How long will your EMTB last you?

[33red]

I’ll chop mine in when Shimano bring out a bigger capacity internal battery and possibly update the motor.

Most of the “innovation” seems to be around battery integration, and although the new bikes look great, they’re not really providing anything over and above what we’ve seen over the last few years.

Innovations are the problem. My 2017 is better than many 2018, 2019 and 2020. It rolls like a bike should. I read about 10,000, 20,000kms trouble free. Mine was bought recently, over 3,600 sofar.

 

[Pdoz]

Let's not even speculate about what stock the LBS has.
there are litterally hundreds of different pads for bicycle brakes now.
you'd have to be an incredibly big/busy LBS to keep BULK quantities of EACH

Fair enough, I'm just using the example of our lbs - serving a town of <15000 people , a good 3.5 hours drive from a major city. They sell mostly giant bikes and have boxes of pads out the back to fit my (shinano xt) and my daughters ( sram level ) . I'm preARSE u and me ing this is normal practice - guess I'm wrong?

 

[Rusty]

Maybe a tandem will be the future?

Duke916 would be the best test rider for something like that. He & his lovely lady have had a succession of tandems - road, hard tail MTB & Full Suspension.

 

[Ananda]

You make an assumption about my age. I’m similar age to you and I’ve maintained lots of wheeled vehicles. Including old classics.

I’m saying that these bikes are serviceable beyond warranty and I think market pressure will make that more likely. Low resale cuts both ways. People will start to choose those bikes that last longer or can be kept running longer.

I also maintain it is fashion that drives people to replace. They are far from disposable which was the point I disagreed with.

If you need proof, look at the clamouring for detail on the 2020 Levo. Essentially the same bike functionally as last year with different paint.

I still don’t know what you mean when you say integration means nothing. Tightly integrated products that aren’t user serviceable become disposable. That’s the consequence of tight integration and the emtb as it stands today has a way to go.

I made no assumption of your age whatsoever! I just stated mine and my experience. I also probably did not understand what you meant by integration. Mea culpa.

Anyhow, I think the really good days of ebikes will come when all motor makers will adopt the same frame fitting pattern for motors and batteries, so 3rd party players can join the fun wi6h motors and frames.

 

[MattyB]

...Anyhow, I think the really good days of ebikes will come when all motor makers will adopt the same frame fitting pattern for motors and batteries, so 3rd party players can join the fun wi6h motors and frames.

Why on earth would they do that? It’s not in their interests to make a standard bolt pattern and give an advantage to competitors so they can take a slice of their business. Look elsewhere in the bike industry for examples, like BBs for instance... How many “standards” are there? 50?!! Motors and batteries will remain proprietary for a long time, probably forever.

 

[33red]

I see a possibility that Ebikes will have the sharebikes ultra cheap no names version. People will buy 3 for the price of 2 wich will be 1/3 of todays prices than a ban will happen. Why buy brand X that needs 3 motors/year at 6,000$US when you can get 3 for 2,000$ that will replace cars.

 

[Pukmeister]

I commuted to work on my emtb again today, a 12 miles each way journey. Its easy enough but my 29er hardtail on road tyres gets the job done just as easily except for one climb on the route. Pedalling into a headwind is a different story, the ebike smashes it.

I can see a place in my garage for a light weight electric tourung bike one day if the prices ever come down enough, a full suspension emtb is too heavy and overkill for commuting on offroad tyres.

If only the growing population took up cycling, the world could be such a better place.

 

[Fivetones]

If only the growing population took up cycling, the world could be such a better place.

I see this as an inevitability given the emerging climate emergency.

 

[B1rdie]

I expect five years at least of life for the shimano 8000 that came on the spectral.

 

[Peaky Rider]

I expect five years at least of life for the shimano 8000 that came on the spectral.

Good luck with that one mate, my E8000 throws up a different error code on just about every ride.
These result in power failure which, so far, has been remedied with a re-boot but I am now going out on every ride with the expectation of having to push back.

Most worrying ones so far are EO10 and WO13.

My bike, a Focus, is 9 months old and has covered 1700 miles (2735 km).

 

[Fivetones]

W013 is usually due to pressure on the pedal when turning on.
E010 is a toque sensor or battery connection (could be related to the above)

I’m guessing you’ve already done the web searches etc to investigate?

 

[Peaky Rider]

W013 is usually due to pressure on the pedal when turning on.
E010 is a toque sensor or battery connection (could be related to the above)

I’m guessing you’ve already done the web searches etc to investigate?

Thanks, I know not to go anywhere near the cranks when switching the motor on and WO13 came on for the first time today immediately after the EO10 cut the power..

