike brand(BMC) dealers in my country.

But discussion here was helpful in a way: if it comes to that, I will ask internet store (bike24) I bought bike at to help. I spent a lot of money there, maybe they will be merciful. There is also local BMC dealer now, maybe they can bend the system a little.

 

[wheelsx2]

Well, my motor blew last Sunday.
JRA and suddenly I hear the unmistakable sound of plastic gears slipping. Any amount of torque applied results in a skip, so it wasn't just a couple of teeth. Thankful that turning off the assist allowed me to pedal out.

I took the bike to Trek and it took them 5 days to finally look at in and tell me what I already new. Motor busted, can't be fixed, would I like to order a new one? Then they had the temerity to not know what the price is. Guessing $1100 or $1000 based on the "high pivot V3 listed" for $1100 on trek.com.

It appears that I can get one from Treefort Bikes for $840 or eBay for $700. Thinking that if I get it from Trek, I should get a 2 year warrranty. Possibly the same from Treefort, but hassle factor is higher. Ebay- you're on your own.

I am also contacting TQ about the possibility of getting it fixed. For Pete's sake, it's a plastic drive gear. It's going to fail.

I had 4624.5 miles and 1477 hours on the bike before the failure. Since the warranty expired in December, I have had to replace the display and the battery, and now the motor. That's some awesome planned obsolescence.

 

[Pastvne]

Well, my motor blew last Sunday.
JRA and suddenly I hear the unmistakable sound of plastic gears slipping. Any amount of torque applied results in a skip, so it wasn't just a couple of teeth. Thankful that turning off the assist allowed me to pedal out.

I took the bike to Trek and it took them 5 days to finally look at in and tell me what I already new. Motor busted, can't be fixed, would I like to order a new one? Then they had the temerity to not know what the price is. Guessing $1100 or $1000 based on the "high pivot V3 listed" for $1100 on trek.com.

It appears that I can get one from Treefort Bikes for $840 or eBay for $700. Thinking that if I get it from Trek, I should get a 2 year warrranty. Possibly the same from Treefort, but hassle factor is higher. Ebay- you're on your own.

I am also contacting TQ about the possibility of getting it fixed. For Pete's sake, it's a plastic drive gear. It's going to fail.

I had 4624.5 miles and 1477 hours on the bike before the failure. Since the warranty expired in December, I have had to replace the display and the battery, and now the motor. That's some awesome planned obsolescence.

Exactly the same thing last week with about 1200 miles on the bike, and out of warranty. So much for Pin Rings being more bullet proof than belts or gears. But, I did appreciate being able to pedal the 12 miles back to base without power. Could not have done that on my Bosch.

 

[wheelsx2]

Still waiting to hear back from TQ support.

Trek asked for $1100 for a new motor. During research, I learned that QBP is the US Distributor for TQ now. Searching for a motor led me to a few shops that claimed to have 8 units available. These are clearly shops that are selling from QPB inventory. I called Tree Fort Bikes and asked about the warranty and they said they honor the manufactures warranty through QBP. I ordered a new motor for $834.

There was one on eBay for 700 OBO. I was tempted but decided that something tied directly to QBP was safer. I hope.

Depending on what I hear from TQ, I may be doing a teardown of the failed motor. I would love to be able to buy the Harmonic pin ring and try and fix it. The motor seems fine other than the skipping teeth.