Specialized or YT?

[Kiwi in Wales]

Is it free if you didn’t buy the bike from them?

I believe so but I purchased my bike from them so not sure what costs if any may be passed on. However, there are plenty of people on here that have used them for this very reason so I am sure they will be able enlighten us with the own personal feedback re costs if any were incurred.

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

The YT has a 700wh battery option coming out later in the year, which I am hoping will be for all models unlike the Levo which is only on the £££ models.

Hopefully the YT 700Wh will be better priced than the Levo as the Levo batt cost is well over the top even with a discount

 

[Dax]

Same day service for a motor change at Berkshire Cycles.

I'm well aware of that, but my point is that not all specilized dealers are created equal and a mate just took his kenevo in to the store he bought it from and was told it would be up to a month.

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

I'm well aware of that, but my point is that not all specilized dealers are created equal and a mate just took his kenevo in to the store he bought it from and was told it would be up to a month.

Point taken
My point is, your mate still has the option available to call Berkshire and get the motor changed much sooner if he so wishes, has his receipt and doesn’t mind a bit of travel

 

[Dax]

I suggested that option to him a couple of days ago, also suggested that he told the shop to order him a new motor rather than taking it out, posting it to specilized and then waiting for it to come back. We'll see what happens.

 

[outerlimits]

End of the day, the real question you have to ask yourself is. If money was no object, which frame, motor, battery combo currently available would you choose to suit your needs ? As everything else on the bike can be changed with minimal fuss. It will cost you, but there would be of minimal compromise.

 

[More-read-than-ride]

This might be a little off topic, but at least in my group of friends, I find that going from mtb to emtb, or buying an emtb as a first bike, everyone end up doing more agressive downhill stuff and jumps than they expected. Do the rest of you also see that trend?

What I am getting at, is that if thats the case, the YT gets an extra point (Besides the price, Spesh is just ridiculous).

A few notes:
Obviously my group is not representative of the entire world (too bad ) and we are generally not greatly skilled riders. This means that simply by getting out more, we get better and this allows us to try more challenging stuff. I think someone who is already a great rider will probably not change riding style as much by going to emtb.

Also, since emtb's do not have the same focus on weight saving, it means it is generally more "burly" bikes, which invites you to do more. For instance, many of my friends have changed from 120mm non-dropper, hardtails to +140mm FS, dropper ebikes. This has had the effect that instead of looking for nice smooth surfaces and flowing trails, we are now looking for "trouble."

So my point is this: For "non-lifers" emtb leads to more DH. Let the flak begin!

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

This might be a little off topic, but at least in my group of friends, I find that going from mtb to emtb, or buying an emtb as a first bike, everyone end up doing more agressive downhill stuff and jumps than they expected. Do the rest of you also see that trend?

What I am getting at, is that if thats the case, the YT gets an extra point (Besides the price, Spesh is just ridiculous).

A few notes:
Obviously my group is not representative of the entire world (too bad ) and we are generally not greatly skilled riders. This means that simply by getting out more, we get better and this allows us to try more challenging stuff. I think someone who is already a great rider will probably not change riding style as much by going to emtb.

Also, since emtb's do not have the same focus on weight saving, it means it is generally more "burly" bikes, which invites you to do more. For instance, many of my friends have changed from 120mm non-dropper, hardtails to +140mm FS, dropper ebikes. This has had the effect that instead of looking for nice smooth surfaces and flowing trails, we are now looking for "trouble."

So my point is this: For "non-lifers" emtb leads to more DH. Let the flak begin!

Couldn’t agree with you more.
My move to emtb last year changed a lot of things for me. I tripled the mileage I did the previous year, dropped 4kgs in weight due to getting out more and I too started ‘looking for trouble’. This was down to the ebike opening up a number of possibilities that I had ‘never considered/could not even image’ doing before because of the assistance/extra push in power an ebike gives you.
For me though, It was more focused on the technical steep uphills and ‘trials’ type riding than the DH. Only because I was comfortable with the DH already.

The new YT is more or less great straight out of the box where for me personally, I had to change loads of components on my Levo to get anywhere near the same. But this is just me and my particular preferences, others may be more than happy with how the Levo comes as they are riding a completely different terrain to me and may not be into technical horrendously steep lumpy climbs. We are all different on how we roll, just get out, ride and enjoy!

 

[R120]

Looking for trouble, nailed it right there Kiwi, that sums up tome the best thing about Emtb's - its when it turns into hunting for hurt that things go wrong!

 

[Fivetones]

Some great points made in this thread.

I have ridden most types of bikes over the years from BMX to road to MTB and all points in between. I love exploring new types of bikes early too hence my interest in eMTB. I also have a motor cycle trials background too.