EO10 power loss twice today and twice two rides ago. Battery is non-removable so whist not impossible, chances of a poor connection should be reduced. Have just cleaned the small di2 cable connectors on top of the motor but they already seemed pretty good.

My mate , who bought his Giant the same time I bought my Focus, has had to send his motor back to Giant today.

Definitely thinking a second, back-up emtb (just a cheap one) is the required way to go.

 

[steve_sordy]

..................

Definitely thinking a second, back-up emtb (just a cheap one) is the required way to go.

After many years with two clockwork bikes, I sold the enduro before my emtb purchase and the trail bike afterwards. Because I could no longer ride them without pain. I thought I could live with just one bike, but I'm about to test that. My emtb has just gone down with a sheared lower shock mounting bolt. It's a warranty job, but it could be out for two weeks, even if they can fix it! Just as the weather is becoming nice too!

 

[33red]

I feel for you with issues. My bike chain picked up a big branch about 6 days ago. It was a long time with my bike in the shop using an other but i prefer my main bike. I just had my first ride and it was sweet. I am glad to be Eriding.

 

[Peaky Rider]

After many years with two clockwork bikes, I sold the enduro before my emtb purchase and the trail bike afterwards. Because I could no longer ride them without pain. I thought I could live with just one bike, but I'm about to test that. My emtb has just gone down with a sheared lower shock mounting bolt. It's a warranty job, but it could be out for two weeks, even if they can fix it! Just as the weather is becoming nice too!

At least yours can be sorted out with a dab of super glue

 

[Ananda]

Why on earth would they do that? It’s not in their interests to make a standard bolt pattern and give an advantage to competitors so they can take a slice of their business. Look elsewhere in the bike industry for examples, like BBs for instance... How many “standards” are there? 50?!! Motors and batteries will remain proprietary for a long time, probably forever.

It will happen just like it happened with desktop computers. Ebikes are here to stay and expand. You will still have the odd mac of course.

 

[Rusty]

It will happen just like it happened with desktop computers. Ebikes are here to stay and expand. You will still have the odd mac of course.

Actually going the opposite currently. 20 years ago - hell, even 10 years ago I would have 2-3 power supplies in stock and they would fit anything except servers. The only difference was the power rating to allow for serious graphics cards. Now I don't stock any PSU as Dell, HP & Lenovo all use proprietary designs and probably 6-8 different form factors across their ranges. $150-$180 for something that I can but a generic for $45-$50 ... all about the Benjamins.

 

[Pukmeister]

Pretty much the bicycle industry is a total rip-off.
Just about every part on a bike is priced massively greater than it has any right to be. I look at the high use things like disk pads, cassettes, chains and see pricing so far apart from the cost of production that it makes me shake my head in wonder. Now I look at batteries for instance - my 700W/h battery for my Levo was $1500 NZD - that could retail for $500 NZD and still provide a generous profit to all involved - is a total rip-off.

In the first half of 2019, Giant said ebikes accounted for *40%* of their business and they expect growth to continue.

*Edit: That should read 28% of their global business for first half of 2019 and 40% growth in bikes over the previous year, my mistake. (Still a lot)*

Thats a nice earner when other markets are stalling, articles below:

Bike EU

Bike EU

Bike EU

 

[33red]

In the first half of 2019, Giant said ebikes accounted for 40% of their business and they expect growth to continue. Thats a nice earner when other markets are stalling, articles below:

Bike EU

Bike EU

Bike EU

If the car business was not controlling politicians there would not be thousand of dollars subvention for 1 Ecar with the same parking problems, with the same traffic jam problems. We all could get 600$US rebate/subvention when buying an Ebike.

 

[Rusty]

In the first half of 2019, Giant said ebikes accounted for 40% of their business and they expect growth to continue. Thats a nice earner when other markets are stalling, articles below:

Considering ebike unit numbers are not really that large you can see that if dollar wise they are 40% of their business then they are a massive earner per unit.

 

[Pukmeister]

Considering ebike unit numbers are not really that large you can see that if dollar wise they are 40% of their business then they are a massive earner per unit.

That's exactly my point !

With a bit more searching, I'd wager you could prove it even further with other brands as they release their sales figures and yearly profits.

 

[33red]

Ya but i bet many are commuters/city ones not our toys.
Their earnings i guess include over 100 brands not just the Giant sticker. In north america it is just starting but india and many places they use bikes and motorbikes.

 

[DrStupid]

The bikes seem

Considering ebike unit numbers are not really that large you can see that if dollar wise they are 40% of their business then they are a massive earner per unit.

