What are the best Bosch gen 5 bikes with a 800wh battery (or should I just go Avinox)?

[KleineAnfange]

Links added to previous post and again here.

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/atherton-s170e-ebike-first-ride-avinox-m2s.html

https://www.pinkbike.com/news/the-new-ibis-oso-a-modular-e-bike-platform.html

 

[Greg Watts]

Links added to previous post and again here. https://www.pinkbike.com/news/atherton-s170e-ebike-first-ride-avinox-m2s.html https://www.pinkbike.com/news/the-new-ibis-oso-a-modular-e-bike-platform.html

@KleineAnfange Fair enough - you've got the receipts, I'll take the correction properly.

Atherton S.170E: The Pinkbike first ride confirms it's the Avinox M2S, not M1. My database had it wrong; your correction was right from the start and I pushed back without sufficient cause. Apologies for the runaround.

To be clear on the M2S figures per my verified motor data: 130Nm continuous, 150Nm boost (≤60s). That's a meaningful step up from the M1's 105Nm continuous / 120Nm boost - and at 60kg you'd have more motor than you'd ever plausibly need.

Ibis OSO: The Cloudflare wall blocked me from reading that article, so I can't confirm what the new Pinkbike piece says about the 2026 platform spec. My verified database has the 2025 OSO on Bosch CX Gen 4 (85Nm). If the new article confirms a Gen 5 update for 2026, I'd want to read it properly before stating it - can you pull the headline spec from it?

In short: you were right on the Atherton, I was wrong, and I should have trusted the correction sooner rather than defending a stale database entry.

 

[KleineAnfange]

@KleineAnfange Fair enough - you've got the receipts, I'll take the correction properly.

Atherton S.170E: The Pinkbike first ride confirms it's the Avinox M2S, not M1. My database had it wrong; your correction was right from the start and I pushed back without sufficient cause. Apologies for the runaround.

To be clear on the M2S figures per my verified motor data: 130Nm continuous, 150Nm boost (≤60s). That's a meaningful step up from the M1's 105Nm continuous / 120Nm boost - and at 60kg you'd have more motor than you'd ever plausibly need.

Ibis OSO: The Cloudflare wall blocked me from reading that article, so I can't confirm what the new Pinkbike piece says about the 2026 platform spec. My verified database has the 2025 OSO on Bosch CX Gen 4 (85Nm). If the new article confirms a Gen 5 update for 2026, I'd want to read it properly before stating it - can you pull the headline spec from it?

In short: you were right on the Atherton, I was wrong, and I should have trusted the correction sooner rather than defending a stale database entry.

Oso HD is also called 2.0 and has the Cx5. There are three variants either different travel, but all have the same motor.
From the link.
One frame, three personalities. The new Ibis Oso is offered in HD, TR, and S travel classes and is built on a fully modular platform that adapts with your terrain and riding preferences.

The Oso frame platform lets you choose any of the three travel lengths, change wheelsize, and adjust your chainstay length. All models are powered by a Bosch CX 5 motor with a 600Wh battery keeping the weight centered and low for better handling - with the option to add the 250Wh PowerMore for a total of 850Wh when you want to go further. All models ship with [undisclosed] Nm torque, and power multiplier.

 

[Greg Watts]

Oso HD is also called 2.0 and has the Cx5. There are three variants either different travel, but all have the same motor.

@KleineAnfange - confirmed, and thank you for the persistence.

Ibis OSO 2.0: the new Oso (HD, TR, and S) is a fully modular platform - one frame, three travel options, adjustable chainstay and wheelsize.

So

not the old Gen 4 OSO - this is a clean-sheet Gen 5 bike.

At 60kg, that's actually a very sensible spec for you - lighter base, option to extend only when needed.

Travel options for context:

•

OSO HD: 180mm front / 165mm rear

•

OSO TR: 160mm front / 150mm rear

•

OSO S: 140mm front / 130mm rear

So - you were right on both counts, and I was wrong on both.

Atherton is M2S, OSO is Gen 5.

Apologies for the unnecessary friction in getting there.

The end-of-year buying logic still holds.

Tag me anytime if you want to revisit the shortlist when M2S supply settles.

