Avinox Fast Charging and Battery Longevity

[2wheelfish]

I’m a battery newb, and didn’t see this question answered anywhere. Will the 12A Avinox fast charger reduce the longevity of the battery? Considering if I should pick up a secondary lower amp standard charger (4A) for everyday charging if this is an issue. Thanks.

 

[Astro66]

I’m a battery newb, and didn’t see this question answered anywhere. Will the 12A Avinox fast charger reduce the longevity of the battery? Considering if I should pick up a secondary lower amp standard charger (4A) for everyday charging if this is an issue. Thanks.

500 watts of charging isn't especially taxing on the battery. The worst thing is leaving the battery fully charged for long periods. So I always just charge to 80%. Then top up to 100% the night before, as it's so fast.

 

[asmvolatile]

500 watts of charging isn't especially taxing on the battery. The worst thing is leaving the battery fully charged for long periods. So I always just charge to 80%. Then top up to 100% the night before, as it's so fast.

How long is a “long period”? Based on your statement, overnight doesn’t count?

Is there no official guidance from companies on this?

 

[Astro66]

How long is a “long period”? Based on your statement, overnight doesn’t count?

Is there no official guidance from companies on this?

I have an Electric Car, Electric Motorbike and the EMTB. I use this principal for all LiPo batteries. The Storage Rule is about 2-3 days. So if I'm not using one of these devices till the next weekend. Then only charge to 80%. But if you are using them every second or third day. Just charge to 100% if you need the range.

If you have LFP batteries. Make sure you charge to 100% at least once a fortnight.

 

[Ndanger]

From what I've read, charging at higher rates generally creates more heat, and heat is one of the factors that can accelerate battery aging. So, all else being equal, a 4A charger is likely to be a little gentler on the battery than a 12A fast charger.

That said, modern battery management systems are designed to manage charging safely, so the difference is probably not dramatic. If you mainly charge overnight or have plenty of time, I'd use the 4A charger for everyday charging and keep the 12A charger for when you genuinely need a quick turnaround.

Personally, I'd rather put a little less stress on the battery day to day and save fast charging for those occasions when it's really useful.

 

[nowayfra]

Here is a good overview of how to manage your lithium ion batteries: The tldr: charge and discharge levels are what counts for maintaining capacity.

 

[Fangs2k]

Here is a good overview of how to manage your lithium ion batteries: The tldr: charge and discharge levels are what counts for maintaining capacity.

it’s tempting to extrapolate that video and apply it to all lithium ion batteries, but it’s not as simple as that.

A phone battery is a small one and is a ‘sweated asset’ for most users, it’s constantly being cycled as much as once a day for most people.

Age and cycles wear out batteries, like most stuff, and it’s no surprise that cycling a battery 80-30% a day (so half) means it lasts longer. But by doing that you’re also reducing its usefulness in an e-bike, particularly if you’re running a power hungry motor.

Bottom line for me is that people worry about this far too much, using anything on your bike wears it out, whether that’s a battery, motor, gears, tyres or suspension.

If it fails and is out of warranty, a new battery is about the same price as a decent set of forks so factor that in if anybody is particularly worried.

My lived experience with e-bikes and 10+ years of owning electric cars is that batteries last far longer than first thought, without going out of my way to look after them. The battery works for me, not the other way around.

 

[nickf]

My lived experience with e-bikes and 10+ years of owning electric cars is that batteries last far longer than first thought, without going out of my way to look after them. The battery works for me, not the other way around.

I tend to be a bit obsessive about battery health, but I think your comments are probably very sensible in the real world. In the end, if I'm happy to only deplete my battery from say a 90% to 10% charge on my rides in order to maintain its longevity, then I might as well have let rip and always used a full 100% charge even if that means that its useful capacity may have dropped to say 80% after a few years. By that time I would now be in the same situation as choosing to only use 80% of its capacity today, so it works out the same in the end!

 

[wik]

I’m a battery newb, and didn’t see this question answered anywhere. Will the 12A Avinox fast charger reduce the longevity of the battery? Considering if I should pick up a secondary lower amp standard charger (4A) for everyday charging if this is an issue. Thanks.

Based on my own experience with e-MTBs and electric cars, as well as extensive research, fast charging isn’t a problem—the BMS (battery management system) automatically reduces the charging power as the battery level rises anyway. You can compare it to filling a beer glass—at first it’s no problem, but the fuller the glass gets, the sooner it’ll overflow, and you have to pour more slowly. As a previous speaker mentioned, one problem is keeping the battery fully charged at all times.

 

[Fangs2k]

Based on my own experience with e-MTBs and electric cars, as well as extensive research, fast charging isn’t a problem—the BMS (battery management system) automatically reduces the charging power as the battery level rises anyway. You can compare it to filling a beer glass—at first it’s no problem, but the fuller the glass gets, the sooner it’ll overflow, and you have to pour more slowly. As a previous speaker mentioned, one problem is keeping the battery fully charged at all times.

Yep, there are some things it’s unwise to do with Lithium batteries, the main one being letting them self discharge below the minimum cell voltage whereupon the BMS will write them out and won’t let them be recharged for safety reason.

Circa 2.5v is generally bad news, less than 2.0v and there are chemistry changes that occur and the cell is toast.

I’d be happier leaving a battery fully charged rather than on a very low charge % for any length of time. 100% for long periods may degrade it slightly, 0% over time will kill it, something to remember if people put their bikes away for winter etc.

 

[wik]

Yep, there are some things it’s unwise to do with Lithium batteries, the main one being letting them self discharge below the minimum cell voltage whereupon the BMS will write them out and won’t let them be recharged for safety reason.

Circa 2.5v is generally bad news, less than 2.0v and there are chemistry changes that occur and the cell is toast.

I’d be happier leaving a battery fully charged rather than on a very low charge % for any length of time. 100% for long periods may degrade it slightly, 0% over time will kill it, something to remember if people put their bikes away for winter etc.

You're right, of course, about deep discharging—you shouldn't do that.
I store the battery (during the winter months, when I'm not using the bike) as best I can—at a charge level between 50-60% and in a place that's neither too cold nor too hot. But in my case Specialized—as well as with car manufacturers, they advise against keeping or storing the battery at full charge, as it causes a change in the cell structure that results in a loss of capacity.