I have a Comp Carbon Levo on order and have seen delivery dates slip a couple of times. I’ve got itchy feet because of this so started considering other bikes. The angle this conversation has gone regarding ‘looking for trouble’ really struck a chord with me and has me thinking that could well be how I’ll end up going and should consider something burlier.

What’s also clear, as with most early forms of new bike category, is it’s never a good time to buy one as things shift to new models quickly. I think R120 made a point about a lot of new stuff on the way as well as the new YT.

As ever the maxim ‘get out and ride’ might be the best thing to remember. You could wait for ever

 

[Kiwi in Wales]

Some great points made in this thread.

I have ridden most types of bikes over the years from BMX to road to MTB and all points in between. I love exploring new types of bikes early too hence my interest in eMTB. I also have a motor cycle trials background too.

I have a Comp Carbon Levo on order and have seen delivery dates slip a couple of times. I’ve got itchy feet because of this so started considering other bikes. The angle this conversation has gone regarding ‘looking for trouble’ really struck a chord with me and has me thinking that could well be how I’ll end up going and should consider something burlier.

What’s also clear, as with most early forms of new bike category, is it’s never a good time to buy one as things shift to new models quickly. I think R120 made a point about a lot of new stuff on the way as well as the new YT.

As ever the maxim ‘get out and ride’ might be the best thing to remember. You could wait for ever

It is becoming very difficult to pick an ebike now as you have so many good ones to choose from and as R120 said, there are even more on the way which is a good thing but also a bad thing as it is hard to know which way to jump
What is the current lead time on your Comp carbon Levo and what size were you after?

 

[Fivetones]

Scheduled now for end of May (slipped a month after a previous 2 week slip). I’m a little tied in to the LBS due to an arranged cycle to work voucher so YT is perhaps not an option.

I ordered Red Medium.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

The YT has certainly thrown up a decision into the mix for a lot of people. I've had over 30+ messages asking about YT Decoy vs Levo and which I'd recommend. I'll probably make a video as I think its a good debate!

I'd say that the 2019 Specialized frame is a year to 18 months ahead of YT. The Brose Mag motor is also more natural feeling, quieter and more refined.

Specialized dropped a bunch of weight on the 2019 with the full integration removing the need to structural components and housings. YT using a similar design to the 2018 Levo where the battery is semi integrated. This requires mounting hardware and will certainly add weight.

Here's a comparison between the £6k price point (a LOT of money but for comparison sake). Removing the WARRANTY SUPPORT aspect from the equation here's how they stack up:

The YT has a LOT of benefits too. Its a seriously good bike and a LOT of bike for the money.

Levo Comp Carbon (pictured with non stock DT Swiss wheels and Maxxis Tyres)
Price: £5999
Weight: 21.3KG (Large, no pedals, tubeless)
Components: Basic Fox 34 / DPS Shock
Frame / Wheels: Carbon Front, Alu rear, Alu wheels
Motor: Brose Mag S
Battery: Custom Specialized 500Wh fully integrated inside the frame
Travel: 150 Front 150 rear
Head Angle: 66 degrees
Warranty: Dealer / Local Bike Shop

YT Pro Race
Price: £5999
Weight: 21.9 KG (Small, no pedals, tubeless)
Components: Fox Factory 36 Forks, X2 Factory Shock
Frame / Wheels: Full carbon frame, carbon wheels
Motor: Shimano E8000
Battery: Custom YT 540Wh integrated / mounted to the downtube
Travel: 160 Front 165 rear
Head Angle: 65 degrees
Warranty: Shimano / YT

Levo will be slightly more agile on trails with its head angle and tune. For everyday trail riding the Levo would *probably* be my pick. I didnt ride the YT much on 'regular' trails, you know, Surrey Hills, Swinley, local UK type stuff. I'd like to test it more.

I'd definitely pick the YT for gravity stuff / Bike Park and chunkier stuff. The Levo would be more than capable but the YT will be more forgiving and and easier with its longer travel and slacker head angle. Plus, you're getting Fox 36 forks and Factory X2 shock.

What is awesome is that these bike companies are continuing to innovate and that competition is FIERCE! There's a HUGE emtb market out there at the moment. Brands are putting in serious cash to develop and capture this market.

Ebike sales are on the up, it's like an entire new segment that is ripe. New bikers, old bikers getting back into the sport. What a time to be alive!!!

I agree totally that there's a space for a ENDURO spesh, not quite 180mm Kenevo, but a bit more rowdy that the current Levo. Like, EVO LEVO??? @Specialized Rider Care ?

