TurdFarmer
New Member
Are you trying to somehow prove a point by posting some bullshit marketing material?
New Santa Cruz model
- Thread starter The undecided
- Start date
…but it’s rail. I didn’t hate the one I rode, didn’t love it. Properly meh bike. Maybe the new one is more fun? At least it wasn’t a bloody e160
Look at the center picture, the lower link would have to be inside the motor for the suspension to work right. The reason the Heckler and bullet suck under braking is the link is to high. The heckler sl is a better bike because the smaller drive unit allowed them to lower the link. Who the heck wants a bike with a suspension that gets firmer under braking. As for weather or not it’s “bullshit”, I’ll leave that to the turdfarmers to figure out.
JStrube
Active member
I still haven't figured out where this one sits in the lineup.
Santa Cruz ditches the Heckler (and VPP!) for the new Vala: Bosch powered, two flip chips and a smaller battery - MBR
Santa Cruz has just unveiled the Vala – a brand new all-mountain e-bike that replaces the similarly intentioned Heckler. Instead of a Shimano EP801 motor like its predecessor though, the Vala gets Bosch’s latest gen 5 CX Performance Line motor and a non-removable 600Wh unit. It’s a brave choice...
www.mbr.co.uk
Suggests Vala replaces Heckler. Presumably Heckler SL lives on as the remaining Heckler.
TheMirrorVision
Member
What does charging VPP price mean to you? As a long-time SC fan myself I'm curious to know how others define the value of SC bikes vs other manufacturers?
With the VPP patent expired for many years now and many other virtual pivot type designs in use by other manufacturers that really hasn't been a key differentiator in and of itself to me. The fact that SC has their own factory and doesn't share those costs with many other manufacturers like other factories do (I don't really care about this), their top tier frame build quality (I do care about this and can see the difference), and the fact that they receive their frames and assemble the full bikes in Santa Cruz (I care about this as it creates jobs in my state) all add to their price.
Additionally I'll say that it's a breath of fresh air to see any company realize something they've been doing for the a long period of time isn't always the best thing to keep doing in the future. If SC learned through testing and feedback that their previous generation Bronson & Hightowers needed less anti-squat and other changes to improve the overall ride quality and they implemented those improvements in the recent versions of those bikes, then it does not make sense to stick to VPP just for VPP's sake if all of those kinematic improvements couldn't be made on the Vala.
SEBA
Active member
sc copied pivot because pivot Shuttle is far more superior
sc vala will sell well
sc vala will sell well
SC going 4bar is one more step towards making it a classic PON style euro brand.
There is no wrong in changing suspension design,but one could expect a brand like SC with PON backing to invest in something like 6bar,switch style setup or come with something new alltogether.
4 bar works well when done propelly,but it screams to me low design and manfuctaring costs and just lack of innovation for a brand like that = less value for the customer
There is no wrong in changing suspension design,but one could expect a brand like SC with PON backing to invest in something like 6bar,switch style setup or come with something new alltogether.
4 bar works well when done propelly,but it screams to me low design and manfuctaring costs and just lack of innovation for a brand like that = less value for the customer
This just looks like the regular Bosch screen with a custom plate to have it sitting there ?
It is
Anyone in the loop know if SC are planning to bring out a longer travel bike with the Bosch gen5 to phase out the current shape Bullit, like they've done with the Vala and Heckler?
Given all the spiel they've said about 4 bar allowing them better suspension curves, less anti squat etc, compared to current VPP full powered ebikes where the links are too high due to the motor, surely it would make sense to bring out a Bullit replacement too.
Like 180-170F/170R, MX Wheels etc
Given all the spiel they've said about 4 bar allowing them better suspension curves, less anti squat etc, compared to current VPP full powered ebikes where the links are too high due to the motor, surely it would make sense to bring out a Bullit replacement too.
Like 180-170F/170R, MX Wheels etc
There was no confirmation, but the Bullit was a very popular bike before they let it rot with a small battery since launch in 2020 and no updates except EP801.
