First pics of Yamaha's full suspension emtb.

[wepn]

The video won’t play...

I might have drooled on my keyboard a bit...try searching YouTube for this:

ホンダMTB貴重映像

 

[CjP]

I might have drooled on my keyboard a bit...try searching YouTube for this:

ホンダMTB貴重映像

I don’t want to appear racist but was that a joke? Without smilie faces it’s hard to tell

 

[wepn]

I don’t want to appear racist but was that a joke? Without smilie faces it’s hard to tell

Not a joke at all...my favourite bike of all time. If you're having trouble viewing the vid, copy & paste ホンダMTB貴重映像 into YouTube, it's the first video that appears. And you definitely weren't racist.

 

[CjP]

Lol I was referring to the writing as I wouldn’t know how to write that if I tried.
I already watched the video earlier on. Sick bike!

 

[CjP]

Gave me some ideas!

 

[Zimmerframe]

Do you think the guy in white was The Japanese Stig ?

Gave me some ideas!

You know if you take the clamps off and turn the forks upside down it won't work don't you

Or is the weekend set aside for polishing down to bare aluminium ?

Or you're replacing the front chain ring with a cassette and mounting the derailleur upside down above the new front cassette ?

 

[CjP]

Do you think the guy in white was The Japanese Stig ?



You know if you take the clamps off and turn the forks upside down it won't work don't you

Or is the weekend set aside for polishing down to bare aluminium ?

Or you're replacing the front chain ring with a cassette and mounting the derailleur upside down above the new front cassette ?

I was thinking more rohloff above motor for better centre of gravity. Could always chop up the old Kenevo now that I have a new one.

 

[Zimmerframe]

I was thinking more rohloff above motor for better centre of gravity. Could always chop up the old Kenevo now that I have a new one.

Sounds like a plan ... The classic Kenevo becomes a development mule .. So would you run from the existing chainring to the rohloff and then run a chain to the back wheel from the opposite side ? Or just develop your wireless drive technology at the same time .. Maybe go the whole hog and stick on a sbarro hubless wheel ... that takes me back ....

 

[Zimmerframe]

After 6 months of development @Christian, working with @R120 and @Gary , finally came up with a bike which accommodated all their views on which wheelsize was best ...

The "CHRIGAR120" .....

 

[GrandPaBrogan]

Got a short run on that at Rotorua back in 2006 - it was quite frankly so much more bike that I could use, but damn was it made well.

I’ve always wondered something about the RN01 all these years and never thought to ask someone who might know ... but then here you are! If I may:
1) that single cog on the rear hub, does that have a ratchet or is that a fixed ala motorbike wheel sprocket?
2) if that’s fixed, so the chain moves and rotates along with the wheel, while it’s coasting downhill even if you’re not pedalling, right?
3) if so, then there must be a ratchet inside the gearbox - but is it configured so that you can change gears while just coasting?
4) can you also change gears while the bike stationary?

 

[Rusty]

1. Nope - the freewheel is actually in the bottom bracket.
2. The chain is moving when the wheel is.
3. Yes can change gears while coasting.
4. Not sure - never tried. I believe the CVVT they were experimenting with did allow that but not the internal derailleur they ended up using.

 

[CjP]

Sounds like a plan ... The classic Kenevo becomes a development mule .. So would you run from the existing chainring to the rohloff and then run a chain to the back wheel from the opposite side ? Or just develop your wireless drive technology at the same time .. Maybe go the whole hog and stick on a sbarro hubless wheel ... that takes me back ....

So I’m thinking this with the Kenevo linkage/shock setup and Rohloff hub.
I’ll use the parts from my brothers Commencal seeing as though he never rides that relic anymore.
If I use the creo motor I can probably fit the Rohloff and motor inside the same space. Might need a 2019 Levo bottom cover after I hack the bottom engine mounts.
2020 Kenevo bang!

 

[GrandPaBrogan]

Yup, doesn't look like a PW-X motor.
Could be Kayaba forks. Loved my conventional Factory A Kayabas but hated the rigidity. Being single crown they would probably be OK. Still, take away the pink and all the spastic writing and I would ride that.

