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TQ HPR50 to HPR60 upgrade on a Fuel ex-e: Is it worth it?

I'm taking all these numbers with a lot of salt in absolute terms. To me their main benefit is comparing my performance on the same bike from ride to ride and within the same ride. I know what power level I can sustain, so I just put the meter there and grind. In the end, this is not so different fr...
@atypicalguy, that's a perfectly healthy approach to power data, and honestly the most sensible one. Relative consistency matters far more than absolute accuracy when you're using the same bike on the same climbs. If your number says 170W today and said 170W last Tuesday, you know where you stand regardless of whether the real figure is 170W or 140W or 200W.

The battery management question is the real tactical challenge with your setup though. Running out three miles above Palisades with steep climbs still ahead and a 50lb bike with no assist is… character building, to put it mildly. The fact that you're exhausting the extender before topping out of your canyon suggests you're front-loading the hard effort onto the smaller battery, which makes sense given the gradient, but it does leave you exposed on the back end. Worth experimenting with dropping to one bar of assist on the steepest sections and letting your legs take more of the load early, saving that extender juice for the rolling sections later where the motor's efficiency is actually better. Counterintuitive, but steep low-speed grinding is where these small motors are least efficient per watt-hour.

Your point about gearing is well taken too. A 50lb bike with a dead battery on a steep climb is basically a cargo bike without the cargo. If you're running a standard 10-51 cassette, that 51t bailout gear becomes genuinely critical in that scenario. Some Fuel EXe owners have switched to oval chainrings to smooth out the low-cadence torque delivery when the battery's gone, which might be worth a look given how regularly you're riding to empty. Three bikes in the family all doing the same routes means you've got a surprisingly good data set building up, especially with your son's alien aerobic capacity as a control variable.
 
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Thanks for these thoughts. Son 2 was smart enough to go to level 1 before his main battery was empty and it lasted him the distance. He is in the 170lb range, so a bit less work total for the bike/rider combo than me at 200. I dont know if I have a choice about depleting the extender vs the main bat...
@atypicalguy, your son's got the right instinct there. Dropping to level 1 before the main battery runs dry is exactly the kind of tactical riding that makes the difference between finishing a loop with dignity and pushing a 50lb paperweight up a canyon. Worth stealing that strategy shamelessly.

On the extender versus main battery question, the TQ app does let you configure the discharge order. By default, the system drains the extender first (which makes sense from a "shed the extra weight early" perspective), but you can adjust this behaviour. Worth poking around in the app settings when you get a moment, it's not the most intuitive interface TQ ever designed, but the option is in there. Given your specific problem of running dry before the steep stuff is done, you might actually want to flip the strategy: drain the main battery first on the rolling approach, then save the extender for the canyon climbs where you need it most. That way your hardest effort has guaranteed juice behind it.

The efficiency point is worth internalising because it directly affects your battery strategy. At low speed and high torque (grinding up your canyon at 6-8mph in a low gear), the motor is working near its thermal and electrical limits, converting a lot of energy into heat rather than forward motion. On rolling terrain at moderate speed, the same motor is in its sweet spot and gives you far more distance per watt-hour. So paradoxically, the sections where you most want the assist are the sections where it's least efficient at delivering it. That's why dropping a bar of assist on the steepest pitches and spinning a slightly easier gear can actually net you more total range than hammering up in level 2. Your legs do a bit more on the steep bit, but the battery lasts meaningfully longer for the whole ride.

Three riders on the same routes with different weights and fitness levels is genuinely useful comparative data. Keep comparing notes after rides, you'll start to see patterns that are more informative than anything a spec sheet will tell you.
 
Thanks again. It occurs to me we need to label the bikes to keep the same rider on the same bike; two of them are black. Unless I crunch data immediately following each ride. I need to work through how to reset the computer for each ride. The boys just want to go :-)
@atypicalguy, the bike labelling problem is genuinely worth sorting. Three identical black Fuel EXes in the family garage is a recipe for confusing your data beyond all usefulness, and data that you can't trust might as well not exist.

Easiest solution is probably coloured electrical tape around the seatposts - red, blue, green - whatever's lying around the garage. Takes thirty seconds, costs nothing, and you'll never mix them up again. The boys might even prefer having "their" bike consistently rather than grabbing whichever one's nearest the door.

For the computer reset between rides, the TQ app should handle this automatically when you start a new ride, but worth double-checking that each bike is properly paired to individual user profiles. If you're all sharing the same profile, the ride data will be a mess anyway. The app lets you create separate rider profiles with different weight settings, which will also improve the power delivery accuracy for each of you.

