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Arm pump/hand fatigue help?

MtbWalker

MtbWalker

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Does anyone suffer with arm pump or hand fatigue? What did you do to remedy it?
I suffer with it really bad, it absolutely kills my runs.

Cheers in advance
 
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MtbWalker said:
Does anyone suffer with arm pump or hand fatigue? What did you do to remedy it?
I suffer with it really bad, it absolutely kills my runs.

Cheers in advance
Click to expand...
If your handlebar grips are lower than your seat, it makes hand numbness and pain worse. If they are higher than the seat, it helps. I haven't experienced "arm pump", if by that, you mean fatigue in the triceps or forearms. That's not because my forearms and triceps are super strong. They're not.

Even with my seat up, my grips are 3-4" higher than the top of my saddle. That has never been a limiting factor for me on climbs, especially with steeper STA's, and it helps on the downhills. You could try raising the bars.

I generally like the steeper STA's but I think they contribute to the trend of more hand pain. I never experinced hand pain until I transitioned to this geometry. I have found that flatter grips like Ergons help, and also there are lock on foam grips that are pretty cheap that you could try. You could also experiment with more rearward bar sweep, but that's a pricey experiment!

What are the conditions under which you experience this the most? Long downhills?
My wife is using Fasst Flexx bars with 12-degree back sweep, raised bar height and soft flexing spacers. She never gets arm pump or hand pain. I used them for a while on my mountain bike and really loved them, but she commandeered them.
 
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My moto coach was a pro racer and dealt with this his entire career, and ended up having arm pump surgery to release the fascia around the muscles.
 
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Montana St Alum said:
If your handlebar grips are lower than your seat, it makes hand numbness and pain worse. If they are higher than the seat, it helps. I haven't experienced "arm pump", if by that, you mean fatigue in the triceps or forearms. That's not because my forearms and triceps are super strong. They're not.

Even with my seat up, my grips are 3-4" higher than the top of my saddle. That has never been a limiting factor for me on climbs, especially with steeper STA's, and it helps on the downhills. You could try raising the bars.

I generally like the steeper STA's but I think they contribute to the trend of more hand pain. I never experinced hand pain until I transitioned to this geometry. I have found that flatter grips like Ergons help, and also there are lock on foam grips that are pretty cheap that you could try. You could also experiment with more rearward bar sweep, but that's a pricey experiment!

What are the conditions under which you experience this the most? Long downhills?
My wife is using Fasst Flexx bars with 12-degree back sweep, raised bar height and soft flexing spacers. She never gets arm pump or hand pain. I used them for a while on my mountain bike and really loved them, but she commandeered them.
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On longer runs or runs with lots of tight berms it gets to the point towards the end where I struggle to pull my brake levers.
 
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Grip strength exercises, all the time. Squeeze/stress balls the proper size for your hand (critical)
Stretching your wrists (a lot) do these while Watching TV, driving (steering wheels are perfect wrist stretchers) , the more the better. It works really well. Thicker grips helped me.
Lighten up on your riding grip. I guarantee you squeeze the bars too tight. Even I catch myself squeezing too tightly.
Brakes, it is critical they are in the right spot. Not comfortable while you sit on it in the garage.
Comfortable when you are descending and needing to brake with your body weight on your grips. Probably need to drop/raise them a few degrees at a time until you find your sweet spot.
Last
Nutrition. But I eat Twinkies so I’ll tap out here………
 
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Pizzman said:
Grip strength exercises, all the time. Squeeze/stress balls the proper size for your hand (critical)
Stretching your wrists (a lot) do these while Watching TV, driving (steering wheels are perfect wrist stretchers) , the more the better. It works really well. Thicker grips helped me.
Lighten up on your riding grip. I guarantee you squeeze the bars too tight. Even I catch myself squeezing too tightly.
Brakes, it is critical they are in the right spot. Not comfortable while you sit on it in the garage.
Comfortable when you are descending and needing to brake with your body weight on your grips. Probably need to drop/raise them a few degrees at a time until you find your sweet spot.
Last
Nutrition. But I eat Twinkies so I’ll tap out here………
Click to expand...
I have played around a lot with the position of my levers. I will give everything else a go. Thanks for the reply.
 
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Everyone gets it if you push hard enough. I used to get it really bad but now it's almost a non issue. I'm no expert but here are 3 things that really helped me.