Here you go Rusty, no mmmore spppastttic wwriting... some of us could also use a better night's sleep!

 

[Rusty]

Here you go Rusty, no mmmore spppastttic wwriting... some of us could also use a better night's sleep!

Tell me about it - was awake half the night ... then I got a call from a client at 6am.
Just about to put my feet up on my desk and have a snooze.

Now - I would probably ride that bike as it looks there ........... and hate on the rear suspension constantly.

 

[wepn]

and hate on the rear suspension constantly.

Yes you would think that with Yamaha's moto & PAS pedigree they would do better...and absolutely I'd ride it!

 

[wepn]

So I’m thinking this with the Kenevo linkage/shock setup and Rohloff hub.
I’ll use the parts from my brothers Commencal seeing as though he never rides that relic anymore.
If I use the creo motor I can probably fit the Rohloff and motor inside the same space. Might need a 2019 Levo bottom cover after I hack the bottom engine mounts.
2020 Kenevo bang!

View attachment 20141

View attachment 20142

Very interesting! Have a look at what's been done previously at endless-sphere.com/forums some amazing engineering of all types there.
Also I have no doubt Rohloff is the best IGH but have a look at enviolo - CVT may be more suitable for this configuration.
Also have a look at Revonte - something special.

Combined motor & Internal gearbox. Placing all the ´moving parts´ in one enclosed package creates a drivetrain that is care-free, functional and pleasing to the eye as well.

Automatic & stepless transmission. This was the feature that produced most of the questions during the show. Since bicycle transmission has been based on indexed solutions since the beginning, it can be hard to grasp the features and ride properties of a stepless version. When automatic shifting and our steady cadence mode is added to that, it’s quite a lot to take in. Our software enables the rider to use an indexed type of shifting as well which emulates the function of traditional drivetrain by dividing the gear range to the desired amount of steps.

Software first approach – which stands on the sturdy foundations of robust mechanical engineering. Although almost all of the existing e-bike motor systems have some type of in-built software, no one is going as far as we have.

We are taking the e-bike motor software to the next level. First of all, the ´magic´ behind the ride experience which Revonte ONE offers is based on sophisticated software that is monitoring rider inputs and other parameters (used assistance mode, velocity, battery life, etc.) with very high frequency and adjusting the output and motor behavior accordingly. It also learns from user behavior over time. Accomplishing this type of ride experience would not simply be possible with a simple electro-mechanical system.

 

[GrandPaBrogan]

... and hate on the rear suspension constantly

How come? I could be mistaken, but that looks just like the Specialised FSR four-bar linkage currently being used on the Levo and the Kenevo. Even the pivot point next to the rear axle is in the right place (on the chain stay, whereas early counterfeits were on the seat stay I think).

 

[wepn]

How come? I could be mistaken, but that looks just like the Specialised FSR four-bar linkage currently being used on the Levo and the Kenevo. Even the pivot point next to the rear axle is in the right place (on the chain stay, whereas early counterfeits were on the seat stay I think).

Really? When I look closer it looks more like a pre-production render or am I looking at the wrong pic?

 

[Rusty]

How come? I could be mistaken, but that looks just like the Specialised FSR four-bar linkage currently being used on the Levo and the Kenevo. Even the pivot point next to the rear axle is in the right place (on the chain stay, whereas early counterfeits were on the seat stay I think).

And that is shit. To be fair, I don't work the system hard enough for long enough at my age, but crap design is crap design. That design, while slightly better than a non linkage design with the shock in the same location is abysmal. It loads up the headset under heavy braking and puts more load onto the forks than necessary. That causes the front to not work as well as it should when braking hard and also causes inconsistency at the rear.

Yamaha Monoshock bikes were crap until they moved to a vertical shock with linkage - I think in the mid 80's.

 

[Rusty]

Really? When I look closer it looks more like a pre-production render or am I looking at the wrong pic?

Yup - just a render.

