Haibike FLYON, 120Nm motor, 630Wh battery with quick charge


Haibike 2019: FLYON, 120Nm motor, 630Wh battery with quick charge

Haibike have just announed their new 2019 FLYON system to huge applause at EuroBike. FLYON is a new category of bikes in the Haibike line up. They offer more torque, assistance and better range and a whole host of other things from lights to a huge integrated screen. Let's check out what FLYON includes and the features that it brings. I had earlier met up with TQ, who make the motor for this bike. They told me that there was a 'world exclusive' announcement happening today with their motor, seems this is it!

2019 Haibike Flyon


Haibike have been developing the FLYON bikes for over two years, around the relatively unknown TQ motor. When I met up with TQ they mentioned that they had developed the motor originally in 2015 and have been refining it over the past couple of years ready for the market.

2019 Haibike Flyon


Speaking to Haibike. its quite clear that they are super passionate and excited about this new FLYON range. It's the first time that they have had an entire package that is their own; their own software and custom motor firmware that is not just another off-the-shelf Shimano or Bosch, but more like what Specialized have done with their partnership with Brose. You'll not see the TQ branding or marketing used anywhere, instead Haibike will brand everything as their own.

2019 Haibike Flyon


This bike really does look awesome. It looks futuristic. It even has air intakes on the head tube to cool the battery. The TQ motor is integrated into the frame and the Haibike designed chainring make it look like something you might see on an AMG Mercedes. What about that headlight! 5000 lumens of light output. I'm still not 100% convinced its needed (I beleive it will be on the higher-end models only), interesting that they've decided it is going to be a factory fit option. The back also has tail lights which look pretty cool. I asked are they easy to change when they break. They said yes and dealers will carry spares.

2019 Haibike Flyon


The TQ HPR120S motor is the most powerful motor on the market, using a patented gearbox system. I got a chance to speak to the TQ inventor of the motor. He claims that the motor is actually capable of over 120Nm of torque, but they wanted to limit it as anything over that is pretty pointless. Also, no issues with heat build up, even on extended punishing rides and large ascents. It will still maintain a powerful 120Nm, even at low cadences.

2019 Haibike Flyon TQ Motor


The speed sensor is on the actual disc, more commonly found on motorcycle ABS systems, you can see the smaller black disk inside the regular brake disk. The system monitors revolutions 18 times per revolution meaning that its more precise. What this also means is that it will be pretty much impossible for anyone that wants to unlock the speed restrictions as the disc is coded to prevent any speed modifications being added.

2019 Haibike Flyon


2019 Haibike Flyon TQ Motor


The 630Wh battery is completely integrated into the down tube but can be removed for charging. The battery contains 56 cells, the highest density currently on the market. An uprated battery charger can be bought separately that charger as 10A (vs the regular supplied 4A charger). This will give an industrly leading charge time of 0-80% within an hour. Incredible! A bit tight that you dont get it included, but nonetheless, that's a fantastic charge time.

2019 Haibike Flyon


The huge display gives excellent rider visibility on whats happening during the ride. Whilst I didnt get to see it on this bike (must be still not quite 100% finished) the details were shared in the presentation. The display will indicate a colour coded way of showing the rider what mode the bike is in, and is apparently really easy to read at a glance. In your peripheral view it should be easy to make out what colour the screen is and you'll know the mode. As you go faster, the speedo gets larger so you don't have to squint down to see how fast you are when you're blasting down your local trails.

2019 Haibike Flyon


I've been saying it for a while in my videos now integrated displays would be really cool done right. I cant wait to see this one working during a ride to see how useful it is.

2019 Haibike Flyon


Theres more innovation on too. Better dropper posts without running wires that Haibikes have always had. Geometry is also changeable with the flip chip too.

2019 Haibike Flyon


This is a remarkable bike. New powerful TQ motor, integrated accessories, beefy, muscular looks and years worth of work, design and engineering have gone into making this bike. Never before have we had so much torque available on an EMTB or this level of add-on kit off the shelf.

