Rise creaking under pedaling load

[RickBullotta]

Hi, all. My Rise has developed an annoying creaking sound when pedaling. I've isolated it to the rear end of the bike, and it does not appear to be related to motor mounts. It appears to be coming from either the rear axle area (which is also a pivot) or the pivot(s) on the seatstay(s). Has anyone else encountered this?

 

[Bigkatoomer]

Yes - I have a slight creak on pedaling which I've never been able to isolate, mostly out of the saddle which would fit with leaning the bike more side to side with each stroke. I will see if it stops when more smooth with the bike movement to prove that.

How did you manage to identify the area it was coming from?

 

[RickBullotta]

Yes - I have a slight creak on pedaling which I've never been able to isolate, mostly out of the saddle which would fit with leaning the bike more side to side with each stroke. I will see if it stops when more smooth with the bike movement to prove that.

How did you manage to identify the area it was coming from?

Could “feel” it in the rear triangle when bouncing on the pedals. The rear axle/pivot design certainly seems the most likely culprit. There’s a lot going on there. I regreased and retorqued it and will report ride results tomorrow. Seems to have quieted it down.

 

[Borut]

Mine also creaks, its left or right linkage u have to takenit apart, clean it...and use loctite 648...and retightened bolts ...i took all bike apart until i discovered that.

 

[RickBullotta]

Mine also creaks, its left or right linkage u have to takenit apart, clean it...and use loctite 648...and retightened bolts ...i took all bike apart until i discovered that.

Which spot? Could you post a picture? Thanks!

 

[Borut]

In that spot. But be carefoul to assembly back with correct procedure ...which is written in bluepaper

 

[KuRi]

I have the same noise, coming from rear axle. I tried re-greasing but it just worked for some hours. I think the bearings are the problem will try a replacement tomorrow. Cheers!

 

[Borut]

I have the same noise, coming from rear axle. I tried re-greasing but it just worked for some hours. I think the bearings are the problem will try a replacement tomorrow. Cheers!

Greasing rear bearings wont help, they are dry more or less and very little movement in those. Im quite sure creacking comes from rocker arm....

 

[KuRi]

do you know how to fix it then? Thanks

 

[Mcharza]

Greasing rear bearings wont help, they are dry more or less and very little movement in those. Im quite sure creacking comes from rocker arm....

Check the main pivot bolt. A fairly common fault on Occam bikes, on which Rise is based.

 

[Borut]

Demontange rocker arms, clean it, grease pivot rocker bearings, then apply loctatite 648 on cylindrical part, as it is described in bluepaper and tigthen back with correct nm 10nm on rocker arms, and 15nm i think bolts for dampfer on rocker arms. ...

 

[KuRi]

But my noise is not coming from that point... once I wash the rear axle joints with some water the noise inmediately dissapears for a couple of hours.

 

[RickBullotta]

Demontange rocker arms, clean it, grease pivot rocker bearings, then apply loctatite 648 on cylindrical part, as it is described in bluepaper and tigthen back with correct nm 10nm on rocker arms, and 15nm i think bolts for dampfer on rocker arms. ...

That wasn't the issue on my Rise. It is coming from the rear axle and the "psuedo-pivots" there.

 

[RickBullotta]

But my noise is not coming from that point... once I wash the rear axle joints with some water the noise inmediately dissapears for a couple of hours.

Same here - I've narrowed it down to something associated with the rear axle and the pivots there.

 

[KuRi]

It was the rear brake cable... where it leaves the frame. When dirty, it makes this squeaking sound

 

[jka]

It was the rear brake cable... where it leaves the frame. When dirty, it makes this squeaking sound

Glad you found it and thanks for the tip. I hate chasing squeaks and creaks.

 

[volts]

In that spot. But be carefoul to assembly back with correct procedure ...which is written in bluepaper

View attachment 64954

solved my creak! Thanks!

 

[BiGJZ74]

Check the main pivot bolt. A fairly common fault on Occam bikes, on which Rise is based.

That's where my creaking came from. Felt side to side play in the main pivot arms. I loosened the pinch bolts tightened with the bearing preload tool and retightened everything up. Creak came back and just did it all again. If if happens again, I'll add loctite but hopefully the play didn't damage the bearings.

 

[BiGJZ74]

In that spot. But be carefoul to assembly back with correct procedure ...which is written in bluepaper

View attachment 64954

Gives you a reason to use the purple preload tool......

 

[Rod B.]

The upper and lower pivot axles are not sealed. Because there isn't any sealing, dust and water will eventually work into the pivot axle assembly and dry up or wash out the grease lubricating the axles where they ride on the bearings. When this happens, the pivot axles will start creaking.

