Crestline x DJI - RS 181 SPECTRE Edition

[Scford]

I''m your size and I went with the RH2 knowing I was going to run full 29 and that would make it feel even longer, and it seemed long on paper to begin with to me. Anyway, that's not helpful unless you sell and buy a RH2.

For any tweaking don't forget to change one setting at a time and test. I can imagine in the frustration you're feeling making multiple changes and feeling lost as to what's working and not. Also, if you're like me and probably most people, don't get too in your head about how you're riding by messing with things like your body positioning, how you jumbo, etc. That can throw everything out of wack.

To me, I would guess someone's on too SMALL of a bike, not too big with what you're experiencing. Which makes me think it's more of a rear/front suspension set up and balance issue. Too fast rebound in the back, fork wallowing in the mid travel/too much sag will push you forward on jumps no matter how fast the fork rebound is. It's all speculation really. What fork are you running?

Set up wise, longer CS and -5 reach adjust is going to help F/R center and put you more in the middle of the wheels. The +14mm stack is only like .5 a degree.

Thanks for the advise, I’m running a zeb ultimate, charger 3. I’ve been trying to do 1 change at a time, just keeps feeling off so i keep tweaking. Definitely getting in my head about it, feel like im riding worse and worse, constantly thinking i don’t feel good on the bike so then translates into skipping more and more sections of trail from no confidence. Started comparing geo to my previous bikes and just leaning into maybe the bike is too big

 

[Suns_PSD]

Sure, I’m 5’10” inseam i haven’t measured, gotta be 30-32. RH3, 445 cs mx setup. Ive tried 150 and 160mm cranks, 40 and 50mm stem, 30mm rise bars, 770 width. Tried 160/170/180 fork. I haven’t tried the reach reducer as it adds 14mm of stack height underneath the steerer tube and i dont want to rake the wheel out further. I still might try it with a 160 fork and short travel setting.

Again the main issue i’ve been trying to solve is the font end being dive off jumps and floppy on slower tech but bring the stem back and bars higher have pushed me to far off the back, all that has me thinking the front is just to far stretched out for me

I don't think you're describing a bike that's too large; I think you're describing suspension that isn't set up correctly as a result isn't creating the right balance and response.
It sounds like if you go to a shorter bike you're going to be hanging way off the back and your issues are going to get a bit worse.
By chance is this the heaviest bike you've ever had? How much do you weigh?
Those changes in front wheel travel should have made a giant difference in front wheel traction, wandering and wheel flop. Yet the problem persisted.

 

[Scford]

I don't think you're describing a bike that's too large; I think you're describing suspension that isn't set up correctly as a result isn't creating the right balance and response.
It sounds like if you go to a shorter bike you're going to be hanging way off the back and your issues are going to get a bit worse.
By chance is this the heaviest bike you've ever had? How much do you weigh?
Those changes in front wheel travel should have made a giant difference in front wheel traction, wandering and wheel flop. Yet the problem persisted.

Ive been riding for about 8-9 years, this is my 4th ebike and probably 10-12th bike in that time frame. I’ve been able to setup the others without issues. I was on a bullit before the crestline and weight is the same. Like i said it is the longest bike Ive been on, that’s the biggest basis for thinking I’m on the wrong size. I can’t imagine I’ve fubar’d the suspension that bad on one particular bike. Its mostly been at the 180 travel range, it was 160 initially on a fork i had laying around, then 170 while i was waiting for a 180 airshaft.

 

[KillerbeeDH]

Again the main issue i’ve been trying to solve is the font end being dive off jumps and floppy on slower tech but bring the stem back and bars higher have pushed me to far off the back, all that has me thinking the front is just to far stretched out for me

This isn't making sense to me, not very descriptive. What is "floppy"?. As someone else stated, you seem to be contradicting yourself, but mostly what you are describing doesn't fit the "too large" hypothesis. Especially if you feel pushed off the back. That would get worse with the smaller frame. Or I am just not tracking. But so far I am not seeing anything that supports a fame size argument.

Is this just a descending tech comfort issue?

 

[Onetime]

Just get a super short stem, like a Rulezman, higher rise bars and longer chainstays, either 455 or 460. That’ll help center you on the bike, the shorter stem will make it less floppy and turn better and the longer chainstays will help the front wheel stay more planted. The fork will also not dive as much with the higher bars. Basically what Reece Wilson did on his bike in the video on the previous page.

 

[Scford]

I appreciate all the feedback, didn’t feel i was contradictory but probably the forum isn’t the place to solve the problem. My main point is posting was to see if anyone near me had a rh2 that was willing to meet up so I could compare sizes and see if id be better suited to a smaller frame.

 

[mrtrinh]

Ive been riding for about 8-9 years, this is my 4th ebike and probably 10-12th bike in that time frame. I’ve been able to setup the others without issues. I was on a bullit before the crestline and weight is the same. Like i said it is the longest bike Ive been on, that’s the biggest basis for thinking I’m on the wrong size. I can’t imagine I’ve fubar’d the suspension that bad on one particular bike. Its mostly been at the 180 travel range, it was 160 initially on a fork i had laying around, then 170 while i was waiting for a 180 airshaft.

