20mph speed government petition is live!

20mph · Jan 30, 2024

Hey everyone,

I'm Paulina, a fellow e-bike and motorbike enthusiast with a geeky side that I proudly embrace. Riding has always been a passion of mine, and it's the freedom and thrill of the journey that keeps me going. Today, I'm here not just as a rider, but as someone who wants to make a difference in our community.

I'm reaching out to discuss and gather support for an initiative very close to my heart—advocating for an increase in the e-bike speed limit to 20 mph. It's a change that I believe can significantly enhance our riding experience, ensuring better safety and alignment with urban traffic speeds.

I've put together some thoughts and research on this topic, which you can explore in more detail on our dedicated website:

Read More & Join the Cause

And if you're already on board with this idea, your signature on our petition would mean the world to us:

Support by Signing Here

But more than just signatures, I'm here for your insights. Do you have any arguments, ideas, or facts that could bolster our cause? Your experiences and knowledge could greatly enrich our collective voice.

Additionally, I extend a special invitation to our forum administrators: If there's an official statement or insight you'd like to share on our platform, complete with a link back to this forum, I'd be thrilled to feature it. Collaboration with communities like ours can only strengthen our advocacy.

Thank you for considering this initiative and for any contributions you might have. Together, we can push for a safer and more enjoyable future for all e-bike riders.

Ride safe and stay inspired, Paulina

Plummet · Jan 30, 2024

I dont think i'd bother with an e bike with a 25kph limit. That would suck.

I tap out the 32kph limit i have going uphill... (im in NZ).

Even at 32kph there is limitations at the bike park when hitting big jump lines that require more speed and pop above motor cut out. There are some jumps i cant clear on the e bike that I can on the mtb. In that instance an e bike is slower and more dangerous than an mtb.

Plummet · Jan 30, 2024

Also, locally electric scooters and skateboards have no such limits. I see those things ripping along at 40-50kph.
I find that super ironic because they are harder to control with less braking and are more likely to crash and injure others.

20mph · Jan 30, 2024

Plummet said:
I dont think i'd bother with an e bike with a 25kph limit. That would suck.

That's the main reason why people in Europe trying to go around by:

chip bikes (illegally unlock)
build own using Chinese, cheap kits
choosing non-branded bikes without any limits, certificates or safety

It's hard to blame others, as current limit is set too low.

You can speed easily up to 35 mph (50 km/h) on derestricted bike which is quite dangerous.
I believe that if there would be reasonable limit: 20mph (32 km/h) - that would be enough for majority of people and number of people brake law, loosing warranty etc by derestrict bikes has been drastically limited.

RoJo · Jan 30, 2024

Agreed and most importantly signed.
It makes no sense for commuting as fit people can easily maintain over 15.5mph on the flat on a normal bike.

Plummet · Jan 30, 2024

20mph said:
That's the main reason why people in Europe trying to go around by:

chip bikes (illegally unlock)

build own using Chinese, cheap kits

choosing non-branded bikes without any limits, certificates or safety

It's hard to blame others, as current limit is set too low.

You can speed easily up to 35 mph (50 km/h) on derestricted bike which is quite dangerous.
I believe that if there would be reasonable limit: 20mph (32 km/h) - that would be enough for majority of people and number of people brake law, loosing warranty etc by derestrict bikes has been drastically limited.

50kph derestricted would be less dangerous on the larger jump lines I listed above.

Paulquattro · Jan 31, 2024

Welcome to the site
This may back fire and get the assist limit reduced thou
It was lower here in the UK than the current limit but we had to fall in line with Europe that little jem has now disappeared
Good luck thou

Weeksy · Jan 31, 2024

I'm perfectly happy with the limiter... When i want to go faster in traffic, i just use power of my legs instead.

Basically if you're implying that a 25kph limit isn't safe, then you're implying all manual bicycles are not safe either ? Both though can exceed it for a fair chunk of cyclists... but if it's an urban/city commuter who doesn't do it often, even the manual rider won't exceed 25kph, therefore meaning they're not safe

johnnystorm · Jan 31, 2024

Weeksy said:
I'm perfectly happy with the limiter... When i want to go faster in traffic, i just use power of my legs instead.