When the upper pivot axle begins creaking, it will sound exactly like a creaking seat post or saddle rail clamps that are creaking. The lower pivot axle will sound similar to the upper, but will have a deeper tone to the creaking.

I now have about 2,000 miles on my Rise and know it fairly well. Other than the occasional creaking, I've yet to have any major issues with the linkage and bearings. To avoid the creaking, I lubricate the axles about every three months.

For those interested, I wrote several tech articles on servicing the upper and lower pivot axles and linkage. In the tech articles I go into full blown detail on how to clean, service and lubricate the entire upper and lower pivot assemblies. If you don't suspect pivot bearing failure, i.e. grinding and binding noises, you can "Short Cut" the upper and lower service procedures by just removing the axles themselves for lubrication.

Part # 1: Orbea Rise - Upper Linkage Axle and Bearing Service

Thank you to those who have contributed their experiences thus far to make this article better. I service the linkage, i.e. remove the linkage, axles, inspect, clean and lubricate the bearings about every six months on my Rise. The pivot bearings have held up nicely. Very wet or powdery dirt...

www.emtbforums.com

PART # 2: ORBEA RISE - LOWER MAIN LINKAGE AXLE AND BEARING SERVICE

This is Part Two in a two part series on servicing the Rise pivot bearings and linkage. Part Two will discuss servicing the Rise's lower main pivot axle and bearings. If possible, please read Part One before continuing with this article. In Part One, "Orbea Rise - Upper Linkage Axle and Bearing...

www.emtbforums.com

 

[E&NonEinCO]

One of the best methods to troubleshoot noises is to use an automotive stethoscope. These are inexpensive and readily available. You can pinpoint a noise location with this tool.

I had a creaking sound coming from the rear of my Rise only when under high torque - as when climbing a very steep grade. It creaked regardless of what gear I was in. The culprit was the cassette where the 46 ring was riveted to the cassette assembly.

 

[KGA109]

I came here with the same issue - the carbon chassis is creaking horribly but it really feels (sounds) like the whole frame is flexing, which emits the common carbon-frame creak-crackle with every pedal stroke. Maddening. Seated, standing, climbing, descending - any pressure on the cranks and its cracking and popping.

I'll pull the rear end apart and follow some of the suggestions here, but to me it sounds like the frame flexing like crazy. Not a linkage pivot issue. Its so bad, I'm quite tempted to get the alloy model instead. I can't tune those noises out.

 

[Rod B.]

I came here with the same issue - the carbon chassis is creaking horribly but it really feels (sounds) like the whole frame is flexing, which emits the common carbon-frame creak-crackle with every pedal stroke. Maddening. Seated, standing, climbing, descending - any pressure on the cranks and its cracking and popping.

I'll pull the rear end apart and follow some of the suggestions here, but to me it sounds like the frame flexing like crazy. Not a linkage pivot issue. Its so bad, I'm quite tempted to get the alloy model instead. I can't tune those noises out.

KGA109,

The Rise has a known issue with the linkage arms loosening up and shifting on the splined upper pivot axle. The Rise requires a correct preload on the upper splined axle and pivot linkage arms. When the linkage arms loosen up and move on the splined axle, the pre-load loosens up and play will develop in the rear end. Your Rise will start to creak as a result. You can tell the linkage arms have moved on the upper pivot axle when you feel the frame flex sideways like it's tracking strange after you've entered into a turn or hit a berm hard.

Follow my instructions in my post "PART # 1: ORBEA RISE - UPPER LINKAGE AXLE AND BEARING SERVICE."

Part # 1: Orbea Rise - Upper Linkage Axle and Bearing Service

Thank you to those who have contributed their experiences thus far to make this article better. I service the linkage, i.e. remove the linkage, axles, inspect, clean and lubricate the bearings about every six months on my Rise. The pivot bearings have held up nicely. Very wet or powdery dirt...

www.emtbforums.com

Please read the thread all the way through to page three. When I first wrote the post, I attributed the creaking to lack of grease. While this does occur after a period of time, I've since come to the conclusion that in most instances, the creaking is the result of the linkage arms loosening up on the splined upper axle and play thus developing in the rear end.

The Rise Blue Paper manual calls for a cylindrical retaining compound (Loctite 638) to be used on the splined interface between the upper pivot axle and linkage arms. However, Rises are coming from the factory without the cylindrical retaining compound having been applied. This lack of retaining compound is causing the linkage arms to loosen up on the splined upper axle and thus rear frame play develops. Also, the Rise Blue Paper manual calls for the threaded portion of the upper pivot axle to face to the right, drive side of the bike. However, Rises are coming from the factory with the threaded portion of the upper pivot axle facing to the left, non drive side. All of these issues can be easily fixed.