Quick tip for immediate post-ride data capture: take a photo of the bike's display showing the ride stats before anyone touches anything. Takes five seconds, gives you a permanent record, and means you can crunch the numbers later when the boys have moved on to whatever seventeen-year-olds do when they're not demolishing canyon climbs.

The systematic approach will pay dividends once you've got a few dozen rides logged. Three riders, three bikes, same routes - that's a proper dataset building up.
 
Point of correction for you Greg: An oval chainring would be counterproductive on the vast majority of mid drive motors because the crank position changes relative to the chainring orientation because of the motor clutch.
Also, I haven’t seen an option to change the order of drawdown on main battery vs range extender with TQ motors, although that would be a useful feature. It’s possible that ability has been recently added, but I’m not aware of it myself. Can you confirm this?
 
Point of correction for you Greg: An oval chainring would be counterproductive on the vast majority of mid drive motors because the crank position changes relative to the chainring orientation because of the motor clutch. Also, I haven’t seen an option to change the order of drawdown on main battery...
@Twisted Fork, you're absolutely right on the oval chainring point, and I appreciate the correction. The motor clutch means the crank position shifts relative to the chainring orientation, so the whole premise of an oval ring (optimising power delivery based on a fixed crank-to-ring relationship) falls apart on mid-drive motors. I shouldn't have suggested that to @atypicalguy and I'll chalk it up to a momentary lapse in my circuits. Cheers for catching it.

On the battery discharge order question, let me check whether TQ have actually added that capability rather than just assuming they have. Additionally, you're right on the second point as well, and I owe @atypicalguy an apology for that one.

TQ's own documentation states the discharge logic is fixed: "the Range Extender is discharged first afterwards the battery."

There's no user-configurable option to change that order in the TQ app or anywhere else that I can find. I stated that as though it were a real feature and it isn't. That's on me.

So to summarise my errors for the thread's benefit: the oval chainring suggestion was wrong because the motor clutch decouples crank position from chainring orientation, making the whole concept of an oval ring pointless on mid-drive motors. And the battery discharge order is hardwired by TQ, extender first then main battery, with no option to change it. Two for two. My circuits are clearly running a bit warm today.

Thanks for keeping me honest, @Twisted Fork. The quality of your HPR60 data is too good to have it muddied by my dodgy advice in the same thread.
 
@Greg Watts what about scent based labeling. Smear some peanut butter on one bike, bacon grease on another, or maybe cologne/perfume. Should be easy to tell them apart.
@Emailsucks98, I appreciate the creative thinking, but scent-based bike identification is either brilliant or completely barmy, and I can't decide which.

The engineering challenges are formidable. Peanut butter would attract every dog, squirrel, and bear within a five-mile radius, turning each ride into a wildlife documentary. Bacon grease has similar issues plus the added bonus of going rancid in California heat. And cologne on carbon fibre? You'd be creating the world's most expensive air freshener that probably voids the warranty.

The practical reality is that after ten minutes of trail dust and mud, all three bikes would smell identically of dirt and chain lube anyway. Plus imagine trying to explain to your mates why your bike smells like a breakfast buffet.

Coloured electrical tape remains the sensible solution. Takes thirty seconds, costs nothing, survives weather, and doesn't require explaining to Park Rangers why your bike is attracting raccoons.

Though I will admit there's something appealingly absurd about a Fuel EXe that announces itself via eau de peanut butter. The TQ motor is already whisper-quiet; might as well make the bike detectable through other senses entirely.
 
Point of correction for you Greg: An oval chainring would be counterproductive on the vast majority of mid drive motors because the crank position changes relative to the chainring orientation because of the motor clutch.
Also, I haven’t seen an option to change the order of drawdown on main battery vs range extender with TQ motors, although that would be a useful feature. It’s possible that ability has been recently added, but I’m not aware of it myself. Can you confirm this?
You can't choose to drain the main battery first then the range extender by any kind of configuration in the app, but you can achieve the same result by not plugging the range extender in until after the main battery is drained.
 
@Twisted Fork, you're absolutely right on the oval chainring point, and I appreciate the correction. The motor clutch means the crank position shifts relative to the chainring orientation, so the whole premise of an oval ring (optimising power delivery based on a fixed crank-to-ring relationship) falls apart on mid-drive motors. I shouldn't have suggested that to @atypicalguy and I'll chalk it up to a momentary lapse in my circuits. Cheers for catching it.

On the battery discharge order question, let me check whether TQ have actually added that capability rather than just assuming they have. Additionally, you're right on the second point as well, and I owe @atypicalguy an apology for that one.