Basically if you're implying that a 25kph limit isn't safe, then you're implying all manual bicycles are not safe either ? Both though can exceed it for a fair chunk of cyclists... but if it's an urban/city commuter who doesn't do it often, even the manual rider won't exceed 25kph, therefore meaning they're not safe

Same here, happy with the current situation where I can hop on my bike without any mandated PPE, insurance, or MOT and off I trot. If the legislation gets looked at they might decide to slip some more caveats in while they're at it.

cozzy · Jan 31, 2024

I would prefer this useless government meddled elsewhere to be honest.
Currently there are options to get a bit more speed if you want it via 3rd party methods.

steve_sordy · Jan 31, 2024

Currently, I am OK with the 25kph assist limit because it gives me freedom from being taxed and having to be insured. I say "OK" only because of the tax and insurance aspects. If I could still have them at 32kph (20mph) then I would be happy with that.

If I really, really, really wanted an assist speed above 25kph, then I'd chip the motor or otherwise frig the system.

What would concern me about the petition is my considerable doubt that our civil servants would content themselves with just altering the assist speed and no other aspect of the relevant regulation (law, whatever). Our civil servants have a decades long track record of gold plating EU regulations for implementation into UK law. I fear that they would seek the opportunity to add stuff that we don't want. I mean why should they spend time setting up committees, investigating, discussing evidence, hearing pleas for and against the case, debating, writing position papers and all the "Yes Minister" pantomime that goes on, without getting something in return? That return may involve registration of the bike, compulsory insurance, indelible marking of the bikes and an annual fee to pay for all that bureaucracy.

And that would be the minimum they could do. Once they have the bikes marked, registered, insured and effectively taxed (the annual registration fee), why not demand the wearing of a bright yellow tabard that displays the relevant details so that officers can check up on you that all is well? What about an e-bike tax? What government doesn't like a new tax?

And after all that they may decide that 25kph is still the correct limit, but while they are at it, they still introduce all the other things I mentioned above. (As I said, they have to get something for their efforts).

I think we should let sleeping dogs lie.

20mph · Jan 31, 2024

Weeksy said:
Basically if you're implying that a 25kph limit isn't safe, then you're implying all manual bicycles are not safe either ?

Hey, I totally get where you're coming from, and just to set the record straight—I'm not saying the current 25kph limit is a danger zone, nor am I dissing manual bikes for being speed demons in their own right. What's really bugging me is how this one-size-fits-all speed cap on e-bikes is kinda backfiring.

You know how it is, when something feels way too slow, there's always that temptation to tinker, to 'chip' the bike to break free from those speed shackles, or even to jump ship to some beastly, but not exactly street-legal, rides. And it's not just a couple of rebels doing this; it's becoming more of a thing, which has these souped-up e-bikes hitting speeds that leave the 20 mph limit in the dust, going way faster and getting way riskier.

I've chewed over this a bunch on my website making the case that if we nudged up the speed limit just a bit, it might actually dial down the need for riders to go rogue with their rides. If e-bikes could roll at speeds that vibe better with how the city pulse beats and keep pace with the pedal-pushers, maybe we'd see fewer folks feeling the need to hot-rod their bikes into uncharted—and unsafe—territory.

To quote directly from the section addressing this:

How increasing speed improve safety?
Reducing the Inclination to Modify Bikes:
By allowing e-bikes to achieve speeds that are comparable to those of non-assisted bikes on flat terrain, riders are less likely to modify their bikes illegally. Currently, some riders “chip” or unlock their e-bikes to bypass the speed limit, which can lead to speeds much higher than the typical 20 mph limit, risking overheating of batteries and motors. This not only increases the chance of mechanical failures but also poses significant fire hazards. A higher, yet safe, speed limit could reduce these unsafe practices by providing sufficient speed for most riding conditions, negating the need for dangerous modifications.

Improved Predictability and Road User Behavior:
When e-bikes can maintain speeds closer to those of traditional bicycles and even some city traffic, it results in more predictable movements for all road users. This predictability can lead to smoother traffic flow and reduce sudden maneuvers that often lead to accidents. For instance, when e-bike riders don’t have to constantly accelerate or decelerate to match the speed of traffic or other cyclists, their movement becomes more consistent, which helps both motorists and other cyclists anticipate and react to their presence on the road more effectively.
Furthermore, when e-bike speeds are aligned with the general flow, it can also reduce the impatience or frustration of other road users, such as drivers who might otherwise engage in risky overtaking. This harmony in traffic speeds can contribute to a calmer, safer road environment for everyone.