What size bullit were you on? So I did feel the dji crestline pitches more forward compared to the bosch due to the longer battery. Ended up removing my push coil fork to better balance the bike.

 

[ShapeThings]

The reach adjust headset is the cheapest experiment, I'll look in my parts bin, but I don't think I have a EC56 lower. I'm a half inch taller than you and have had no problems riding 485 reach bikes. But they did have longer chainstays to help balance (+ lower BB). Looking at the Crestline geo chart, also looks like the BB is kinda high.

You're located in Santa Cruz? Unless you're sending the gnarliest stealth trails, a 160 bike is my ideal range for those trails. I've ridden those trails on everything from 100mm to big ole enduro rigs. Lot of people like to run over traveled, but I think it just dulls things out. It's an argument that I'll keep making…

 

[KillerbeeDH]

You seem to think the bike is too long, and has excessive wheel flop. Have you considered an angleset to address both? Full 29 would also steepen it a bit.

You could ride someone elses bike, but it will still be a completely different build. It would be hard to conclude anything. I dont see 5mm changing much. But if your main issue is DH, that stem in the video should cure everything. But I would not enjoy steep climbing on it.

 

[John_likes_bikes]

You seem to think the bike is too long, and has excessive wheel flop. Have you considered an angleset to address both? Full 29 would also steepen it a bit.

You could ride someone elses bike, but it will still be a completely different build. It would be hard to conclude anything. I dont see 5mm changing much. But if your main issue is DH, that stem in the video should cure everything. But I would not enjoy steep climbing on it.

FWIW, the dropouts for 29" adjust for the bigger wheel and don't change the geo compared to 27.5

 

[John_likes_bikes]

Thanks for the advise, I’m running a zeb ultimate, charger 3. I’ve been trying to do 1 change at a time, just keeps feeling off so i keep tweaking. Definitely getting in my head about it, feel like im riding worse and worse, constantly thinking i don’t feel good on the bike so then translates into skipping more and more sections of trail from no confidence. Started comparing geo to my previous bikes and just leaning into maybe the bike is too big

Charger 2.1 and then 3 really lacked mid travel support especially when set up in longer travel. 3.1 is slightly better.

t's a shot in the dark but what sag are you running? Try something around 15%. It may not feel great in high speed compressions but if it may feel better in slow speed like turn in/mid turn and jumping (unless you're hitting super hippy jumps). The lack of front wheel control with a fork with no mid stroke support and a bike too long for comfort is in my mind no too dissimilar. That'll zap confidence quick. But like you said, you figure it out before.

 

[Suns_PSD]

What size bullit were you on? So I did feel the dji crestline pitches more forward compared to the bosch due to the longer battery. Ended up removing my push coil fork to better balance the bike.

Yah, that was going to be my next point but I didn't want to ruffle any feathers. Some have stated that the long battery so near the front has a pretty negative effect on how the front end behaves.

He's had similar bikes, but the Bullit with that 600w is going to feel a bit different.

 

[Scford]

The bullit i had was a large, i was just going back through the geo chart and realized it had 449 cs, i thought it was 445 so i went with that on the spectre. I was able to pick up a reach adjust recently, Ive ordered a 160 airshaft. Sounds like the longer cs will help and pulling the headset back 5mm will offset any growth in length. Thats basically the next plan.

 

[KillerbeeDH]

FWIW, the dropouts for 29" adjust for the bigger wheel and don't change the geo compared to 27.5

I didn't understand why the RH-2 was listed as a dedicated mx (as a frame only purchase) until now. Thanks. Now wondering why build a RH-2 29er ? I see one person here using that config at 5-10".

 

[John_likes_bikes]

I didn't understand why the RH-2 was listed as a dedicated mx (as a frame only purchase) until now. Thanks. Now wondering why build a RH-2 29er ? I see one person here using that config at 5-10".

That's probably me you're referring to... why not?

 

[KillerbeeDH]

That's probably me you're referring to... why not?

No criticism, I am thinking along the same lines. I am 5-10 also. It seems the frame comes with 445 27.5 dropouts? Did you change them?

If you dont mind, were there any other tweaks that you needed to make the RH-2 accommodate your size and ride style? Using full travel?

 

[KillerbeeDH]

I wonder if it's only a matter of time until we see Shimano Di2 integration with Avinox. It's already or soon to be available with Bosch CX Gen 5 (I'm talking about the new Wireless Di2, not the previous wire-only 8120 or 8150 can't remember that worked with Shimano EP8). I'm probably gonna wait it out, I have a Linkglide shifter/derailleur/cassette/chain to throw on my RS181.2 to hold me over if it's not available in April.

Figured I would share news I got today from Troydon. DI2 integration firmware should be available this year, "Q2 or Q3". Still trying to determine if the same cable that powers Sram will also power a batteryless DI2 der. I have not heard anyone specifically state they have a no-battery DI2 on their Avinox.