It's almost 99% guaranteed SC are cooking a new Bullit with the new Bosch system & 4 bar suspension.
They need to replace the existing Bullit ASAP so we might see that bike pretty soon in my opinion.
I could see the big plough bike with the 800 battery too
Nothing in that video suggests that water ingress problems with Bosch CX Gen4 been addressed with the CX Gen5 ...
I also think they will spec the 800wh.
Limiting the Vala to the 600wh was a mistake in my mind, full power eMTBs should always have a large battery option instead of being forced to plug in a range extender like SL eMTBs.
Rumor is Bullit is next year. I’d assume 4 bar bosch but have heard one person mention seeing proto last winter and was vpp, my bet is they were confused. I’m not familiar with how Bosch battery system works but I’d hope the 600 could slide into an 800 down tube and fit giving the option to use either and then the extra carbon material would matter on a Bullit but personally I’d probably opt for the 600. I’ve never really even come close to killing my 630 shimano Bullit.
Oh and it better have a battery that comes out easily like the current and like Treks done. Otherwise I’ll like to see Danny and Peaty do a re do on the new bikes. I’ll bet the Vala can’t
Oh and it better have a battery that comes out easily like the current and like Treks done. Otherwise I’ll like to see Danny and Peaty do a re do on the new bikes. I’ll bet the Vala can’t
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TheMirrorVision
Member
DJI definitely appears to be the innovation leader with best-in-class performance in the lightest overall packaging. If DJI's system is as reliable as Bosch's after a couple of years then Bosch will really have to step up their game.
They didn't miss anything as it would be a major gamble to go DJI right now with no proven reliability or anything, going Bosch was the best decision for them.
DJI is also Chinese and DJI drones are about to get banned in the USA as a reference. Canada is also fighting against some Chinese products, specific import duties are definitely a possibility.
Going off DJI history and reputation I don’t think it’s much gamble, they basically take over whatever market they enter and this one appears no different. Also Bosch appears (no first hand experience) to follow the same German mentality of not being consumer convenient, any updates require you to bring your stuff in. It’s 2024 anyone with an ebike has a smart phone or laptop just let us flash the unit and be done with it like Shimano and I have no doubts DJI would be the same for any future fixes/improvements. Not mentioned in the review is also their charging technology blows everyone else out of the water. Good thing I won’t be in the market for another ebike for a while because by then I’m sure they’ll have more DJI equipped bike options.
So you're telling me choosing a new player in the market with no history at all, very limited product support & distribution and no reliability data would be a safe bet for them ? Yeah right.
Santa Cruz faced a lot of criticism because of poor reliability of EP8 and Fazua systems in the last few years, I can guarantee you that finally going with a proven and reliable system like Bosch will pay off a lot for them.
Going off dji company history no I wouldn’t be too worried, anything they make they end up doing better than anyone else and it’s looking like the same will be happening here. Look how many people already complaining the Vala doesn’t have an 800w battery, the amflow is lighter than the Vala, has an 800w batt, more power, fast responsive touch screen and quick charging. With the loss of vpp now it makes the bike much more directly comparable to other offerings that are also 4 bar so we will see how the Vala plays out. Personally my ep8 has been flawless, can’t say the same on my friends Bosch with two rides that turns itself off after every impact.
Yes, I’d read about the same rumours of a near 20% increase power which makes the 600w battery decision all the more strange as more power will rinse the battery quicker.
All riders are not interested touch screens and all that shit while they are riding, some could say that there are people who rides to stay away all screens and enjoy nature and riding. And there are people who thinks that everything should not be owned by chinese. And there are people who appreciate ride quality over power. And there are riders using mainly trail mode and not boost all the time. And there are bike companies who also appreciate these things and make their bikes accordingly.
A large company like Santa Cruz can't be taking business decisions based on guesses, that motor didn't even hit the market yet....give it some time before any serious bike company even consider them.
I agree that Santa Cruz made a mistake restricting the Vala to the 600wh battery as a lot of riders want a full fat battery with their full fat motor instead of being forced into a range extender.
Anyway, the hype train here is crazy.
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