E-bike battery explodes, burns out NYC store

[Streddaz]

Lol, just wait until used EV's are the only option for millions of car users. Does our super intelligent governments think cash strapped drivers will a) install high cost home chargers and the associated upgraded wiring or b) use domestic plugs and extension leads?
Coming within the next decade every street having a toxic fire on a weekly basis 'to help save the planet'.

The percentage per 1000,000 vehicles of vehicle fires is less for EVs than ICE vehicles, it is just that an EV fire makes headlines while a normal car burning is not worth covering, so all you see is "EVs are burning everywhere".
In Norway, which has the world’s highest share of electric car sales, there are four to five times more fires in petrol and diesel cars. The Swedish Civil Contingencies Agency found this year that there were 3.8 fires per 100,000 electric or hybrid cars in 2022, compared with 68 fires per 100,000 cars for all fuel types. Same goes for Ebikes. All the fires you see are some cheap brand thing that's dodgy AF.

 

[Pablo8]

So what brand was the battery and charger in the video?

 

[kbass24emtp]

The issues New York is having with battery fires is unique. Most of the batteries that are exploding are either really cheap Chinese crap or remanufactured. The remanufactured batteries are made up of used cells. The builders don’t know or don’t care of the condition of the batteries or if they are damaged. They also don’t have the overcharge protection. They are built with poor materials and workmanship. Our battery packs are expensive and people in New York don’t want to spend $1000 for a pack when they can get one for $200.

 

[Gavalar]

New York state, I believe, now requires UL certification for all e-bike batteries.
That would mean that a UL battery blew up - so maybe UL certification does not have as much meaning as we think (or had hoped)?

Or it didn't have the necessary certification, just because a city / state deems it necessary doesn't mean everyone plays by the same rules.

 

[Pablo8]

Yahoo and Fox News, a flammable combination in itself!

More food for the people who’ve already made their minds up, and another opportunity to bash ‘renewable energy’.

They’re not going to change their minds so I don’t even try, save my energy and avoid the pointless stress.

All the news agencies in the US do it.

Push and hype can be two sided. Gov is trying to create and hype a market, yes there is a market, and yes it needs some level of regulation.

That scooter place looked sketch as hell. Who knows what kind of cheezed charger let alone charge controller were involved - sitting on what looks like some sort of wooden counter, shelf or box, unattended.

Even a crap battery just sitting there disconnected is EXTREMELY unlikely to combust in raging oxidation.

 

[TGR KS]

New York state, I believe, now requires UL certification for all e-bike batteries.
That would mean that a UL battery blew up - so maybe UL certification does not have as much meaning as we think (or had hoped)?

Earlier this year, the New York City Council passed and Mayor Eric Adams signed into law a lithium-ion battery safety package that included requiring all e-bikes (UL 2849) and lithium-ion batteries (UL 2272) sold in the city to meet those standards or another recognized certification standard.

Well remembered. But, "...or another recognized certification standard." EU, maybe? Communist China, maybe?

 

[Sophie777]

Earlier this year, the New York City Council passed and Mayor Eric Adams signed into law a lithium-ion battery safety package that included requiring all e-bikes (UL 2849) and lithium-ion batteries (UL 2272) sold in the city to meet those standards or another recognized certification standard.

Well remembered. But, "...or another recognized certification standard." EU, maybe? Communist China, maybe?

Interesting. Maybe that's a loophole businesses can use (and are using).

 

[MountainBoy]

Lol, just wait until used EV's are the only option for millions of car users. Does our super intelligent governments think cash strapped drivers will a) install high cost home chargers and the associated upgraded wiring or b) use domestic plugs and extension leads?
Coming within the next decade every street having a toxic fire on a weekly basis 'to help save the planet'.

The only car chargers are fast DC chargers like those installed by Tesla (Superchargers) and other third-party fast DC charge manufacturers in public places. The AC "chargers" people install in garages, on the side of their houses and on pedestals by their outdoor parking spots are not even chargers. That's because the battery charger is built-into the EV and those devices merely serve to connect the car to the grid power source (or in the case of solar properties, to the off-grid power supply).

My point is that the car's high-quality on-board charger takes care of the batteries, a cheap charger will not cause a battery fire. If the on-board charger doesn't like the quality of the A/C power it is supplied with, it would simply refuse to use it.

As far as cutting corners with house wiring, there are very few jurisdictions that will approve an install if it doesn't meet electrical code. People have always been able to break the rules and create a hazardous wiring situation, but most people generally respect electricity and the danger it can pose if not used properly.