The Rise Blue Paper calls for cylindrical retaining compound to be used on the upper pivot axle and linkage arm interface. The Rise manual does not specify which cylindrical retaining compound to be used. Refer to the Occam Blue Paper manual. The Occam shares the same suspension design as the Rise. The Occam Blue Paper calls for Loctite 638 to be used.

The Orbea Occam shares the same linkage design as the Rise and calls for Loctite 638 to be used on the splined upper pivot axle and linkage arm interface.

Follow my procedures in "Part # 1." I explain in detail how to service your upper pivot linkage and set proper linkage arm pre-load. Make sure to use Loctite 638 as a cylindrical retaining compound on the splined upper pivot linkage arm and axle interface. Your Rise will be absolutely rock solid and you will not have any further issues with linkage arms loosening up, frame flexing and creaking.

While you are elbow deep servicing the upper pivot assembly, be sure to check your lower pivot axle also.

PART # 2: ORBEA RISE - LOWER MAIN LINKAGE AXLE AND BEARING SERVICE

This is Part Two in a two part series on servicing the Rise pivot bearings and linkage. Part Two will discuss servicing the Rise's lower main pivot axle and bearings. If possible, please read Part One before continuing with this article. In Part One, "Orbea Rise - Upper Linkage Axle and Bearing...

www.emtbforums.com

If you have any questions, send me a private message or reply via the Part # 1 thread and I'll help you out.

Be safe,
Rod

 

[sKermi]

I came here with the same issue - the carbon chassis is creaking horribly but it really feels (sounds) like the whole frame is flexing, which emits the common carbon-frame creak-crackle with every pedal stroke. Maddening. Seated, standing, climbing, descending - any pressure on the cranks and its cracking and popping.

I'll pull the rear end apart and follow some of the suggestions here, but to me it sounds like the frame flexing like crazy. Not a linkage pivot issue. Its so bad, I'm quite tempted to get the alloy model instead. I can't tune those noises out.

I had an awful creak (sounded like something was going to snap). It turned out to be the freehub. Check to see if you can wobble the cassette. There were also witness marks on the axle where the lockring was rubbing under heavy load.

 

[BiGJZ74]

I came here with the same issue - the carbon chassis is creaking horribly but it really feels (sounds) like the whole frame is flexing, which emits the common carbon-frame creak-crackle with every pedal stroke. Maddening. Seated, standing, climbing, descending - any pressure on the cranks and its cracking and popping.

I'll pull the rear end apart and follow some of the suggestions here, but to me it sounds like the frame flexing like crazy. Not a linkage pivot issue. Its so bad, I'm quite tempted to get the alloy model instead. I can't tune those noises out.

When my linkages loosened, it felt like my rear end was a noodle. Rise isn’t a stiff frame by any means but after adding 638 to the pivot axle, 90% of frame flex and the creaks were gone.

 

[KGA109]

I'll chime in with my results - I took the linkage apart (my axle was also installed with the threads facing the non-drive side), cleaned everything as usual, re-installed with LocTite 638.

The frame is dead quiet. With one exception now.

This Rise has always been noisy since day 1 (creaks) and I actually only have about 300 miles on it to begin with.

But now that the linkage noise issue is resolved, that brought out my seat-tube-creak. Or isolated it rather. I did a long climb the other day, stopped at one point and put my Reverb all the way to the collar and the seat-tube creaking went away entirely. It was pretty amazing to ride a bike that was dead-quiet. Dropping the seat post down collar-to-collar must have dispersed the load of the post itself on the seat tube.

For testing, I made a 1.25" ID PVC collar so I can raise the post back up, but with this collar in place between the seat post clamp and the collar of the Reverb, which will hopefully disperse the load that the post puts on the frame. Haven't had a chance to try it, but I can't handle creaking,

I've read it a few times on this forum, but this frame does have a lot of flex. But I think we're close to making it quiet.

EDIT 23-05-19 - the "creak collar" I installed on my seat post absolutely worked. That bike was dead quiet all last season after servicing the linkage and installing that collar. Amazing bike. We've since moved on to the Wild but this Rise was fantastic.

 

[Psymantis]

KGA109,

The Rise has a known issue with the linkage arms loosening up and shifting on the splined upper pivot axle. The Rise requires a correct preload on the upper splined axle and pivot linkage arms. When the linkage arms loosen up and move on the splined axle, the pre-load loosens up and play will develop in the rear end. Your Rise will start to creak as a result. You can tell the linkage arms have moved on the upper pivot axle when you feel the frame flex sideways like it's tracking strange after you've entered into a turn or hit a berm hard.