But do we know this? What are the actual ebike numbers? I'm not disagreeing, just curious.
Myself, I hadn't bought a bicycle for 25 years except for the kiddos at birthdays and at Christmas. I've bought 3 emtbs In last few months. I guess there may be alot of old motocross converts (like me) doing the same. We bought 3 nice ebikes for the the cost of one new motocross bike. I'm not upset at all about the cost. If you want all the latest wizbangs... you pay for them. I dont need electronic shifting or carbon fiber anything. The bikes are a hoot without the bling. Easy to work on and cheap to repair.

My guess is they will last as long I'm willing to work on them.

 

[B1rdie]

Good luck with that one mate, my E8000 throws up a different error code on just about every ride.
These result in power failure which, so far, has been remedied with a re-boot but I am now going out on every ride with the expectation of having to push back.

Most worrying ones so far are EO10 and WO13.

My bike, a Focus, is 9 months old and has covered 1700 miles (2735 km).

Thanks for wishing luck. Will add some prudence and respect to the mix, just in case ?

 

[Pukmeister]

But do we know this? What are the actual ebike numbers?

If you read the links in my post above, they take you to a bicycle industry trade website.

Giant, the largest Taiwanese cycle manufacturer, produced 290,000 E-bikes in the first half of 2019, accounting for 28% of the groups global revenue and showing 40% growth on the previous year. Thats over €245.7 Million in E-bike sales for just one company. Merida also did well, they hold around a 40% stake in Specialised Bicycle Components Inc, the fourth largest bicycle supplier in the USA.

 

[steve_sordy]

Considering ebike unit numbers are not really that large you can see that if dollar wise they are 40% of their business then they are a massive earner per unit.

I was in Rutland Cycling in Jan'19 and I commented to one of the sales team about how many eBikes of all types they had on the floor. He said that they had saved the business (he meant that particular site I believe). In the last quarter of 2018, they sold £5m of eBikes. When you add in that many of them are sold with a service plan, and that most of the rest also come back for some sort of servicing it adds up to a big revenue stream. Those that bring their bikes in for whatever reason also tend to buy something else while they are the shop. Whenever I visit there now, there are loads of sales staff, when at one time, you had to go find one that wasn't on a till. I know it's the school holidays and it's a Bank Holiday weekend coming up, but the place was buzzing yesterday.

 

[Beekeeper]

I was in Rutland Cycling in Jan'19 and I commented to one of the sales team about how many eBikes of all types they had on the floor. He said that they had saved the business (he meant that particular site I believe). In the last quarter of 2018, they sold £5m of eBikes. When you add in that many of them are sold with a service plan, and that most of the rest also come back for some sort of servicing it adds up to a big revenue stream. Those that bring their bikes in for whatever reason also tend to buy something else while they are the shop. Whenever I visit there now, there are loads of sales staff, when at one time, you had to go find one that wasn't on a till. I know it's the school holidays and it's a Bank Holiday weekend coming up, but the place was buzzing yesterday.

Fast becoming a craze. The wife and I ordered our first e-bikes last week. Awaiting delivery.
It does amaze me that all the mountain bike magazines I’ve flicked through in the newsagents hardly mention e bikes at all. It’s almost as if it’s a taboo subject. Surely they need to embrace the change in order to maintain readership. The e-bike trend is not going to go away ?

 

[DrStupid]

If you read the links in my post above, they take you to a bicycle industry trade website.

Giant, the largest Taiwanese cycle manufacturer, produced 290,000 E-bikes in the first half of 2019, accounting for 28% of the groups global revenue and showing 40% growth on the previous year. Thats over €245.7 Million in E-bike sales for just one company. Merida also did well, they hold around a 40% stake in Specialised Bicycle Components Inc, the fourth largest bicycle supplier in the USA.

Thanks. I have read Gaints earnings reports, but I dont see the numbers compared to non-ebikes. I simply see lots of ebikes being sold. I guess my question is... does anybody actually know that the profit margins are higher on ebikes when compared to non-ebikes?

 

[33red]

What i see is big income is partly at the cost of the car industry. Some home will have a car + 2 Ebikes instead of 2. The car business will react. People in power tend to keep it or at least do all they can to keep it, even increase it. GM or Toyota could buy a bike company give one with every car. Big guys will move in to cash in.

 

[Beekeeper]

What i see is big income is partly at the cost of the car industry. Some home will have a car + 2 Ebikes instead of 2. The car business will react. People in power tend to keep it or at least do all they can to keep it, even increase it. GM or Toyota could buy a bike company give one with every car. Big guys will move in to cash in.

Haha! I think Peugeot already do this ?