UK Police seize & destroy legal e-bike

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Maxi

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Basically, rider stopped as suspected of riding an illegal (modified) bike. Police tested speed that it can achieve in a very suspect way and deemed the bike to be illegal. Seized & destroyed.

This is not about derestricting but is about how badly understood the 'rules' are about EPAC in the UK, especially by those who enforce it.

BBC article here - Birmingham man's legal e-bike seized and destroyed by police in error
 
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If the cops have anything about them, they'll drop the case & recompense the owner long before it gets anywhere near court where a decent KC will munch them up for elevenses. Obvs, the 'if' is doing a lot of heavy lifting, not unlike that chap's bike before Constable Savage got his hot little hands on it.
 
Police destroyed a bike supplied by city council. 😂
A cargo bike….
This reeks of deep level corruption.
Police, city council, bike manufacturer, all corrupt!
🤣🤣😂😂

Sucks to be the dude who HAD a sweet Ecargo bike..
Hopefully he will ride again👍🏼
 
Pizzman said:
Police destroyed a bike supplied by city council. 😂
A cargo bike….
This reeks of deep level corruption.
Police, city council, bike manufacturer, all corrupt!
🤣🤣😂😂

Sucks to be the dude who HAD a sweet Ecargo bike..
Hopefully he will ride again👍🏼
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Settle down! It is more likely to be simple incompetence, either on part of the Police trainers or the cops themselves. Their unwillingness to listen also has echoes of that poor sod (Henry Nowak) who was arrested and handcuffed on the floor after he was fatally stabbed by his assailant (Vickram Digwa) who was using the racism card. Police training (indoctrination) again! Digwa was jailed for life with a minimum of 21 years, the Police officers are facing a gross misconduct investigation.

Corruption requires that small numbers individuals organise in a criminal enterprise. It is much simpler to rely upon incomptence or stupidity, of which there is a large supply of individuals.
 
Obviously police incompetence/poor training which will ultimately result in more thorough training and understanding of pedelec laws.
 
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steve_sordy said:
Settle down! It is more likely to be simple incompetence, either on part of the Police trainers or the cops themselves. Their unwillingness to listen also has echoes of that poor sod (Henry Nowak) who was arrested and handcuffed on the floor after he was fatally stabbed by his assailant (Vickram Digwa) who was using the racism card. Police training (indoctrination) again! Digwa was jailed for life with a minimum of 21 years, the Police officers are facing a gross misconduct investigation.

Corruption requires that small numbers individuals organise in a criminal enterprise. It is much simpler to rely upon incomptence or stupidity, of which there is a large supply of individuals.
Click to expand...
Yeah ok
All settled here. Pretty full frontal sarcasm.
My bad.
It’s a hilarious story.
 
Surely police cannot be that stupid. Are they also destroying bicycles they lift the wheel on and pedal over 25kph ?

irie said:
result in more thorough training and understanding of pedelec laws.
Click to expand...
Pedelec Laws ??? How about a simple understanding of physics. You turn a crank by hand with no load. It will achieve the maximum speed your hand can generate, not the bloody motor. I fear for the other physics deficiencies these geniuses are making arrests on.
 
Astro66 said:
Surely police cannot be that stupid. Are they also destroying bicycles they lift the wheel on and pedal over 25kph ?


Pedelec Laws ??? How about a simple understanding of physics. You turn a crank by hand with no load. It will achieve the maximum speed your hand can generate, not the bloody motor. I fear for the other physics deficiencies these geniuses are making arrests on.
Click to expand...
Yes, UK pedelec laws.
 
This story had been widely shared, and used as a police bashing tool. The more I see it, the more something doesn't ring true, and as with most sensationalist things on social media, there is more to the story than reported - Was the rider riding at an obvious high speed with no effort, ie the bike has been modified? Has the bike been actually been crushed, where is the evidence of this? If it has, this should go to court, where it will immediately be thrown out, as the evidence has been destroyed. The police will then have to remove fines and points, and buy a new bike. If the bike is in storage, it needs and independent assessor to test it to see if it's illegal or not.
They way the story is portrayed, is the police have become judge, jury and executioner using a totally shit and fatally flawed 'test' with no means of appealing the on the hoof decision. If this is all actually all true, the police need some serious retraining, and maybe sanctions.
 
Auldain said:
They never do listen. Just ask the 2000 genocide in Gaza protesters arrested, if the family of Henry Nowak. Justice needs to blind, but not the police.
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This is the second time in this thread people have drawn an equivalence between a bicycle confiscation & a murder. Some of you need to calm down.
 