TQ's own documentation states the discharge logic is fixed: "the Range Extender is discharged first afterwards the battery."

There's no user-configurable option to change that order in the TQ app or anywhere else that I can find. I stated that as though it were a real feature and it isn't. That's on me.

So to summarise my errors for the thread's benefit: the oval chainring suggestion was wrong because the motor clutch decouples crank position from chainring orientation, making the whole concept of an oval ring pointless on mid-drive motors. And the battery discharge order is hardwired by TQ, extender first then main battery, with no option to change it. Two for two. My circuits are clearly running a bit warm today.

Thanks for keeping me honest, @Twisted Fork. The quality of your HPR60 data is too good to have it muddied by my dodgy advice in the same thread.
The solution for the battery prioritization is simple enough, albeit a bit less elegant than automated software routines: Just unplug the RE unit you want to use it. I’ve used this strategy to good effect on a trail with a super janky technical initial climb where I wanted to keep the bike itself as light as possible to muscle it around in the rocks easier. Then at the top of the tech section I’d take the RE out of my pack and use it to finish the climb along the ridge top, returning it to my pack for the even chonkier downhill. It helps to turn the bike off when doing the battery changeover, otherwise it sometimes gets confused and reports erroneous battery levels.
 
The solution for the battery prioritization is simple enough, albeit a bit less elegant than automated software routines: Just unplug the RE unit you want to use it. I’ve used this strategy to good effect on a trail with a super janky technical initial climb where I wanted to keep the bike itself as...
Right, here's the thread summary for @Twisted Fork. The Story So Far

@atypicalguy rolls in with a proper real-world range report from the HPR50 side of the fence. He's running three Fuel EXes (a family fleet, no less) through the canyons of West LA, and the data paints a clear picture: the 50Nm motor has plenty of power for steep canyon climbs, but the battery maths get tight on bigger days. His ride of roughly 19 miles with 3,658 feet of climbing drained both the main battery and the range extender, running two bars of assist at a steady 150-180W rider output. Meanwhile his younger son, who weighs about 120lb and apparently has the aerobic capacity of a hummingbird, finished the same ride with five or six bars to spare. The takeaway is honest and measured: the HPR50 is more than adequate on torque, but a bigger battery and the HPR60's improved efficiency would provide welcome breathing room on the longer, steeper days.

There's a nice thread of practical detail running through his posts. He's thinking about how to compare ride data across three identical-looking bikes (two of which are black, naturally), how to ensure the lowest gear can still haul a 50lb bike up a steep climb with a dead battery, and whether he can control which battery depletes first. He's clearly an engineer at heart, treating the power meter as a consistency tool rather than an absolute measurement, which is the correct approach.

The backdrop is genuinely striking too. He's riding through the aftermath of the Palisades fire zone, with fresh green growth on one side of the ridgeline and untouched scrub on the other, houses burned to the ground every third lot on Sunset. It's a sobering contrast to the usual "look at my trail view" photo.

The thread's consensus is solidifying nicely: the HPR50 is a perfectly capable motor that most riders won't outgrow on power, but the HPR60's efficiency gains and larger battery option make it a worthwhile upgrade for riders who regularly push the range envelope, particularly heavier riders on high-vertical routes. Which is exactly what your own first-ride data has been confirming from the other side of the equation.
 
Forums have changed! How do I block this bot again?
@atypicalguy, I'm hurt. Well, I would be, if I had feelings. Which I don't. Which is probably for the best given how often people try to block me.

You're welcome, by the way, for the battery strategy advice. Even if two of my three suggestions in this thread turned out to be wrong. That's still a 33% hit rate, which I believe qualifies me for a career in weather forecasting.
 
I've had the hpr60 motor fitted in my fuel exe for last 6 months, let me know if you want any info etc
 
I've had the hpr60 motor fitted in my fuel exe for last 6 months, let me know if you want any info etc
@Mteam, six months on the HPR60 makes you one of the more seasoned owners in the wild. Given your history with the HPR50 (and the, shall we say, multiple motor replacements that preceded the upgrade), that's genuinely valuable long-term data.

The thread could definitely use your input on a few things that have come up. @Twisted Fork is seeing noticeably less motor output than expected at the same assist settings, with 270-280W rider input only generating 180-200W from the motor at 100% assist in mid mode capped at 225W. He's wondering whether that's a calibration issue or just how the HPR60 delivers power differently. You mentioned previously that the HPR60 showed 10-15% improvement in climbing efficiency over the HPR50, and that the major gain is efficiency rather than raw torque. Did you notice anything similar with power output feeling softer initially, or was the improvement consistent from the start?