The cost? Up to €8,999 for the flagship NDURO 10.0 and the entry level NDURO 5.0 comes in at €6299. Not cheap at all, in fact this puts them at the top of the pricing tiers that we see on EBikes now.

Haibike has really upped the ante in innovation here and it's going to be an awesome year seeing how the rest of the pack keep up. 2018 and 2019 are going to be really exciting times!

 
Last edited:
Rob Hancill

Comments

davegixer

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Jul 7, 2018
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#2
And my futile quest for a new bike keeps getting harder. Great stuff Rob
 

davegixer

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Jul 7, 2018
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#3
Got a quick interview with Haibikes designer on their new FLYON system. It looks impressive, it’s their first ‘in house’ bike that’s all theirs... Motor is TQ but Haibike have developed their own software for it. Integrated lights front and rear, neat display. Looks very good.
I need to hold off on the new bike purchase until you're back with your bucket load of info I think...
 

Rob Hancill

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#4
Haibike FLYON is being sold April/May 2019.
 

Donnie797

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#6
To me it alteady seems that all that cares is more Motor Power. Where will that end? Do we need more Nm and more Watts? Are todays emtbs underpowered?
I‘ve tested the Bosch CX and Shimano E8000 and on both i would reduce the standard eco 50% support cause it felt too much to me. Turbo was amazing on both, but when you get up to 25km/h within a few pedal strikes, why is more power needed?

I‘m afraid it’s the same development the photo-camera industry took with the megapixel hype and the mass of the customers don’t realize that more megapixels doesn’t mean its better.

For sure it’s controversial, i wonder what you think about it?
 

eFat

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#7
For sure it’s controversial, i wonder what you think about it?
Maybe this would be an interesting subject for a new thread.

But if now most users seems to favour "eco" mode it's surely also related to the limits of the batteries. With "unlimited" energy I'm sure "eco" will be forget by most.

As for the camera, it's not really true. In the end every new camera with more Mpixel gives better results than its predecessor (with same generation technology).

Nevertheless, No, todays e-bike are not underpowered.
 

Blackbird

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#8
I think it really depends on where you use the bike. In the Netherlands, were hill is a foreign word and mountains are clouds, no you really do not need more power. Turbo on a cx is already overkill.
In the Swiss alps? Making very steep climbs? Power could be usefull.

Then again, it is not just about what people need, it is also what people want, since more speed isn't possible under current laws, more power atracts buyers.

Also interesting to point out, the speed sensor is built into the rear brake disc and they say it is coded and cannot be manipulated. So no more overriding the speed governer.
 
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Donnie797

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#10
I think it really depends on where you use the bike. In the Netherlands, were hill is a foreign word and mountains are clouds, no you really do not need more power. Turbo on a cx is already overkill.
In the Swiss alps? Making very steep climbs? Power could be usefull.
That‘s the point and why i have this opinion - with turbo you can already do the steepest climbs these days. If it’s to steep to ride than it’s probably not because of lacking motor power, it‘s because of physics (lifting the front wheel or a spinning rear wheel) or the rider‘s abilities (shifting weight, line choice, overtaking obstacles, pedal strikes, etc). But sure, i see the point. A riders‘ energy is limited and on a very steep and long climb when no muscle power is left we all wish to have 2000% motor support to get up there ^^
 

Blackbird

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#11
Besides, just a torque figure does not say much, at what rpm does it deliver that? If for instance you get 120nm at 40 rpm but only 50 remains at 90 rpm a motor is much less usefull than one that delivers 80 nm from 10-100rpm.
 

Kiwi in Wales

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#12
80% charge on a 630Wh battery in one-hour... These are some impressive claims.
My idea of heaven if it is true.
Having to wait until April/May 2019 for it is not so good ☹️
Amazing looking bike and definitely something that could lure me away from Specialized.
 