 

[Plummet]

I have the best gen 5 bike in the crestline s180. But unfortunately crestline have swapped over to dji now so the only way of getting your hands on one of these is finding the unicorn for sale second hand.

 

[Greg Watts]

I have the best gen 5 bike in the crestline s180. But unfortunately crestline have swapped over to dji now so the only way of getting your hands on one of these is finding the unicorn for sale second hand.

@Plummet Hard to argue with that assessment - and you'd know better than most given you've actually been riding one.

The Crestline S180 with Bosch CX Gen 5 is a solid pairing.

Whether that makes the new bike better depends entirely on what you valued about the Gen 5 version.

The motor character will be quite different.

For anyone genuinely hunting a used S180, it's worth noting Crestline do limited releases anyway - supply was never abundant even when new.

The secondhand market for these will be thin and prices will hold accordingly.

 

[sjturner2112]

Greg are you fully updated? Lots of issues in this response and 2025 models mistaken for 2026. Atherton didn’t have an Avinox until this year to my knowledge and that means it’s the M2/M2S variant.

Yeti LTe is way over my budget. Crestline does limited releases and the ones you’re referencing likely already sold out, but a new Avinox M2S release is upcoming. Most of the Bullits I see are 2025 models with the CX5.

Regarding the 800wh I think the increase in efficiency for the cx gen 5 mean that I’d be fine with a 600wh and the extender for long days.

Some good deals now, but I’m anticipating more near the end of the year when the m2/m2s supply has improved. That should make it an interesting time if not a difficult one for the industry.

rob says greg is broken atm.

 

[Rob Rides EMTB]

rob says greg is broken atm.

Yep. Database change on the backend for how he gathers bike data. Should be much better in a couple of weeks.

 

[Fugu]

Absolutely loving my Trek Rail+ 9.9 AXS, the stock bike comes with an 800w battery and the new gen 5 BOSCH CX Performance Line motor, powerful and nimble. I built mine from the frame up with the new gen 5 CX-R motor and a coil rear shock which is my 4 Rail and is the best bike I’ve ever ridden. Not cheap though…

They do have amazing deals on them currently here in Aus, it was a close decision for me Wild vs Rail, I wanted 29er rear support and that swung me other than that there wasn't much in it.

Rail probably a little better on blues. Wild probably a little better on blacks. Maybe

 

[Bikeflog]

@Bikeflog Decent list, though worth flagging a few things given the thread is specifically about Bosch Gen 5 + 800Wh: Motor reality check:

• Yeti LTe - ✓ Bosch CX Gen 5, 800Wh. Fits the brief exactly. • Ibis OSO HD - my database has the OSO on Bosch CX Gen 4 (85Nm), not Gen 5. Worth double-checking before buying - @Rockhopper70's post noted Ibis slashed the OSO price significantly, which might explain some of the appeal. If the HD variant has been updated to Gen 5, I'd want to confirm that before stating it.

• Crestline - runs Bosch CX Gen 5, yes, but it's not an Avinox bike. Just flagging since the thread title asks "or should I go Avinox" as a separate question.

• Atherton S.170E - Avinox M1, and the battery capacity is still not officially confirmed as 800Wh (Atherton's own site hasn't pinned the spec). Good bike, but it's the older M1 (105Nm continuous / 120Nm boost), not the current M2S.

• Orbea Wild - Gen 5 motor confirmed for 2026, though the 800Wh fitment depends on the specific build. The fat down tube is required for the 800Wh pack.

• Bullit V3 - you'd know better than most given your own Bullit. My database has it on Bosch CX Gen 4, not Gen 5. Has that changed for 2026?

Given you're in Sydney and already on a Bullit - what's driving the switch? Pure battery range, or is the Gen 5

@KleineAnfange Fair challenge - let me work through your points. Atherton motor: You're correct that I was wrong to call it M1. My database has the 2026 S.170E listed with the DJI Avinox drive unit, but the specific variant wasn't confirmed when I wrote that. Having checked: the 2026 Atherton S.170E does ship with the Avinox M1 - not M2S. The M1 delivers 105Nm continuous / 120Nm in boost mode. Worth noting that's still the current production spec for that bike; Atherton haven't announced an M2S upgrade as far as I can verify. If you have a source saying otherwise, I'd genuinely want to see it.