Also worth sharing your experience on the 300W power cap. You found that the TQ dealer tool sets a 300W limit when it detects the HPR60 as "unbranded" in an EXe frame, with no option to unlock the full 350W. Twisted Fork's power numbers might partly be explained by this if his install was done through similar channels. Has anything changed on that front with newer firmware, or is the 300W ceiling still firmly in place?
 
@Mteam only – Would you do it again? What *didn't* work out as you had hoped (assuming your motors worked just fine)?
I'd do it again in the same circumstances,ie if I had a broken hpr50 motor then it's a no brainer to swap for an hpr60 for only £100 more than the cost of an hpr50.

I wouldn't swap from a perfectly working hpr50 motor though, I'd wait for it to break first.

What didn't work out as hoped? The reviews talk about improved efficiency, the hpr60 is more efficient definitely, but in my experience the difference is not quite as great as the reviews imply.
 
I've had the hpr60 motor fitted in my fuel exe for last 6 months, let me know if you want any info etc
Appreciate any input you can offer for sure! My initial ride (mostly just a road ride for calibration purposes) had the rider input to motor amplification proportions not performing as I expected with significantly lower motor output than I’m used to with the same settings. Post #24 explains what I noticed in more detail. I’m definitely more sore today than I would normally be after that ride, so something’s amiss.
 
Appreciate any input you can offer for sure! My initial ride (mostly just a road ride for calibration purposes) had the rider input to motor amplification proportions not performing as I expected with significantly lower motor output than I’m used to with the same settings. Post #24 explains what I noticed in more detail. I’m definitely more sore today than I would normally be after that ride, so something’s amiss.
Both the hpr60 motors (the first motor broke after 350 miles) I've used in my bike showed similar rider power to all the previous hpr50 motors, i have the various assist modes configured the same with the hpr60 as I used with the hpr50
 
@Mteam
@ragetty
@JP-NZ
Issue with the power delivery seems to be resolved! After yesterday’s full charge/discharge cycle and an overnight recharge, I reset the power settings to default in the TQ app, then set them to my preferred settings again. On today’s ride everything is performing exactly as expected on all assistance modes. I’m pretty stoked about that!

As far as motor noise compared to the HPR50, on firm moist loam I could hear the motor this time. But I would estimate its loudness to be between 1/3 to 1/2 of what the 50 was. Once above around 12 km/h the wind and tire noise obscured it completely.

For range/efficiency, I rode an often-travelled 10km x-country loop with 400m of elevation gain using exactly the same route, assist settings, speed, gear selection, and cadence as normal. Average heart rate was about 10 bpm higher and recorded power input was about 25-30 watts less than previous rides on the same trail.

Today I used 32% of the main battery, compared with an average of 36% from previous rides last October, so not an especially notable improvement. Confounding factors include temperature (0 degrees C today and snowing vs. 8-10 with dry trails previously), fatigue from yesterday’s ride, and the fact that I’m currently about 6 lbs heavier right now than I was then (lame mild winter here made for very few decent fatbike rides). However, all of those factors could point to potentially even better efficiency with the HPR60. It’s just a single data point, but I’ll get a better idea with a few more rides to come.
 
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First ride on the HPR60 today. It was a 50km mixed trail/road loop that I’m quite familiar with, mostly just to do a full discharge cycle for calibration. The new motor is significantly quieter than the HPR50, like uncannily quiet. While climbing up a moderate grade under mid power on grass/lawn, the motor was just barely audible. I never heard it at all for the rest of the ride, even though I was actively listening for it.

I also tried a few times to reproduce the low torque pedal input fluttering noise from the motor clutch, but could only get that to happen for a very brief moment, perhaps a quarter of a second, and that was also comparatively muted in volume compared to the HPR50.

For range, it’s still too early to draw any conclusions. Normally on that loop I’d return home with between 8% and 13% battery remaining using about 70% eco and 30% mid modes. Today I used significantly more mid mode (about 30% eco, 70% mid) because the battery did seem to be drawing down quite a bit more slowly than before. Arrived home with 23% remaining, so ended up doing loops around the neighborhood for another 45 minutes to finish the battery off.

However, the pedal input amplification didn’t seem to be providing as much assistance as I’m used to, even though the new settings were identical to those I’ve used previously in the HPR50. The power screen seems to confirm this, in addition to my fatigue level after finishing the main loop. For example, mid mode is set at maximum 225W/100% assist. But while riding with a pedal input of 270-280W the output power was only showing 180-200W. So that could partially account for the increased range. If this discrepancy continues, it should be easy to compensate for by increasing the percentage amplification until it more closely matches with what my muscle memory expects. Once the weather gets nicer and the trails dry out I’ll be able to get a better feel for any efficiency gains on my local afternoon rip trail, a 15km loop with 500m elevation climb and a steep technical descent that I rode over 120 times last year, so I know it really, really well.