Discouraging the Purchase of Non-Certified Bikes:
The market is flooded with non-certified e-bikes, often from Chinese manufacturers, that come equipped with throttles and lack speed limitations. These bikes can reach dangerously high speeds and are tempting for those seeking faster e-bikes within a lower price range. Raising speed limits for certified e-bikes would make them more competitive with these non-certified alternatives, encouraging consumers to opt for safer, regulated, and trusted brands. This shift would also reduce the likelihood of accidents due to low-quality components and poor electrical connections found in non-certified bikes and conversion kits, which are known fire risks.

Promoting Consistent Riding Speeds:
Allowing e-bikes to maintain consistent speeds with non-assisted bikes on flat terrain means e-bike riders won’t feel pressured to overcompensate on more technical sections or climbs to stay with their group. Group riding is inherently safer, particularly on busy public roads, as it increases visibility and reduces the likelihood of accidents. A higher speed limit would facilitate this group cohesion, enhancing overall safety.

Matching Road Traffic Speeds:
In urban settings, where traffic speeds can often hover around 20 mph, a higher speed limit for e-bikes would allow them to better keep pace with cars. This capability would reduce instances of cars overtaking bikes, which is a common cause of accidents. By aligning e-bike speeds more closely with the flow of traffic, the interaction between cyclists and motorists can become smoother and safer, minimizing risky maneuvers and enhancing road safety for everyone involved.

In summary:
Carefully considered increase in the speed limits for e-bikes could lead to a safer riding environment by discouraging unsafe modifications, steering consumers towards certified and safer products, promoting more stable and consistent group riding, and improving the integration of e-bikes into road traffic.

cozzy said:
Currently there are options to get a bit more speed if you want it via 3rd party methods.

steve_sordy said:
If I really, really, really wanted an assist speed above 25kph, then I'd chip the motor or otherwise frig the system.

Absolutely, there are ways to tweak your e-bike for a bit more zip, but it's kind of a double-edged sword, isn't it? Messing with your bike's setup can kiss your warranty goodbye, and then where are you if something goes sideways? Plus, cranking up the speed too much might just be asking for trouble. Imagine your battery deciding to throw a tantrum and overheating—yikes, not cool, especially if you're about to hop on a bus or something.

I get the temptation, really. It's like, "If I can make my ride faster, why not?" But then, think about the bigger picture. If one of these modded e-bikes causes a scene, like starting a fire or breaking down, it's not just a headache for the rider but a bad look for all of us in the eMTB community. We don't want that kind of heat, no pun intended.

I'm all for squeezing a bit more fun out of our rides, but keeping it within the lines so we don't end up making things tougher for the whole e-bike scene. What do you think? Is pushing the limit worth the risk, or is there a better way to get that thrill without the drama?

steve_sordy said:
I mean why should they spend time setting up committees, investigating, discussing evidence, hearing pleas for and against the case, debating, writing position papers and all the "Yes Minister" pantomime that goes on, without getting something in return?

I totally hear you on the whole circus that can go into making even the smallest change in the rules. It does seem like a lot of hoops to jump through, right? But, at the end of the day, that's kind of the gig when it comes to government stuff. Their job is to look out for us, to sift through all the noise, and make sure that the decisions they land on are good for the crew. They're supposed to be in our corner, helping make things better based on what we need and want. It's all part of the dance, and hopefully, it leads to tunes we all want to groove to.

Weeksy · Jan 31, 2024

A well reasoned answer, I like it.

Whilst I don't agree, I like the fact it can be discussed sensibly

Weeksy · Jan 31, 2024

Getting the thrill, yeah go Enduro or DH racing. If it's all about the thrill and speed, take it to the extreme

Mabman · Jan 31, 2024

Plummet said:
I dont think i'd bother with an e bike with a 25kph limit. That would suck.

I tap out the 32kph limit i have going uphill... (im in NZ).