 

[Mikerb]

Assuming everyone here is buying their bikes from the major EMTB brands we are probably fairly unique in knowing how our batteries are manufactured and by whom, and use chargers designed specifically for each bike. Certainly all my batteries and chargers ( all Bosch) carry the CE accreditation mark. I suspect that is not the case for a lot of E scooters or lesser known brands of bike.
In the last 2 days, 2 London buses have caught fire and been burnt out...........one full electric and one hybrid. Apparently there were 2 previous cases both occuring in the Bus Station garage ( but not widely reported). So in those cases we have the vehicles probably being charged in the engineering workshop before setting off on the daily route ( both fires occured at about 7am)and then subsequently catching fire. So a mix of charging requirements in the same bus station garage getting mixed up?? Who knows.
For those not in the UK we also recently had 2 fires in airport car parks. One completely destroyed a multi story car park and dozens of cars. In none of the 2 bus fires or airport fires were the vehicles being charged..............so something is clearly going wrong here.

 

[Downhillr]

Does everyone in New York State comply with the law? Don't. Think. So.

Loads of dodgy people selling loads of dodgy stuff everywhere in the world.

Lol, one notorious, now former New Yorker certainly doesn’t!

 

[Pablo8]

Lol, one notorious, now former New Yorker certainly doesn’t!

She moved out?

 

[Downhillr]

She moved out?

He… went far South!

 

[Scuirus]

About 1 out of 15 million battery cells from the leading manufacturers have a manufacturing defect which will cause the cell to vent during it's lifetime. A 750 W eBike battery has 60 18650 cells, so one out of 250,000 batteries will have one cell venting. If this will spread to the other cells and out of the battery will depend on the construction. But I think a 0.0004 % risk for a battery fire during the lifetime of the battery is acceptable.

My list of top quality manufacturers of 18650 cells is short, it contains only 4 names. Cells from other manufacturers will have higher failure rates.

 

[CaptKirk]

E-bike battery explodes, burns out NYC store: video

A newly released video by the FDNY shows the moment an e-bike lithium-ion battery catches fire and explodes, causing a two-alarm fire to burn out a store in Queens.

news.yahoo.com

This is a serious problem people, does anyone know what brand of scooter was involved in this fire, and the battery manufacturer ? was the charger attached to the scooter? I have been using lithium batteries for R/C purposes for 30 years, and building my own battery packs for over 10. I have had a couple of the foils pack lithium ion cells swell, and even get hot, but never had a fire. I always use the proper charger and triple check charger settings on my advanced programmable charger.. But still this threat exist to all of the users of this power source. Anyone have any actual information concerning this??

 

[CaptKirk]

Final post on this thread: I did tear down a cheap battery I purchased from "Greenergy" a 48VDC 11AH battery. Paid a decent amount ($500) and opened battery to examine the "Battery management system" . Imagine my surprise when I find a large "Heat sink" base and absolutely NOTHING else just hard wiring the charging pins, no fuse and no other circuitry or protection.

 

[Growmac]

Put in place legislation that requires that all batteries imported into the UK pass standards regulations.

That legislation is in place. You need a CE mark to sell in the UK, which has comprehensive safety requirements. I suspect that many importers and many online retailers do not care and completely ignore.

 

[irie]

That legislation is in place. You need a CE mark to sell in the UK, which has comprehensive safety requirements. I suspect that many importers and many online retailers do not care and completely ignore.

And enforce that legislation.

 

[CaptKirk]

The only car chargers are fast DC chargers like those installed by Tesla (Superchargers) and other third-party fast DC charge manufacturers in public places. The AC "chargers" people install in garages, on the side of their houses and on pedestals by their outdoor parking spots are not even chargers. That's because the battery charger is built-into the EV and those devices merely serve to connect the car to the grid power source (or in the case of solar properties, to the off-grid power supply).

My point is that the car's high-quality on-board charger takes care of the batteries, a cheap charger will not cause a battery fire. If the on-board charger doesn't like the quality of the A/C power it is supplied with, it would simply refuse to use it.

As far as cutting corners with house wiring, there are very few jurisdictions that will approve an install if it doesn't meet electrical code. People have always been able to break the rules and create a hazardous wiring situation, but most people generally respect electricity and the danger it can pose if not used properly.

For the most part you are correct, but you kinda went off the rails with the "Cheap" charger claim. Lithium battery chemistry is different than "lead acid", NiMh and Nicad. Connecting a Lithium battery to the "Incorrect" charger can force too much current into the battery causing heat and venting and a resulting fire that makes the news.
Having said that (not a piro) I have TRIED on more than 1 occassion to get a lithium battery to ignite and have NEVER had any success.