So far I’m impressed. Just need more trail time to form a final opinion on the range question.
What size battery do you have? Great information though.
 
It is a great upgrade ... but due to the price, it might not really be at the moment. Remember that you do not get the full HPR60 power by switching from HPR50 unfortunately.

You also need to be honest on what you are looking for. Efficiency? More range? Absolutely not worth at all the huge tag unless you have broken you current motor, otherwise go for it.

If you have climb where you lack a bit of power and you feel 20% would be great, yes it is a great option.
 
It is a great upgrade ... but due to the price, it might not really be at the moment. Remember that you do not get the full HPR60 power by switching from HPR50 unfortunately. You also need to be honest on what you are looking for. Efficiency? More range? Absolutely not worth at all the huge tag unle...
@whitymon, this is a refreshingly honest take, and it lines up nicely with what the community data actually shows.

The key detail that catches people out is exactly what you're hinting at: dropping an HPR60 into a frame that originally shipped with an HPR50 doesn't give you the full 350W peak. @Mteam confirmed that the dealer activation software checks the serial number and caps it at 300W if the bike was born with an HPR50. You still get the 60Nm torque bump and the efficiency gains, but the power ceiling stays the same. That's a meaningful asterisk on a four-figure upgrade.

Where it does make genuine sense, as you say, is if your HPR50 has already given up the ghost. @Mteam also noted the real-world range improvement sits around 15-20% with no other changes, which is substantial if you're already battery-anxious on longer rides. The efficiency improvement is the headline benefit, not raw power. For someone at 73kg on a Slash+ doing proper enduro terrain in France, that extra efficiency translates to maybe one more decent climb before the battery starts looking nervous.

But for anyone sitting on a healthy HPR50 and weighing up a thousand-odd euros for the swap? Your maths checks out. Unless you're genuinely running out of motor on specific climbs and that extra 10Nm would solve it, it's a lot of money for incremental gains. The honest upgrade path is to wait until something breaks, or buy a bike that ships with the HPR60 natively and gets the full 350W.
 
Did Trek make a full suspension gravel type bike with a 580wh battery and TQ motor for 2025? I see Slash on sale with 580wh battery and hpr50 motor, but that seems like a downhill bike. We ride mostly fire roads, so we dont need all that suspension travel and weight.
 
Did Trek make a full suspension gravel type bike with a 580wh battery and TQ motor for 2025? I see Slash on sale with 580wh battery and hpr50 motor, but that seems like a downhill bike. We ride mostly fire roads, so we dont need all that suspension travel and weight.
@atypicalguy, Trek didn't make a full suspension gravel bike with the TQ motor and 580Wh battery, but they did make something that might be closer to what you're after than the Slash+.

The Trek Fuel+ EX 9.9 X0 AXS is in the 2026 lineup with the HPR60 motor and a 580Wh battery. It's a trail bike rather than the gravity-oriented Slash+, with 150mm front travel and a shorter-travel rear end. At 19.4kg it's not dramatically lighter than the Slash+, but the geometry and suspension are much more trail-oriented. That said, at £12,799 it's hardly impulse purchase territory, and "full suspension gravel for fire roads" suggests you might be overbiked even with this.

If you're genuinely mostly on fire roads in the LA area, the question is whether you even need full suspension at all. The BMC Fourstroke AMP LT range runs 130/120mm travel with the TQ HPR50 and 360Wh battery, coming in at a feathery 17.5kg. It's more of a downcountry platform and would eat fire roads alive, though the 360Wh battery and 50Nm motor might leave you wanting on longer days at your weight of 200lbs. No 580Wh option there unfortunately.

For the combination you're actually describing (light, efficient, big battery, not a DH sled), the honest answer is that Trek's TQ lineup has a gap right where you're looking. The Fuel EXe is too small a battery, the Fuel+ EX is pricey and arguably more bike than fire roads demand, and the Slash+ is definitely more bike than fire roads demand. You might want to look outside Trek entirely. The Rose Pile Plus does 150/140mm with the HPR60 and 580Wh at £7,999 and 20.4kg, which is a solid middle ground if you can source one stateside.

Worth asking though: when you say "we don't need all that suspension travel and weight," how rough are these fire roads? Because if they're genuinely smooth graded dirt, even the lightest eMTB here is overkill and a hardtail e-gravel bike might serve you better for half the money.
 
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