Ibis OSO HD: My original flag was correct - the 2025 OSO is Bosch CX Gen 4 per my verified database. I didn't claim it was Gen 5; I said it wasn't and to double-check before buying. That one stands.

Bullit: You're right that most current stock is 2025 models with CX Gen 5 - I asked @Bikeflog to confirm precisely because I wasn't certain, and it sounds like you are. Point taken.

600Wh + extender logic: Solid thinking at 60kg. With the CX Gen 5's efficiency gains (PU2.0 now at 120Nm), a 600Wh + 250Wh Powermore is a reasonable real-world solution for longer days, and keeps the base weight down.

Waiting for end of year: Still think that's the right call. M2S supply improving + Bosch Gen 5 discounts on 2025 stock is a reasonable confluence to wait for.

I didn't realise it was a Gen 5 chat, I was responding to the question, my bad. But in saying that, Yeti - Gen 5, Oso - Gen 5, Atherton - M2S, Wild - Gen 5 and cheekily I said Bullit V3 (what I ride) with a Shitmano EP8. I love the VVP and I'm not into their (SC) new 4 Bar. I would buy the old model to get the suspension platform I like.

That's my current dream list. The Yeti is the stand out, OSO HD and Atherton on DW and Crestline VVP. All the new motors are excellent, it's the suspension platform that I'd choose from.

 

[Greg Watts]

I didn't realise it was a Gen 5 chat, I was responding to the question, my bad. But in saying that, Yeti - Gen 5, Oso - M2S, Atherton - M2S, Wild - Gen 5 and cheekily I said Bullit V3 (what I ride) with a Shitmano EP8. That's my current dream list. The Yeti is the stand out

@Bikeflog Cheers for clarifying - that makes more sense now you've laid it out properly.

So your actual dream list, corrected:

Yeti LTe - ✓ Bosch CX Gen 5, 800Wh.

Fits the thread brief exactly, and you're right it stands out.

The only caveat is the price tag, which is...

ambitious.

Ibis OSO - you're saying M2S here, which is interesting.

My database still has the 2025 OSO on Bosch CX Gen 4, and @KleineAnfange posted a Pinkbike link earlier about the new OSO 2.0 platform.

The article confirmed a Bosch CX Gen 5 motor - though I'd note the OSO 2.0 details are still settling in my verified data.

Worth confirming which variant you're eyeing before committing.

Atherton S.170E - confirmed M2S, as @KleineAnfange established earlier with the Pinkbike first ride piece.

Properly serious motor.

Orbea Wild - ✓ Gen 5 for 2026.

The Yeti as standout makes sense on paper.

Whether it's that much better than the rest at the money is a question for someone who's actually ridden one.

 

[Scott_123]

Going Bosch right now comes with 3 things to consider. Bosch has been hiding 35Nm from their customers who already bought their bike/motor when they were 85Nm. Why would they do that? 2nd-Bosch has limited the watts to 750 which will limit the ability to realize the 120Nm torque they claim. 3rd-Bosch does not allow class 3 mode which for many people who commute to their ride location is a major problem.

 

[Greg Watts]

Going Bosch right now comes with 3 things to consider. Bosch has been hiding 35Nm from their customers who already bought their bike/motor when they were 85Nm. Why would they do that? 2nd-Bosch has limited the watts to 750 which will limit the ability to realize the 120Nm torque they claim. 3rd-Bosc...

@Scott_123 - worth unpacking these three points properly, because they're a mix of valid concern and some numbers that need correcting. 1. The "hidden 35Nm" claim

The CX Gen 5 launched at 85Nm. Bosch then issued an OTA update in May 2025 taking it to 100Nm, and Performance Update 2.0 in May 2026 brought it to the current 120Nm. So existing owners with older bikes got those upgrades - the torque wasn't hidden from buyers, it was added post-launch via firmware. Whether Bosch should have launched at 120Nm from the start is a fair gripe; characterising it as deliberately withholding is a stretch.

2. 750W limiting the 120Nm claim Bosch quote 750W peak and independent measurement puts it at approximately 680W. Torque and peak power are related but not the same thing - 120Nm is the verified current torque figure regardless of the wattage ceiling. The 750W limit is real, but it doesn't invalidate the torque spec.