 

[John_likes_bikes]

No criticism, I am thinking along the same lines. I am 5-10 also. It seems the frame comes with 445 27.5 dropouts? Did you change them?

If you dont mind, were there any other tweaks that you needed to make the RH-2 accommodate your size and ride style? Using full travel?

No worries.

The stated reason the RH2 has 445/27.5 is because it's the optimum setup but that 's personal really. I went with 450 for the 29 rear. I figured 5mm more CS wasn't going to be noticeable and it really isn't. SoCal doesn't have the tightest tech in the world so the faster rolling 29er is welcome.

I have a 50mm stem, 40mm rise bar and usually slammed my seat forward but had to move it back to mid rail bc it felt a little tight climbing. That's an old habit from the 'ol mtb days. I planned on using the reach adjust but after trying it without it was fine once out of the seat. I run it full 180mm and it feels like it can handle anything while still feeling easy to maneuver. For me it's a true quiver killer.

 

[KillerbeeDH]

I run it full 180mm and it feels like it can handle anything while still feeling easy to maneuver. For me it's a true quiver killer.

When you were deciding on sizing, what moved you in this direction?
For me, I remain concerned about such a short effective top tube. I have never had a seat tube angle so steep.

 

[John_likes_bikes]

When you were deciding on sizing, what moved you in this direction?
For me, I remain concerned about such a short effective top tube. I have never had a seat tube angle so steep.

As a "do it all bike" in between sizes I've always felt going smaller is better than going bigger. I've had a bike that was maybe a little too big and it felt that way a lot of the time. Front center was long enough on the RH2 and if I used a reach adjust it would get me pretty close to what I wanted. But it was wheel base that really decided it for me. I don't remember the numbers but the RH3 was like 50mm longer than I was used to and the reach only 10mm less. There are trade offs both ways, with the RH2 it felt like they were less and easier to adjust for.

 

[BikingBad]

Sure, I’m 5’10” inseam i haven’t measured, gotta be 30-32. RH3, 445 cs mx setup. Ive tried 150 and 160mm cranks, 40 and 50mm stem, 30mm rise bars, 770 width. Tried 160/170/180 fork. I haven’t tried the reach reducer as it adds 14mm of stack height underneath the steerer tube and i dont want to rake the wheel out further. I still might try it with a 160 fork and short travel setting.

Again the main issue i’ve been trying to solve is the font end being dive off jumps and floppy on slower tech but bring the stem back and bars higher have pushed me to far off the back, all that has me thinking the front is just to far stretched out for me

If you can, test ride a RH3 with 600Wh battery. I’m same height, RH3 MX, 445 cs, bike felt as you described, that is, until I swapped the battery, removing 2 lbs from front/top of bike. Welcome to take mine out for a spin if you‘re in my neck of the woods.

 

[Scford]

If you can, test ride a RH3 with 600Wh battery. I’m same height, RH3 MX, 445 cs, bike felt as you described, that is, until I swapped the battery, removing 2 lbs from front/top of bike. Welcome to take mine out for a spin if you‘re in my neck of the woods.

Man I’ve been trying to get ahold of one, no luck. I called dealers, amflow won’t sell you one unless you have an amflow, tryodon can’t get them, and avinox still hasn't setup a supply site in US yet.

I was thinking it would help, hopefully they become available soon. Lots of rumors of availability coming soon but nothing yet.

 

[BikingBad]

Man I’ve been trying to get ahold of one, no luck. I called dealers, amflow won’t sell you one unless you have an amflow, tryodon can’t get them, and avinox still hasn't setup a supply site in US yet.

I was thinking it would help, hopefully they become available soon. Lots of rumors of availability coming soon but nothing yet.

I understand your frustration…lets just say Troydon used to have one for his Spectre

 

[KillerbeeDH]

Can someone clarify something for me? I see the various dropout options. Is there just one size rear triangle for all sizes, or is there more than one?

 

[Scford]

Can someone clarify something for me? I see the various dropout options. Is there just one size rear triangle for all sizes, or is there more than one?

One size triangle, different bolt on lengths for either 27.5 or 29 rear wheel. The triangle itself is the same fore both 27.5/29.

So if you bought a mx setup and decide you want a full 29er just buy a new dropout and vice versa.

 

[Powerslider]

One size triangle, different bolt on lengths for either 27.5 or 29 rear wheel. The triangle itself is the same fore both 27.5/29.

So if you bought a mx setup and decide you want a full 29er just buy a new dropout and vice versa.

...or if you just want to tune the chainstay length.

 

[BikingBad]

I have 435CS for MX for sale @50% discount. Pm me if interested.

 

[Scford]

I have 435CS for MX for sale @50% discount. Pm me if interested.

What are you running now? And what else have you tried?

Never mind, just looked at some old posts and realized you said already

 

[Suns_PSD]

Can I get @Greg Watts to summarize BikingBad's experience with different chainstay lengths on his Crestie or does that not work anymore?

 

[E-NUB]

Just got the first new and perhaps the most critical of parts going for the upcoming build, the top cap(s)!!