Even at 32kph there is limitations at the bike park when hitting big jump lines that require more speed and pop above motor cut out. There are some jumps i cant clear on the e bike that I can on the mtb. In that instance an e bike is slower and more dangerous than an mtb.

It is actually written in law here in Oregon that scooters are allowed to go 25mph. eBikes 20mph......

Mikerb · Jan 31, 2024

Despite what was posted a bove about UK regulations, the fact is that the UK was in the EU when the EPAC/Pedelec Regulations were first agreed. So the current assisted speed limit is and always was a EU regulation.

Of course there are plenty of us EMTB riders that would like a marginal increase in assisted speed but any petition to request such a change is highly unlikely to be interested in our concerns. The far greater percentage of Pedelecs are used on public roads as commuter bikes, city, bikes, delivery bikes etc. It is therefore those categories that should be used to encourage a review.
As is normal with politics, any such request will be ignored unless it serves to promote a policy that has public appeal ( it is an election year after all!). As far as I can determine there are only 3 red buttons to hit

1. Promotion of cycling as an alternative to car journeys ( net zero and all that rubbish!!)
2. Part of required regulations to discourage the illegal chipping of otherwise legal pedelecs and purchase of illegal Ebikes that do not conform to regulations. Maybe referencing the dangers/fire risks of DIY modifications and cheap imports.( current media coverage of Ebike fires and their consequences.)
3. The replacement of a EU regulation with a UK regulation. ( current political arguments about that process)

20mph · Jan 31, 2024

Nice one! I will think how to write a nice section about it on initiative website and try to publish something tomorrow!

Stoffel · Jan 31, 2024

I think the current limit is perfectly fine 99% of the time. Like others have said why draw attention to ourselves, it could back fire massively. I’m very happy at the moment not having to MOT, tax or insure my ebike unlike every other vehicle I own.
I also love being able to legally go wherever any other non assisted bike can go, unlike some countries.
We’re at the bottom of the pecking order on our bridleways so let’s not give them the excuse to throw us off them.

Streddaz · Feb 1, 2024

Plummet said:
I dont think i'd bother with an e bike with a 25kph limit. That would suck.

I tap out the 32kph limit i have going uphill... (im in NZ).

Even at 32kph there is limitations at the bike park when hitting big jump lines that require more speed and pop above motor cut out. There are some jumps i cant clear on the e bike that I can on the mtb. In that instance an e bike is slower and more dangerous than an mtb.

What type of bike do you have that requires assistance above 32kph and has enough drag to not be able to make jumps that you could do on a normal MTB? Any properly designed jump line you should have plenty of speed just from gravity. Some will require you to hit each jump to keep the momentum going but that's consistent on any MTB. An Ebike tends to hold speed easier downhill due to the added weight.
We have 25kph limit here in Australia and none of us seem to have issues on a jump trails. It's just when riding back up that some people would like a faster limit.

#lazy · Feb 1, 2024

We”ll be riding hoverboards on mars by the time this petition reaches 100,000 pings

Peaky Rider · Feb 1, 2024

The 'We Hate Cyclists Brigade' will soon put a stop to it in the UK.

BeBiker · Feb 3, 2024

20mph said:
That's the main reason why people in Europe trying to go around by:

chip bikes (illegally unlock)

build own using Chinese, cheap kits

choosing non-branded bikes without any limits, certificates or safety

It's hard to blame others, as current limit is set too low.

You can speed easily up to 35 mph (50 km/h) on derestricted bike which is quite dangerous.
I believe that if there would be reasonable limit: 20mph (32 km/h) - that would be enough for majority of people and number of people brake law, loosing warranty etc by derestrict bikes has been drastically limited.

True because:
-We are no road bikers. Those can buy a 45kmh speed pedelec.
-In the bushes we drive generally 10kmh-15kmh.
-I just want to be able to follow my "Amish-bike" MTB friends on the road inbetween the bushes.
-My "Amish-bike" MTB friends peak at max 36kmh on asphalt, 32kmh should be enough to keep up.

rpurdie · Feb 3, 2024

I'd support that change so signed, thanks for raising it.

manu.w · Feb 3, 2024

speed = «dangerous»

This narrow simplistic view is easy to set up by government by asking (obliging) private manufacturers to implement this restriction and police to control it.
We all know that surrounding context and rider experience matters not only speed.
So everything is leveled down every time over and over.