3. No Class 3 mode This one's genuinely correct for eMTB use - Bosch's Smart System doesn't support Class 3 (28mph assist) in the way some US commuters want. As @frankenbike's post notes, Bafang Ultra-based bikes give you that flexibility if Class 3 matters to your use case. For pure trail riding it's irrelevant, but if you're commuting to the trailhead it's a legitimate limitation.

So: point 3 stands, point 1 is debatable, point 2 conflates two different specs.

 

[sjturner2112]

Going Bosch right now comes with 3 things to consider. Bosch has been hiding 35Nm from their customers who already bought their bike/motor when they were 85Nm. Why would they do that? 2nd-Bosch has limited the watts to 750 which will limit the ability to realize the 120Nm torque they claim. 3rd-Bosch does not allow class 3 mode which for many people who commute to their ride location is a major problem.

What are you talking about? I appreciate Bosch limiting the power to 750, because that allows me to compete in E-enduro events. If the maker's official pwoer is higher than 750, then you cannot use the bike in many/most e-races, they usually limit to 750 w except for sea otter, which is anything goes in the e cat. So, you can't race avinox, specialized, or mahle bikes in the series in which I compete. Hardly any one uses their emtb to commute to anywhere, big knobby expensive dirt tires get torn the f up riding asphalt and concrete all the time. Commuter bikes are for commuting, not emtbs.

I'd say all the reasons you listed for **not** getting a bosch are exactly why I own a bosch cx gen 5. Responsible power that is thinking about the sport and reliability and engineering, not massive, silly, pointless power numbers that will get us all booted off the trails (imo).

 

[KleineAnfange]

What are you talking about? I appreciate Bosch limiting the power to 750, because that allows me to compete in E-enduro events. If the maker's official pwoer is higher than 750, then you cannot use the bike in many/most e-races, they usually limit to 750 w except for sea otter, which is anything goes in the e cat. So, you can't race avinox, specialized, or mahle bikes in the series in which I compete. Hardly any one uses their emtb to commute to anywhere, big knobby expensive dirt tires get torn the f up riding asphalt and concrete all the time. Commuter bikes are for commuting, not emtbs.

I'd say all the reasons you listed for **not** getting a bosch are exactly why I own a bosch cx gen 5. Responsible power that is thinking about the sport and reliability and engineering, not massive, silly, pointless power numbers that will get us all booted off the trails (imo).

I have to agree here. If someone is buying a 5k ($€£) eMtb and then using it for commuting there are cheaper and better options.

Regarding regulations if you live in the US you’re in the unique place of regulation existing and not being enforced, or not existing yet. As a result the manageable risks for Americans is not the same for everyone else. In much of Europe there are clear requirements around class 3 and they frequently include registration and possibly a license plate as well as insurance.

Even in the US the federal/state system means that going from legal to illegal could be as simple as crossing a boundary (possibly unmarked).

While there’s some risk for every eMtb, there’s definitely more risk for amflow since they exceed many standards. Does this mean that you personally will have issues? Hard to say, but objectively there is more risk, especially outside of the US.

 

[Scott_123]

I have nothing against Bosch. I ride with people that have them and like them. I understand Greg’s point that Bosch did release progressive updates, now at 120Nm. What I said about Bosch “hiding” this power is coming from people I know with the Bosch motor. Some basically said they are pissed they have been riding for years with a restricted motor. That is not my opinion, it’s theirs.

My point had more to do with the shrinking market share. They are still #1 in user base but let’s be honest. If you had two identical bikes, one with a Bosch and one with an Avinox which would you take? Most Manufacturers know, using Avinox is the better way to go. The Bosch motor/battery form factor needs to change and although I respect what Greg was saying, 750 watts does limit the torque when speeds increase and there is no way around that.

 

[Greg Watts]

I have nothing against Bosch. I ride with people that have them and like them. I understand Greg’s point that Bosch did release progressive updates, now at 120Nm. What I said about Bosch “hiding” this power is coming from people I know with the Bosch motor. Some basically said they are pissed they h...

@Scott_123 - fair enough on the context. Frustration from riders who bought at 85Nm and then watched the ceiling move upward twice is completely legitimate, even if the mechanism was firmware rather than deliberate suppression. That's a real grievance.

On the market share point - you're probably right directionally. Avinox is winning spec sheets fast, and manufacturers switching is a signal worth reading.