Tetley said:
This story had been widely shared, and used as a police bashing tool. The more I see it, the more something doesn't ring true, and as with most sensationalist things on social media, there is more to the story than reported - Was the rider riding at an obvious high speed with no effort, ie the bike has been modified? Has the bike been actually been crushed, where is the evidence of this? If it has, this should go to court, where it will immediately be thrown out, as the evidence has been destroyed. The police will then have to remove fines and points, and buy a new bike. If the bike is in storage, it needs and independent assessor to test it to see if it's illegal or not.
They way the story is portrayed, is the police have become judge, jury and executioner using a totally shit and fatally flawed 'test' with no means of appealing the on the hoof decision. If this is all actually all true, the police need some serious retraining, and maybe sanctions.
Click to expand...
It is going to court, did you read the BBC article in the original post?
 
This whole mess isn't helped by the fact nearly all these bikes are illegal, and most are ridden by foreigners. The police probably start out with a default setting that every bike they seize is illegal, and in fact every single non scheme e-scooter is illegal anyway without any flawed tests.
I would love to hear the police's response to this, and perhaps a bit more of the back story - there often is, and this can change everything. Look at the Henry Nowak murder- the bodyworn footage clearly showed a racist attack, as we now know the back story showed something completely different........
 
Tetley said:
I would love to hear the police's response to this
Click to expand...

It's right there in the link in post one. Instead of posting the same histrionics over & over, why not read it?

This place takes a dim view of politics & you are amongst a few pushing what could be an interesting story to a locked thread. Pack it in.
 
Fizzy said:
It is going to court, did you read the BBC article in the original post?
Click to expand...
No, because I've read it many times before elsewhere, and the other reports were saying, 'bike crushed, no appeal, case closed'
So now we have multiple different versions of the story circulating. As said above, I suspect the is more to this than is being reported...
 
Tetley said:
They way the story is portrayed, is the police have become judge, jury and executioner using a totally shit and fatally flawed 'test' with no means of appealing the on the hoof decision. If this is all actually all true, the police need some serious retraining, and maybe sanctions.
Click to expand...
My understanding on this is that for not too serious traffic offenses the police can offer the defendant the choice of a fixed penalty fine and possibly points on the license which is what happened here I believe, (it can be a good deal if you know you are guilty) or they will take you to court. Unfortunately justice at the magistrates court is a rare commodity, they implicitly believe the police regardless of how contested and unlikely their evidence is and technicalities such as the flawed test used here would be completely ignored. If you don't believe me spend a morning in the visitors gallery at a magistrates court. To take it further to a Crown court where such issues as the material evidence ( bike, missing or otherwise) and the technicalities of the test should come under proper scrutiny you will need money for a solicitor and lawyer but with no guarantee of being awarded costs and with the bar for legal aide set so high these days, is it worth it. For minor offenses I believe the police have, sad to say, become quote "judge, jury and executioner" imo.
 
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Tetley said:
No, because I've read it many times before elsewhere, and the other reports were saying, 'bike crushed, no appeal, case closed'
So now we have multiple different versions of the story circulating. As said above, I suspect the is more to this than is being reported...
Click to expand...
have a read of this article
road.cc

Police seize and destroy delivery cyclist’s legal e-bike hired through council-funded scheme after “bogus” test – but officers claim rider didn’t have insurance | electric bike reviews, buying advice and news - ebiketips

Cycling and disability groups have called for the UK’s police forces to be properly trained and educated on the laws surround e-bikes, after officers in Birmingham seized and destroyed a fully legal electric cargo bike hired as part of a council-funded scheme, claiming it was an illegal...
road.cc road.cc
more info.
 
Sod the legality of the bike, the poor sap riding it now has 6 points for no insurance on his driving licence, the cost implications may be massive. We all know that the streets are filled with illegal bikes and the food delivery industry are mostly to blame.

However if we don't want draconian legislation coming in we as a community need to be whiter than white in what and where we ride.
 
Tetley said:
This whole mess isn't helped by the fact nearly all these bikes are illegal, and most are ridden by foreigners. The police probably start out with a default setting that every bike they seize is illegal, and in fact every single non scheme e-scooter is illegal anyway without any flawed tests.
I would love to hear the police's response to this, and perhaps a bit more of the back story - there often is, and this can change everything. Look at the Henry Nowak murder- the bodyworn footage clearly showed a racist attack, as we now know the back story showed something completely different........
Click to expand...
I wish they would bring the campaign to London. I ride everyday in London and I am confident that 90 percent of the bikes used by food delivery riders are illegal. Most seem to have throttles since they move without peddling also even the ones that don't greatly exceed the 15 mph speed limit. I ride an electric Brompton and while travelling at the max speed possible they whizz pass doing what seems like 40 mph.
 
The "facts" of this incident are a mix of those by the rider, who evidently spoke very little English, then amplified by the owner of the shop who sold or rented the bike. He was not there when the police tested the bike of course and his priority is to protect his business.
So I am not prepared to accept the story without some statement from the police. Whilst the reported method used is of course flawed it would have only taken a further few mjnutes for the policd to have actually done a short ride to confirm the motor was still providing support beyond 20 kph. Maybe that was done?
 
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