 

[R120]

The need to make the Levo Evo, I have been eyeing up a Stumpy Evo for a while.

I reckon the weight difference between the two bike in your comparison could be down to the suspension components alone - would be interesting to see how much a similar specced Levo weighs

 

[More-read-than-ride]

I agree totally that there's a space for a ENDURO spesh, not quite 180mm Kenevo, but a bit more rowdy that the current Levo. Like, EVO LEVO???

EVO LEVO??? Surely that has to catch on! great name for the mod thread too

 

[More-read-than-ride]

Couldn’t agree with you more.
My move to emtb last year changed a lot of things for me. I tripled the mileage I did the previous year, dropped 4kgs in weight due to getting out more and I too started ‘looking for trouble’. This was down to the ebike opening up a number of possibilities that I had ‘never considered/could not even image’ doing before because of the assistance/extra push in power an ebike gives you.
For me though, It was more focused on the technical steep uphills and ‘trials’ type riding than the DH. Only because I was comfortable with the DH already.

The new YT is more or less great straight out of the box where for me personally, I had to change loads of components on my Levo to get anywhere near the same. But this is just me and my particular preferences, others may be more than happy with how the Levo comes as they are riding a completely different terrain to me and may not be into technical horrendously steep lumpy climbs. We are all different on how we roll, just get out, ride and enjoy!

Agreed, I should have said "emtb leads leads to more agressive DH and UH stuff!"
Edit: An emtb is a "DUH" ... a new segment!?

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

The need to make the Levo Evo, I have been eyeing up a Stumpy Evo for a while.

I reckon the weight difference between the two bike in your comparison could be down to the suspension components alone - would be interesting to see how much a similar specced Levo weighs

For sure the X2 on the YT will weigh more, and the Fox 36 on the YT will likely weigh more than the Fox 34 on the Levo.

Just to throw it in, the S-WORKS 2019 Levo, with Fox 36 / Fox Factory rear shock weights an incredible 19.9KG which is an outstanding feat of engineering.

But, £10,000.

For £10,000 you can but both a 2019 Levo AND a YT Decoy!

 

[More-read-than-ride]

For sure the X2 on the YT will weigh more, and the Fox 36 on the YT will likely weigh more than the Fox 34 on the Levo.

Just to throw it in, the S-WORKS 2019 Levo, with Fox 36 / Fox Factory rear shock weights an incredible 19.9KG which is an outstanding feat of engineering.

But, £10,000.

For £10,000 you can but both a 2019 Levo AND a YT Decoy!

I am generally very hard on Levo for their pricing policy, but I will say that R&D is hugely expensive and such cutting edge bikes and integration deserve a premium. However, they need to take it down a notch and use better base components. A 15% premium may be well deserved but the Sworks is more like 50%. Edit: another defense of levo pricing (I am generous today): resale price is probably the best.

 

[Dax]

the Sworks is more like 50%.

Sworks pricing has always been a percentage bump over the standard specilized bump. They go after a very specific market with the Sworks line.

 

[Gazzpod]

The YT has certainly thrown up a decision into the mix for a lot of people. I've had over 30+ messages asking about YT Decoy vs Levo and which I'd recommend. I'll probably make a video as I think its a good debate!

I'd say that the 2019 Specialized frame is a year to 18 months ahead of YT. The Brose Mag motor is also more natural feeling, quieter and more refined.

Specialized dropped a bunch of weight on the 2019 with the full integration removing the need to structural components and housings. YT using a similar design to the 2018 Levo where the battery is semi integrated. This requires mounting hardware and will certainly add weight.

Here's a comparison between the £6k price point (a LOT of money but for comparison sake). Removing the WARRANTY SUPPORT aspect from the equation here's how they stack up:

The YT has a LOT of benefits too. Its a seriously good bike and a LOT of bike for the money.

View attachment 12604

Levo Comp Carbon (pictured with non stock DT Swiss wheels and Maxxis Tyres)
Price: £5999
Weight: 21.3KG (Large, no pedals, tubeless)
Components: Basic Fox 34 / DPS Shock
Frame / Wheels: Carbon Front, Alu rear, Alu wheels
Motor: Brose Mag S
Battery: Custom Specialized 500Wh fully integrated inside the frame
Travel: 150 Front 150 rear
Head Angle: 66 degrees
Warranty: Dealer / Local Bike Shop

View attachment 12605

YT Pro Race
Price: £5999
Weight: 21.9 KG (Small, no pedals, tubeless)
Components: Fox Factory 36 Forks, X2 Factory Shock
Frame / Wheels: Full carbon frame, carbon wheels
Motor: Shimano E8000
Battery: Custom YT 540Wh integrated / mounted to the downtube
Travel: 160 Front 165 rear
Head Angle: 65 degrees
Warranty: Shimano / YT

Levo will be slightly more agile on trails with its head angle and tune. For everyday trail riding the Levo would *probably* be my pick. I didnt ride the YT much on 'regular' trails, you know, Surrey Hills, Swinley, local UK type stuff. I'd like to test it more.