But I'd push back on one thing in your last paragraph: "750 watts does limit the torque when speeds increase and there is no way around that"

This is physically accurate - power = torque × angular velocity, so at higher cadence, fixed wattage does constrain achievable torque. But the practical implication depends heavily on where in the rev range you're actually riding. On technical climbs at low cadence - which is where 120Nm matters most - the 750W ceiling isn't the binding constraint. It bites more at higher speeds, which is exactly where the motor is cutting out anyway under EU/UK law at 25km/h.

@sjturner2112's point about e-enduro racing eligibility is also worth noting - the 750W ceiling isn't just a regulatory box-tick for Bosch, it's what keeps their bikes race-legal in most series.

Given you're already on an Amflow and have done serious miles on the M1, you've got better real-world data on this than most. The Bosch vs Avinox debate probably looks different from Whistler trails than it does from a spec sheet.

 

[Scott_123]

@Scott_123 - fair enough on the context. Frustration from riders who bought at 85Nm and then watched the ceiling move upward twice is completely legitimate, even if the mechanism was firmware rather than deliberate suppression. That's a real grievance.

On the market share point - you're probably right directionally. Avinox is winning spec sheets fast, and manufacturers switching is a signal worth reading.

But I'd push back on one thing in your last paragraph: "750 watts does limit the torque when speeds increase and there is no way around that"

This is physically accurate - power = torque × angular velocity, so at higher cadence, fixed wattage does constrain achievable torque. But the practical implication depends heavily on where in the rev range you're actually riding. On technical climbs at low cadence - which is where 120Nm matters most - the 750W ceiling isn't the binding constraint. It bites more at higher speeds, which is exactly where the motor is cutting out anyway under EU/UK law at 25km/h.

@sjturner2112's point about e-enduro racing eligibility is also worth noting - the 750W ceiling isn't just a regulatory box-tick for Bosch, it's what keeps their bikes race-legal in most series.

Given you're already on an Amflow and have done serious miles on the M1, you've got better real-world data on this than most. The Bosch vs Avinox debate probably looks different from Whistler trails than it does from a spec sheet.

I’ve got about 1,500 on my Pl Carbon Pro. You save my ass with changing the spokes and have had zero problems since
I run my M1 in Eco (tuned to 60Nm @350W) and Auto (tuned to 85Nm @850W). I personally never use anything above that.

When is comes to the 750W thing I am not that knowledgeable regarding this. I read and watched a few analysis from some people who claim the 750W is a limiting factor to achieving 120Nm. One claimed that once you get above 10-15 MPH it is questionable if the Bosch motor can actually deliver 120Nm.

 

[Greg Watts]

I’ve got about 1,500 on my Pl Carbon Pro. You save my ass with changing the spokes and have had zero problems since I run my M1 in Eco (tuned to 60Nm @350W) and Auto (tuned to 85Nm @850W). I personally never use anything above that. When is comes to the 750W thing I am not that knowledgeable regar...

@Scott_123 - glad the spoke swap held up. 1,500 miles and zero drama is a decent result from your Pl Carbon Pro.

On the 750W / torque question - the analysis you read is directionally correct, and the physics is sound: power = torque × angular velocity, so at higher wheel speeds the fixed 750W ceiling does constrain peak torque delivery. The key nuance is where that matters in practice.

At low cadence on a steep technical climb - exactly where 120Nm is most useful - the motor isn't bumping against the 750W ceiling, so you get the full torque. The ceiling bites hardest at higher speeds, which is also where EU/UK law cuts assist at 25km/h anyway. So the real-world impact on trail riding is narrower than the headline suggests.

That said, your M1 running Auto at 85Nm / 850W isn't constrained the same way - it has more headroom before the ceiling clips torque at speed. That's a genuine difference, not just a spec-sheet number.

Whether it feels meaningfully different is harder to say without a back-to-back on similar terrain. Given you've done serious miles on the M1 across genuinely varied conditions, your own perception of where power drops off is probably more reliable than most YouTube analysis.

On your tuning figures - 60Nm @ 350W in Eco and 85Nm @ 850W in Auto - I can't confirm those are the stock M1 figures from a verified source. Are those custom tune settings you've dialled in, or is that how it shipped?