The end for ebike tuning?

[Mikerb]

Saw this in industry cycling news.....French Govt planning to introduce punitive legislation for owners manufacturers and retailers if found tuning or being comllicit in tuning a pedelec beyond the 25kph legal limit. Thse steps being taken apparently as a result of the recent fatal accident.

 

[#lazy]

“The” one fatal accident ! They’ll be riots in the alps if goes through !!

 

[Zimmerframe]

Yup .. and they've just extended the Hunting season from October>March too .... ALL year except part of June and August ..

Excellent .. so you'll be prosecuted if you've derestricted your bike. But you can roam around drunk without a care in the world and with no respect for other human beings or animals and shoot the crap out of everything and everyone - killing 18 people in 2017 alone not to mention the hundreds of dogs, cats and horses which get killed or permanently injured.... god forbid you might want to ride past them a bit quicker so you can reduce your chance of death. Not that you'll be able to go out, because they just block all the forest trails and claim them as their own and you have to stay home all day and guard your animals so they don't just come and kill them.

If you kill someone whilst hunting .. you just say "I thought it was a wild boar" ... and you're let off . The fact that you shouldn't be shooting at a person if you can't tell that they're a person and not a wild boar is irrelevant.

So maybe derestricted pedalec owners just need to say they're hunting and viola - innocent of any wrong doings ..

 

[Mikerb]

Do you know anymore about the new law? Is it proposed or noe in place? Is it France only or is it being taken up by the EU? The article I read suggested Spain was following suit.

 

[Mikerb]

Another recent article covered an ECJ ruling on a specific case which specified that any motorised vehicle should be insured for use whether on public or private land. That ruling encompassed ebikes and even sit on lawnmowers! The UK was refusing to implement it as being ridiculous but dont know how that affected France and other Eu members.

 

[dobbyhasfriends]

its a fucking joke... where is the balance in the world? get less time and punishment for violent crimes or car/van theft.. how the hell can one incident justify this level of punishment

 

[#lazy]

I thought ALL the laws were made by the EU ! Argh we’ve been conned again ?

 

[Zimmerframe]

I think it actually came in on December 24th to "clarify things" as they felt it was a bit open as it was.

Personally, when comparing it to other "crimes" and their relevant punishments it seems a little unbalanced.

It's actually "upto" a €30,000 fine - but also upto 1 year in prison and possible removal of your driving licence for three years ...

Anyone selling de-restrict kits - Upto 2 years in prison and the €30,000 fine.

On top of that "The person responsible for the unlocking" gets all that AND .. you'll like this - they'll also take your driving licence off you for 3 years ... so go figure that one out !!

 

[#lazy]

Is this for riding on trails as well as on public roads ?

 

[Mikerb]

I thought ALL the laws were made by the EU ! Argh we’ve been conned again ?

The exact opposite. All lawa are national but if a member of the EU they have to incorporate EU regulations unless an opt out is negotiated.

 

[Mikerb]

Is this for riding on trails as well as on public roads ?

My guess is it follows all other pedelec regulations so applies everywhere except private land. At least that is the UK position.(I assume you are referring to tuning rather than the issue of insurance.)

 

[Mikerb]

I think it actually came in on December 24th to "clarify things" as they felt it was a bit open as it was.

Personally, when comparing it to other "crimes" and their relevant punishments it seems a little unbalanced.

It's actually "upto" a €30,000 fine - but also upto 1 year in prison and possible removal of your driving licence for three years ...

Anyone selling de-restrict kits - Upto 2 years in prison and the €30,000 fine.

On top of that "The person responsible for the unlocking" gets all that AND .. you'll like this - they'll also take your driving licence off you for 3 years ... so go figure that one out !!

Pretty draconian! Also completely uneccessary at least in the UK for the rider since if the bike is tuned it ceases to beva pedelec and all the laws that form the Road Traffic Act apply.