I'd definitely pick the YT for gravity stuff / Bike Park and chunkier stuff. The Levo would be more than capable but the YT will be more forgiving and and easier with its longer travel and slacker head angle. Plus, you're getting Fox 36 forks and Factory X2 shock.

What is awesome is that these bike companies are continuing to innovate and that competition is FIERCE! There's a HUGE emtb market out there at the moment. Brands are putting in serious cash to develop and capture this market.

Ebike sales are on the up, it's like an entire new segment that is ripe. New bikers, old bikers getting back into the sport. What a time to be alive!!!

I agree totally that there's a space for a ENDURO spesh, not quite 180mm Kenevo, but a bit more rowdy that the current Levo. Like, EVO LEVO??? @Specialized Rider Care ?

Hi Rob,

It's the YT that's tempting me to make the emtb leap. I'm not sure about sizing though. I'm 5'11 and the guy at YT recommended the large but I'm worried it may come up a bit small. I'd be using it mainly for rocky stuff in the Peak District plus trips to Scotland, Wakes and Alps. What size did you ride and how did it measure up?

 

[Benson]

Just to throw it in, the S-WORKS 2019 Levo, with Fox 36 / Fox Factory rear shock weights an incredible 19.9KG which is an outstanding feat of engineering.

Only it kinda isn’t 19.9Kg as it’s marketed and shipped with a considerably heavier battery, albeit with improved range. Still a little naughty of Spesh.

 

[R120]

My recent thoughts have been turning to battery range, as I am now regualrilly draining my battery before I am drained.

On that note it would be interesting to see what price the YT's will be with the 700wh battery, either installed or as an extra, compared to the Specilizeds.

If it is only something like 500 quid on top, then I am going to find it very hard not to get one!

 

[chris edwards]

from what I've seen I would take a punt on the YT , they have a few years of experience now with the direct selling aspect and no doubt will have a strong policy for back up. I ride a Kenevo and absolutely love it ..... BUT ...... the Decoy is the 1st e-bike I have seen that would make me change . A brave step by YT claiming it will do everything from XC - downhill but that said so does my Kenevo !! Is there really a bad e-bike ?

YT have a very strong image which will appeal to the more rowdy rider if this fits your profile then go for it , the Levo, an incredible bike, won't be as hard charging as the Decoy.

 

[R120]

I think it depends on the rider, you can push a Levo pretty hard, and if you put a 160 on the front and a coil out back you have a bike that can smash pretty much anything.

I can't speak for the wider world, but some of the Surrey boys on here like @Jonny2 @Paul Mac and of course the headmaster himself @Rob Hancill are slaying it on them

 

[galaga187]

Sworks pricing has always been a percentage bump over the standard specilized bump. They go after a very specific market with the Sworks line.

Dentists?

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

Vid uploading to Patreon now!

 

[Jamsxr]

Hi Rob,

It's the YT that's tempting me to make the emtb leap. I'm not sure about sizing though. I'm 5'11 and the guy at YT recommended the large but I'm worried it may come up a bit small. I'd be using it mainly for rocky stuff in the Peak District plus trips to Scotland, Wakes and Alps. What size did you ride and how did it measure up?

I’m 5’11 and ride a large YT Jeffsy, it’s not the longest bike, and is maybe a little cramped. As it’s a trail bike I’m happy with my decision, but for the Decoy I’m going to try the XL at their demo day to make sure I get it right. I’m still thinking large will be best.

 

[Doomanic]

I’m 5’9(and a bit ) and I’m hoping to try the M and the L. On paper the L is closest to where I’m comfortable but given the opportunity it would be stupid not to try both.

 

[Stringbean]

Dentists?

Riding a s works but not a dentist ?
Was initially going to buy comp carbon but lbs didn’t have color I wanted and didn’t want to wait either.They did have a s works on the floor that had been there for a few months and were willing to do a deal on.
For those looking at comp carbon I would suggest phoning around and upspeccing your choice.The top Levo are not flying out of the stores because of price.In 2 months the 2020 Levo will be appearing and the last thing a dealer wants is to have a 2019 s works sitting on the floor.
You might get a surprise with what they are willing to offer the higher spec bike to you for.

 

[Fivetones]

Apparently there are no S-Works available for the rest of 2019.

September for the Expert too.