 

[Rusty]

Seriously, if I was Yamaha and going to be producing my own eMTB I would be talking to Giant about licensing the Maestro system.

 

[wepn]

One of my other bikes has usd forks. They are fooking lush to ride. I love 'em. But the seals on usd forks are prone to leaks.
View attachment 20006

Very nice! Is that a gearbox? VBOXX? Actually I looked it up & looks like a Schlumpf - still used on the Stealth F-37.

I still have my Stealth Bomber c.2009 - the bike from which all these subsequent bikes derived - NYX, HPC, Qulbix, Sur Ron, Vector, Bultaco etc. I could keep going for quite a while.

 

[GrandPaBrogan]

Really? When I look closer it looks more like a pre-production render or am I looking at the wrong pic? View attachment 20146

You need to be looking at the fundamental placement and number of the pivot points, the stays and linkage motion arcs, and the approximate rear axle path... not necessarily the shapes of the main frame and suspension members. CGI render or not, I believe what we're looking at is still a four-bar linkage, be it a different iteration IMHO.

 

[GrandPaBrogan]

And that is shit. To be fair, I don't work the system hard enough for long enough at my age, but crap design is crap design. That design, while slightly better than a non linkage design with the shock in the same location is abysmal. It loads up the headset under heavy braking and puts more load onto the forks than necessary. That causes the front to not work as well as it should when braking hard and also causes inconsistency at the rear.

Yamaha Monoshock bikes were crap until they moved to a vertical shock with linkage - I think in the mid 80's.

Interesting observations. I had never thought of it that way.

So you reckon when the rear shock is positioned parallel-ish to the top tube... so the compression/extension stroke would move along an imaginary path connecting the rear axle and the head tube... that this would have a detrimental effect on stability?

So rear suspension linkage designs where the shock is positioned and moves in a vertical-ish direction (the Giant Maestro, being but one example) has better behaviour and responsiveness?

Certainly food for thought... did I catch that right?

 

[Rusty]

Certainly food for thought... did I catch that right?

Yup - pretty much.

We had a term back in the day - Yamahop.

I raced Yamaha monoshocks for a couple years and could not ever get them to work satisfactorily .... neither could Hannah, but he was able to compensate.

 

[Zimmerframe]

So I’m thinking this with the Kenevo linkage/shock setup and Rohloff hub.
I’ll use the parts from my brothers Commencal seeing as though he never rides that relic anymore.
If I use the creo motor I can probably fit the Rohloff and motor inside the same space. Might need a 2019 Levo bottom cover after I hack the bottom engine mounts.
2020 Kenevo bang!

View attachment 20141

View attachment 20142

10/10 for your autocad !!

 

[CjP]

10/10 for your autocad !!

Hahaha calm down man, I just done the course, that was stolen from google.

 

[apac]

Very nice! Is that a gearbox? VBOXX? Actually I looked it up & looks like a Schlumpf - still used on the Stealth F-37.

I still have my Stealth Bomber c.2009 - the bike from which all these subsequent bikes derived - NYX, HPC, Qulbix, Sur Ron, Vector, Bultaco etc. I could keep going for quite a while.

No vbox or schlumpf, the pedals are just for balance. The only thing i use to make the bike move is a throttle. But as you say the stealth bikes did start the high power craze and the want for an integrated/manufactured battery frame which are now common place and very badly copied with no finesse by the chinese.

 

[Zimmerframe]

No vbox or schlumpf, the pedals are just for balance. The only thing i use to make the bike move is a throttle. But as you say the stealth bikes did start the high power craze and the want for an integrated/manufactured battery frame which are now common place and very badly copied with no finesse by the chinese.

It's very cool and all .. but it just needs that little cherry on top ...

Bicycle Horn bell LED light Little Yellow Duck With Helmet Bike Bell child Toy | eBay

 

[apac]

It's very cool and all .. but it just needs that little cherry on top ...

Bicycle Horn bell LED light Little Yellow Duck With Helmet Bike Bell child Toy | eBay

Do they do one in carbon fibre?