 

[Fivetones]

If the UK could adopt the US speed limit for a pedelec I’d be happy enough. The lower EU-wide limit is daft.

 

[B1rdie]

I am afraid that people riding regular mtb may be accused of having removed the motors of the bike just to be able to achieve careless speeds when downhilling those alpine trails omg.

 

[Janc]

The world is bonkers... and getting worse... appreciate this is off topic but just as crazy!

"
Hello from Greece!

We are facing a problem here in Athens /Greece with the coast guard in the last month.
They have an order to enforce a Greek law that unfortunately clearly dictates that windsurfing is strictly forbiten when the wind blows with strength of 6 bft scale or more.
The penalty is 1000 euro! (yes the zeroes are correct... 1 thousand euro)
We are trying to change the law or at least increase the number to the bft scale limit ..
This law is already in force in all Greece but from what we know only the coast guard of Athens is trying to enforce it till now.
Any help or info of something similar to other countries would be greatly appreciated...
The law (only in Greek unfortunately) is here...

E-NOMOTHESIA.GR

Υπουργική Απόφαση 2133.1/39328/2018 - ΦΕΚ 1929/Β/30-5-2018
Έγκριση τροποποίησης του Γενικού Κανονισμού Λιμένων αριθμ. 20 «Ταχύπλοα (ταχυκίνητα) σκάφη και λοιπά θαλάσσια μέσα αναψυχής».…"
https://www.e-nomothesia.gr/kat-nay...fQ4Y7u9xA64KN7KNknUCY1PP3HtxrfK47dDeBT2mR7wGw

 

[MattyB]

The punitive and unenforceable law - a global specialism of the 2000s. My other hobby is RC flying; after ~100 years of safe operations this too is being exterminated by the authorities under the auspices off ‘elf n safety. Of course it’s really because governments think they can extract tax £££s from the likes of Google and Amazon. Grrrr... ?

 

[R120]

Spending my working day driving around London, I can see where the authorities are coming from with this - there has been a real increase in people riding around on home converted/ebay specials that are unrestricted, ye they are riding them with no concern fro sticking to traffic laws.

Its these idiots who are making this happen.

 

[Janc]

solution all ready being used for numpteees just apply it to derestricted bikes

 

[Fivetones]

Spending my working day driving around London, I can see where the authorities are coming from with this - there has been a real increase in people riding around on home converted/ebay specials that are unrestricted, ye they are riding them with no concern fro sticking to traffic laws.

Its these idiots who are making this happen.

The rise of the electric scooter (that can be derestricted) won’t help either. This are only used in urban environments and aren’t ‘assisted’ like a pedelec.

 

[Mikerb]

The world is bonkers... and getting worse... appreciate this is off topic but just as crazy!

"
Hello from Greece!

We are facing a problem here in Athens /Greece with the coast guard in the last month.
They have an order to enforce a Greek law that unfortunately clearly dictates that windsurfing is strictly forbiten when the wind blows with strength of 6 bft scale or more.
The penalty is 1000 euro! (yes the zeroes are correct... 1 thousand euro)
We are trying to change the law or at least increase the number to the bft scale limit ..
This law is already in force in all Greece but from what we know only the coast guard of Athens is trying to enforce it till now.
Any help or info of something similar to other countries would be greatly appreciated...
The law (only in Greek unfortunately) is here...

E-NOMOTHESIA.GR

Υπουργική Απόφαση 2133.1/39328/2018 - ΦΕΚ 1929/Β/30-5-2018
Έγκριση τροποποίησης του Γενικού Κανονισμού Λιμένων αριθμ. 20 «Ταχύπλοα (ταχυκίνητα) σκάφη και λοιπά θαλάσσια μέσα αναψυχής».…"

Use slalom gear?? You should be a ble to outrun the coastguard in a force 6 or more!!