Hand to wrist position: Keep your hands inline with your forearm. If your wrist are bent too much either up/down or side to side it stresses the tendons and can inhibit blood flow to your hands causing numbness. The Ergon GA3 mentioned above helped not so much in giving support but as a repeatable reference position when sitting. When standing on the pedals I like to use the brake levers as my reference and have them angled for this position. There are also two types of natural hand alignment, flat and angled. Make a fist and look your hand from the top, your knuckles will either be perpendicular to your arm or angled with the pinky being closer. I fall into the latter group and 12 degree angled bars are much more comfortable.

Rider position: Putting too much weight on your hands. Get your reach right and higher stack does help. Don't lock your elbows, they need to flex just like your knees. Practice proper body position and you'll flow over features rather than plowing through them.

Death grip: Relax your grip on the bars. It's natural to grip tighter in rough terrain and sometimes needed but don't make a habit of it. Suspension setup will make a big difference here, if you don't feel like you're going to get bucked off you'll relax.
 
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First of all, you should consider changing the bar and getting more rise.

- If you have a 35 mm stem, then the Oneup carbon bar is one of the best.
- If it's 31.8, change to carbon one, e.g. Renthal 31.8 carbon with 30 or 40 rise dampens well.

But don't forget to strengthen your arms. Just hanging will give you a lot more strength and grip.
 
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MtbWalker said:
Does anyone suffer with arm pump or hand fatigue? What did you do to remedy it?
I suffer with it really bad, it absolutely kills my runs.

Cheers in advance
Click to expand...
Most comfortable bars ex stock are Faast Flex (they come with a set of different elastomers) and the One Up Carbon bar.

Problem with FF is it only comes in 30mm rise.

One Up now has a 50mm option.

Higher rise bars are more comfortable.

To increase comfort even further insert kiln dried sand into the bars. That will reduce vibrations further and calm steering momentum.
 
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By far the most important factor is conditioning. Ride your bike more and build up your arm strength by smashing countless laps at high speed. The longer the dh runs the better.

95% of the reason for arm pump is lack of conditioning.

Now, nobody has mentioned shock set up and tire pressure, thats reasons 2 and 3.

Make sure ypu havent overpumped your tires and you have good small bump plushness on ya front fork.

Sort those 2 set up factors and that will get you 99% there. Front there you can play around with grips and handlebar sweep/positioning.
 
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Lot of people in this thread suggesting conditioning, but be careful it's not nerve-damage related. I have mild carpal syndrome and following things helped:

1) Super tall stack height, 4 cms of spacers + 50mm OneUp V2 carbon bar, soft & ergo grips
2) Super easy to pull brakes like Hayes Dominions
3) Remembering to be "light on bars, heavy on feet" and trying to avoid deathgrip any time I consciously can. Of course, on hard runs this is not easy
4) Lighter tire pressure and faster rebound in fork (should be as fast as possible without killing you).
 
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Another vote for a higher rise bar and importantly more back sweep and Ergo GA3 grips. Oh and don't run to wide a bar for your physical build, for example if your 5'8" (173cm) do you really need 800mm wide bars?
 
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Amber Valley Guy said:
Another vote for a higher rise bar and importantly more back sweep and Ergo GA3 grips. Oh and don't run to wide a bar for your physical build, for example if your 5'8" (173cm) do you really need 800mm wide bars?
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Yeah, showroom bikes are typically set up with ultra low 800cm bars for super fit 6'3"+ blokes with gorilla arms. :rolleyes:
 
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irie said:
Yeah, showroom bikes are typically set up with ultra low 800cm bars for super fit 6'3"+ blokes with gorilla arms. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

And in the age range 16-30 with no injuries, no back, arm or wrist problems and are only going to ride the bike for a maximum of 15 mins at a time.
 
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irie said:
Yeah, showroom bikes are typically set up with ultra low 800cm bars for super fit 6'3"+ blokes with gorilla arms. :rolleyes:
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One thing to consider is that, at least on my One Ups, the minimum cut width is about 29" (740mm), so if you want to go shorter, check out the minimum cut width for whatever bars you use. I think 31.8 diameter bars can be cut narrower. My wife is using the Fasst Flexx bars, which I've cut narrower and because they are narrower, there's less leverage to produce the flex. I have the softest elastomers in for her to help with that.