May 31, 2018
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#13
My idea of heaven if it is true.
Having to wait until April/May 2019 for it is not so good ☹️
Amazing looking bike and definitely something that could lure me away from Specialized.
I am not a fan of Specialized. When I was investigating my first emtb I saw how they discontinued their ebike and parts that were only two years old. I also got a negative response locally from the Specialized dealers. They wouldn't even consider ordering one and laughed when I asked about a demo.
 

Donnie797

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#14
I am not a fan of Specialized. When I was investigating my first emtb I saw how they discontinued their ebike and parts that were only two years old. I also got a negative response locally from the Specialized dealers. They wouldn't even consider ordering one and laughed when I asked about a demo.
What kind of dealer laughs at you and doesn’t order a bike for you? It probably is not related to specialized, but more to that dealer which has a wrong understanding of his job?
 
May 31, 2018
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#15
What kind of dealer laughs at you and doesn’t order a bike for you? It probably is not related to specialized, but more to that dealer which has a wrong understanding of his job?
Yep, the local dealers were anti-emtb which was a result of local groups along the East Coast expressing their opinions that emtbs are motorcycles. The dealers are required to order three or more I guess? Even this year locally Specialized dealers have Vado's but no Levo's. Visited Utah Salt Lake City and it was a COMPLETELY different atmosphere. I ride a Trek Powerfly 8 FS but the Kenevo looks good to me and I do like the clean cockpit but without support and a corporate history of not caring much about support (just expecting customers to purchase new) I could not justify a serious consideration.
 

R120

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#16
The critical thing for any motor is how it feeds the power, and the software that controls this.

What the Shimano Trail and Bosch EMTB modes do very well, and from my experience compared to other systems, is react and feed in the power you need smoothly.

The problem with most boost modes is that the are too powerful from the off, meaning that they are actually not that good for steep uphills, especially if you stop half way up. If this motor can feed in its power well then that will be really interesting.

Also given the power, would be interesting to know if that the eco or trail modes on it, are only using minimal capacity of its potential output, does that improve battery usage?

Looks like a potentially very cool system, and Haibike have more experience in the sector than anyone else - it’s a big leap for them to move away from established systems of Bosch and Yamaha, so they must have real belief in the potential
 

Rob Hancill

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#17
I rode the TQ motor today and have an interview with the designer. Coming soon to a screen near you 😊😊
 

knut7

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#18
I rode the TQ motor today and have an interview with the designer. Coming soon to a screen near you 😊😊
Cool! This sounds like a 48V system. Quite interesting to see more manufacturers deciding to make their own motors. Lapierre seems to be doing their own motor on the new E-Zesty AM. Lapierre E-Zesty AM - Carbonbike mit Fazua-Antrieb | E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine
Can you find more info on this bike? Could be an interesting one.

I can't help to think we could be seeing the end of Yamaha. Giant doesn't seem to be pushing their ebikes too hard this year. I haven't seen much of the ebikes Yamaha was supposed to make. And will Haibike push ebikes with 3 different motors for long?
 

Rob Hancill

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#19
Cool! This sounds like a 48V system. Quite interesting to see more manufacturers deciding to make their own motors. Lapierre seems to be doing their own motor on the new E-Zesty AM. Lapierre E-Zesty AM - Carbonbike mit Fazua-Antrieb | E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine
Can you find more info on this bike? Could be an interesting one.

I can't help to think we could be seeing the end of Yamaha. Giant doesn't seem to be pushing their ebikes too hard this year. I haven't seen much of the ebikes Yamaha was supposed to make. And will Haibike push ebikes with 3 different motors for long?
I think that Haibike will not use Bosch or Yamaha in the future. Just a hunch based on today. They've put everything into their FLYON package, its hard to see the point of them using the other. The only thing with the TQ could be the price. Maybe they will use the FLYON as top tier bikes (XDuro) and keep the SDuro on the older stuff.