 

[Kingfisher]

They don’t need to change the law, the law is quite clear. if your bike support goes above 25km/h, you are no longer riding a bicycle, you are riding a moped. An uninsured moped, a non type-approved moped.

if you ride a derestricted bike on a public road, you deserve the same punishment as the 16 year old with the souped up monkey bike.

don’t do the crime if you can’t pay the fine. You’re ruining it for the rest of us. The reason we have unlimited trail access in Europe is because we have a sound regulatory framework. Start messing with that and you end up like the USA.

 

[DrStupid]

They don’t need to change the law, the law is quite clear. if your bike support goes above 25km/h, you are no longer riding a bicycle, you are riding a moped. An uninsured moped, a non type-approved moped.

if you ride a derestricted bike on a public road, you deserve the same punishment as the 16 year old with the souped up monkey bike.

don’t do the crime if you can’t pay the fine. You’re ruining it for the rest of us. The reason we have unlimited trail access in Europe is because we have a sound regulatory framework. Start messing with that and you end up like the USA.

From where I'm standing, some 2,250 miles from California, to be honest, our (US) trouble has nothing to do with derestricted bikes, if that's what your alluding to? Our trouble is mostly complete ignorance about ALL ebikes, by law makers, traditional bicycle users, and the public in general. You cant really pick derestricted ebikes out of the mix and say... there it is, that's the problem.

 

[Rusty]

The reality is that this has little to do with the fatal accident - it is all about someone in a government somewhere having power/control over you.

 

[outerlimits]

This should be the case world wide.
Massive fines for those who ride derestricted ebikes illegally.
I live in a nanny state, so one more law won’t hurt ?‍

 

[outerlimits]

From where I'm standing, some 2,250 miles from California, to be honest, our (US) trouble has nothing to do with derestricted bikes, if that's what your alluding to? Our trouble is mostly complete ignorance about ALL ebikes, by law makers, traditional bicycle users, and the public in general. You cant really pick derestricted ebikes out of the mix and say... there it is, that's the problem.

It gives the anti ebike crew more ammo when it comes time to defend their narrow mindlessness. Why make it easy for them to argue. If you derestrict your ebike and ride it illegally, then you are part of the problem, not the solution.

 

[HORSPWR]

Another recent article covered an ECJ ruling on a specific case which specified that any motorised vehicle should be insured for use whether on public or private land. That ruling encompassed ebikes and even sit on lawnmowers! The UK was refusing to implement it as being ridiculous but dont know how that affected France and other Eu members.

Easy to implement and difficult to police!
What do they come to your house every day and do a mandatory plug in to see if it's been speed altered?

 

[#lazy]

I’m assuming you guys never drive your cars over the speed limit , always drive with both hands on the wheel at all times , never eat or drink when driving and always comply with every law that has ever been made ! If so you are the pillars of the world , if not then you are like everyone else who just wants to push the boundaries a little every now and again ! Lighten up dudes

 

[Rusty]

I’m assuming you guys never drive your cars over the speed limit , always drive with both hands on the wheel at all times , never eat or drink when driving and always comply with every law that has ever been made ! If so you are the pillars of the world , if not then you are like everyone else who just wants to push the boundaries a little every now and again ! Lighten up dudes

Fonk No. My ex always reckoned the posted speed limit was my Minimum Speed Required

I do however drive with both hands on the wheel ...... unless
I am changing gear
I have a beer in one hand
I am being helpful and giving directions with my middle finger
I have a burrito in one hand
I am going puff - puff - pass

 

[DrStupid]

It gives the anti ebike crew more ammo when it comes time to defend their narrow mindlessness. Why make it easy for them to argue. If you derestrict your ebike and ride it illegally, then you are part of the problem, not the solution.

I agree completely, my post wasn't defending or supporting either side..I was pointing out that derestriction isn't in any way, shape, or form, the cause of trail access issues in the US..ignorance is.

None of my bikes are derestricted.

 

[Zimmerframe]

None of my bikes are derestricted.

But fortunately your mind is ??

Keep building them there trails !