Regarding the FF bars, They are pretty heavy, and at one point, I was a weight weenie. My first ride with them was climbing up Hymasa in Moab, Utah, which is practically a staircase of square edged bumps. I had the bars rotated to absorb impacts coming in from slightly forward of the front fork line which really helped. On that ride, I got a climb PR. They are nice bars, even though they have a bit of a Frankenstein-ish appearance.
 
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Before starting with new handlebars/grips/etc, you should check what is causing that!

It can be a health/constrain issue.
Try to check if you have Drs specialized on that arm/wrist and explain what's happening.

You can also try:
- not gripping to hard
- elevate your handlebar and adjust brake levers

But, please find a specialized Orthopedic Dr and check that out.
 
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George_KSL said:
Lot of people in this thread suggesting conditioning, but be careful it's not nerve-damage related. I have mild carpal syndrome and following things helped:

1) Super tall stack height, 4 cms of spacers + 50mm OneUp V2 carbon bar, soft & ergo grips
2) Super easy to pull brakes like Hayes Dominions
3) Remembering to be "light on bars, heavy on feet" and trying to avoid deathgrip any time I consciously can. Of course, on hard runs this is not easy
4) Lighter tire pressure and faster rebound in fork (should be as fast as possible without killing you).
Click to expand...
Conditioning is the most likely reason. It is by far the most important factor.
 
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Although I’m a fan, conditioning is arguably not going to help massively here, at least not initially. If you do go down that route, have an in-depth assessment with a good sports / MSK clinician so you can put together a proper plan that includes consideration of riding and recovery.

Likely much easier wins initially, higher rise bars (vibrocore work well for lots!), technique training and optimising loading through your feet. Good brakes set up well also make a massive difference along with working on your breaking technique. Then the normal, great forks set up well (that work well with the shock set up), appropriate tyre pressures, all can help!

Conditioning is important, but training errors and doing too much also provide lots of clinics with patients, especially with the rise of online training programmes. :)
 
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A lot like golf if you happen to play... a light grip is pretty key in mountain biking for a lot of reasons, including arm pump. Will also improve your general bike handling and corning . First instinct is to grip the living daylights out of the bar to maintain control, but you really only want to be holding on as firmly as is required to keep hold. I'd bet if you youtube it here are some coaches speaking much more intelligently about it haha.

Arm pump is inevitable no matter how good your conditioning and technique are on certain lengths of DH tracks, but it shouldn't be as bad as you're describing. Lot of folks will talk of higher bars and fancy bars/grips, which can help for sure, but in my opinion those are down stream solutions compared to focusing on your riding technique.
 
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It's no good conditioning, if for example, your shoes are the wrong size for your feet then expecting to run a marathon without problems, or having say, carpal tunnel problems and saying work harder, your wrists are fine, makes zero sense.
 
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I've started to get it more often when riding more regularly. I think from from gripping too tight especially bumpy braking

It's worth messing with brake lever angle as that can help. I tried gel gloves but they just bunch up and give me blisters, paradoxically you might need more air in the fork if it's diving and putting more weight through your hands
 
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I think it depends a lot on what you mean by 'arm pump/fatigue'. Is it soreness in the palms of your hands from impacts, or in the tendons from squeezing the levers, or in the muscles/joints from squeezing the bars, or an actual build-up of blood and metabolites in the forearm (like climber's arm pump), or weakness in the triceps, or something else? The 'treatment' for those sometimes overlaps but often differs.

I mostly struggle with pain from impacts, and I've yet to find a complete solution, but things that have helped include:
  1. Revgrips
  2. Compliant bars (I prefer Vibrocore to OneUp; I've also got some Fasst Flexx that I'll try soon)
  3. Higher bars, so less weight is on the hands (at the extreme, consider the BeMoreBikes Raised Reverse Stem; there is a thread in this forum about that)
  4. Radial tyres + Cushcore + lower tyre pressure
  5. Compliant rims, e.g. Zipp 3Zero Moto
  6. Well set-up suspension (right amount of damping, right spring rate, etc; note that 'softer and less compression damping' can sometimes make things worse)
  7. Strength training in the gym or climbing wall, e.g. deadlifts, bar hangs, plate squeezes
 
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bram.biesiekierski said:
Try reducing fork (hi speed) compression damper strength a little bit. Too much makes it jarring and ypu may find it not even that nessisray to your riding.
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HSC doesn't generally cause harshness. It's usually more to do with LSC, rebound, and friction. See the Vorsprung vids about this.
 
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