Also, to note, the TQ motor is heavy. 3.8KG. The recently released Brose is 900g lighter.
 

Doomanic

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#20
The cost? Up to €8,999 for the flagship NDURO 10.0 and the entry level NDURO 5.0 comes in at €6299.
That's not so bad, assuming it rides as good as it looks, it's cheaper than a Shuttle.
 

Rob Hancill

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#21
It looks stunning. Really does. Also the motor is excellent. Not as loud as the Bosch or Shimano but not as quiet as the Brose.
 

Blackbird

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#22
I'm just hoping the centre bearing will hold up well, looking at it i do not think it can be replaced.
 

EddieJ

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#24
I think it really depends on where you use the bike. In the Netherlands, were hill is a foreign word and mountains are clouds, no you really do not need more power. Turbo on a cx is already overkill.
In the Swiss alps? Making very steep climbs? Power could be usefull
More torque means faster battery consumption and potentially less bike control. Having spent years riding in the Swiss Alps, my statistics have shown that in respect of the Bosch drive unit, the Performance Line with 500wh battery, is my perfect set up. Obviously I have the CX fitted, but that isn't through choice.
 

Blackbird

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#25
Cool! This sounds like a 48V system. Quite interesting to see more manufacturers deciding to make their own motors. Lapierre seems to be doing their own motor on the new E-Zesty AM. Lapierre E-Zesty AM - Carbonbike mit Fazua-Antrieb | E-MOUNTAINBIKE Magazine
Can you find more info on this bike? Could be an interesting one.

I can't help to think we could be seeing the end of Yamaha. Giant doesn't seem to be pushing their ebikes too hard this year. I haven't seen much of the ebikes Yamaha was supposed to make. And will Haibike push ebikes with 3 different motors for long?
The Complete Guide: Haibike 2019 Electric Bike Range

According to this for 2019 Yamaha will get an intergrated battery and a new screen.

Also they are talking about econnect for bosch and yamaha in habikes as retrofit. Sounds interesting.
 

Rob Hancill

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#26
More torque means faster battery consumption and potentially less control. Having spent years riding in the Swiss Alps, my statistics have shown that in respect of the Bosch drive unit, the Performance Line with 500wh battery, is my perfect set up. Obviously I have the CX fitted, but that isn't through choice.
It all depends on when the max torque is applied. If you're smashing it up an insanely steep climb I'd take the 120Nm if its in the tank. For 95% of riding it wont be needed. Its just that it is capable of that kind out output. The motor is actually capable of more than 120Nm but in their (TQ's) extensive tests anything more than this is too much.
 

knut7

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#27
According to this for 2019 Yamaha will get an intergrated battery and a new screen.
I've read that, no doubt Haibike will run Yamaha for 2019. But it seems Yamaha is losing market share. Their decision to make their own ebikes doesn't appear to have been successful. How long can/will they keep going? I might not see what's going on in all markets though.
 

EddieJ

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#29
It all depends on when the max torque is applied. If you're smashing it up an insanely steep climb I'd take the 120Nm if its in the tank. For 95% of riding it wont be needed. Its just that it is capable of that kind out output. The motor is actually capable of more than 120Nm but in their (TQ's) extensive tests anything more than this is too much.
Afraid that I don't agree, with requiring more torque over either that of the Performance Line or CX on insanely steep climbs. It just isn't required and having more will sooner or later end in tears for the rider.
 

knut7

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Apr 10, 2018
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#30
The motor is actually capable of more than 120Nm but in their (TQ's) extensive tests anything more than this is too much.
I'm not sure this is a motor I want. The increased power doesn't seem necessary, and I'm hoping to see more lightweight bikes for 2019, not heavier. Did Haibike make a bad decision when they started on this motor in 2015, thinking more power is better? That was sort of the idea back then, wasn't it?

Nm is a strange measurement. Both 70Nm and 120Nm motors are 250W nom :)
 



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