Ps:
I know that my next accident (never had one) will be with an 25kmh e-biker, not a car driver…, why, because now suddenly everyone get into bicycling and are not used to riding on 2 wheel at 25kmh

johnnystorm · Feb 3, 2024

So everything is leveled down every time over and over.
Well yes and no.
The current standard means anyone 14 yrs or older can pop into any bike shop and ride off in their shorts and flip flops on a bike that'll propel them at a reasonable speed.

If you want to go as fast as someone 16 or over manages on a moped then you can. You just need to follow the same rules as them and get insured, MOT'D, etc.

manu.w · Feb 3, 2024

johnnystorm said:
If you want to go as fast as someone 16 or over manages on a moped then you can. You just need to follow the same rules as them and get insured, MOT'D, etc.

That is the problem, if you have the money, pay the tax to go fast, thinking now that you have a priority over the other non bike payers …

In my experience, the fastest and most dangerous e-bikers are the one that bought to go fast , and arrogantly think that they now own the road.

jonmat · Feb 3, 2024

20mph said:
Hey everyone,

I'm Paulina, a fellow e-bike and motorbike enthusiast with a geeky side that I proudly embrace. Riding has always been a passion of mine, and it's the freedom and thrill of the journey that keeps me going. Today, I'm here not just as a rider, but as someone who wants to make a difference in our community.

I'm reaching out to discuss and gather support for an initiative very close to my heart—advocating for an increase in the e-bike speed limit to 20 mph. It's a change that I believe can significantly enhance our riding experience, ensuring better safety and alignment with urban traffic speeds.

I've put together some thoughts and research on this topic, which you can explore in more detail on our dedicated website:

Read More & Join the Cause

And if you're already on board with this idea, your signature on our petition would mean the world to us:

Support by Signing Here

But more than just signatures, I'm here for your insights. Do you have any arguments, ideas, or facts that could bolster our cause? Your experiences and knowledge could greatly enrich our collective voice.

Additionally, I extend a special invitation to our forum administrators: If there's an official statement or insight you'd like to share on our platform, complete with a link back to this forum, I'd be thrilled to feature it. Collaboration with communities like ours can only strengthen our advocacy.

Thank you for considering this initiative and for any contributions you might have. Together, we can push for a safer and more enjoyable future for all e-bike riders.

Ride safe and stay inspired, Paulina

Signed

Sgarth42 · Feb 3, 2024

Signed. The same bikes are manufactured for US and other countries that allow 32kph ( 20mph) so that demonstrates that there is no safety issue with the bike itself. Allowing this increase would mean that a large majority of riders on both manufactured and converted bikes would be more likely to be satisfied and comply with the law.

Mikerb · Feb 3, 2024

we are talking here about an additional 5 mph and all of that being whilst pedalling a bike considerably heavier than a normal road bike on which average speeds of 20mph are very easy to maintain...............very different to a moped! As far those whose only interest is going fast they already have access to a range of devices to ( illegally) achieve motor assisted speeds of 20 mph and in many cases considerably more than that.
The origins of the moped were back when ALL motorised vehicles needed type approval , registration, tax, insurance, MOT tests and the full set of requirements for road use like road worthy tyres, lights, horns, indicators etc. The arrival of limited power electrical motor pedal assist cycles broke the mould in terms of previous categories of motorised transport and the maximum motor assisted speed was not set on the basis of anything other than creating a category ( Pedelec) below the moped as far as existing Motor Transport Acts were concerned.
Governing authorities have only very limited means to identify let alone prosecute those that illegally derestrict their bikes or ride illegal bikes that do not conform to the Pedelec regulations, but it does have the agencies that can ensure electric cycles being offered for sale both in retail outlets and online are legal.....and safe. Maybe setting a more functional maximum assisted speed together with robust measures to ensure all bikes ridden on public roads/in public areas, would be one way to proceed.

aegidius · Feb 3, 2024

Come and do some lobbying in Australia. Please. Someone tried to get up a petition here to bring in a class following the EU s-pedelecs (45km/h) and got nowhere. We follow the EU regs for 20km/h ebikes just to allow importation and sale. Even a small change to allow the NZ speed would be a huge improvement.

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