Follow my instructions in my post "PART # 1: ORBEA RISE - UPPER LINKAGE AXLE AND BEARING SERVICE."

Part # 1: Orbea Rise - Upper Linkage Axle and Bearing Service

Thank you to those who have contributed their experiences thus far to make this article better. I service the linkage, i.e. remove the linkage, axles, inspect, clean and lubricate the bearings about every six months on my Rise. The pivot bearings have held up nicely. Very wet or powdery dirt...

www.emtbforums.com

Please read the thread all the way through to page three. When I first wrote the post, I attributed the creaking to lack of grease. While this does occur after a period of time, I've since come to the conclusion that in most instances, the creaking is the result of the linkage arms loosening up on the splined upper axle and play thus developing in the rear end.

The Rise Blue Paper manual calls for a cylindrical retaining compound (Loctite 638) to be used on the splined interface between the upper pivot axle and linkage arms. However, Rises are coming from the factory without the cylindrical retaining compound having been applied. This lack of retaining compound is causing the linkage arms to loosen up on the splined upper axle and thus rear frame play develops. Also, the Rise Blue Paper manual calls for the threaded portion of the upper pivot axle to face to the right, drive side of the bike. However, Rises are coming from the factory with the threaded portion of the upper pivot axle facing to the left, non drive side. All of these issues can be easily fixed.

The Rise Blue Paper calls for cylindrical retaining compound to be used on the upper pivot axle and linkage arm interface. The Rise manual does not specify which cylindrical retaining compound to be used. Refer to the Occam Blue Paper manual. The Occam shares the same suspension design as the Rise. The Occam Blue Paper calls for Loctite 638 to be used.

View attachment 93885

The Orbea Occam shares the same linkage design as the Rise and calls for Loctite 638 to be used on the splined upper pivot axle and linkage arm interface.
View attachment 93886

Follow my procedures in "Part # 1." I explain in detail how to service your upper pivot linkage and set proper linkage arm pre-load. Make sure to use Loctite 638 as a cylindrical retaining compound on the splined upper pivot linkage arm and axle interface. Your Rise will be absolutely rock solid and you will not have any further issues with linkage arms loosening up, frame flexing and creaking.

While you are elbow deep servicing the upper pivot assembly, be sure to check your lower pivot axle also.

PART # 2: ORBEA RISE - LOWER MAIN LINKAGE AXLE AND BEARING SERVICE

This is Part Two in a two part series on servicing the Rise pivot bearings and linkage. Part Two will discuss servicing the Rise's lower main pivot axle and bearings. If possible, please read Part One before continuing with this article. In Part One, "Orbea Rise - Upper Linkage Axle and Bearing...

www.emtbforums.com

If you have any questions, send me a private message or reply via the Part # 1 thread and I'll help you out.

Be safe,
Rod

Thank you for the detailed instructions, this fixed the creak in my Rise and mine also had the linkage axle installed backwards.

 

[mak]

I've book marked the thread, 2 weeks old and 200 miles in i now have a creak on my m10, the bikes not been washed yet Looks like a bit of a strip down for me to check things over.
Apart from that its the best decision i made buying this bike, and to think I was worried about range and lack of power coming from a bosch gen 4 bike.

For my riding and area its ideal. It would seem the little rise is old history now and doesn't really get a mention with all the new middle weight bikes coming out for next year which is a shame because is it not the bike that started the trend?

Creek or no creek i will be out tomorrow

 

[neilo]

Off topic but which mudguard is that you have there?

 

[Rod B.]

Usually if the rear axel (bearings) is moving under load the brake disk will let you know. Right?

Yes, that's been my experience. Bad wheel hub bearings or a rear axle that is loosening up will also allow the wheel to flex side to side and cause the rotor to rub on the caliper. The Rise does have bearings at the rear axle, however they move very little and I've yet to have the two bearings make any noise.

This is one issue with the rear axle bearings which I've encountered on several Rises. The two rear axle bearings are pressed into each side of the chain stay. I've found that the orifice opening which the axle bearings are pressed into has often been milled/molded too small. When the axle bearings are pressed into the orifice, it will cause excessive pressure on the bearings and they become somewhat difficult to rotate. If you remove the bearing it will spin freely. Once it has been re-inserted, it will freeze up again. Bikes that I've encountered this on, mine included, don't seem to have any issues with negative operation.